The Philosophy of Obesity

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Veritas Aequitas
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The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

One good example of why Philosophy-proper is essential can be demonstrated by the Philosophy of Obesity.

Those who put down 'philosophy-in-general' without the ability to grasp its essence, e.g.
All Philosophy Is Bunk by Saunders.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=34168
are ignorant and a liability to humanity.

What is the Essence of Philosophy?
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=34177
Philosophy-proper [its essence] is a fundamental function within all humans but the problem is, it is not active in the majority of people. Thus there is a need to expedite to trigger the philosophical function in the majority in the future. This will depend on those philosophers who has a more active philosophy-function within them.

The Problem of Obesity has now reached pandemic levels throughout the world and it is going out of control and getting worse by the day because the supposedly experts and authorities are merely addressing the symptoms and superficial issues rather than tacking the root causes.

This inability to dig into the root causes is due to one not invoking the philosophy-proper impulse.

There are a small percentage of people who has the impulse of philosophy-proper to deliberate on the problem of obesity but they are usually outnumbered by the narrow-minded dogmatic more dominant ignoramus.
Here is a summary on the point by Sculptor.

The effective approach to resolve the Problem of Obesity is to invoke the Philosophy-proper impulse [appropriately defined] to view the problem more holistically in its wider and complex perspective using all available tools and resources to seek continual optimal solutions. I believe the most effective label to this unique effective holistic approach is to called it 'philosophy-proper'.

The point is one cannot be hasty and jumping to conclusion but rather upon the philosophy-proper impulse to suspend judgment then to review all the interdependent variables related the Problem of Obesity. Note the following System Chart linking all the complex variable related the Problem of Obesity.
Other than the main sets, not the complex connecting lines in the background linking the individual variable.
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/For ... 1_40441706

Image

My point:
The Philosophy and Problem of Obesity is one good example to exemplify the need to invoke 'philosophy-proper' to deal with the problem effectively.
Thus All Philosophy Is NOT Bunk and useless as the ignoramus would insist.

Your Views on the Philosophy of Obesity and Philosophy-Proper?
promethean75
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by promethean75 »

"I am not at all against obesity, but against consecrated obesity; my skinniness is not opposed to fatness... nor is it an enemy of indulgence, nor of dieting... and least of all of obesity —in short, it is not an enemy of true interests; it rebels not against obesity, but against sacred obesity, not against binge eating, but against sacred binge eating, not against fat bodies, but against sacred fat bodies." - Max Stirner, The Fatman and His Own
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

promethean75 wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:00 pm "I am not at all against obesity, but against consecrated obesity; my skinniness is not opposed to fatness... nor is it an enemy of indulgence, nor of dieting... and least of all of obesity —in short, it is not an enemy of true interests; it rebels not against obesity, but against sacred obesity, not against binge eating, but against sacred binge eating, not against fat bodies, but against sacred fat bodies." - Max Stirner, The Fatman and His Own
Yes, "consecrated" obesity is a problem especially when it is taken in an ideological or dogmatic manner.

Point is obesity is not absolutely a bad thing.
There are those who are obese but are within the 'healthy' range if the fats are concentrated on the subcutaneous [just below the skin] region. Note sumo wrestlers for example.
There are those who are skinny outside but are internally 'fat' and are unhealthy where the fats are heavily loaded in the visceral regions and surround all the critical organs.

Image

One can appear thin, but the internal organs are surrounded by fats, i.e. visceral fats.

Image

However, in general and % wise, obesity is an indicator that something not-so-good is happening in the body. Obesity is also associated or correlated [not a determinate cause] for many of the chronic diseases [heart, diabetes, cancer, etc.] of civilization.

So before jumping to any conclusion, the exact proximate or even ultimate root cause of the obesity must be established.

The point is, the problem surrounding obesity and the associated chronic diseases is very complex [note the image above].

However the problem at present is there is one group of medical scientists i.e. the Calories in Calories Out [CICO] group who jumped to a hasty conclusion that problem of obesity is due to merely ASSOCIATED [not the cause] that 'calories intake exceed calories expenditure' due to too much fats and sedentary attitudes.

