Kant's Four Questions

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Plato's Rock
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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Plato's Rock » Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:31 pm

Well, I'm not entirely familiar with Plotinus, so that name drop sort of went over my head. Although if it's meant to imply that there's a "Singularity" or a central loci to existence. Like One "Universe" (however big), then there's a chance that there's an overlap between perennial philosophy and my thoughts. I wouldn't be surprised if there is.

My thoughts are along the lines that there's a cosmic "instability" (think like a hub of wheel, or the central most part of a flower). That "blossoms" in accord with the principles that are adopted. You know the "fine tuning" of the Universe that seemingly allows for our type of life. Each adopted principle/worldview that is integrated into one's own mental model is like a petal off of their flower. Thus our subjective world, is actually dependent upon a past generations facts. Ex; Classical mechanics, they weren't as developed until Newton came along...they were mostly ballistics tables, but lets say that by adopting Newton's work as a central thesis to our worldview. We solidified his world in hindsight, but we're branching off of his work. Until Einstein came along with a new central thesis. Relativity, soon that got applied to everything. Cultures, morality, ...etc.

In essence we are byproducts of the survivors, the universe isn't fine tuned for us, we are fined tuned to it. And going back, to the earliest eras of "the universe", I'd say at the "singularity" that was the big bang...that could've been a distillation of Truth/Reality from some other "dimension". Say the old principles that embraced Reality.

To simplify, take the thought that one's parents had kids at the most opportune time in their lives, and that they often hope/prepare the child for their lives. The child, ideally, has a better life than the parents, but the child's base point...is likely the climax of the parent's efforts. There's no set step between generations, it's a gradual transition. All the way from the beginning when the first dust (hydrogen) accumulated into a star.

As a fun tidbit, Newton spent a lot of time on Alchemy, and it influenced his entire worldview (including physics thoughts). He supposedly had success with making something like a "living metal", but that was "squelched" by Newton himself. He didn't want to destroy the "worldview at that time". Now, his alchemy work is somewhat controversial to scientists (chemists, and physicists) because they can't accept those notions of his life. This "Alchemy" of his, would be a different petal off of his "flower", and in turn it may have generated an entirely different "worldview" if taken a couple hundred years into the future. Ie; Alternate Reality, possibly.

Regarding your second post;
To simply answer your questions; "Can we experience and acquire psychological knowledge through intuition?". I would think we can/could, but it would be a limited knowledge. In the past I have heard a voice say, "A Kiss from God". It was a completely nondescript voice, no body, hardly any vocal tone, but not monotone. And it was a one time affair. Now analyzing it in hindsight, most voices that a person hears are deemed personal sub-vocal self-talk, rationally, and by current standards of psychology/psychiatry.

Now did I really receive some sort of blessing like that? Who's to verify, or deny it? Has that experience shaped my life since then, most assuredly. Can I profess that I am "Blessed", and have experienced the "Word of God"? Not likely, that'll cause huge problems in my life. Thus I like to think of it as a limited truth, that even I am uncertain of.

Second question: Moral law, if it is defined as Truth of Reason, or as a standard that Truth makes "right" via rationality. To me at present, it would seem that said standards would be problematic. Psychology/psychiatry is currently undermining many aspects of the Enlightenment notion that we are "sane & rational thinkers". I'll let you run with that thought for a while. And prestige? That would seem to be nothing more than approval within a certain social "tribe/group".

To me at least, it seems like some of us are heading towards the "Morality & Rationality" of the Individual. Where as a person, who thinks for themselves, ideally, they have to create, or acknowledge a personal value system. Mainly because if one looks at "social norms" as "morals", you can see a whole lot of variation.

Third question: Hope, as a word, and a meaning may have deteriorated since Kant's time. There's hope for tomorrow, there's hope for an afterlife, there's hope for success...etc. It seems to me, at present, in the culture I've been exposed to. That hope has come to mean a passive prayer. Not a prayer that one actively does, or enacts, but a type of thing that is like a "wish for....". The same goes for "Faith", there's faith in the system, faith in each other, faith in a higher power...etc. Some of it can be rational, others irrational. It's up to personal judgment.

