There being no truth as you say you can't claim to be true what you are claiming.
No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Unfortunately you are so bankrupt of knowledge. Your misleading articles are a disservice to humanity.RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:54 pmWell absolutely none of that is true.Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:12 am Your 'true assertions' are empty and meaningless.
What is truth is conformance to reality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth
Reality is all-there-is which comprised humans and all other things.
All humans are programmed to survive till the inevitable.
To survive effectively, humans need to know the truth of reality.
But reality is subject to infinite regression.
To survive within infinite regression, humans seek patterns within reality.
To grasp patterns within reality, humans established various Framework and System of knowledge [FSK] to seek conformance with reality i.e. truths.
Being conditioned by humans [diversified & fallible] efforts, there will be degrees of veracity of the truths from the different FSK.
The degrees of the veracity of truth will depend on the credibility of the FSK.
viewtopic.php?p=489338#p489338
At present the scientific truths of the scientific FSK is the most credible to justify their utilities to the survival of the individuals and of humanity.
All other FSKs and their truths are relative and lower in degrees of credibility to the Scientific FSK.
For example, if Scientific truths are rated at 95/100, then theistic truths [criteria assessed] would be rated, say, 10/100 or less.
Therefore 'truth' is conformance to reality - having degrees relative to the credibility of its specific FSK - and is generated for its utilities and ultimately geared toward the survival of the individuals and humanity.
What are you trying to put over?
I spoke of scientific truths, you don't agree they exists and are useful?
Scientific truth
Louis A. Girifalco
Scientific truth is based on facts.
Philosophy, religion, feelings, and prejudice have nothing to do with science.
Only facts matter.
Verified, reproducible facts are the bedrock of scientific truth.
The facts are used to construct theories which describe the detailed relations among large numbers of facts and their origin from common roots. Each element of a theory corresponds to some part of nature and, in this sense, scientific theories describe nature.
- RCSaunders
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Why do you keep quoting idiots and referring to philosophical and academic crackpots. The whole point of my post is to point out the obscene perversion of the meaning of truth by virtually every philosopher and so-called intellectual in history. Just for the hell of it, try thinking for yourself.Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sun Oct 24, 2021 7:06 amUnfortunately you are so bankrupt of knowledge. Your misleading articles are a disservice to humanity.RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:54 pmWell absolutely none of that is true.Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:12 am Your 'true assertions' are empty and meaningless.
What is truth is conformance to reality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth
Reality is all-there-is which comprised humans and all other things.
All humans are programmed to survive till the inevitable.
To survive effectively, humans need to know the truth of reality.
But reality is subject to infinite regression.
To survive within infinite regression, humans seek patterns within reality.
To grasp patterns within reality, humans established various Framework and System of knowledge [FSK] to seek conformance with reality i.e. truths.
Being conditioned by humans [diversified & fallible] efforts, there will be degrees of veracity of the truths from the different FSK.
The degrees of the veracity of truth will depend on the credibility of the FSK.
viewtopic.php?p=489338#p489338
At present the scientific truths of the scientific FSK is the most credible to justify their utilities to the survival of the individuals and of humanity.
All other FSKs and their truths are relative and lower in degrees of credibility to the Scientific FSK.
For example, if Scientific truths are rated at 95/100, then theistic truths [criteria assessed] would be rated, say, 10/100 or less.
Therefore 'truth' is conformance to reality - having degrees relative to the credibility of its specific FSK - and is generated for its utilities and ultimately geared toward the survival of the individuals and humanity.
What are you trying to put over?
I spoke of scientific truths, you don't agree they exists and are useful?
Scientific truth
Louis A. Girifalco
Scientific truth is based on facts.
Philosophy, religion, feelings, and prejudice have nothing to do with science.
Only facts matter.
Verified, reproducible facts are the bedrock of scientific truth.
The facts are used to construct theories which describe the detailed relations among large numbers of facts and their origin from common roots. Each element of a theory corresponds to some part of nature and, in this sense, scientific theories describe nature.
Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
I do not think it does. Truth is the label used when facts meet belief. Those that are predisposed to think of truth like that can use words that support that, but even the link make it clear that truth is a relation.RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:57 pmThe problem with the correspondance theory is how it's presented. If you study all the various versions (and there are several), they all end up reifying, "truth," into some kind of metaphysical thing, with language like, "truth bearing elements," as though it were some kind of independent existent that had any meaning separate from propositions. What I'm emphasizing is: truth has no meaning or existence at all independent of human conscious thought.Sculptor wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:44 pmPhilosophers usually call it correspondence, conformity, congruence, agreement, accordance, signification, representation, or reference.RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:39 pm
How does an, "idea," match anything in the real world.? Don't things match when they have some common attribute or characteristic, like the same size, or shape, or color? I'm not disputing what you've said, just trying to understand what you mean. I don't see how any idea can have any attribute or characteristic that would match something, "in the real world."