They [CICO group] readily admit they do not know the exact proximate root cause of the obesity but yet they are influencing Laws that impose of what Americans* should eat to be healthy, i.e. eat less fats [especially saturated], proteins [red meats] and more carbohydrates, with other essential elements.
* those in the Army, civil servants, school meals, etc. and the majority of the public also follow suit as influenced by the media. This ideology is also extended to the rest of the world.
This has exacerbated the chronic obesity and the associated diseases since the CICO's ideas dominated the scene to influence the authorities.

OTOH, the other main group of scientists oppose the CICO diet [the Energy-Balance Model - EBM] and they promote a low carbohydrate, high saturated fat diet and has supported their thesis with proven evidence in the reduction of obesity, diabetes therefrom the related chronic diseases.

Despite the reasonable [not very strong] evidences, the EBM is overshadowed by the CICO on the belief [based on no solid evidence] that too much fats is bad for the heart based on the ideology of one medical scientist, Ancel Keys.

This is a problem of philosophy where facts are sacrificed for ideology [faith] habitualized by customs, monetary influence and egos.
Last edited by Veritas Aequitas on Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:52 am, edited 2 times in total.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Just a survey...

1. Do you think saturated fats and too much fats are bad for health?

2. Do you agree carbohydrates [basic C6H12O6] without restriction is not a bad thing?

3. Note the EBM group propose that >20% carbohydrate per meal is equivalent to poisoning the person over the long run. Agree or Disagree?
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Here’s the circular logic of Obesity
  • Why do we get fat?
    Because we’re overeating*.
    How do we know we’re overeating?
    Because we’re getting fatter.
    And why are we getting fatter?
    Because we’re overeating.
*overeating imply taking more calories than we expend out due to gluttony, sedentariness, laziness, lack of willpower, etc.

This is why philosophy is so critical in solving the Problem of Obesity.
Impenitent
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Impenitent »

having an abundance of food is not necessarily a bad thing

is it up to your government master to decide who has enough?

-Imp
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RCSaunders
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by RCSaunders »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 8:49 am One good example of why Philosophy-proper is essential can be demonstrated by the Philosophy of Obesity.

Those who put down 'philosophy-in-general' without the ability to grasp its essence, e.g.
All Philosophy Is Bunk by Saunders, are ignorant and a liability to humanity.
More bunk. Since when is the purpose of philosophy is to solve personal, lack-of-self-discipline problems.
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Sculptor
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Sculptor »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Jan 31, 2022 8:28 am Here’s the circular logic of Obesity
  • Why do we get fat?
    Because we’re overeating*.
    How do we know we’re overeating?
    Because we’re getting fatter.
    And why are we getting fatter?
    Because we’re overeating.
*overeating imply taking more calories than we expend out due to gluttony, sedentariness, laziness, lack of willpower, etc.

This is why philosophy is so critical in solving the Problem of Obesity.
Are you fat?
User avatar
Sculptor
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Sculptor »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:42 am Just a survey...

1. Do you think saturated fats and too much fats are bad for health?

2. Do you agree carbohydrates [basic C6H12O6] without restriction is not a bad thing?

3. Note the EBM group propose that >20% carbohydrate per meal is equivalent to poisoning the person over the long run. Agree or Disagree?
1. Too much food is bad for you. On the matter of fats, there as been a long term misconception due to the highly selective 7 Country Study of Ancel Keys that wrongly attributed heart disease to staurated fats. Funded by Canola this study directed a generation of people to eat "healthy" vegetable fats which are now seen as very damaging to human health. All seed based fats; TRANS fats are harmful and natural fats are not only not harmful but are essential to health. Olive oil, and other naturally occuring fats, even butter fat is better that Corn Oil.