Nick_A
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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Nick_A » Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:10 am

I like your explanation of the cosmic instability. If you consider Plotinus’ ONE as the hub and everything flowers within it it becomes clear how the ONE intentionally devolves into Intelligence so that ONE and intelligence (nous) are simultaneously present much like white light and the perception of colors are simultaneously present. Read the paragraph on the ONE. Everything you’ve written suggest your mind is open to this perspective.

http://www.iep.utm.edu/plotinus/

If as you suggest everything is connected and deviates according to universal laws, we are an expression of what has previously taken place, it raises the question if we have choice in this. The traditional Ways in their own way suggest that we can consciously evolve out of this involutionary process. This is really the objective purpose of the essence of religion.

Alchemy is perfectly reasonable for anyone open to the Great Chain of Being. Alchemy deals with the density and frequency of vibrations defining matter. What we call energy is just material vibrations beyond what we can sense.

It appears like you have had a valuable experience. You re indeed fortunte.
To me at least, it seems like some of us are heading towards the "Morality & Rationality" of the Individual. Where as a person, who thinks for themselves, ideally, they have to create, or acknowledge a personal value system. Mainly because if one looks at "social norms" as "morals", you can see a whole lot of variation.
Imagine you are in a dark room and told to redecorate it so that it makes sense. You cannot do it in the dark. If we do dwell in the darkness of Plato’s cave, how are we supposed to develop a personal value system reflecting both what we are and our collective past? It seems we must turn n a light in order to "see" the reality of our situation What will prevent us from just following the crowd?

Would you define hope as described in the following way, as an active or a passive process?
"Hope is a state of mind, not of the world. Hope, in this deep and powerful sense, is not the same as joy that things are going well, or willingness to invest in enterprises that are obviously heading for success, but rather an ability to work for something because it is good." Vaclav Havel

Plato's Rock
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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Plato's Rock » Wed Dec 13, 2017 4:18 am

Well, I read the One, along with Emanation & Multiplicity, and Presence. And I can say at least a little that it resonates with my perspective, but I can't say fully to what extent. Mainly because if one takes Plotinus' One as a starting point of it's own, and as a possible revitalization point for Christianity (Christianty was invigorated with Neo-Platonic thought provided I'm remembering correctly). It kinda sets one up in a sort of bind. Can my mindset exist without defaulting to a state that I had known previously?

To illustrate; If you grew up only hearing English, and it became your dominant language. You'd operate all the time in "English". Now say you're older, and you're trying to learn a "new language". How would one go about it? Correlating the new with the old? Meaning you'd have to learn the "English" meanings before you'd understand the "German, or French...etc" for example?

In this instance, English has become a pre-conditional to one's way of thought. This also applies to the next thought of having a choice. You have all the choices, as far as I'm aware. You can choose to remain a dominant English speaker, or you can overtime coax yourself into another language. Say you lived 20 years speaking English, but you didn't like the mindset/culture, so you moved to a foreign country and lived there for 20 years. Is it wrong to say that you aren't a "native speaker" of a language after 20 years? Does said person still "think in" English? Or have they acclimated to their new world?

Regarding the Dark Room, does darkness exist without light? This is kind like the joke/analogy of the Black Cat in a dark room ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_cat_analogy ). If you are conscious of who/what you are, aren't you a form of "light/awareness"? Kind of like, "I am the flame of Consciousness. I know that, I know". We are our own light, but we have to be aware of it.

Using Plato's cave, even if old...is still following the "Crowd", just an ancient crowd. And there's multiple ways to "answer" the black cat analogy, my favorites are "pat down the room", or "think, I am the "cat" in metaphor".

Hope; in that passage, I want to say; "and/or/neither", and by that I mean it is both a sense of joy, and willingness for success. It is not either/or joy, or willingness. Neither is it a concrete application. For instance, if I jumped in to a work of desperation (like life in Despair), and continued to apply myself (even if I feel no need to), but I continue regardless...am I not filled with hope? A sort of hope that I can make things "better"? Thus with that sort of understanding. I would lean towards calling it active, but it's also passive in a sense that it's long lasting.

If a force exerted over a long time, longer than we care to measure, is that not consistent with being a "permanent" effect? Say gravity stopped for a micro-second, but then resumed at the point where we couldn't tell that it stopped. Ie; we're experiencing gravity constantly, but if it suddenly boosted us up, and then brought us back down would we have a way to call it active, or passive? We are constantly being exerted upon by Gravity, but do we think it's a temporary thing? Gravity is a force of attraction via mass in Classical Mechanics (Newton).

