Why truth is necessary?

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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

artisticsolution wrote:
SpheresOfBalance wrote: For me, there is no room for 'any' lies, when it comes to a couple or a family, a 'real' relationship!
I don't know about that...I mean...not that you and I have a 'real' relationship...but I seem to remember a time or two you got very upset when I told you the truth...lol. One must always use discretion when living with another or face the possibility of living with a tyrant...it is not the same online...where you can simply step away from the computer so you don't have to 'hear' another person's 'truth'.

Having lived in a house filled with men for the past 25 years...I have noticed that men are sometimes way to confident that their 'opinion' = truth.

How do you know that your family is really telling you the truth or not...taking into account that sometimes one doesn't want to hear what another has to say?

There should always be room to be less than perfect in a family...even if it means that one is being less than perfect when they lie.

At least that is how I like to live ...in a relaxed atmosphere where a little white lie to save ones feelings is not something to come unglued about and where one can feel free to be themselves without the constant threat of not having "any room" for their flaws. But that's just me...I love my family...faults and all...and they are always forgiven.
Well I think, that as to the truth of emotion, as perceived on an internet forum, it's just an illusion, as text can be made to sound like anything one believes another might believe, in an attempt to convey a message of seriousness. But as to the rest, I see that lies, no matter how slight are a statement of trust, or rather no trust in the other person. To me a family is all about truth and trust, because if it doesn't exist in a family, then it surely shall exist nowhere.
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The Voice of Time
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

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Aronn00 wrote:Hello, I have to make an oppinion essay on the theme: "It is the truth necessary in family, economical, political and social life and why?".
I have to write about one of those 4, so i chose family and so far this i what i did: I do agree that honesty is one of the most important elements in a family. This way, in a family it is necessary that there should not be any secret, one should never lie or hide things that happened or things they have done, and that is what makes it happy.one should not hesitate telling every fact about everything including the bad facts. When one committed on doing bad things or even if anything bad happened to them, they should be able to share it to their family and so everyone will be able to help them find their solution because two heads are better than one right?
Now I don't really know how to continue. If someone can help me I would be really grateful. And sorry for my bad grammar, english not my matern language.
And important element could be that truth should be served in doses, but eventually all should be out. For instance, if you're a teenage girl who just got pregnant through your boyfriend, it is perhaps best to mention that you have a boyfriend before you mention that you've gotten pregnant, so your parents are not like "WTF! HAVE YOU BEEN OUT ON PARTIES WHO DID THIS TO YOU HOW DID IT HAPPEN OH MY GOD I MUST CALL THE POLICE!".

In another way it's also probably best that the first time you tell about where babies come from you don't start with the rather unanaesthetic scenes of a bloody birth or the rough sex part that came before it, perhaps reserve them both for later, but, if we are gonna be cliche, probably more like "when mom and daddy really love each other... blah blah blah".

Or if you've stolen cash and return home with a police escort because of petty theft you might want to start by saying "it's not that bad mom/dad", of course they'll likely disagree but it's better than whatever else their imagination might conjure up.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by artisticsolution »

SpheresOfBalance wrote:
artisticsolution wrote:
SpheresOfBalance wrote: For me, there is no room for 'any' lies, when it comes to a couple or a family, a 'real' relationship!
I don't know about that...I mean...not that you and I have a 'real' relationship...but I seem to remember a time or two you got very upset when I told you the truth...lol. One must always use discretion when living with another or face the possibility of living with a tyrant...it is not the same online...where you can simply step away from the computer so you don't have to 'hear' another person's 'truth'.

Having lived in a house filled with men for the past 25 years...I have noticed that men are sometimes way to confident that their 'opinion' = truth.

How do you know that your family is really telling you the truth or not...taking into account that sometimes one doesn't want to hear what another has to say?

There should always be room to be less than perfect in a family...even if it means that one is being less than perfect when they lie.

