Prostitution and Eternal Values

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Dubious
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dubious » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:38 am

Dontaskme wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:29 am
Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:21 am


If nothing was born and nothing can die then what is WHAT coming from
An idea.
Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:21 am
and what is WHAT going to?...
An idea.

Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:21 am
or does that depend on what's coming and what's going because I can't tell which is which or what what applies to which which!
Drop the idea and all will become crystal clear clarity.
If I drop the idea of coming and the idea of going then where am I heading? Let me guess...to another idea!

Dubious
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dubious » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:45 am

Dontaskme wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:30 am
Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:21 am

Why didn't I think of that! It's so obvious! If nothing is born then nothing can die!

Because it's the thinking that blocks the realisation.
Does that mean if I stop thinking and start realizing I'll immediately evaporate? That would be convenient! I'd never have to call Mary for her services. I'll just stop thinking!

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Dontaskme
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dontaskme » Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:18 am

Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:38 am

If I drop the idea of coming and the idea of going then where am I heading? Let me guess...to another idea!
Not heading anywhere, where ever the mind wanders there it is. HERE NOW NOWHERE < Same place, same as it ever was.

Presence does not need to know it is... to be.

Knowing is a movement through ''thought'' aka mind within itself the non-moving space of presence.
Last edited by Dontaskme on Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:24 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Dontaskme
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dontaskme » Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:20 am

Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:45 am
Dontaskme wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:30 am
Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:21 am

Why didn't I think of that! It's so obvious! If nothing is born then nothing can die!

Because it's the thinking that blocks the realisation.
Does that mean if I stop thinking and start realizing I'll immediately evaporate? That would be convenient! I'd never have to call Mary for her services. I'll just stop thinking!

We're not talking about transference of thought from one to another...we're talking about nothing is born, so nothing can die.

Dubious
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dubious » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:50 pm

Dontaskme wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:20 am
Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:45 am
Dontaskme wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:30 am


Because it's the thinking that blocks the realisation.
Does that mean if I stop thinking and start realizing I'll immediately evaporate? That would be convenient! I'd never have to call Mary for her services. I'll just stop thinking!

We're not talking about transference of thought from one to another...we're talking about nothing is born, so nothing can die.
Then why talk about coming from and going to an idea. Ideas are thoughts. You couldn't have one without thinking. It's so easy to come up with ideas that don't make sense, isn't it.

Nick_A
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Nick_A » Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:38 pm

Dubious
As to what mindset will eventually dominate; hopefully not yours for that would be a thorough corruption of both secular and sacred as the latter has no reason to exist without the former...that what you call THE GREAT BEAST!

"Cosmic man", I can't get over how stupid and vulgar this phrase sounds. Even if we understood every detail of the universe - which is never going to happen - there is no way to explain what that actually means without employing a massive overdose of absurdity for its justification. As they say when expectations cease to be congruent with reality, IN YOUR DREAMS! In dreams, anything is possible. Live there for too long and you become psychotic.
And you wonder why I quote others. If I brought up the potential for the Cosmic Man on my own then the men in the white coats would come after me. They would claim this person has lost his mind. It is proven because he supports some crazy woman whose claim to fame is her willingness to annoy the Great Beast. What could be more absurd?

I’ve chosen to blame the idea on Einstein. I can sit here as pure as the virgin snow and claim I am a victim of a faulty education. So instead of cursing me out people will post on Amazon and curse out Einstein.

https://www.amazon.com/Einstein-Poet-Se ... 0828318735

I see three reviews. Now you can curse out Einstein and I remain a victim.
I also noticed you didn't answer this question:

...rebirth and resurrection are NOT the same; there's a fundamental distinction which has again eluded you. Is your enlightenment enlightened enough to know what it is?
Being born again is being born of the spirit as opposed to the earth. The Resurrection refers to the development of this new birth becoming the New Man

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Greta
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Greta » Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:09 am

I came across a new term yesterday that I love: virtue signalling.

From Wiki:
Virtue signalling is the conspicuous expression of moral values done primarily with the intent of enhancing standing within a social group. The term was first used in signalling theory, to describe any behaviour that could be used to signal virtue—especially piety among the religious. In recent years, the term has become more commonly used as a pejorative characterization by commentators to criticize what they regard as empty, or superficial support of certain political views, and also used within groups to criticize their own members for valuing outward appearance over substantive action.
Nick, I thought you might find the concept interesting since that appears to be your entire modus operandi.

As it turns out, prostitutes are people and there is no need to reduce them to highly speculative stereotypes, unless one is so insecure that one needs to bully and undermine unfortunates to bolster one's own sense of position in society. If one is keen simply to study prostitutes in a sociological sense to find what common qualities lie in the work's practitioners, one may wonder why the focus on prostitutes? To what end? Curiosity? What about astronauts, musicians, accountants or masseurs?