Active can imply that it's temporary, and it also may imply the other. That it lasts longer than necessary. So I may end with this;
Faith Passive-Applied
Hope Active-Applied
Wishes Passive-Unapplied
Prayer Active-Unapplied(?).

A sort of need for; is it an "Applied, or not" type of qualifier upon Active-Passive. I don't really know for certain, but these are just current thoughts as I write them, and update my own mental model.

Nick_A
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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Nick_A » Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:27 am

P R,
Well, I read the One, along with Emanation & Multiplicity, and Presence. And I can say at least a little that it resonates with my perspective, but I can't say fully to what extent. Mainly because if one takes Plotinus' One as a starting point of it's own, and as a possible revitalization point for Christianity (Christianty was invigorated with Neo-Platonic thought provided I'm remembering correctly). It kinda sets one up in a sort of bind. Can my mindset exist without defaulting to a state that I had known previously?
But is that really a bad thing? For example I have two choices for contemplating Creation. It either initiates from above in a lawful involution of being or it began with something appearing from nothing with no direction. This is illogical for me.

If it is far more logical to begin with the idea of the ONE why are so many opposed to it? My guess is that recognition of the process of involution admits the God question which dominant secularism must deny to retain its supremacy. As you wrote it is like learning a new language. Our usual language is based on duality. This new language recognizes a third vertical dimension of thought inviting a higher perspective which reconciles duality. Do you have any better suggestions as to why so many people prefer to accept a virtual impossibility of something appearing from nothing in order to deny the logical involution of being or unity into diversity?
"I am the flame of Consciousness. I know that, I know". We are our own light, but we have to be aware of it.
But why aren’t we aware of it? If we aren’t why do you think the flame of consciousness is active? As I understand it, we have conscious self awareness only during brief intervals. As a result the results of the light quickly devolve into imagination.
Active can imply that it's temporary, and it also may imply the other. That it lasts longer than necessary. So I may end with this;
Faith Passive-Applied
Hope Active-Applied
Wishes Passive-Unapplied
Prayer Active-Unapplied(?).
As far as the relationship between active and passive forces, as I understand it an active or passive force is defined in context. Say a man is bullying a woman. He is the active force and she is the passive force. All of a sudden her brother appears and beats up the bully who became the passive force in relation to her brother. Consciousness as I understand it is pure affirmation or active force by definition. It has no denying side. Faith, hope, the power to wish, and prayer are only genuine in the presence of consciousness. Without it these qualities are just expressions of imagination lacking conscious force.

Plato's Rock
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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Plato's Rock » Thu Dec 14, 2017 4:08 am

Not sure if it's a bad thing, or not. It may just be limits of our imagination that gives us those two choices. Up from above with involution, or from nothing with no direction. They both can be a little illogical if viewed through certain lenses. An omniscient, omnipotent being that looks down/in on us? It strikes me as a sort of "ant farm type notion"...we scurry about our daily lives..., all the while we're being observed for another's amusement.

Existence from nothing is just as absurd, but that's sort of the point. All beliefs, in my point of view, are absurd during some points of their conception. Including my own. It sort of depends upon what sort of "crunk" you wish, and can stomach. Regarding as to whether it's logical or not. I'd imagine that "logical, and illogical" weren't really matters when some of these thoughts came about. Psychiatry is a fairly young institution (a couple hundred years compared to religion), and sanity is just another hammer to keep people in line with the status quo.

And just because it seems logical, it doesn't mean that it is "the right course". Ex; I'm sure Hitler was perfectly logical from his point of view for all his shenanigans. And I'm sure he was in the beginning considered Logical to the Germans who supported him. The Generals didn't think so in some of the operations he ordered them to do as far as I know, as things developed later on. They lost battles, too many, and they started to paint their leader in a different light. To most people, it's probably logical to make ends meet, and to not ask too many questions. "Why rock the boat? I can get the answers from my "Spiritual/political leaders"...etc". I mean how many of my thoughts have you accepted at face value? It keeps the conversation going to do so, but at what cost? When things are working well/good, we generally don't care about the mechanisms underneath. Human nature.

