Apologies

What did you say? And what did you mean by it?

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Harbal
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Re: Apologies

Post by Harbal » Sat Jul 16, 2016 5:39 pm

artisticsolution wrote: "You should have given the blind woman a slap."

I assert that neither of these statement will bring either parties a long term sense of well being.
When I said Greta should have slapped the blind woman I wasn't being totally serious. For one thing, striking a blind person in a room full of witnesses would put you on shaky ground, as far as the law is concerned. Besides, violence is rarely the best course of action, even if it was deserved. I think a good measure of strong verbal abuse would have been an adequate response on Greta's part. If Greta could have got the man in the wheelchair to back her up, that would have been even better. The ideal outcome, of course, would have been if Greta could have instigated an argument between the wheelchair man and the blind woman, that way, not only would the blind woman have got what she deserved, but Greta could have gone back home with an amusing anecdote to tell her friends.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Apologies

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:47 pm

artisticsolution wrote: There is absolutely no harm in treating everyone kind, (even those we feel have said unkind things to us). There is harm, however, in harboring bad feelings:


"I was less certain about the humanity of the sanctimonious blind cow taking her misery at her misfortune out on others."


"You should have given the blind woman a slap."


I assert that neither of these statement will bring either parties a long term sense of well being.

I assert that letting the anger go is better for humanity on a wider scale.

I assert that if the blind woman would have been kind to Greta, Greta would have felt better about the day/people/situation.

I assert that if everyone sucked it up and just exercised their will to be kind instead of aggressive, it would be a better world.

I assert that our base instinct is to fight at the slightest aggression, and it's common to give into these desires.

I assert that fighting these desires makes us stronger emotionally and more able to discern that which should cause us concern.

"Purity of Heart, Is To Will One Thing" (Thereby having control of ourselves and not giving into our base instinct to be like the herd.)

Is it rational, to want people to be decent yet at the same time, call them cows and call for them to be slapped?

I think Kierkegaard calls this, double-minded, if I remember correctly.

You can't will one thing and do the other and expect your will to be done. It's impossible.

In conclusion, if you want to feel harmed, then continue to feel harmed and act out on those impulses. If you don't want to feel harmed, then break the cycle and don't act out on them...and eventually, those impulses to feel harmed...lessen.

Remove the judgement and you have removed the thought ‘I am hurt’; remove the thought ‘I am hurt’ and the hurt itself is removed. Marcus Aurelius
What would have been a 'kind' response to the woman?

artisticsolution
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Re: Apologies

Post by artisticsolution » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:12 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: What would have been a 'kind' response to the woman?
"Oh, excuse me if I misspoke. Thank you for bringing it to my attention."

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Apologies

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:50 am

artisticsolution wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: What would have been a 'kind' response to the woman?
"Oh, excuse me if I misspoke. Thank you for bringing it to my attention."
Actually that would probably just make her feel bad, and I don't think you want to do that. It also seems insincere and a bit cloying.

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Re: Apologies

Post by artisticsolution » Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:49 am

I guess it would depend on the delivery and the intent. If it is said sincerely, it is short and to the point and does not aggravate the situation .

Plus, if said sincerely, it would be a casual response that did not place emphasis on the blind woman's rudeness as to make her feel badly for behaving in an undignified manner. It is polite and kind not to spot light another's bad manners, but instead to assume to yourself you have misinterpreted their words for whatever reason...and give them the benefit of the doubt the exact way one would have wished they had been given (as in Greta's case...for isn't the whole point of greta being mad at the blind woman is because the blind woman immediately scolded Greta without giving her the benefit of the doubt with understanding and grace?).

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Re: Apologies

Post by Walker » Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:59 am

artisticsolution wrote:If you were kind to the person in the wheelchair, Greta (which by the way is very nice)...why not be kind to the bitter blind woman who mistook your statement...who knows what her life has been like? It is easy to be kind to those who give you reward...harder to be kind to those who belittle you or make you out to be the bad guy. But really What is the harm of doing what Walker suggests? (not trying to make you an example....but I just realize I did...I apologize...I don't think poorly of you...really...as I have been there and done that...I'm just saying....exercising the body is alot like exercising the mind. When your body gets stronger it can handle alot more....same with the brain. When you understand where the pain is coming from in others...they can't hurt you...well...not as much. lol
Humility comes with a price. Is it worth paying? Many people in the world view kindness and humility as a weakness. A naivete to be exploited. Humility in itself is sufficient to raise Ire in the conquerors for it is oft viewed as arrogant piety. Be too humble and you get eaten, so singing kumbaya comes with that responsibility caused by human nature. Face the tiger like a bodhisattva and if you are eaten, no problem. The tiger will not apologize. Ego thinks that it is strong with broad shoulders to bear unfairness and for awhile it can.