Nick_A
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Nick_A » Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:13 am

Greta

There is nothing new about virtue signaling. Jesus warned us about it. Hypocrisy is an primary attribute of the human condition
Matthew 23:

1 Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 2 “The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. 4 They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.
5 “Everything they do is done for people to see: They make their phylacteries[a]wide and the tassels on their garments long; 6 they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; 7 they love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and to be called ‘Rabbi’ by others.
Secularists argue about prostitutes. Universalists discuss prostitution as a concept in relation to eternal values as I tried to do in the OP.
Does prostitution exist for those who do not recognize eternal values? By eternal values I mean “everlasting morals, enduring principle” which have always existed.
We’ve learned it cannot be done. The concept will always devolve into a worldly secular debate. Is a sane discussion on sexual prostitution possible without first discussing the concept of objective prostitution? No, that is why it isn’t discussed. The secular always corrupts the universal.

We’ve learned that the seventeen students killed in Florida today didn’t die since they were never born. From this perspective there are no eternal values so nothing to prostitute. There is no reason to respect life. Rather just deny its existence

You insist on focusing on the worldly life of a sexual prostitute and rejecting the concept of the relationship of prostitution to eternal values. It is the modern secular way.

The Bible provides an excellent example of the temptation to objectively prostitute oneself.
Matthew 4:

8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. 9 “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”
10 Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’[e]”
11 Then the devil left him, and angels came and attended him.
At this point in his life Jesus was a conscious being. As such he could do anything. He didn’t suffer the inner oppositions and imaginations which keep us in psychological slavery. With this freedom he could rule the world. But Jesus knew his purpose was to serve eternal values rather than an earthly ego. In short, he couldn’t prostitute himself.
"does there exist in man a natural attraction to truth and to the struggle for truth that is stronger than the natural attraction to pleasure?" Jacob Needleman.
The struggle to consciously experience the reality of our existence necessarily includes recognition of eternal values. Secularism which denies eternal values will naturally pursue pleasure and any attraction to eternal values and their source will be rejected in favor of the pleasure and psychological defenses of egoistic self justification.

So Greta, you will remain primarily concerned with the secular question of the life of a sexual prostitute. My philosophical concern will continue to be focused on the relationship between prostitution as a concept, the willingness to sell oneself cheaply, and eternal values which provide objective human meaning and purpose which by definition will always be lacking in a dominant secular society governed by temporary fashionable subjective values. Is it really so surprising that I would value a woman who "feels" and acts upon her attraction to eternal values over one who doesn't and remains dominated by her vanity?

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Greta
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Greta » Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:24 am

Nick_A wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:13 am
Secularists argue about prostitutes.
Go easy on the projection.

You are showing an unhealthy obsession with people working in the sex industry. "Secularists" aka non religious people have disagreed with your poorly reasoned views. This is the situation.

Belinda
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Belinda » Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:08 am

I don't know enough about selling sexual services to comment upon the inherent psychological dangers as compared with other occupations. However I do support raising the social status of sex workers from manual to therapeutic or even to celebrity status, educating and paying the workers accordingly. This would benefit both the moral purpose of the general population and also public health.

Holy Willies such as Nick still constipate the processing of morality.
Does prostitution exist for those who do not recognize eternal values? By eternal values I mean “everlasting morals, enduring principle” which have always existed.
(Nick)

http://www.robertburns.org.uk/Assets/Po ... willie.htm

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Dontaskme
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dontaskme » Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:32 am

Dubious wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:50 pm

Then why talk about coming from and going to an idea. Ideas are thoughts. You couldn't have one without thinking. It's so easy to come up with ideas that don't make sense, isn't it.
No it doesn't make sense to say you were born and that you will die. . . without knowing what it is that is born and dies.

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Dontaskme
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dontaskme » Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:41 am

Nick_A wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:13 am

The struggle to consciously experience the reality of our existence necessarily includes recognition of eternal values. Secularism which denies eternal values will naturally pursue pleasure and any attraction to eternal values and their source will be rejected in favor of the pleasure and psychological defenses of egoistic self justification.
Consciousness expressed as a human being could not function properly without eternal values, humans could not live by the absence of them.

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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by SpheresOfBalance » Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:18 pm

Nick_A wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:41 pm
Does prostitution exist for those who do not recognize eternal values? By eternal values I mean “everlasting morals, enduring principle” which have always existed.

It has become acceptable in modern times to suggest that we create our own reality and values so by definition they have a pragmatic social origin. They are temporary in contrast with eternal values which are permanent.

