Healthcare Workers should be Fired

[Belinda]

Are you saying that no medic should help you when you are injured or dying until and unless you have given the medic express permission to do so?

I'm not even saying any medic should have the right to forgo the treatment of any patient. I'm saying that patients have a right to determine their own care. That's quite a different proposition.

I agree as far as the patient has the status and function of a patient vis a vis a medic. But as a member of society vis a vis other members of society the individual has a different status and function.

There is difference between role of patient and role of member of society. These roles attach to individual hygiene and public hygiene respectively.

For instance if you are an unhygienic wild man of the woods this matters only to yourself. If you have a family hygiene responsibility begins. If you are preparing food for thousands your hygiene responsibility is so important it's enshrined in law.
A very infective fever such as covid is very much a matter for public hygiene.

[commonsense]

No one has a right to use his body to punch someone in the face. Why would anyone have a right to cause harm to others in any fashion?

[henry quirk]

The logic is straight-forward simple...

Lordship over one's self is a given. If a person decides not to receive treatment for something - affecting ONLY that person almost certain to be in contact with others - he/she has the absolute right to do so. But *if your body is a vessel for transmission of a killer virus then that right must be questioned. **Rights are not and never have been absolute. It's not possible for any such situation to exist without annulling the concept of rights which always defines a balance within a society since no single individual is the sole inheritor of those rights. ***There are conditions when certain rights MUST be temporarily suspended until that which caused its curtailment is resolved or controlled. Whatever rights we have were not created on top of Mt. Sinai.

*Not to be intemperate and hostile but this smells of guilty till proven innocent.

**In other words: a man is his own except when TPTB say otherwise.

***Funny how such suspensions are never reversed. Funny how the suspenders retain the power they've acquired. Funny like a *heart attack.




*I truly hope referrin' to a heart attack isn't intemperate or hostile. My apologies if it is.

[commonsense]

To all those who object to the infringement of individual rights:

IF, having decided for yourself and having found yourself in agreement with TPTB regarding getting your vaccination, would you take the vaccine?

Likewise, if TPTB were to desist from pushing the public to get vaccinated, wouldn’t you find yourself in agreement with the PTB?

There are no tricks here. I just want to establish that I am understanding your position.

[commonsense]

The logic is straight-forward simple...

Lordship over one's self is a given. If a person decides not to receive treatment for something - affecting ONLY that person almost certain to be in contact with others - he/she has the absolute right to do so. But *if your body is a vessel for transmission of a killer virus then that right must be questioned. **Rights are not and never have been absolute. It's not possible for any such situation to exist without annulling the concept of rights which always defines a balance within a society since no single individual is the sole inheritor of those rights. ***There are conditions when certain rights MUST be temporarily suspended until that which caused its curtailment is resolved or controlled. Whatever rights we have were not created on top of Mt. Sinai.

*Not to be intemperate and hostile but this smells of guilty till proven innocent.

**In other words: a man is his own except when TPTB say otherwise.

***Funny how such suspensions are never reversed. Funny how the suspenders retain the power they've acquired. Funny like a *heart attack.




*I truly hope referrin' to a heart attack isn't intemperate or hostile. My apologies if it is.

This is a different matter when the PTB legitimately represent the majority of the public.

And where do you get the idea that such suspensions are never reversed? Or are you still waiting for WWII rationing to be abolished?

[commonsense]

No one has a right to use his body to punch someone in the face. Why would anyone have a right to cause harm to others in any fashion?

Yes, why would that be alright, anti-vaxers?

[commonsense]

I do not think we'd have a problem with sacking a waitress who refused to wash their hands after taking as a shit at work.

How will you know the waitress didn't wash her hands?

You'll only know if customers become ill, an investigation is mounted, and the waitress is shown, by way of her poor hygiene, to be the cause of the illness.

No one stands at the door of the restroom to test her, then issue a clean hands certificate, each time she goes to have a movement or void her bladder or blow her nose or check her makeup or switch out her tampon.

Why don't we do that?

All it takes is one customer who witnesses the waitress leaving the women’s restroom without washing her hands, one customer who assumes the waitress defecated and who reports the waitress to a manager.

A manager is prone to accept the unsubstantiated word of a single customer over the protests of any employee.

[commonsense]

My natural rights notions have at their core 'a man belongs to himself'. His life, liberty, and property are his. His life, liberty,
and property are only forfeit, in part or whole, when he knowingly, willingly, without just cause, deprives another, in part or whole, of life, liberty, or property.

Yet you willfully deprive others of their health and potentially their lives.