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Harbal
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Re: Apologies

Post by Harbal » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:20 pm

Why is everyone so obsessed with the blind woman's feelings? She's the one in the wrong, she should have kept her mouth shut instead of causing all this fuss. What about Greta? Am I the only one here who cares about her feelings?

Walker
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Re: Apologies

Post by Walker » Sun Jul 17, 2016 2:29 pm

W.C. Fields in "It's A Gift" - Blind Man with Cane

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y189-69cQPs

artisticsolution
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Re: Apologies

Post by artisticsolution » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:39 pm

Is this a philosophy forum or a psychology forum?

There is a huge difference between having a philosophical discussion about apologies and having a psychological discussion about apologies.

I am not here to analyze personalities from a psychological point. I am here to discuss apologies from a philosophical stand point only.

Tell me, philosophically , aside from a uncalled for sanctimonious tone, what did the blind woman say that was not factual?

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Harbal
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Re: Apologies

Post by Harbal » Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:05 pm

artisticsolution wrote:I am here to discuss apologies from a philosophical stand point only.

Tell me, philosophically , aside from a uncalled for sanctimonious tone, what did the blind woman say that was not factual?
As far as the parable of the blind woman and the wheelchair is concerned, I don't see where apologies come into it. Greta had been in conversation with the man in the wheelchair so, presumably, he was aware that she was acknowledging him as a person so there is no reason to think that he was offended and required an apology. Putting myself in Greta's position, I imagine it was she who was offended by the inappropriate intervention of the blind woman so, if anyone was due an apology, it was Greta. Greta didn't do anything wrong to the blind woman so what the hell was she supposed to be apologising for?

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Re: Apologies

Post by Nick_A » Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:16 pm

Harbal wrote: As far as the parable of the blind woman and the wheelchair is concerned, I don't see where apologies come into it. Greta had been in conversation with the man in the wheelchair so, presumably, he was aware that she was acknowledging him as a person so there is no reason to think that he was offended and required an apology. Putting myself in Greta's position, I imagine it was she who was offended by the inappropriate intervention of the blind woman so, if anyone was due an apology, it was Greta. Greta didn't do anything wrong to the blind woman so what the hell was she supposed to be apologising for?
Yo momma sucks!

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Apologies

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Sun Jul 17, 2016 6:20 pm

Harbal wrote:Why is everyone so obsessed with the blind woman's feelings? She's the one in the wrong, she should have kept her mouth shut instead of causing all this fuss. What about Greta? Am I the only one here who cares about her feelings?
I agree. And there is no possible 'kind' response that wouldn't have sounded like a patronising load of drivel anyway. Ridiculous. Perhaps we should have a discussion on possible replies to the woman. You could probably come up with some good ones.
It reminds me of a blind woman I saw on a train. She had a guide-dog, which she was horrible to, hissing and spitting at it constantly. I always feel sorry for those dogs. Some of them have 'dog's lives', and they always look sad.

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Lacewing
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Re: Apologies

Post by Lacewing » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:08 pm

I would like to publicly apologize to Harbal for talking about his little pinkie in another thread.

Sometimes my admiration is hard to conceal.

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Harbal
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Re: Apologies

Post by Harbal » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:31 pm

Lacewing wrote:I would like to publicly apologize to Harbal for talking about his little pinkie in another thread.
I wouldn't have shown it to you if I'd known you were going to tell the whole World about it.

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Re: Apologies

Post by Dalek Prime » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:57 pm

Harbal wrote:
Lacewing wrote:I would like to publicly apologize to Harbal for talking about his little pinkie in another thread.
I wouldn't have shown it to you if I'd known you were going to tell the whole World about it.
I demand to see a picture of this ever so wise pinkie! And a fingerprint, for added measure. Otherwise, I'll have to assume the wisest pinkie is the Wikipedia one, pictured.

Image

Very authoritative pinkie, that looks to me.

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