...in respect to the flame of consciousnesses, this again may be a topic of the times, and who's to say we aren't aware of being aware by default? 100% awareness of everything can be a bad thing too. Say for instance you weren't comfortable with the life you have now, and that you were horribly exposed to the possible acts you may do to change it. Stupid ex; There's nothing stopping you from impersonating an Officer, killing someone, and causing shifts in society that way...there's nothing stopping you from raping that cute barista, or jumping off a cliff....etc....too much freedom can be a really bad thing. I learned that a hard way when I truly started asking, "What did I want to do with my life?" I didn't do anything "Stupid" other than get paralyzed by the possibilities/freedoms of what I could do.

Yes, context in regards to passive-active. Consciousness, isn't always pure affirmation from my experiences. It may affirm the mindset, but the mindset can change. It can be turned upon itself...analysis paralysis as mentioned above..., now I wonder if that's Kierkegaard's "Fear & Trembling"...that moment when one fully realizes that there is "no limits" like above...., and that it applies to everyone.

Nick_A
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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Nick_A » Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:29 pm

P R,
Existence from nothing is just as absurd, but that's sort of the point. All beliefs, in my point of view, are absurd during some points of their conception. Including my own. It sort of depends upon what sort of "crunk" you wish, and can stomach. Regarding as to whether it's logical or not. I'd imagine that "logical, and illogical" weren't really matters when some of these thoughts came about. Psychiatry is a fairly young institution (a couple hundred years compared to religion), and sanity is just another hammer to keep people in line with the status quo.
But what determines the value of the crunk? Does it matter what attribute of your collective presence is experiencing and responding to the impressions of the external world. We were discussing hope. It seems we can respond, logically, emotionally, physically or consciously. Consider these aphorisms from Gurdjieff. They indicate that the sacred impulses of faith, love, and hope, vary in their value. Do you agree or are they all just crunk?
Conscious love evokes the same in response. Emotional love evokes the opposite. Physical love depends on type and polarity.

Conscious faith is freedom. Emotional faith is slavery. Mechanical faith is foolishness.

Hope, when bold, is strength. Hope, with doubt, is cowardice. Hope, with fear, is weakness.

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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Plato's Rock » Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:03 am

Not sure. I would say the value is determined via the applications they have to survival. All the wishful thinking, and striving one does doesn't really matter now if it doesn't help them throughout their day now does it?

All of those sacred impulses of faith, love, and hope...can probably be stimulated via different chemical concoctions. Ex; Trust and intimacy, can be simulated via MDMA (Ecstasy), and there is now an effort to do so for "treatment" ( https://singularityhub.com/2017/12/14/h ... 2gh7mkdvqp ).

Does that seem like the higher stages of "Conscious Love", or "Conscious Faith", or "Hope with boldness"? Now say, that you're on a medication, because of "Local Law" (like I am), and you essentially have to stay on it until told otherwise...."For the Greater Good". This to me is essentially Majority Tyranny....they aren't allowing me to be an individual even if my pursuits conflict with "The Greater Good"....which I don't think they do.

I am simply in the "wrong" because ...why? I don't even know, and I'm being medicated. I haven't had extreme, or any real hallucinations other than that one "voice" a Kiss from God..., and I only mentioned that to the "Authorities" because I thought they'd want to know...you know, acquiescence to the proper authorities, but every time I've done so my life has gotten "worse". I was terrified of...Humans, and myself years ago. And now my fears have essentially manifested. I've been socially deemed an "outcast/unfit", for the most part.

Is it because I didn't agree/understand the system I was previously so adherent to? I don't know. Thankfully I no longer fear myself. That is my salvation, my hope...that no matter how much I suffer at the hands of those outside me (Psychiatrists, Judges, Lawyers, Family). I can still remain true to myself, for I shall always have to answer to myself.

...ever since I came back from Alabama in 2010 to my home state, I've been making "hard choices". Go to clinic..."voluntarily or we can call the police"... only two choices. I've had that happen 3 times, the last three have been the police getting called on me...because I've been "agitated", and my Father/Family said I've "changed". That I'm no longer the same "obedient/subservient son"....that I've essentially shook up their world..., and they're "doing what's best for me"...without really understanding me. It's tyranny, pure and simple.

Every time, to me at least, it's been a "Socrates' & Hemlock" type thing from my perspective, and to "Them"...it just supports their claims...

..., so do I have "Conscious Love, Faith, and Hope"....I'd like to think so being that I've forgiven each and every single one of them. Even while I still feel like I'm suffering...because of them. Thus, should I bend a "knee" to "Society". To participate in a worldview that doesn't work for me? Accept my "Insanity", and "be a vagabond" that lives off the "System" for decades while the drugs they pump into me corrode my very being?