2, Humans are evolved to eat primarily meat. Sugars are rare in nature and the unprecedented availability of refined Carbs are harmful and implicated in the massive diabetic epidemic. Unrestricted access to carbohydrates causes insulin resistence and there is growing evidence that this is a primary cause of arteriosclerosis. Cholesterol is deposited on the arteries to protect them against excess sugar and insulin in the blood.

3. I do not know who the EBM group is but I think that we would do well to closesly mimic the palaeolithic diet where carbs are an autumn event and leads to the lay down of fat for the winter. In modern times this winter never comes. Generally food should look like food. We have only had bread since 10kbp in the Levant and this has spread to the rest of the world. We are not prepared in an evolutionary sense to cope.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Sculptor wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 12:03 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Jan 31, 2022 8:28 am Here’s the circular logic of Obesity
  • Why do we get fat?
    Because we’re overeating*.
    How do we know we’re overeating?
    Because we’re getting fatter.
    And why are we getting fatter?
    Because we’re overeating.
*overeating imply taking more calories than we expend out due to gluttony, sedentariness, laziness, lack of willpower, etc.

This is why philosophy is so critical in solving the Problem of Obesity.
Are you fat?
Once I had a high BMI but has now reduced it to a 'good' reading of 22 and hope to maintain that at all times. Thus my interest in obesity and the Philosophy of Obesity.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Sculptor wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 12:14 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:42 am Just a survey...

1. Do you think saturated fats and too much fats are bad for health?

2. Do you agree carbohydrates [basic C6H12O6] without restriction is not a bad thing?

3. Note the EBM group propose that >20% carbohydrate per meal is equivalent to poisoning the person over the long run. Agree or Disagree?
1. Too much food is bad for you. On the matter of fats, there as been a long term misconception due to the highly selective 7 Country Study of Ancel Keys that wrongly attributed heart disease to staurated fats. Funded by Canola this study directed a generation of people to eat "healthy" vegetable fats which are now seen as very damaging to human health. All seed based fats; TRANS fats are harmful and natural fats are not only not harmful but are essential to health. Olive oil, and other naturally occuring fats, even butter fat is better that Corn Oil.
You seem to be well verse and in depth with the subject of obesity.

The interesting philosophical consideration is why people like Ancel Keys are so dogmatic and ideological with their views to the extent that millions of people are now suffering within the obesity epidemic and many people had died of the related chronic diseases.
2, Humans are evolved to eat primarily meat. Sugars are rare in nature and the unprecedented availability of refined Carbs are harmful and implicated in the massive diabetic epidemic. Unrestricted access to carbohydrates causes insulin resistence and there is growing evidence that this is a primary cause of arteriosclerosis. Cholesterol is deposited on the arteries to protect them against excess sugar and insulin in the blood.
Agree. I have been researching in depth into the bio-chemistry of the above subjects. Note Fructose which is not glucose and it is not measured in a glucose-meter is much more dangerous. Fructose goes direct to the liver and excess of that cause Fatty Liver [..I was a casualty of Fatty Live but now have reversed it] and all its related problems.
3. I do not know who the EBM group is but I think that we would do well to closesly mimic the palaeolithic diet where carbs are an autumn event and leads to the lay down of fat for the winter. In modern times this winter never comes. Generally food should look like food. We have only had bread since 10kbp in the Levant and this has spread to the rest of the world. We are not prepared in an evolutionary sense to cope.
I need to make a correction here, the Energy Balance Model EBM is similar to the CICO model but use Energy instead of Calories. Thus obesity is due to taking in more energy than expending energy.

The opposing models are the EBM [CICO] versus the Carbohydrate-Insulin Model [CIM].

CIM believe strongly excessive insulin secretion [irregular basis] related to high consumption of Carbohydrates [C6H12O6] is the main underlying culprit of obesity and all its related disease.

The Paleo [Paleolithic] diet makes sense. The extreme form is the Carnivore Diet where only meat is eaten [e.g. the Eskimos of the old day who had survived from thousands of year in the Artic regions.] There are many reported success from anecdotal cases. Dr. Shawn Baker is one of the pioneers.
https://www.youtube.com/c/ShawnBakerMD/videos

The other CIM diet is the Keto Diet [ex Atkins] which has also reported thousands of good results on sustainable weight loss, diabetes, etc.