At least that is how I like to live ...in a relaxed atmosphere where a little white lie to save ones feelings is not something to come unglued about and where one can feel free to be themselves without the constant threat of not having "any room" for their flaws. But that's just me...I love my family...faults and all...and they are always forgiven.
Well I think, that as to the truth of emotion, as perceived on an internet forum, it's just an illusion, as text can be made to sound like anything one believes another might believe, in an attempt to convey a message of seriousness. But as to the rest, I see that lies, no matter how slight are a statement of trust, or rather no trust in the other person. To me a family is all about truth and trust, because if it doesn't exist in a family, then it surely shall exist nowhere.
So then you admit to lying online...I don't understand the point of lying online but ok.

I too believe a family is all about trust...but that 'trust' should not only be reserved for honesty but also for being at home and loved no matter what. Home is a sanctuary to come to and be yourself. If one day you are having a bad day and lash out in anger ...to me that might be a lie...as maybe you didn't mean what you said at that moment, then I think the kind thing for a family to do is forget and forgive...as everyone will have an off day....Just to be and relax...not to feel every little thing needs to be addressed.

If you can't trust a family to forgive you if you happen to tell a white lie then I think it would be miserable to coexist in a house where you could never ever make a mistake of misspeak.

I do think that where people go wrong is thinking that perfection actually exists and expecting people to live up to ones own ideals. I think eventually people will start feeling resentful if expected to act a certain way....at least I would.
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

SpheresOfBalance wrote: For me, there is no room for 'any' lies, when it comes to a couple or a family, a 'real' relationship!
artisticsolution wrote:
SpheresOfBalance wrote:
artisticsolution wrote:I don't know about that...I mean...not that you and I have a 'real' relationship...but I seem to remember a time or two you got very upset when I told you the truth...lol. One must always use discretion when living with another or face the possibility of living with a tyrant...it is not the same online...where you can simply step away from the computer so you don't have to 'hear' another person's 'truth'.

Having lived in a house filled with men for the past 25 years...I have noticed that men are sometimes way to confident that their 'opinion' = truth.

How do you know that your family is really telling you the truth or not...taking into account that sometimes one doesn't want to hear what another has to say?

There should always be room to be less than perfect in a family...even if it means that one is being less than perfect when they lie.

At least that is how I like to live ...in a relaxed atmosphere where a little white lie to save ones feelings is not something to come unglued about and where one can feel free to be themselves without the constant threat of not having "any room" for their flaws. But that's just me...I love my family...faults and all...and they are always forgiven.
Well I think, that as to the truth of emotion, as perceived on an internet forum, it's just an illusion, as text can be made to sound like anything one believes another might believe, in an attempt to convey a message of seriousness. But as to the rest, I see that lies, no matter how slight are a statement of trust, or rather no trust in the other person. To me a family is all about truth and trust, because if it doesn't exist in a family, then it surely shall exist nowhere.
So then you admit to lying online...I don't understand the point of lying online but ok.
No it's not a lie to present something in such a way so as to give it an accent, so as to be dramatic, it's, (you're gonna love this), "Artistic License."

I too believe a family is all about trust...but that 'trust' should not only be reserved for honesty but also for being at home and loved no matter what. Home is a sanctuary to come to and be yourself. If one day you are having a bad day and lash out in anger ...to me that might be a lie...as maybe you didn't mean what you said at that moment, then I think the kind thing for a family to do is forget and forgive...as everyone will have an off day....Just to be and relax...not to feel every little thing needs to be addressed.
What's unconditional love got to do with honesty? Nothing in my book. Unconditional love goes unconditionally. And the fact that truth is all that matters, bears no reflection on true love. Or does 'honesty' and 'true' love have something in common?