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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Nick_A » Fri Dec 15, 2017 5:31 am

P R,
Not sure. I would say the value is determined via the applications they have to survival. All the wishful thinking, and striving one does doesn't really matter now if it doesn't help them throughout their day now does it?
These aphorisms refer to objective quality. You seem to be considering them in terms of temporary subjective situations. The point is that we use the same word to apply to three different qualities of being. The word love for example can be used to describe a physical attraction. Conscious love is the love of another or others for their benefit – not ours. It is a conscious human potential. Emotional love arises in a person because of the image of another or others and how it makes them feel. This is why it in esoteric circles it is considered dangerous since once a person stops feeling emotional love they blame it on the other and can even do them great harm. Yet in normal society emotional love is praised and sells a lot of tickets because of our tendency to justify and identify with it. A person can give the energy of conscious love yet emotional love can drain a person. The point is that from the perspective of the great chain of being, conscious love is of a higher objective quality than either physical or emotional love.

I suspect that you have been experimenting with drugs. Am I right? They can lead to altered states of consciousness and a dangerous form of imagination that over time can deprive a person of their ability to experience reality both with their senses and with their powers of contemplation.

You seem both rational and highly intelligent. It is hard to understand why you would be medicated except if you tried to commit suicide. A change in personality is not that uncommon. If you are suffering from some form of Schizophrenia you seem surrounded by some very ignorant people.

Inner work can be of great benefit psychologically. It opens a person to human potential. However the effect of drugs can pervert any benefits into harmful imagination. Stay away from hallucinogens

But as of now, if drugs are the problem get sane help to enable you to become free from addiction. If schizophrenia is the problem don’t feel it is your fault. Try and find holistic practitioners who can help you get inwardly balanced again. Addiction feeds on imbalance. Sometimes healing begins with being active outside and taking in the sunlight. It will bring you back into your body. You are a good person and I would hate to see you fall apart. If you ever have the desire to communicate privately, feel free to PM me.

It often takes real human intelligence to fall victim to some form of depression. Have you ever seen a neurotic rhinoceros? You won’t because they lack the intelligence to suffer inner conflict. They just put their head down and charge. Sounds like a lot of people you probably know. You have questions that don’t arise from the rhinocerous mentality. Don’t let talent go to waste.

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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Plato's Rock » Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:12 pm

Well, thanks.

I've never experimented with drugs, nor I have I been around people while they're using. I've been friends with people who've used/experimented, but I never got into "It". And they've never pressured me to do so either.

The most "drug usage" I've had is probably 5 beers in my entire life, and a few glasses of whiskey (like 2). Other than that it's been the prescription I've been "assigned".

I haven't tried to commit suicide, but I have "contemplated it" from both an emotional and rational perspective. The closest I've come to "doing it", was when I was out hunting one year by myself (for the most part). But I just couldn't put a 12 gauge slug through my head....wanted to, but didn't.

I think the biggest "issue" I used to have was that I was "socially inept", had an identity crisis, isolated, and dwelt upon/in depression for a few years. Essentially, I had no/little social contact for close to 8 months while I was "sorting myself out" while I was away for college that one year. In addition to "External stressors" going on at the time (car accidents, avoided a campus shooting by an hr). Came home "talking to myself" about esoteric stuff that made no sense to those around me, and ended up in the clinic.

One parent thought I was brainwashed because I was talking about "mnemonics", and "that's how they train us"....or something. The last time I apparently was "chanting" to myself in an "evil tone" while I was trying to go to sleep. I had spent ~90 hrs awake nonstop over a week without meaning to. Stress at work, stress at home probably caused it..., but they don't seem to care about those facts.

Inner wise, during that "chant" time, I must've had done some "inner work" (if that's really a thing) where I thought I was exorcising a demon from within and through myself. Involved deep contemplation of "chakras", and if they could be rearranged/multiplied...had a whole schema in my mind's eye...called it the "demon grinder" to myself. Spontaneous development, and work....wasn't really intentional...from a surface conscious standpoint. Also may have done a "past life regression upon myself" where I was imagining I was a "bastard of some king" in medieval/renaissance times (no proof ...just thoughts).

