Evil

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artisticsolution
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Re: Evil

Post by artisticsolution »

TSBU wrote:
Greta wrote:
TSBU wrote:And evil people is evil to the core, not in the surface.
Were these "intrinsically evil people" evil as infants, as babies, as toddlers? People get damaged in life and can go haywire. It's not as if people are born with an "evil soul".
Who said intrinsically? No, not every evil person has get damaged in life, many of them have a context not very different from yours. Like there are people who born with a mind to be depressed or nervous or stupid, there are people who born "to be evil", sure, no one is in anything only a matter of how you born, the context is important. But the context is not the only thng either.
And please, I say "core" or "soul"like I can say "operative system".
So, TSBU, I have a question for you...

Should evil be destroyed?
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TSBU
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Re: Evil

Post by TSBU »

artisticsolution wrote:
TSBU wrote:
Greta wrote:
Were these "intrinsically evil people" evil as infants, as babies, as toddlers? People get damaged in life and can go haywire. It's not as if people are born with an "evil soul".
Who said intrinsically? No, not every evil person has get damaged in life, many of them have a context not very different from yours. Like there are people who born with a mind to be depressed or nervous or stupid, there are people who born "to be evil", sure, no one is in anything only a matter of how you born, the context is important. But the context is not the only thng either.
And please, I say "core" or "soul"like I can say "operative system".
So, TSBU, I have a question for you...

Should evil be destroyed?
For me, yes, of course.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Evil

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

TSBU wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
TSBU wrote: In... the people I've found? Like the color red in the tomatoes?
And what does this 'evil' look like? A person?
Some people look like that, other people don't...
I'm not seeing the point in this XD.
Evil is a word with many different concepts attached by many different people, agree, so many of them, that the meaning is vague, it's like saying "love". But, like love, it's a word that exist in every part of the world with no many differences, so we usually can understand what is evil. I don't want to start a whole conversation about what exactly do I consider evil, if I do it, (the same if I do it with "house") we'll get to a point where my definition is different, but it's similar enough to share a word.
So, what do "beauty" looks like? But it exist, certeanly, you can understand when a person talk about beauty, and you can understand it when a person talk about evil. You can say that you have to do "Jaque mate" to win chess, but you can't explain all the moves...
See? I don't see the point, so I'm going to language philosophy XD.
I see it as a useful descriptive word for someone whose actions are particularly repellent, but it's still only a descriptive word. You talk as if it's something tangible that exists in itself.
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TSBU
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Re: Evil

Post by TSBU »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
TSBU wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: And what does this 'evil' look like? A person?
Some people look like that, other people don't...
I'm not seeing the point in this XD.
Evil is a word with many different concepts attached by many different people, agree, so many of them, that the meaning is vague, it's like saying "love". But, like love, it's a word that exist in every part of the world with no many differences, so we usually can understand what is evil. I don't want to start a whole conversation about what exactly do I consider evil, if I do it, (the same if I do it with "house") we'll get to a point where my definition is different, but it's similar enough to share a word.
So, what do "beauty" looks like? But it exist, certeanly, you can understand when a person talk about beauty, and you can understand it when a person talk about evil. You can say that you have to do "Jaque mate" to win chess, but you can't explain all the moves...
See? I don't see the point, so I'm going to language philosophy XD.
I see it as a useful descriptive word for someone whose actions are particularly repellent, but it's still only a descriptive word. You talk as if it's something tangible that exists in itself.
Nothing "exist in inself" if what you mean by that is that it isn't related with the rest of reality and that relations are what make that thing been what it is. That's how I work.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Evil