If you can't trust a family to forgive you if you happen to tell a white lie then I think it would be miserable to coexist in a house where you could never ever make a mistake of misspeak.
To lie is no mistake, it is purposely perpetrated, And to me a so called "white lie" is only when it benefits the one being told the lie. For instance, your husband says, "I know you're planning me a surprise birthday party," and you say, "no I'm not." In this case you are lying just to maintain his surprise, it is for him that you lie, not for you. Any lie that suits only your interests, is not a white lie, it's as black as pitch. But if you lie to another in order to help the other, as you truly have helping in mind as it's delivered, regardless of how it's taken, is considered a white lie. Such that if you know that obesity can kill, and yet you tell your husband, "no, you're not fat, come here and gimme som-o-dat," sorry but that lie is not white, but black as pitch, if on the other hand you were ignorant of such knowledge, then it was a white lie as you tried to spare his feelings. But I don't see where that could ever be the case, because everyone knows that fatness is the opposite of fitness, whether or not they're aware that there is increased coronary heart decease or not.


I do think that where people go wrong is thinking that perfection actually exists and expecting people to live up to ones own ideals. I think eventually people will start feeling resentful if expected to act a certain way....at least I would.
Well, it's true that some would hate to do what's right, and cry about it, if someone demanded it, as it was in the families best interests. It takes all kinds, winners and losers. Winners do not cry, because they are expected to maintain a high standard of integrity. One is as good as the amount of work they put into it.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by reasonvemotion »

We begin telling lies from a very early age. Children, very young children, use lies to manipulate the situation and from there it escalates, upwards and onwards throughout our lives.


Don't fret Spheres, you are in good dishonest company.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

reasonvemotion wrote:We begin telling lies from a very early age. Children, very young children, use lies to manipulate the situation and from there it escalates, upwards and onwards throughout our lives.
WRONG!!!!!! You forgot the most important part, which is that:

IT'S THE PARENTS AND THOSE PARENT-LIKE THAT TEACH THE CHILDREN TO LIE, AS THE CHILDREN SILENTLY WATCH AND MIMIC, AS THAT'S THE WAY THEY LEARN.


THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A BAD CHILD, ONLY BAD PARENTS!!!!!!!!!

Don't fret Spheres, you are in good dishonest company.
Now what was that you just said??????

You know I love you, right? ;-)
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by reasonvemotion »

Spheres,

My twisted sense of humour.

Take it easy. Its all good. Now.
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

reasonvemotion wrote:Spheres,

My twisted sense of humour.

Take it easy. Its all good. Now.
As if I don't know that, it's not about me, it's about all those out there that are clueless. Of course it's just that I understand it clearly, who better to speak of such things?
artisticsolution
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by artisticsolution »

SpheresOfBalance wrote:
No it's not a lie to present something in such a way so as to give it an accent, so as to be dramatic, it's, (you're gonna love this), "Artistic License."
LOL I do like it! I take your points....but it still sounds to me as if you are saying, "Do as I say not as I do."

But I am all over that Artistic License and unconditional love...and hope everyone can find such.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

artisticsolution wrote:
SpheresOfBalance wrote:
No it's not a lie to present something in such a way so as to give it an accent, so as to be dramatic, it's, (you're gonna love this), "Artistic License."
LOL I do like it! I take your points....but it still sounds to me as if you are saying, "Do as I say not as I do."

But I am all over that Artistic License and unconditional love...and hope everyone can find such.
You know I love you, right? ;-)
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by reasonvemotion »

reasonvemotion wrote:

We begin telling lies from a very early age. Children, very young children, use lies to manipulate the situation and from there it escalates, upwards and onwards throughout our lives.
WRONG!!!!!! You forgot the most important part, which is that:

IT'S THE PARENTS AND THOSE PARENT-LIKE THAT TEACH THE CHILDREN TO LIE, AS THE CHILDREN SILENTLY WATCH AND MIMIC, AS THAT'S THE WAY THEY LEARN.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A BAD CHILD, ONLY BAD PARENTS!!!!!!!!!

Don't fret Spheres, you are in good dishonest company.
Now what was that you just said??????

You know I love you, right? ;-)

Yes, I hear you Spheres.

But the fact is you come across as being very personal.

So much so, that I feel as if I am there with you witnessing these bad parents. We were all children once. We all began our lives in the same way. Even these bad parents you continually refer to. To blame them in capital letters seems rather childish to me. We all have the ability to move on.......if we wish to. As we become adult, we look at these parents from a different perspective and we see their behaviour as an adult, perhaps analysing it and finally understanding it, or even seeing some of it in ourselves. Without doing this we cannot 'grow up', let go of the anger, that by now is only doing damage.