[henry quirk]

To all those who object to the infringement of individual rights:

IF, having decided for yourself and having found yourself in agreement with TPTB regarding getting your vaccination, would you take the vaccine?

Likewise, if TPTB were to desist from pushing the public to get vaccinated, wouldn’t you find yourself in agreement with the PTB?

There are no tricks here. I just want to establish that I am understanding your position.

My position: I'll get jabbed when and if I deem it necessary.

I won't be bulldogged in to gettin' the jab by family, friends, society, or The State.

Currently: I see no reason to get jabbed, and, even if I were inclined to be jabbed, the evidence, as I see it, indicates the jab is woefully ineffective and potentially harmful.

Tomorrow: we'll see. Tomorrow, a jab may be introduced I find acceptable. Tomorrow, I may see the need to accept this improved jab.

But: not today.

As I say: if you want the jab, please, accept it. I will not.

[commonsense]

Don't have the vaccine. Who gives a shit? One less moron in the world. Just stop spreading bullshit.
Fuck off.

Amen.

[commonsense]

I am not a conspiracy theorist which means I prefer to trust what is significantly probable. Scientists are probably significantly trustworthy, politicians a lot less so.

Many health care workers are not recruited from among the better educated in a population due to poor rates of pay for the lower grades of health care workers, and at the same time health care workers are in short supply.

In times past nurses were a disciplined force like soldiers and there was no question of their non-compliance, perhaps sadly , that is no longer the case.

This was worth repeating here.

[henry quirk]

My natural rights notions have at their core 'a man belongs to himself'. His life, liberty, and property are his. His life, liberty,
and property are only forfeit, in part or whole, when he knowingly, willingly, without just cause, deprives another, in part or whole, of life, liberty, or property.

Yet you willfully deprive others of their health and potentially their lives.

By not accepting the jab?

Okay, let's look at that.

Your notion is: by not acceptin' the jab I'm a threat to the health and lives of others. Understand, I'm not talkin' generalities here. Your assertion is: I, personally, am a threat to others if I am not vaccinated against beer virus.

If this is your assertion then you have to prove it. Prove that I, Henry Quirk, am a public hazard, a bonafide threat, becuz I will not accept the jab.

We have, here in America, a means for you to do so. Sue me. Take me to court. Plead your case.

[commonsense]

Camps in Australia for people who don't get the vaccine?

For the beer-virus exposed. The refusenik canps are in the works.

Camps?

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

[vegetariantaxidermy]

To all those who object to the infringement of individual rights:

IF, having decided for yourself and having found yourself in agreement with TPTB regarding getting your vaccination, would you take the vaccine?

Likewise, if TPTB were to desist from pushing the public to get vaccinated, wouldn’t you find yourself in agreement with the PTB?

There are no tricks here. I just want to establish that I am understanding your position.

My position: I'll get jabbed when and if I deem it necessary.

I won't be bulldogged in to gettin' the jab by family, friends, society, or The State.

Currently: I see no reason to get jabbed, and, even if I were inclined to be jabbed, the evidence, as I see it, indicates the jab is woefully ineffective and potentially harmful.

Tomorrow: we'll see. Tomorrow, a jab may be introduced I find acceptable. Tomorrow, I may see the need to accept this improved jab.

But: not today.

As I say: if you want the jab, please, accept it. I will not.

Do you take any medications at all? Everything has some kind of potential side effect.
The main reason for getting as many people vaccinated as possible is so that hospitals don't get overwhelmed, so life can get back to relative normality for everyone. Nothing sinister or 'conspiratorial' :roll
There are people with other health problems and other emergencies who can't get the attention they need because of fuckwits who refuse to be vaccinated. Even your hero Trumpy has been vaccinated

[henry quirk]

Do you take any medications at all? Everything has some kind of potential side effect.

Nope. At 59 I'm healthy as a [insert your favorite robust, hard to kill, animal]. When the day comes my physician advises medicines, I'll be the one who decides that I will or won't take his advice.


The main reason for getting as many people vaccinated as possible is so that hospitals don't get overwhelmed.

That's the line, yeah. It may even be true. Now, explain how that obligates me to take the jab?


Nothing sinister or 'conspiratorial' -- so life can get back to relative normality for everyone.

Mebbe, mebbe not. Stiil not seein' where I'm obligated to accept the jab.


There are people with other health problems and other emergencies who can't get the attention they need because of fuckwits who refuse to be vaccinated.

Mebbe, mebbe not. Specifically, though, you have the same burden Commonsense does: Prove that I, Henry Quirk, am a public hazard, a bonafide threat, becuz I will not accept the jab.


Even your hero Trumpy has been vaccinated

So what?