The reservations is while the above had been adopted by our ancestors of thousands years ago with success, there is no long term study that it is fool proof with modern man in a modern society.

I personally follow a low-carb, protein and fiber diet with no strict % like the Keto diet and with daily intermittent fasting and regular water fasting. So far I have good results with weight loss and results from blood tests.
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Sculptor
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Sculptor »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 6:59 am
Sculptor wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 12:14 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:42 am Just a survey...

1. Do you think saturated fats and too much fats are bad for health?

2. Do you agree carbohydrates [basic C6H12O6] without restriction is not a bad thing?

3. Note the EBM group propose that >20% carbohydrate per meal is equivalent to poisoning the person over the long run. Agree or Disagree?
1. Too much food is bad for you. On the matter of fats, there as been a long term misconception due to the highly selective 7 Country Study of Ancel Keys that wrongly attributed heart disease to staurated fats. Funded by Canola this study directed a generation of people to eat "healthy" vegetable fats which are now seen as very damaging to human health. All seed based fats; TRANS fats are harmful and natural fats are not only not harmful but are essential to health. Olive oil, and other naturally occuring fats, even butter fat is better that Corn Oil.
You seem to be well verse and in depth with the subject of obesity.

The interesting philosophical consideration is why people like Ancel Keys are so dogmatic and ideological with their views to the extent that millions of people are now suffering within the obesity epidemic and many people had died of the related chronic diseases.
2, Humans are evolved to eat primarily meat. Sugars are rare in nature and the unprecedented availability of refined Carbs are harmful and implicated in the massive diabetic epidemic. Unrestricted access to carbohydrates causes insulin resistence and there is growing evidence that this is a primary cause of arteriosclerosis. Cholesterol is deposited on the arteries to protect them against excess sugar and insulin in the blood.
Agree. I have been researching in depth into the bio-chemistry of the above subjects. Note Fructose which is not glucose and it is not measured in a glucose-meter is much more dangerous. Fructose goes direct to the liver and excess of that cause Fatty Liver [..I was a casualty of Fatty Live but now have reversed it] and all its related problems.
3. I do not know who the EBM group is but I think that we would do well to closesly mimic the palaeolithic diet where carbs are an autumn event and leads to the lay down of fat for the winter. In modern times this winter never comes. Generally food should look like food. We have only had bread since 10kbp in the Levant and this has spread to the rest of the world. We are not prepared in an evolutionary sense to cope.
I need to make a correction here, the Energy Balance Model EBM is similar to the CICO model but use Energy instead of Calories. Thus obesity is due to taking in more energy than expending energy.
I have to make an intervention here. Calories are energy. The calorie is a unit of energy. The only way we put in energy is through calories.
Despite being a blunt stick CICO is an indelibly true statement. You cannot loose weight unless you manage tomake a calorie deficit.
Clearly with most simplifications it misses the nuance. one might decide to embark upon a calorie limited diet. But this always leads to a reduction of BMI as the body goes into a starvation mode. The body needs fewer calories and the only way to get your deficit is to reduce calories further - this is a downward spiral and usually ends with the dieter giving up, where upon the body makes you hungry to get back what it thinks you need.

There are ways to avoid that. Fasting does not invoke starvation mode like a little and often eating practice. When you fast the body does the opposite. Using the Palaeolithic model the body is preparing the body to seek food in times of scarcity. Once the glycogen is burned up, the body can start to work on actual fat. If you trickly feed on a low calorie diet the glycogen gets preserved by the body initiating austerity by lowering BMI.

The opposing models are the EBM [CICO] versus the Carbohydrate-Insulin Model [CIM].

CIM believe strongly excessive insulin secretion [irregular basis] related to high consumption of Carbohydrates [C6H12O6] is the main underlying culprit of obesity and all its related disease.

