Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
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Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
If one puts forth the proposition, that identities aren't attainable, is this proposition negated through the dimension, that the term thinker is a symmetry to philosopher and doctor and worker?
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
What actually exists are there are animals, or things, known as 'human beings', and these human beings are provided with identities, or labeled with names, but these human beings are never actually those given names, labels, nor identities. What exists are human beings, which are made up of physical matter, thoughts, and feelings - emotional and physical.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:30 am If one puts forth the proposition, that identities aren't attainable, is this proposition negated through the dimension, that the term thinker is a symmetry to philosopher and doctor and worker?
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
Not every clever or wise philosopher owes his status to Academia. But most do benefit from Academia because it does help you to be a clever or wise philosopher if you are tutored by people who have already learned what philosophy is about and what it is not about.
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Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
The President of the United States isn't the President, supermarket employees aren't supermarket employees, and the Taliban aren't the Taliban?Age wrote: ↑Fri Oct 29, 2021 10:37 pmWhat actually exists are there are animals, or things, known as 'human beings', and these human beings are provided with identities, or labeled with names, but these human beings are never actually those given names, labels, nor identities. What exists are human beings, which are made up of physical matter, thoughts, and feelings - emotional and physical.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:30 am If one puts forth the proposition, that identities aren't attainable, is this proposition negated through the dimension, that the term thinker is a symmetry to philosopher and doctor and worker?
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
Now is not now.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 6:00 pm The President of the United States isn't the President, supermarket employees aren't supermarket employees, and the Taliban aren't the Taliban?
There is an exact instant in time when The President of the United states stopped being The President.
There is an exact instant in time when an employee of a supermarket stops being an employee.
There is an exact instant when the Taliban stop being Taliban.
Identity is just an axiom. You can pre-suppose it as true; or false. It just a choice.
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Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
When are those exact instants of time, for each person listed?Skepdick wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 6:42 pmNow is not now.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 6:00 pm The President of the United States isn't the President, supermarket employees aren't supermarket employees, and the Taliban aren't the Taliban?
There is an exact instant in time when The President of the United states stopped being The President.
There is an exact instant in time when an employee of a supermarket stops being an employee.
There is an exact instant when the Taliban stop being Taliban.
Identity is just an axiom. You can pre-suppose it as true; or false. It just a choice.
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
Precisely at the instant when the president stops being the president.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 7:24 pm When are those exact instants of time, for each person listed?
Precisely at the instant an employee stops being an employee.
I hope you realise you've asked a trully silly question.
When is the exact instant of time when now becomes now?
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Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
by the time you think of "now" it is long gone...
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Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
For the question, about now, I don't knowSkepdick wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 7:28 pmPrecisely at the instant when the president stops being the president.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 7:24 pm When are those exact instants of time, for each person listed?
Precisely at the instant an employee stops being an employee.
I hope you realise you've asked a trully silly question.
When is the exact instant of time when now becomes now?
For the Taliban, I also don't know when they stop being the Taliban - could it be when they see and enjoy daylight, or if and when they think about Scream 2's internet life?
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
It doesn't matter. At the instance they stop being Taliban and become whatever else - that's when.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:14 pm For the Taliban, I also don't know when they stop being the Taliban - could it be when they see and enjoy daylight, or if and when they think about
Non-contradiction crumbles to recursion/self-reference.
I identify as somebody who lacks identity. Now what?
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Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
Skepdick wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:21 pmIt doesn't matter. At the instance they stop being Taliban and become whatever else - that's when.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:14 pm For the Taliban, I also don't know when they stop being the Taliban - could it be when they see and enjoy daylight, or if and when they think about
Non-contradiction crumbles to recursion/self-reference.
I identify as somebody who lacks identity. Now what?
Non-contradiction crumbles to self-reference - consistency breaks down into self-reference.
I think what you're trying to say, is that philosopher type beings are the only ones who can repeatedly ask about identity
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
No. What I am trying to say is that all classification-schemes (taxonomies) are entirely arbitrary and subject to arbitrary choice.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:33 pm Non-contradiction crumbles to self-reference - consistency breaks down into self-reference.
I think what you're trying to say, is that philosopher type beings are the only ones who can repeatedly ask about identity
Suppose that a Philosopher rejects Philosophy.
Some would go on to say that a Philosopher rejecting Philosophy is itself a Philosophy.
Others would go on to say that a Philosopher rejecting Philosophy is not a Philosophy.
So is it; or isn't it?
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Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
I'm concerned with disproportionalities, in taxonomy. For example, philosopher is a typical taxonomy, and so is fan, but, whereas to be a royal family philosopher or a United States presidency philosopher are common (in relative terms), it's much more uncommon to hear or speak of a philosopher or fan of September 1998's daylight (the daylight having perhaps occurred on any day of the month), or a philosopher or fan of Philosophy Now discussion threadsSkepdick wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:37 pmNo. What I am trying to say is that all classification-schemes (taxonomies) are entirely arbitrary and subject to arbitrary choice.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:33 pm Non-contradiction crumbles to self-reference - consistency breaks down into self-reference.
I think what you're trying to say, is that philosopher type beings are the only ones who can repeatedly ask about identity
Suppose that a Philosopher rejects Philosophy.
Some would go on to say that a Philosopher rejecting Philosophy is itself a Philosophy.
Others would go on to say that a Philosopher rejecting Philosophy is not a Philosophy.
So is it; or isn't it?
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
That's just Bayes' theorem.trokanmariel wrote: ↑Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:44 pm I'm concerned with disproportionalities, in taxonomy. For example, philosopher is a typical taxonomy, and so is fan, but, whereas to be a royal family philosopher or a United States presidency philosopher are common (in relative terms), it's much more uncommon to hear or speak of a philosopher or fan of September 1998's daylight (the daylight having perhaps occurred on any day of the month), or a philosopher or fan of Philosophy Now discussion threads
What is more probable?
That any given person is a philosopher; or that any given person is a philosopher who is 176cm tall.
P(philosopher) > P(philosopher + 176cm)
Re: Is the proposition, that identities aren't attainable stopped through thinker being identical to philosopher?
John = Philosphertrokanmariel wrote: ↑Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:30 am If one puts forth the proposition, that identities aren't attainable, is this proposition negated through the dimension, that the term thinker is a symmetry to philosopher and doctor and worker?
Bob = Philosopher.
BUT
John is NOT equal to Bob. Therefore Philosopher is not equal to Philosopher.
The case is closed