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

TSBU wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
TSBU wrote: Some people look like that, other people don't...
I'm not seeing the point in this XD.
Evil is a word with many different concepts attached by many different people, agree, so many of them, that the meaning is vague, it's like saying "love". But, like love, it's a word that exist in every part of the world with no many differences, so we usually can understand what is evil. I don't want to start a whole conversation about what exactly do I consider evil, if I do it, (the same if I do it with "house") we'll get to a point where my definition is different, but it's similar enough to share a word.
So, what do "beauty" looks like? But it exist, certeanly, you can understand when a person talk about beauty, and you can understand it when a person talk about evil. You can say that you have to do "Jaque mate" to win chess, but you can't explain all the moves...
See? I don't see the point, so I'm going to language philosophy XD.
I see it as a useful descriptive word for someone whose actions are particularly repellent, but it's still only a descriptive word. You talk as if it's something tangible that exists in itself.
Nothing "exist in inself" if what you mean by that is that it isn't related with the rest of reality and that relations are what make that thing been what it is. That's how I work.
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Then you are contradicting yourself. :D
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TSBU
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Re: Evil

Post by TSBU »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
TSBU wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: I see it as a useful descriptive word for someone whose actions are particularly repellent, but it's still only a descriptive word. You talk as if it's something tangible that exists in itself.
Nothing "exist in inself" if what you mean by that is that it isn't related with the rest of reality and that relations are what make that thing been what it is. That's how I work.
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Then you are contradicting yourself. :D
From your perspective. Maybe it would be useful if you say where.
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BradburyPound
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Re: Evil

Post by BradburyPound »

TSBU wrote:
BradburyPound wrote:Evil is what you make it.
It is not a force of nature. It is not out there. It is whatever we say we don't like.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxJrjV4PNXA
Not much of an argument.
Try Socrates.
http://ancphil.lsa.umich.edu/-/download ... Segvic.pdf
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Re: Evil

Post by BradburyPound »

TSBU wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
BradburyPound wrote:Evil is what you make it.
It is not a force of nature. It is not out there. It is whatever we say we don't like.
Indeed. People are stupid enough to believe it's anyone who's not on their 'side' and kills a lot of people. They are perfectly happy when it's 'their own' doing the killing.
That's the definition. I don't see it stupid :/
And it exist, of course XD.
Of course, there are people who kill and harm indiscriminately or nearly indiscriminately too, and people who say that everyone who kill is evil :(
Even when they are fair...
Nothing you have yet said begins to establish your notion that evil is a thing in itself.
I'd be willing to bet that many you would call evil, are themselves doing good in their own eyes. And those you think are going good are in the eyes of other good people doing evil.
The problem is not the abstracted ideas or forces of good and evil, but the actions and intentions of people and the values they hold about their actions.
There are even examples of people intentionally doing evil and some bright spark seeing their actions as good.
It's about personal values, perspective and most importantly the direct and personal effects such actions can have on you.
Let us imagine that a politician intends to do good by balancing the economy and cuts benefits that directly cause the deaths and suffering of a thousand people. Is this act evil, or good?
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TSBU
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Re: Evil

Post by TSBU »

BradburyPound wrote:
TSBU wrote:
BradburyPound wrote:Evil is what you make it.
It is not a force of nature. It is not out there. It is whatever we say we don't like.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxJrjV4PNXA
Not much of an argument.
Try Socrates.
http://ancphil.lsa.umich.edu/-/download ... Segvic.pdf
Oh, hell, do you think that the songs and the pictures are arguments? I just post them cause I remind them in the topic. I know what Socrates said about it.
And this thread has gone too far long time ago XD.
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TSBU
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Re: Evil

Post by TSBU »

BradburyPound wrote:
TSBU wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Indeed. People are stupid enough to believe it's anyone who's not on their 'side' and kills a lot of people. They are perfectly happy when it's 'their own' doing the killing.
That's the definition. I don't see it stupid :/
And it exist, of course XD.
Of course, there are people who kill and harm indiscriminately or nearly indiscriminately too, and people who say that everyone who kill is evil :(
Even when they are fair...
Nothing you have yet said begins to establish your notion that evil is a thing in itself.
In fact, I've said the oposite: Nothing "is a thing in itself". Or everyting if you want. Evil is just "as much a thing in itself as the rest".
I'd be willing to bet that many you would call evil, are themselves doing good in their own eyes. And those you think are going good are in the eyes of other good people doing evil.
And you would win the bet if you find a person who don't agree with you. I agree.