The Paleo [Paleolithic] diet makes sense. The extreme form is the Carnivore Diet where only meat is eaten [e.g. the Eskimos of the old day who had survived from thousands of year in the Artic regions.] There are many reported success from anecdotal cases. Dr. Shawn Baker is one of the pioneers.
https://www.youtube.com/c/ShawnBakerMD/videos

The other CIM diet is the Keto Diet [ex Atkins] which has also reported thousands of good results on sustainable weight loss, diabetes, etc.

The reservations is while the above had been adopted by our ancestors of thousands years ago with success, there is no long term study that it is fool proof with modern man in a modern society.

I personally follow a low-carb, protein and fiber diet with no strict % like the Keto diet and with daily intermittent fasting and regular water fasting. So far I have good results with weight loss and results from blood tests.
We are on the same page
I'm on low carb OMD fasting. I do not avoid natural fat.
Of the three food groups there are essential amino acids and essential fatty acids, but there are NO essential carbohydrates.
Although glucose is an important blood constituent, the body makes all it needs by neoglucogenesis.
If you are fllowing a low carb AND low fat diet this means that you are following a high protein diet by definition. That can be problematic since when the body metabolises protein instead of carbs it throws nitrogenous waste in the the blood in the form of uric acid,- urea. These toxins place pressure on the kidneys, making your pee dark. Older people or people with kidney problems or like me those that suffer with gout have to take great care.
You need very little protein. Grown people only need it for repair. Additionally if you are choosing to fast the body encourages apoptosis and autophagy, which is a recycling system.

Fat cells.
One a fat cell is made, they tend to stay; either full of fat, or wanting to be filled with fat.
Without Apoptosis and autophagy, when you start using your fat cells, those cells do not get recycled. And so when you end your low calorie diet they send out hormones to get replenished, causing you to lay the fat back down immediately you end the diet.
Only with fasting do these fat cells die and get recycled, permanently ending them.
Veritas Aequitas
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Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:41 am

Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Sculptor wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 12:47 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 6:59 am
Sculptor wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 12:14 am

1. Too much food is bad for you. On the matter of fats, there as been a long term misconception due to the highly selective 7 Country Study of Ancel Keys that wrongly attributed heart disease to staurated fats. Funded by Canola this study directed a generation of people to eat "healthy" vegetable fats which are now seen as very damaging to human health. All seed based fats; TRANS fats are harmful and natural fats are not only not harmful but are essential to health. Olive oil, and other naturally occuring fats, even butter fat is better that Corn Oil.
You seem to be well verse and in depth with the subject of obesity.

The interesting philosophical consideration is why people like Ancel Keys are so dogmatic and ideological with their views to the extent that millions of people are now suffering within the obesity epidemic and many people had died of the related chronic diseases.
2, Humans are evolved to eat primarily meat. Sugars are rare in nature and the unprecedented availability of refined Carbs are harmful and implicated in the massive diabetic epidemic. Unrestricted access to carbohydrates causes insulin resistence and there is growing evidence that this is a primary cause of arteriosclerosis. Cholesterol is deposited on the arteries to protect them against excess sugar and insulin in the blood.
Agree. I have been researching in depth into the bio-chemistry of the above subjects. Note Fructose which is not glucose and it is not measured in a glucose-meter is much more dangerous. Fructose goes direct to the liver and excess of that cause Fatty Liver [..I was a casualty of Fatty Live but now have reversed it] and all its related problems.
3. I do not know who the EBM group is but I think that we would do well to closesly mimic the palaeolithic diet where carbs are an autumn event and leads to the lay down of fat for the winter. In modern times this winter never comes. Generally food should look like food. We have only had bread since 10kbp in the Levant and this has spread to the rest of the world. We are not prepared in an evolutionary sense to cope.
I need to make a correction here, the Energy Balance Model EBM is similar to the CICO model but use Energy instead of Calories. Thus obesity is due to taking in more energy than expending energy.
I have to make an intervention here. Calories are energy. The calorie is a unit of energy. The only way we put in energy is through calories.
Despite being a blunt stick CICO is an indelibly true statement. You cannot loose weight unless you manage to make a calorie deficit.
Clearly with most simplifications it misses the nuance. one might decide to embark upon a calorie limited diet. But this always leads to a reduction of BMI as the body goes into a starvation mode. The body needs fewer calories and the only way to get your deficit is to reduce calories further - this is a downward spiral and usually ends with the dieter giving up, where upon the body makes you hungry to get back what it thinks you need.
CICO is a general rule but there are exceptions to it when dealing with obesity and weight loss.

