Why Humans Will Never Understand 4D Space

What is the basis for reason? And mathematics?

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SteveKlinko
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Re: Why Humans Will Never Understand 4D Space

Post by SteveKlinko » Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:07 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:37 pm
SteveKlinko wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:06 pm
This thread is not about the Metaphysical meaning of understanding. Thank you for the book suggestion, but even though I have not read it I have read enough about it to know what it is about.
I am not talking about metaphysics. I am pointing at the meta-epistemic problem of self-skepticism: How do I know that I understand?

I am pointing at the empirical problem of understanding: What does "understanding" feel like?
For this particular issue of Understanding I think that if you can Visualize a 3D object as being a Flat Object then you would have Understood the problem. As a Conscious experience it would Feel good to be able to do this kind of Visualization. Understanding would also result in a Feeling of Completeness and Satisfaction. In any case Understanding will have a Conscious experiential aspect to it.

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Eodnhoj7
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Re: Why Humans Will Never Understand 4D Space

Post by Eodnhoj7 » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:42 pm

SteveKlinko wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 4:29 pm
I have always more or less been on a quest to understand the Universe. I decided to start with understanding the more fundamental aspects of the Universe and then build on that understanding to understand more complicated things. But the question came up as to what was the most fundamental thing in the Universe. Elementary Particle Physics seemed to be a good place to start. What could be more fundamental than Electrons, Protons, and Neutrons? Well you quickly find out that Elementary Particles are just made out of Energy. So Energy seemed to be the thing to start with. Eventually I learned that Energy can arise out of Space itself. So what does this mean about our concept of Space? It would seem that Energy might be made out of Space. So then the regression back to find the most fundamental thing ended up with trying to understanding Space, which of course is Nothing. How do you study Nothing?

Eventually I realized that Space was not really Nothing it was Something. Since Space is Something it could exist or not exist. The common notion that Space is an ever existent background Thing that extends out infinitely in three directions could be wrong. There could be different kinds of Spaces besides our 3D Space. There could be a 4D Space. There could be no Space. The possibility of no Space is almost impossible to grasp by the 3D human brain.

I thought that if I could show that 4D Space is a workable reality for a Universe , then I would be able to convince myself that Space is a Thing just as Energy and Matter are Things. The concept of Nothing then becomes a concept of Absolute Nothing where there is no Matter, Energy, or Space.

To understand 4D Space I thought I should try to experience what it would be like to be a 4D Conscious being living in and moving around in a 4D World. I generated many Animations to help me do this. I think the Animations were helpful but I still feel that I am unable to exactly experience a 4D World in the same way an actual 4D being would. The key thing that we must do is understand how a 4D being can see a 3D Hyperplane as a Flat object. Anything else you think you know is irrelevant until you understand that.

But even though I was not able to experience 4D in the way I had hoped I believe that the Animations have shown me that a 4D World is possible and therefore that our 3D Space is only one type of Space. There can be No Space if there can be 3D Space or 4D Space.

The one thing I learned from the Animations is that the reason I don't understand 4D Space is because I am too embedded in this 3D Universe. I can think about 4D Space in theory and use all the different techniques for visualizing it but my 3D brain will never let me fully understand it. I do not think anyone can. We would need a 4D Brain to do this.

To be able to see in our 3D World we have a Visual Cortex that is roughly a flat (but folded) 2D patch of a little more than 1 billion Neurons. If it were a square patch it would be about 32000 Neurons on each side. A 2D being would only need a line of these Neurons or 32000 of them. The whole 2D Brain Neuron count would be scaled down by a factor of 32000. A 2D Brain would be 32000 times less intelligent than a 3D Brain. A 4D Visual Cortex by analogy would have to be a cube of Neurons with 32000 Neurons on all sides. It would be a 3D Hyper Plane so the 4D being would view it as flat. A 4D being's Visual Cortex would have 32000 times more Neurons than a 3D being's Visual Cortex. The 4D Brain Neuron count would be scaled up by a factor of 32000 and a 4D being will probably be 32000 times more intelligent than we are.

So the conclusion we have to come to is that we, and I mean all of us 3D beings, can never know what it would be like to actually be a 4D being. We are just not smart enough. You might think you understand 4D using one of the techniques but you never really get there. You need to be able to see our 3D Space as being Flat. I think this is an important realization for Philosophy and the study of the limits of our ability to understand things.
This right here ^

Space can be perpetually created as well considering any expansion of space exists relative to space and is a self-measuring system in these respects; and sets a foundation for consciousness.

As a foundation for consciousness it sets further foundations for not just psychology and the sciences, but most specifically math and logic as well.



The Dot as the foundation of all phenomenon:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=24948&p=371714&hili ... ce#p371714

The Creation of Space:
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=25473&p=382766&hil ... ce#p382766

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Gary Childress
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Re: Why Humans Will Never Understand 4D Space

Post by Gary Childress » Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:57 pm

I understand the "standard" three physical dimensions and I understand time. I've heard some scientists talk about even more "dimensions" than just those and that other "dimensions" possibly exist in some way shape or form, however, I have no idea how I could know about or have any real, tangible, discernable experience of any of them except in some sort of indirect mathematical exercise.

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QuantumT
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Re: Why Humans Will Never Understand 4D Space

Post by QuantumT » Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:27 pm

Gary Childress wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:57 pm
I understand the "standard" three physical dimensions and I understand time. I've heard some scientists talk about even more "dimensions" than just those and that other "dimensions" possibly exist in some way shape or form, however, I have no idea how I could know about or have any real, tangible, discernable experience of any of them except in some sort of indirect mathematical exercise.
The 11 dimensions of string theory (or M theory) belong in the realm of particles, or as we call it: The quantum realm.
They do not exist above the quantum realm, and they are unprovable mathematical constructs. We can not use them to explain any macro phenomenons.

But that has not stopped spiritual people, with no scientific understanding, from exploiting the concept to their own gain.

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