How On Earth Can We Be Free?

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bahman
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by bahman »

Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am
Age wrote: Sat Feb 06, 2021 11:52 pm

This is because "this topic" is about YOUR BELIEFS and YOUR CLAIMS, and because you can NOT back up and support YOUR BELIEFS and YOUR CLAIMS, you can NOT help ANY one further, including 'YOU'.
I am just wondering why do you bother when you think I am a liar?
Because a considerable amount of the time you are NOT intentionally lying.

I KNOW 'you' are REALLY 'trying' your hardest to just express what you BELIEVE is the truth of things.

I even KNOW that 'you' are sometimes VERY CLOSE to thee ACTUAL Truth of 'things', and that with a little help and guidance you could be expressing thee One and ONLY ACTUAL Truth of 'things' by now.

I 'bother' because I KNOW I could help 'you', that is; if you wanted some help in expressing 'that' what you BELIEVE deep down IS True.
Cool. Perhaps we can write down something when we agree on a subject for example. But I am not lying. Ok?
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am Are you here to find liars?
What is your concern with the 'liar' tag? EVERY adult human being LIES. And, MOST of that LYING it could be argued, and will be discovered, is completely UNINTENTIONAL and just arises because of the LIES that they have endured through their childhoods. These adults are NOT doing ANY thing DECEIVINGLY WRONG on PURPOSE. They are, however, just deceiving "themselves" because they have been and were deceived "themselves" PREVIOUSLY.
Ok.
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am Is it fun for you?
I only have to listen to my family members, or even just listen to this 'person' writing this speak to "others" outside of this forum" to "find liars". Finding "liars" is EXCEPTIONALLY EASY but NOT necessarily fun at all. Finding and noticing "them" was just a consequence of learning how the Mind and the brain ACTUALLY WORK.

Therefore, I am NOT here in this forum "to find liars". I just respond more to those who make CLAIMS more strongly than "others" do.

I only CHALLENGE and QUESTION "those" who ASSUME or BELIEVE that what they are saying is true.

I do this so that I might possibly find a way to OPEN UP a person who is ALREADY ASSUMING and/or BELIEVING that they know truth.

People who are ALREADY OPEN is NOT what I am LOOKING FOR here, in this forum. Learning how to OPEN UP those who are ALREADY CLOSED is my main goal and intention here, in this forum.
Ok.
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am Do you have anything else more useful to do?
I have some VERY USEFUL to do. That is; to write some words down. But, I have found there is NO use writing those words down WHILE people are CLOSED and STILL BELIEVING some 'things'.

Once I FIND how to OPEN UP adult human beings, and spark that NATURAL CURIOSITY within "them", AGAIN, like they ONCE WERE, then I will KNOW how to write those words, properly AND correctly, which I want to SHARE.
Ok.
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am I cannot help it when your non-sense questions pop up one after another either.
Are you suggesting here that 'you' are COMPLETELY and UTTERLY USELESS in this situation?
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am You have to try very hard to make a coherent picture of what I am trying to say here. It is simple though but it is a lot.
So, for 'me' to UNDERSTAND 'you', what you are saying here is that it is ALL up to 'me', correct?

Could it be a POSSIBILITY that the 'picture', which 'you' say 'you' are 'trying to' paint for 'us', readers, here, I have ALREADY SEEN, and thus also ALREADY KNOW, FULLY?

Or, is this just NOT A POSSIBILITY?
We are minds that interact through the physical. I think that is obvious. The rest is just details which I go through it gradually. Like there was a beginning. No-physical to physical is necessary since there was a beginning and there is no God. Etc.
Advocate
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by Advocate »

[quote=bahman post_id=494882 time=1612689075 user_id=12593]
We are minds that interact through the physical. I think that is obvious. The rest is just details which I go through it gradually. Like there was a beginning. No-physical to physical is necessary since there was a beginning and there is no God. Etc.
[/quote]

The mind that we are does not interact with the physical, it's just a different metaphor for the patterns that exist within the physical substrate. They're only different in semantic terms.

There was never any beginning to the universe. Is just is, and always has been. There is literally no such thing as a beginning or end end in Actuality, only changes of state.
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bahman
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by bahman »

Advocate wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 2:58 pm
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:11 am We are minds that interact through the physical. I think that is obvious. The rest is just details which I go through it gradually. Like there was a beginning. No-physical to physical is necessary since there was a beginning and there is no God. Etc.
The mind that we are does not interact with the physical, it's just a different metaphor for the patterns that exist within the physical substrate. They're only different in semantic terms.
The mind cannot emerge from the physical substrate since the mind is conscious. You cannot get consciousness out of something which is not conscious.
Advocate wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 2:58 pm There was never any beginning to the universe. Is just is, and always has been. There is literally no such thing as a beginning or end end in Actuality, only changes of state.
Of course, there is a beginning for the universe. I have two arguments for that in here.
Advocate
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by Advocate »

[quote=bahman post_id=494949 time=1612722845 user_id=12593]
Of course, there is a beginning for the universe. I have two arguments for that in [url=viewtopic.php?f=16&t=31648]here[/url].
[/quote]

Beginnings only exist in relation to intent, and are entirely mind-bound. The universe has always existed and always will exist and there is literally no other possible option.
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bahman
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by bahman »

Advocate wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:09 pm
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 7:34 pm Of course, there is a beginning for the universe. I have two arguments for that in here.
Beginnings only exist in relation to intent, and are entirely mind-bound.
No. It exists objectively.
Advocate wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:09 pm The universe has always existed and always will exist and there is literally no other possible option.
Such a delusion.
Advocate
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Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:27 am
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by Advocate »

[quote=bahman post_id=494962 time=1612728924 user_id=12593]
[quote=Advocate post_id=494961 time=1612728568 user_id=15238]
[quote=bahman post_id=494949 time=1612722845 user_id=12593]
Of course, there is a beginning for the universe. I have two arguments for that in [url=viewtopic.php?f=16&t=31648]here[/url].
[/quote]
Beginnings only exist in relation to intent, and are entirely mind-bound.
[/quote]
No. It exists objectively.