1. The hormone that is responsible in storing fats in the cells is Insulin.
2. Thus if one eat high calories food that do not trigger the secretion of Insulin, they will not cause fat to be stored thus no weight gain in terms of fats storage.

Note: 5 high-calorie foods that may actually help you lose weight
https://www.insider.com/high-calorie-fo ... oss-2018-7

This is why in a Keto diet one can eat as much fats [very high in calories but healthy] but still will lose weights.
HOW EATING FAT MAKES YOU THIN
https://www.eatthebutter.org/fat-makes-you-thin

This is the CIM model that is contrary to the CICO model [which do not take into account the type of food and how they trigger insulin secretion].
There are ways to avoid that. Fasting does not invoke starvation mode like a little and often eating practice. When you fast the body does the opposite. Using the Palaeolithic model the body is preparing the body to seek food in times of scarcity. Once the glycogen is burned up, the body can start to work on actual fat. If you trickly feed on a low calorie diet the glycogen gets preserved by the body initiating austerity by lowering BMI.
Agree with the above which is similar to the fasting principles used for Low Carb High Fats reasonable proteins diet that does not trigger irregular and excess insulins.

The opposing models are the EBM [CICO] versus the Carbohydrate-Insulin Model [CIM].

CIM believe strongly excessive insulin secretion [irregular basis] related to high consumption of Carbohydrates [C6H12O6] is the main underlying culprit of obesity and all its related disease.

The Paleo [Paleolithic] diet makes sense. The extreme form is the Carnivore Diet where only meat is eaten [e.g. the Eskimos of the old day who had survived from thousands of year in the Artic regions.] There are many reported success from anecdotal cases. Dr. Shawn Baker is one of the pioneers.
https://www.youtube.com/c/ShawnBakerMD/videos

The other CIM diet is the Keto Diet [ex Atkins] which has also reported thousands of good results on sustainable weight loss, diabetes, etc.

The reservations is while the above had been adopted by our ancestors of thousands years ago with success, there is no long term study that it is fool proof with modern man in a modern society.

I personally follow a low-carb, protein and fiber diet with no strict % like the Keto diet and with daily intermittent fasting and regular water fasting. So far I have good results with weight loss and results from blood tests.
We are on the same page
I'm on low carb OMD fasting. I do not avoid natural fat.
Of the three food groups there are essential amino acids and essential fatty acids, but there are NO essential carbohydrates.
Although glucose is an important blood constituent, the body makes all it needs by neoglucogenesis.
If you are fllowing a low carb AND low fat diet this means that you are following a high protein diet by definition. That can be problematic since when the body metabolises protein instead of carbs it throws nitrogenous waste in the the blood in the form of uric acid,- urea. These toxins place pressure on the kidneys, making your pee dark. Older people or people with kidney problems or like me those that suffer with gout have to take great care.
You need very little protein. Grown people only need it for repair. Additionally if you are choosing to fast the body encourages apoptosis and autophagy, which is a recycling system.
Agree, if too much protein and not used, will end up with uric acid leading to gout, etc.

I am following a low carb, reasonable fat and protein.
The general recommendation for protein is 0.8 gram per kg of body weight.
Since the conversion of protein into amino acids are limited within certain hours after meals, the consumption of protein must be spread over different meals because proteins not use cannot be stored. If you are doing OMD then your protein cannot exceed the per meal quantity.
But since I am doing weight lifting I can take in more proteins to build and maintain muscles which I supplement with Whey protein powder.
Btw, have you heard of sarcopenia,
From the time you are born to around the time you turn 30, your muscles grow larger and stronger.
But at some point in your 30s, you start to lose muscle mass and function. The cause is age-related sarcopenia or sarcopenia with aging.

