You must be an idiot

What did you say? And what did you mean by it?

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Age
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Age »

commonsense wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:34 pm
Age wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:42 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:27 am We detect sarcasm, facetiousness, and the like based on its departure from norms, which fuel expectations, including knowledge of what a particular person is likely to think or say. In order to be able to pick up on such things one has to be familiar with and be able to understand and predict norms, plus one has to be capable of and have a decent capacity for not reading everything "literally." Part of being capable of understanding normal language usage is being able to easily tell when language usage shifts between literal and non-literal--which normal language usage frequently does.
WHY does, so called, "normal" language/writings, supposedly, frequently swap between the literal and the non literal?

Are you able to ALWAYS understand and predict, so called, "norms"?

By the way, it is EXTREMELY EASY to NOT read, and NOT write, everything 'literally'. But how SIMPLE and EASY is it for 'you', "terrapin station", to be able to SEE and UNDERSTAND when one is occurring and when one is NOT.

How good do you rate "yourself" at knowing what a particular person is likely to think or say?

And, how good do you rate "yourself" at being able to easily tell when language usage shifts between literal, "and non literal", let us say?
Terrapin Station wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:27 am There are various conditions or tendencies that people can have that interfere with this. Conditions where everything tends to be read "literally," where there is a reduced capacity to understand and predict normal language usage.
LOL with your CONTINUED use of the word "normal", as if there was such a REAL thing to over 100 Billion human beings.

You continually speak as if you ACTUALLY KNOW what the "normal" use of words ARE, and what the "normal" meaning of their definitions ARE.

You have SHOWN that you have a HUGE TENDENCY to BELIEVE that WHAT you SEE, and HOW you SEE 'things', is the "normal" or "right" way, and that if ANY one SEES ANY thing DIFFERENTLY, then they do NOT see correctly, or, in other words, are just plain and simply ab, sub, or NOT "normal"
Terrapin Station wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:27 am Because of the nature of the Internet, it can attract people who have these issues, people who avoid normal offline socializing situations because of these difficulties. This contributes to sarcasm being more challenging to convey online.
REALLY?
Age, if only you understood the concept of normalcy...Normal has no requirement to be correct. It only has to be the most common, the median, the majority. It doesn’t even have to be the average. The most common is the norm.

Understanding this might change what you wrote.
But I did ALREADY understand that view. My point was, and still is, if ANY one ACTUALLY CLARIFIED with "others", then they might find out that what that had PREVIOUSLY PRESUMED was "the norm", "normal", or "normalcy" was in fact NOT normal at all, REALLY. Without CLARIFICATION one never Truly KNOWS.

Another point is, what is considered "normal" may actually, in and of itself, NOT be at all. For example it was considered "normal" that the sun OBVIOUSLY revolves around the earth. So, when was the precise moment "normalcy" CHANGED? Obviously without CLARIFICATION one never Truly KNOWS what is "normal" , or common, or not.

What 'you', human beings, individually and collectively, consider is "normal", when CHECKED and CLARIFIED, just may NOT BE. Is this understood?
commonsense
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by commonsense »

You still don’t understand. Use M&W. Try to be a little bit like everyone else when communicating with everyone else.
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Agent Smith
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Agent Smith »

Why, thank you! I am an idiot of the first class [sarcasm].
Flannel Jesus
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Flannel Jesus »

commonsense wrote: Fri Jan 15, 2021 7:50 pm The posts in this thread have convinced me that sarcasm is more complex than I realized.
That's good.

Your original sense that sarcasm should be always easy to detect ignores a fundamental part of what it means to be sarcastic in text: saying something you don't think is true.

To suggest that sarcasm should always be easy to detect, even in text form, just from context, is to suggest that we should always be able to tell if a person is telling us something they truly believe. It's like saying we should always be able to tell if someone is lying. It's like saying we should know a priori what their actual positions are.

If you told me "yeah, the world is totally flat" right now, I have no idea if that's sarcastic or not. I have no idea if you're a flat earther because I don't know anything about you. Flat earthers exist, and thus there are people who could say that and mean it, and also there are people who would say that only as a joke, sarcastically. If I don't know anything about you, how would I know if you mean it or not?