Perhaps it's what you mean by, "idea." I'm thinking of, "idea," as a simple concept, like, "box," or, "empty," which, all by thenselves are is neither true or false. If you mean by, "idea," a proposition, like, "the box is empty," for example, that's exactly what I said. If the box, in reality, is empty, the proposition, "the box is empty," is true, but if there is something in the box, the proposition is not true.
If that's all you mean, I agree. What you are saying does sound like the, "correspondence," theory of truth, however, which I do not agree with.
Truth theory is quite a big topic.
You might try Hospers.
Actually what you have already describes is much the same as correspondance.
It more about language and people's choices. A similar problem exists when people talk about evolution, so |I do sympathise. But the theory is okay.
Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Bollocks
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Truth is omnipresent. It's simply a matter of access [of which we have zero], although that idea does not preclude us from getting closer to the truth. And this is the key as the closer you can get to the truth, the more accurate your responses can potentially be.Sculptor wrote: ↑Sun Oct 24, 2021 6:52 pmBollocks
Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
simplicity wrote: ↑Sun Oct 24, 2021 7:02 pmTruth is omnipresent.
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
I understand your proposition, that truth is just a statement that attributes truth to something else.
Symmetry and contrast have a war with one another, due to the fact of mind and recording; people have thoughts, and then they have documentations.
Thought = 1
Record of thought = 2
1 and 2 = symmetry and contrast, or either symmetry or contrast
Symmetry and contrast have a war with one another, due to the fact of mind and recording; people have thoughts, and then they have documentations.
Thought = 1
Record of thought = 2
1 and 2 = symmetry and contrast, or either symmetry or contrast
- Immanuel Can
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Is that true?
- RCSaunders
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Ignoring context is ignorance. Evading context is a lie.
If you read the post, it's obvious it is true.
- Immanuel Can
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
It can't be. Remember, "there's not such thing as the truth."RCSaunders wrote: ↑Mon Oct 25, 2021 1:57 amIf you read the post, it's obvious it is true.
But if it IS true, then what you said was false: there is an absolute truth, namely, that what you said is absolutely true.
You can't get both: you can't claim there's no truth, and then frame it as a true statement.
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Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
WHO ARE YOU! [show your credentials] to judge that virtually every philosopher and so-called intellectual in history are perverts re 'truth'.RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:51 am Why do you keep quoting idiots and referring to philosophical and academic crackpots. The whole point of my post is to point out the obscene perversion of the meaning of truth by virtually every philosopher and so-called intellectual in history. Just for the hell of it, try thinking for yourself.
What you have presented are merely dogmatic and bigoted views that you an intellectual 'God'.
It is a good thing to think for oneself in contrast to following ideas blindly.
In addition one has to be a good thinker before thinking for oneself, but on the contrary you are not a good thinker as evident with the messed-up ideas you have presented.
In general, the principle of all improvements [physical and mental] has always been conditioned to something prior. The obvious is displayed in evolution.
All positive contributions [mental and physical] by humans had been referenced to some past ideas.
Do you understand the phrase,
"Standing on the shoulders of giants"
Like I say, it very stupid to adopt the ideas of others to the extreme of doing it blindly. What ideas of 'truth' from others, the ideas must nevertheless be verified using one's critical thinking abilities [as verified and proven] plus where the ideas must be justified and supported with its positive utilities.The phrase Standing on the shoulders of giants
is a metaphor which means "Using the understanding gained by major thinkers who have gone before in order to make intellectual progress"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standing_ ... _of_giants
Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Yes I can.Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:18 am You can't get both: you can't claim there's no truth, and then frame it as a true statement.
It's true that there is no truth. It is a perfectly meaningful claim.
If you are going to insist that I can't do what I have just done, go ahead and explain how I just did the impossible.
Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
People also have feelings about truth. At the simplest level honesty is the basis of any society because a society runs on rails of people meaning what they say and keeping promises. Most people know this, even when society is fractured into sub groups some of them criminal sub groups.
At psychological level people's feelings about truth often amount to longings for or aimings-for more honesty , more truth, in social relationships.
Truth has been reified for the metaphysical level of feelings about truth.It may be the reification that you don't approve of.
Re: No Such Thing as, "The Truth"
Sadly true. People who feel their petty beliefs are true is at the heart of all calumnies of the world.Belinda wrote: ↑Mon Oct 25, 2021 11:16 amPeople also have feelings about truth. At the simplest level honesty is the basis of any society because a society runs on rails of people meaning what they say and keeping promises. Most people know this, even when society is fractured into sub groups some of them criminal sub groups.
But these are not "truth" but a pale fake truth.
At psychological level people's feelings about truth often amount to longings for or aimings-for more honesty , more truth, in social relationships.
Truth has been reified for the metaphysical level of feelings about truth.It may be the reification that you don't approve of.