[quote=Advocate post_id=494961 time=1612728568 user_id=15238]
The universe has always existed and always will exist and there is literally no other possible option.
[/quote]
Such a delusion.
[/quote]

Whatever may have come before the universe as we perceive and understand it now is still universe. If there was a big bang, whatever was the state of existence before it was still universe. Even whatever exists after heat death is still universe.
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bahman
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by bahman »

Advocate wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:35 pm
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:15 pm
Advocate wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:09 pm Beginnings only exist in relation to intent, and are entirely mind-bound.
No. It exists objectively.
Advocate wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:09 pm The universe has always existed and always will exist and there is literally no other possible option.
Such a delusion.
Whatever may have come before the universe as we perceive and understand it now is still universe. If there was a big bang, whatever was the state of existence before it was still universe. Even whatever exists after heat death is still universe.
There was no universe before Big Bang. We are not in heat death therefore there was a Big Bang.
Age
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Re: Can We Be Free?

Post by Age »

bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:11 am
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am
I am just wondering why do you bother when you think I am a liar?
Because a considerable amount of the time you are NOT intentionally lying.

I KNOW 'you' are REALLY 'trying' your hardest to just express what you BELIEVE is the truth of things.

I even KNOW that 'you' are sometimes VERY CLOSE to thee ACTUAL Truth of 'things', and that with a little help and guidance you could be expressing thee One and ONLY ACTUAL Truth of 'things' by now.

I 'bother' because I KNOW I could help 'you', that is; if you wanted some help in expressing 'that' what you BELIEVE deep down IS True.
Cool. Perhaps we can write down something when we agree on a subject for example. But I am not lying. Ok?
There is ABSOLUTELY NO USE on writing something down when a subject is ALREADY agreed upon.

I said I could help you express/write down the RIGHT words that fit in PERFECTLY with thee ACTUAL truth of 'things'.
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:11 am
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am Are you here to find liars?
What is your concern with the 'liar' tag? EVERY adult human being LIES. And, MOST of that LYING it could be argued, and will be discovered, is completely UNINTENTIONAL and just arises because of the LIES that they have endured through their childhoods. These adults are NOT doing ANY thing DECEIVINGLY WRONG on PURPOSE. They are, however, just deceiving "themselves" because they have been and were deceived "themselves" PREVIOUSLY.
Ok.
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am Is it fun for you?
I only have to listen to my family members, or even just listen to this 'person' writing this speak to "others" outside of this forum" to "find liars". Finding "liars" is EXCEPTIONALLY EASY but NOT necessarily fun at all. Finding and noticing "them" was just a consequence of learning how the Mind and the brain ACTUALLY WORK.

Therefore, I am NOT here in this forum "to find liars". I just respond more to those who make CLAIMS more strongly than "others" do.

I only CHALLENGE and QUESTION "those" who ASSUME or BELIEVE that what they are saying is true.

I do this so that I might possibly find a way to OPEN UP a person who is ALREADY ASSUMING and/or BELIEVING that they know truth.

People who are ALREADY OPEN is NOT what I am LOOKING FOR here, in this forum. Learning how to OPEN UP those who are ALREADY CLOSED is my main goal and intention here, in this forum.
Ok.
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am Do you have anything else more useful to do?
I have some VERY USEFUL to do. That is; to write some words down. But, I have found there is NO use writing those words down WHILE people are CLOSED and STILL BELIEVING some 'things'.

Once I FIND how to OPEN UP adult human beings, and spark that NATURAL CURIOSITY within "them", AGAIN, like they ONCE WERE, then I will KNOW how to write those words, properly AND correctly, which I want to SHARE.
Ok.
Age wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:02 am
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am I cannot help it when your non-sense questions pop up one after another either.
Are you suggesting here that 'you' are COMPLETELY and UTTERLY USELESS in this situation?
bahman wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:28 am You have to try very hard to make a coherent picture of what I am trying to say here. It is simple though but it is a lot.
So, for 'me' to UNDERSTAND 'you', what you are saying here is that it is ALL up to 'me', correct?

Could it be a POSSIBILITY that the 'picture', which 'you' say 'you' are 'trying to' paint for 'us', readers, here, I have ALREADY SEEN, and thus also ALREADY KNOW, FULLY?

Or, is this just NOT A POSSIBILITY?
We are minds that interact through the physical. I think that is obvious. The rest is just details which I go through it gradually. Like there was a beginning. No-physical to physical is necessary since there was a beginning and there is no God. Etc.
So now you have changed back to, " we ARE "minds" ".

Here is a helpful tip, when you STOP 'contradicting' what you have previously written, then more people WILL more likely START actually listening to you.
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