That's where I think they get the "Schizophrenia" diagnosis from, but I haven't really mentioned the later paragraph to any one until now.

...that's the sad part about depression, and then you're told to "suck it up", or quit acting that way...etc.

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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Eodnhoj7 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:36 am

Plato's Rock wrote:
Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:12 pm
Well, thanks.

I've never experimented with drugs, nor I have I been around people while they're using. I've been friends with people who've used/experimented, but I never got into "It". And they've never pressured me to do so either.

The most "drug usage" I've had is probably 5 beers in my entire life, and a few glasses of whiskey (like 2). Other than that it's been the prescription I've been "assigned".

I haven't tried to commit suicide, but I have "contemplated it" from both an emotional and rational perspective. The closest I've come to "doing it", was when I was out hunting one year by myself (for the most part). But I just couldn't put a 12 gauge slug through my head....wanted to, but didn't.

I think the biggest "issue" I used to have was that I was "socially inept", had an identity crisis, isolated, and dwelt upon/in depression for a few years. Essentially, I had no/little social contact for close to 8 months while I was "sorting myself out" while I was away for college that one year. In addition to "External stressors" going on at the time (car accidents, avoided a campus shooting by an hr). Came home "talking to myself" about esoteric stuff that made no sense to those around me, and ended up in the clinic.

One parent thought I was brainwashed because I was talking about "mnemonics", and "that's how they train us"....or something. The last time I apparently was "chanting" to myself in an "evil tone" while I was trying to go to sleep. I had spent ~90 hrs awake nonstop over a week without meaning to. Stress at work, stress at home probably caused it..., but they don't seem to care about those facts.

Inner wise, during that "chant" time, I must've had done some "inner work" (if that's really a thing) where I thought I was exorcising a demon from within and through myself. Involved deep contemplation of "chakras", and if they could be rearranged/multiplied...had a whole schema in my mind's eye...called it the "demon grinder" to myself. Spontaneous development, and work....wasn't really intentional...from a surface conscious standpoint. Also may have done a "past life regression upon myself" where I was imagining I was a "bastard of some king" in medieval/renaissance times (no proof ...just thoughts).

That's where I think they get the "Schizophrenia" diagnosis from, but I haven't really mentioned the later paragraph to any one until now.

...that's the sad part about depression, and then you're told to "suck it up", or quit acting that way...etc.
In some cultures being a cripple or mentally ill was considered divine. Schizophrenia is a way overused term, and you seem to be integrating other peoples "opinions" into your own identity. The problem is that you seem to be struggling whether to believe them or not, while simultaneously seeming "hurt" over their hostility.

If these people understood what they were doing when observing you, family/doctors/etc., how can they only see nothingness? To go around pointing to world an saying "this is evil, that is evil, you are evil" is to be blind as evil is nothingness. Why trust blindmen?

The simple truth is that whether you are schizophrenic or not is irrelevant, when you look at the world form by these "judges" we can see it is schizophrenic in itself on its own terms by its own definitions created by these same men and women.

Another simple truth, I have learned, is the the pursuit of wisdom is an agonizing one of body, mind and spirit. It can at times feel as if one is being burned alive and completely naked...but it is okay if one is willing to embrace it...wisdom shows us these things pass. When Odin took the runes he screamed, how is this not a minimum a metaphor for man's pursuit of wisdom?

The pursuit of wisdom is often times a path full of sorrow, "but he who sows in tears, reaps in joy". These people who pass judgement on you no nothing of value, as all they see is darkness.

You are going to have to learn how to quiet your mind and let go of certain wounds. We cannot hold onto the things which give us joy, why bother holding onto the things which give us sorrow?

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Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Nick_A » Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:56 am