T
he problem is not the abstracted ideas or forces of good and evil, but the actions and intentions of people and the values they hold about their actions.
Something that is completely related with what they understand by good and evil. But if you are saying that what's in the dictionary is not important, I agree. Seems like you are arguing something you think is in me, but there isn't.
There are even examples of people intentionally doing evil and some bright spark seeing their actions as good.
Weren't you the one talking about Socrates? XD
It's about personal values, perspective and most importantly the direct and personal effects such actions can have on you.
Like everything.
Let us imagine that a politician intends to do good by balancing the economy and cuts benefits that directly cause the deaths and suffering of a thousand people. Is this act evil, or good?
Poli... yeah... I... forgot I was posting pictures :o
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BradburyPound
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Re: Evil

Post by BradburyPound »

TSBU wrote:It woud take a while to write a nice post, picking for different writers and for my own, translating, and so on.

So, simplifcation: yes, evil exist, evidently. Andit's not necesarily related to what you understand by "hate".
Since you seemed to have changed your mind. I now wonder what you meant by this?
Oh - no more pretty pictures please.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Evil

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

TSBU wrote: Image
What on earth is a 'tight' answer?
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Re: Evil

Post by Impenitent »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
TSBU wrote: Image
What on earth is a 'tight' answer?
torque wrench

-Imp
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TSBU
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Re: Evil

Post by TSBU »

BradburyPound wrote:
TSBU wrote:It woud take a while to write a nice post, picking for different writers and for my own, translating, and so on.

So, simplifcation: yes, evil exist, evidently. Andit's not necesarily related to what you understand by "hate".
Since you seemed to have changed your mind. I now wonder what you meant by this?
Oh - no more pretty pictures please.
If I start a good post, it would be writing about metaphisics, epistemology and philosophy of language before talking about ethics, it would take a while to explain all of that, maybe a minimum of three pages, thinking in the structure etc. And I'm pretty sure that it would be useless. No offense, but people are here to show that they know more, not to show anyone their truth, only to show (basically to themselves) that they are the smartest (or at least the rest are stupid), to show that they know more. They don't reall talk to each othe more than in the surface, they are here to play chess.
artisticsolution
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Re: Evil

Post by artisticsolution »

TSBU wrote: No offense, but people are here to show that they know more, not to show anyone their truth, only to show (basically to themselves) that they are the smartest (or at least the rest are stupid), to show that they know more. They don't reall talk to each othe more than in the surface, they are here to play chess.
That's one way to look at it. Another way is to stop thinking so badly of others and give them the benefit of the doubt. Has it ever occurred to you that just maybe, they are smarter than us? And if that is the case, then wouldn't it stand to reason they would be terrible bored with this existence without a game of' chess' to play?

I'm not saying that they are smarter...I am only asking you to suppose they are....and then to imagine what it would be like to have no one to talk to to engage your mind. If that is the case, then your bitterness for them is this 'evil' you speak of manifesting itself in you. Maybe instead, you could have empathy for them instead of jealousy? Maybe you could have understanding instead of feeling harmed? Maybe...just maybe...their goal here is not to one up you...but rather to communicate the reasoning that goes on in their head. Maybe it is an attempt to know if someone...anyone...out there has gone farther in their thinking process than they have? Or at least have had a thought that they didn't think about?

Could it be that when they argue with you, it is only to see if you might have a thought that hadn't occurred to them before? Not as a way to fight...but rather, as a way to learn?

Also, regarding your post where you said you want to destroy 'evil' ....what if you destroy "evil" and then find out (through science) that the person was not 'evil' but instead had a medical condition, that made him/her violent. What if in the future there is a cure for this condition? In that case, would you too need to seek medical attention for your disease of wanting to 'destroy' a fellow human with the same disease?

Just asking you to suppose. There is no more evidence of evil as there is for a disease of the brain that causes us to act out in an perceived 'evil' manner. Simply put...we just don't know what we don't know.
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