Physically inactive people can lose as much as 3% to 5% of their muscle mass each decade after age 30.
Even if you are active, you’ll still have some muscle loss.
https://www.webmd.com/healthy-aging/gui ... with-aging
Fat cells.
One a fat cell is made, they tend to stay; either full of fat, or wanting to be filled with fat.
Without Apoptosis and autophagy, when you start using your fat cells, those cells do not get recycled. And so when you end your low calorie diet they send out hormones to get replenished, causing you to lay the fat back down immediately you end the diet.
Only with fasting do these fat cells die and get recycled, permanently ending them.
Agree.
Walker
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Walker »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 8:49 am
The Problem of Obesity has now reached pandemic levels throughout the world and it is going out of control and getting worse by the day because the supposedly experts and authorities are merely addressing the symptoms and superficial issues rather than tacking the root causes.
It's a spiritual situation.

- Like the effects of tobacco, eating to the fullness that causes obesity alters one’s state of consciousness away from the present moment.
- Eating to obesity removes one from the present moment.
- Eating to obesity changes The Now into something other than what Now is, right now.
- This happens chemically.
- If one can manage to stay in the present Now, as it is and no matter what chemical changes it brings to the brain, one can move mountains.
- Literally, one can move mountains of fat off one’s poor skeleton, and off what makes that poor skeleton, move.
- What personally amazes me about obese folks is how immensely strong they must be to haul that mass around, which makes an obese, graceful pirouette simply awesome for its display of strength.

Obese people have immense strength to attract all that food.

Proper placement of that strength is all that's needed to end obesity.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: The Philosophy of Obesity

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Walker wrote: Wed Feb 02, 2022 9:03 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 8:49 am
The Problem of Obesity has now reached pandemic levels throughout the world and it is going out of control and getting worse by the day because the supposedly experts and authorities are merely addressing the symptoms and superficial issues rather than tacking the root causes.
It's a spiritual situation.

- Like the effects of tobacco, eating to the fullness that causes obesity alters one’s state of consciousness away from the present moment.
- Eating to obesity removes one from the present moment.
- Eating to obesity changes The Now into something other than what Now is, right now.
- This happens chemically.
- If one can manage to stay in the present Now, as it is and no matter what chemical changes it brings to the brain, one can move mountains.
- Literally, one can move mountains of fat off one’s poor skeleton, and off what makes that poor skeleton, move.
- What personally amazes me about obese folks is how immensely strong they must be to haul that mass around, which makes an obese, graceful pirouette simply awesome for its display of strength.

Obese people have immense strength to attract all that food.

Proper placement of that strength is all that's needed to end obesity.
Fundamentally it is due to lack of willpower.
There are so many cases where the obese were informed they will die soon if they don't stop eating food that make them fat, but yet they cannot control their hunger impulses and eventually they died.

Some did have the willpower to start on a weight loss program and then lose weight, note the reality show 'Biggest Loser'.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bigge ... TV_series)
But it was reported 99% of those who lost lots of weight eventually gained back their original weight and some even became heavier than their original weight. So this is again a problem of lack of willpower.

But based on statistical evidences, the spiritual or lack of willpower at present cannot be the determinant and effective factor to deal with the current obesity epidemic.

You mentioned the 'chemical' factor which is evidently proven by some to be the critical root cause of obesity at present.
So we must focus on the 'chemical' root causes.
Thus if we can control these chemical root causes driving the hunger impulse, then we can control obesity without any consideration for willpower.

The main chemical at play here is Insulin triggered by carbohydrates.
The present Carbohydrate-Insulin Model resolve obesity by managing the secretion of Insulin to prevent a continuous hunger impulse.
Since the hunger impulse if managed optimally there is no excessive eating of the wrong food and thus no obesity. QED.
There is no need to resort to any spiritual nor control of willpower with the CIM model.
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