From this perspective is it right to say that sexual prostitution no longer exists since there are no eternal values? We create our own values. If women or men are seen as prostitutes, aren’t they really just being themselves? How can a person prostitute themselves if they create their own reality and have nothing objective to prostitute? A man or woman cannot sell themselves cheaply since they are just being normal and have defined their own worth.

Should colleges ban the use of the word since like many other words, prostitution or the loss of objective human quality by selling oneself cheaply is now considered insulting and politically incorrect?
No values have ever been or ever will be eternal. The human evolves. Sometimes we take two steps forward and one step back, while that one step back can be extremely painful, (trump), it's factual nature eventually shows us the true way.

There are no prostitutes...

prostitute [pros-ti-toot, -tyoot]
noun
1. a woman who engages in sexual intercourse for money; whore; harlot.
2. a man who engages in sexual acts for money.
3. a person who willingly uses his or her talent or ability in a base and unworthy way, usually for money.

verb (used with object), prostituted, prostituting.
4. to sell or offer (oneself) as a prostitute.
5. to put to any base or unworthy use:
to prostitute one's talents. --Dictionary.com--


...only ever exclusive to sex, as multitudes of humans sell themselves for plethora reasons every day, simply for a monkeys glittering prize, are they any less prostitutes? And so its exclusivity should be washed away as a word that was only ever that of bigotry and fear, puritans their ass!!! What's more pure and fundamental to the animal kingdom than the sex that allows them to exist?

Of course it's more complex than that isn't it?

I mean lets not forget "the monkeys glittering prize," simply a means to conveniently, in as small a package as possible, hoard all the natural resources, for fear of death, but then that can never be too long a fight can it. How much does one really need, anyway? The end always comes no matter what one does. To end in excess serves no purpose.

The monkey's glittering prize has always been the biggest lie of all!!! It's buying into that lie that yields all the prostitutes, and their are indeed many! Multitudes!! If not the entirety of the human race, save those that still live off the land, though many of those peoples have also been tainted with it's stain!

Control by those most fearful, to the point of insanity! The human animal has been, and currently is still, the biggest joke of them all. But the price shall definitely be paid if the status quo remains. Mark my words! Remember! Educate! Think! ALL the books that have ever been written tell the story, one simply has to place ALL the pieces of humankind's puzzle in their proper place to finally understand the total picture! Supposed, temporal, self serving denial should be no option, simply a sheep, clone, parrot, lest one be led astray!

Listen to Prof, he's on the right path!

Peace to all that fight the good fight!
My sympathies to all those that have no clue what the good fight is, blinded by their fearful denial.

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Dontaskme
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by Dontaskme » Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:31 pm

SpheresOfBalance wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:18 pm

No values have ever been or ever will be eternal.
They are because what and who you are is eternal.

The value is placed there by you, or the value is of no value...it's a matter of choice.

Which do you prefer in order to evolve?

Lets not forget that eternity is this moment right here and now. There is no other place beyond what is here right now...it's not like you can step out of the now. This is what eternal means.

This is not for sale..but the devil will try to sell it to you...the devil being your shadow side.

.

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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Prostitution and Eternal Values

Post by SpheresOfBalance » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:12 pm

Dontaskme wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:31 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:18 pm

No values have ever been or ever will be eternal.
They are because what and who you are is eternal.
Not a chance!

The value is placed there by you,
Exactly!

or the value is of no value...it's a matter of choice.
Universally speaking, correct!

Which do you prefer in order to evolve?
I prefer what the universe prefers!

Lets not forget that eternity is this moment right here and now.
Incorrect! Use words correctly or use the ones that actually apply. We're not here to redefine.

eternal [ih-tur-nl]
adjective
1. without beginning or end; lasting forever; always existing (opposed to temporal): eternal life.
2. perpetual; ceaseless; endless: eternal quarreling; eternal chatter.
3. enduring; immutable: eternal principles.
4. Metaphysics. existing outside all relations of time; not subject to change.
noun
5. something that is eternal.
6. the Eternal, God. --Dictionary.com--


There is no other place beyond what is here right now...it's not like you can step out of the now. This is what eternal means.
You're out of your mind as it was used by the OP. Pay attention to context! You said yourself that values are not certain. Here today, gone tomorrow, there is no eternal. Are you still saying, "goo goo gaa gaa?" No! We change, as do our values. How's that mammoth taste? Should I or should I not kill a mammoth? You and I are the culmination of everything that has come before us, and we shall add to that which comes after us, but what that was, is and shall be, is ever changing, never eternal!

This is not for sale..but the devil will try to sell it to you...the devil being your shadow side.
There is no devil, there is only humankind maturing in ever varying environments, with ever varying results, thus ever varying ways to deal with the primal fear of death, (to survive)!!! Some ideas are just not conducive to others.
.

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