P R,
I think the biggest "issue" I used to have was that I was "socially inept", had an identity crisis, isolated, and dwelt upon/in depression for a few years. Essentially, I had no/little social contact for close to 8 months while I was "sorting myself out" while I was away for college that one year. In addition to "External stressors" going on at the time (car accidents, avoided a campus shooting by an hr). Came home "talking to myself" about esoteric stuff that made no sense to those around me, and ended up in the clinic.
Is there a reason you are aware of that made you become socially inept? Was it just shyness, something physical, a desire for retreat into escapism, or an attempt to “sort yourself out” which is really the ancient spiritual question “who am I?”
One parent thought I was brainwashed because I was talking about "mnemonics", and "that's how they train us"....or something. The last time I apparently was "chanting" to myself in an "evil tone" while I was trying to go to sleep. I had spent ~90 hrs awake nonstop over a week without meaning to. Stress at work, stress at home probably caused it..., but they don't seem to care about those facts.
Your user name includes Plato and Plato spoke of anamnesis or remembrance. You became interested in mnemonics which refers to memory. Was your interest a reflection of this classic description?
The word mnemonic derives from Greek mnēmōn ("mindful"), which itself comes from the Greek word meaning "to remember." (In classical mythology, Mnemosyne, the mother of the Muses, is the goddess of memory.) As with many classical borrowings, we retained the double initial consonant, but not the pronunciation of both, since the combination doesn't occur naturally in English. ("Pneumonia" is a similar case.) "Mnemonic" can also be a noun meaning "a mnemonic device." If the spelling of this word strikes you as particularly fiendish to remember, try this mnemonic to get you started on the right track: keep in mind that although the pronunciation begins with an "n" sound, the spelling begins with an "m," as in "memory."
Inner wise, during that "chant" time, I must've had done some "inner work" (if that's really a thing) where I thought I was exorcising a demon from within and through myself. Involved deep contemplation of "chakras", and if they could be rearranged/multiplied...had a whole schema in my mind's eye...called it the "demon grinder" to myself. Spontaneous development, and work....wasn't really intentional...from a surface conscious standpoint. Also may have done a "past life regression upon myself" where I was imagining I was a "bastard of some king" in medieval/renaissance times (no proof ...just thoughts).
During this time were you friendly with anyone involved in a cult? You seem to be aware of ideas that usually don’t come easily and easily taken wrongly. Of course a person can be inspired by books but also by cults. Hopefully you have intelligent human questions you were experimenting with that were not being manipulated by charlatans.

Plato's Rock
Posts: 56
Joined: Sat Nov 18, 2017 4:01 am

Re: Kant's Four Questions

Post by Plato's Rock » Sat Dec 16, 2017 5:49 am

@Eodnhoj7,
Don't we all?

@Nick_A,
Maybe socially inept was a poor phrasing because it was more complicated than that. I was a "social butterfly" in highschool externally, but internally I thought and felt I was a loser/loner. I didn't know anyone outside of school, and when a really gregarious friend died in a car accident. I felt like I was a "false friend" to everyone because I knew nothing about anyone outside of school. There was and still is sort of a desire for escapism. I used to be extremely shy until I started "blooming from wallflower". And come college, I did need to sort myself out...answer "Who am I?" which I surprisingly feel like I've done.

Regarding the user name "Plato's Rock"...it never occurred to me at the time to see it that way...I just found the idea of a "rock" humorous in an ironic way. Plato as far as I knew, was the philosophical forebear of Western Thought, and with his "cave"...I thought he could use a "rock"...in a variety of ways. You know, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone"..., and "I refute it thusly...*kicks a rock*" (in response to solipsism). And besides we can reflect, and analyze anything...a rock seems simplistic enough...until it's not.

Nope, no cults. At least none that I can recall. And that's the spooky part for me at least. I was coming up with essentially "balanced ternary" without realizing it...I was "re-deriving" it based upon morality...in an effort to cope with....something (I don't honestly know what). I don't think I was abducted because I don't think there would've been a point to doing so. Although for a month or so I did feel that way (kinda felt Stockholm syndrome type stuff for a few weeks). I was a 19 year old guy...going to college.

Although I did go paranoid thinking that I was going to be drafted for a bit..., but the draft is over...etc. It didn't help that during that year I was going to a college that was a tier 1 research university that had really good ties with DOD (Department of Defense). Kept seeing DOD stickers on vehicles while walking around campus...guys in black suits like the secret service...etc. Really trippy when your paranoid/loopy.

A lot of my "thoughts" seemingly come up from no where, and I wonder if they're valid, and then I stumble upon them online in Wikipedia, or other sites..., and it's like "OOOH!". Case in point mentioned above, Ternary Logic...didn't even realize it was a thing until a couple of years ago when I started "digging" to find "Foundation".

....although I was thinking about applying for government clearance once had finished the aerospace degree I intended on getting. Wanted to work at Skunkworks (Lockheed Martin)..., but you know...man makes plans, and the gods laugh. And knowing Governments....who knows for sure.

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