Sarcasm in text form inherently, at least sometimes, creates situations where it's hard to detect the sarcasm.
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MagsJ
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by MagsJ »

_
Not getting sarcasm or irony, could simply be due to the place where your head is at.

I get satire most of the time, but there are times when I don’t get it, when I’m thinking or mentally-focused on something.
Impenitent
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Impenitent »

flat earthers are ironic

had a flat so I getsatire...

-Imp
commonsense
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by commonsense »

Impenitent wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:56 pm flat earthers are ironic

had a flat so I getsatire...

-Imp
?
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FlashDangerpants
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by FlashDangerpants »

commonsense wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:54 pm
Impenitent wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:56 pm flat earthers are ironic

had a flat so I getsatire...

-Imp
?
He ... gets a tire
But he also does ... get satire

The best puns really need spelling out that way.
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attofishpi
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by attofishpi »

I've often wondered who Impenitent actually is on the forum 8)
commonsense
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by commonsense »

FlashDangerpants wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 1:17 am
commonsense wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:54 pm
Impenitent wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:56 pm flat earthers are ironic

had a flat so I getsatire...

-Imp
?
He ... gets a tire
But he also does ... get satire

The best puns really need spelling out that way.
True. But I still feel I should’ve seen that for myself.
ThinkOfOne
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by ThinkOfOne »

commonsense wrote: Wed Jan 13, 2021 5:44 pm Sarcasm is recognized by its context. However, there are some individuals who fail to interpret sarcasm correctly, especially in those instances when the text or context is subtle.

Why can’t everybody understand sarcasm every time? Is there a difference in the individuals or in the sarcasm per se?

BTW, you must be an idiot.
Understanding sarcasm is difficult precisely because there are so many idiots. More specifically so many idiots unaware that they are idiots who have no reservations about voicing their idiocy - especially in the internet age. It's as if no matter how ridiculous a belief, there are those who hold that belief. The difficulty is in determining whether or not the individual is being sarcastic or merely an idiot. If idiots were few and far between, it would be much less of an issue.
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Agent Smith
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Agent Smith »

What does sarcasm mean?
Flannel Jesus
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Flannel Jesus »

I wonder if an alien visited our planet, would sarcasm be the most difficult thing to grasp...
Gary Childress
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Gary Childress »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:33 am I wonder if an alien visited our planet, would sarcasm be the most difficult thing to grasp...
That seems reasonable to think to me. I wonder if an AI could ever be programed to discern sarcasm from sincerity. How do humans tell if someone is being sarcastic (or ironic) from someone who isn't? I suppose it comes down to having common beliefs and if someone says something against that common belief, then they are either being sarcastic or they are not in the same frame of mind for whatever reason.
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Agent Smith
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Re: You must be an idiot

Post by Agent Smith »

"There's a storm coming," said Tom in a gloomy tone. He was tired. Who wouldn't be if s/he ran 77 miles over rough terrain. Dick was used to Tom - Tom was and oddball and one of his habits was to say random things - and so kept his silence. Harry, on the other hand, although he knew Tom as well as Dick, never tired of Tom's antics and always, for better or worse, took Tom's words seriously. Why this was the way it was between the three only Maryam knew, but she'd been gone, gone as in passed on, for a coupla years now. The secret whatever it was died with her on that cold Sunday afternoon in May, 2079. Anyhow, Harry or Mr. Curiosity Rover had an epistemic itch that needed scratching and pronto. "Why do you say that?" he prodded Tom. Tom gazed at Tom with his half-closed eyes, I did say he was exhausted, and barely managed a "Good lord Harry, can't you seem I'm about to collapse into a heap on the floor! Ask Dick, he's the brains, remember?! Yawn." Dick knew what was coming and had already made for the door which he'd half-opened in a desperate attempt to exit the room and the conversation. "Dick, how does Tom know there's a storm coming?" queried Harry. Dick's chances of escape quickly fell to a big fat zero, but he'd saved his ace for just such an occasion. "Well, first things first. Before I, we, can answer your question, we must have ...?" went Dick. Tom gave a sleepy smile. Harry's mind exploded with questions, he sat down, pulled out a blank sheet of paper and starting writing. The door clicked shut, Dick was gone. Tom was all zzzzz, sprawled on the couch. Harry was an amazing writer.
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