We all carry our own private memories and they are scattered with battles and very hard fought victories.

By now, as adults, there surely most be some victory, (the victory of understanding) as we look back, enough at least, to extinguish the "love" of anger.

You know I love you, right?
That is the perfect example of a lie.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

reasonvemotion wrote:
reasonvemotion wrote:

We begin telling lies from a very early age. Children, very young children, use lies to manipulate the situation and from there it escalates, upwards and onwards throughout our lives.
WRONG!!!!!! You forgot the most important part, which is that:

IT'S THE PARENTS AND THOSE PARENT-LIKE THAT TEACH THE CHILDREN TO LIE, AS THE CHILDREN SILENTLY WATCH AND MIMIC, AS THAT'S THE WAY THEY LEARN.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A BAD CHILD, ONLY BAD PARENTS!!!!!!!!!

Don't fret Spheres, you are in good dishonest company.
Now what was that you just said??????

You know I love you, right? ;-)

Yes, I hear you Spheres.

But the fact is you come across as being very personal.
Yes and here lies the problem. We are debating as to the facts, and I mentioned a fact that trumped yours, of course you shall be a little put off, especially since you are a student of psychology. But so am I, possibly for many more years longer, than you. And while I know of this all too well, and I speak of it often, as you have noticed, there are still bad parents screwing up innocent babies, so what do you think it is, I'm not saying it enough? Like all things, 'truth' travels the grapevines of the world, it is one way to be a causal force of change. You may argue, that's your prerogative, but I vehemently disagree. I have traveled the world extensively, and have found childhood games of the same, in all corners, funny how they traveled around the globe, and no I'm not talking of those that have been published. You shall probably hear of this, here, again and again, you might even hear of it from a new neighbor...


So much so, that I feel as if I am there with you witnessing these bad parents. We were all children once. We all began our lives in the same way. Even these bad parents you continually refer to. To blame them in capital letters seems rather childish to me. We all have the ability to move on.......if we wish to. As we become adult, we look at these parents from a different perspective and we see their behaviour as an adult, perhaps analysing it and finally understanding it, or even seeing some of it in ourselves. Without doing this we cannot 'grow up', let go of the anger, that by now is only doing damage.

We all carry our own private memories and they are scattered with battles and very hard fought victories.

By now, as adults, there surely most be some victory, (the victory of understanding) as we look back, enough at least, to extinguish the "love" of anger.
You assume to know me more than you do.
You know I love you, right?
That is the perfect example of a lie.
Not at all, you obviously have a different kind of love in mind. I do love you, in the way that I love you.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by Advocate »

The purpose of all knowledge, wisdom, and understanding is actionable certainty.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by commonsense »

If The Truth is not knowable absolutely, and Truth is necessary to a family’s existence, then a family cannot obtain its sine qua non and cannot exist.

Families do exist, quite obviously.

Obviously Truth cannot be necessary for families.

If The Truth is knowable only relativisticlly, then “family” has no definite meaning.

A group of humans who are connected emotionally is definitely a family.

Then The Truth is not knowable relativisticlly.

If The Truth is not knowable either absolutely or relativisticlly, families cannot obtain a necessary element for existence.

Again, it is obvious that there are families.

Neither absolute nor relative Truth can be necessary for families.

Trueness is encompassed by The Truth.

It can be said that the same applies to true statements made by family members.

Neither Truth nor trueness is required by families.

This is consistent with telling little white lies to spare the feelings, as family members do from time to time.
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Re: Why truth is necessary?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

'Knowledge', thus truth, is required for the animal to feel secure. It's understood, whether actual or not, to drive off fear of the 'unknown'. It's all about the belief of control of ones environment. So in a world of uncertainty, pitfalls and ignorance, etc., it's indeed necessary, if only to believe one has control of their life. It satisfies/informs enough to step forward and take a chance, even though we cannot know what we don't know, we can believe we may.
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