Don DeLillo from White Noise
...the half-concealed disasters that constitute a life.
Those that were, those that are and those that will be.
Crowds came to form a shield against their own dying. To become a crowd is to keep out death. To break off from the crowd is to risk death as an individual, to face dying alone.
Not counting all the times it's the other way around.
Mainly we looked at people in other cars, trying to work out from their faces how frightened we should be.
Think The Last of Us. But in reality.
Nothingness is staring you in the face. Utter and permanent oblivion. You will cease to be. To be, Jack. The dier accepts this and dies. The killer, in theory, attempts to defeat his own death by killing others. He buys time, he buys life.
The somethingness let's call it.
I realized the place was awash in noise. The toneless systems, the jangle and skid of carts, the loudspeaker and coffee-making machines, the cries of children. And over it all, or under it all, a dull and unlocatable roar, as of some form of swarming life just outside the range of human apprehension.
Thank goodness for virtual reality, he thought.
All plots tend to move deathward. This is the nature of plots. Political plots, terrorist plots, lovers’ plots, narrative plots, plots that are part of children’s games. We edge nearer death every time we plot.
That's certainly the plot of my posts here.
Quote of the day
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day
Cormac McCarthy from The Road
He descended into a gryke in the stone and there he crouched coughing and he coughed for a long time. Then he just knelt in the ashes. He raised his face to the paling day. Are you there? he whispered. Will I see you at the last? Have you a neck by which to throttle you? Have you a heart? Damn you eternally have you a soul? Oh God, he whispered. Oh God.
Your God perhaps.
When the shooting starts would you rather be armed or legal?
Armed with a bazooka, right henry?
He can give me what you cannot.
Death is not a lover.
Oh yes, he is.
You might disagree of course.
When we're all gone at last then there'll be nobody here but death and his days will be numbered too. He'll be out in the road there with nothing to do and nobody to do it to. He'll say: where did everybody go? And that's how it will be. What's wrong with that?
Nothing. And it can't come too soon for some.
The man watched him. Real life is pretty bad?
What do you think?
Well, I think we're still here. A lot of bad things have happened but we're still here.
Yeah.
You don't think that's so great.
It's okay.
Okay compared to what?
Ever is a long time. But the boy knew what he knew. That ever is no time at all.
Time is always tricky of course.
He descended into a gryke in the stone and there he crouched coughing and he coughed for a long time. Then he just knelt in the ashes. He raised his face to the paling day. Are you there? he whispered. Will I see you at the last? Have you a neck by which to throttle you? Have you a heart? Damn you eternally have you a soul? Oh God, he whispered. Oh God.
Your God perhaps.
When the shooting starts would you rather be armed or legal?
Armed with a bazooka, right henry?
He can give me what you cannot.
Death is not a lover.
Oh yes, he is.
You might disagree of course.
When we're all gone at last then there'll be nobody here but death and his days will be numbered too. He'll be out in the road there with nothing to do and nobody to do it to. He'll say: where did everybody go? And that's how it will be. What's wrong with that?
Nothing. And it can't come too soon for some.
The man watched him. Real life is pretty bad?
What do you think?
Well, I think we're still here. A lot of bad things have happened but we're still here.
Yeah.
You don't think that's so great.
It's okay.
Okay compared to what?
Ever is a long time. But the boy knew what he knew. That ever is no time at all.
Time is always tricky of course.
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day
Joseph Heller from Catch--22
Man was matter, that was Snowden's secret. Drop him out a window, and he'll fall. Set fire to him and he'll burn. Bury him and he'll rot, like other kinds of garbage. The spirit gone, man is garbage. That was Snowden's secret. Ripeness was all.
Be honest: how ripe are you?
Some men are born mediocre, some men achieve mediocrity, and some men have mediocrity thrust upon them.
Next up: some pinheads.
You have a morbid aversion to dying. You probably resent the fact that you're at war and might get your head blown off any second.
I more than resent it, sir. I'm absolutely incensed.
You have deep-seated survival anxieties. And you don't like bigots, bullies, snobs, or hypocrites. Subconsciously there are many people you hate.
Consciously, sir, consciously, Yossarian corrected in an effort to help. I hate them consciously.
You're antagonistic to the idea of being robbed, exploited, degraded, humiliated, or deceived. Misery depresses you. Ignorance depresses you. Persecution depresses you. Violence depresses you. Corruption depresses you. You know, it wouldn't surprise me if you're a manic-depressive!
Yes, sir. Perhaps I am.
Don't try to deny it.
I'm not denying it, sir, said Yossarian, pleased with the miraculous rapport that finally existed between them. I agree with all you've said.
A military thing let's call it. Well, and other things too, of course.
From now on I'm thinking only of me.
Major Danby replied indulgently with a superior smile: But, Yossarian, suppose everyone felt that way.
Then, said Yossarian, I'd certainly be a damned fool to feel any other way, wouldn't I?
Another catch, let's call it.
When I look up, I see people cashing in. I don't see heaven or saints or angels. I see people cashing in on every decent impulse and every human tragedy.
Next up: when I look down.
He was a self-made man who owed his lack of success to nobody.
Pick one:
1] genes
2] memes
Man was matter, that was Snowden's secret. Drop him out a window, and he'll fall. Set fire to him and he'll burn. Bury him and he'll rot, like other kinds of garbage. The spirit gone, man is garbage. That was Snowden's secret. Ripeness was all.
Be honest: how ripe are you?
Some men are born mediocre, some men achieve mediocrity, and some men have mediocrity thrust upon them.
Next up: some pinheads.
You have a morbid aversion to dying. You probably resent the fact that you're at war and might get your head blown off any second.
I more than resent it, sir. I'm absolutely incensed.
You have deep-seated survival anxieties. And you don't like bigots, bullies, snobs, or hypocrites. Subconsciously there are many people you hate.
Consciously, sir, consciously, Yossarian corrected in an effort to help. I hate them consciously.
You're antagonistic to the idea of being robbed, exploited, degraded, humiliated, or deceived. Misery depresses you. Ignorance depresses you. Persecution depresses you. Violence depresses you. Corruption depresses you. You know, it wouldn't surprise me if you're a manic-depressive!
Yes, sir. Perhaps I am.
Don't try to deny it.
I'm not denying it, sir, said Yossarian, pleased with the miraculous rapport that finally existed between them. I agree with all you've said.
A military thing let's call it. Well, and other things too, of course.
From now on I'm thinking only of me.
Major Danby replied indulgently with a superior smile: But, Yossarian, suppose everyone felt that way.
Then, said Yossarian, I'd certainly be a damned fool to feel any other way, wouldn't I?
Another catch, let's call it.
When I look up, I see people cashing in. I don't see heaven or saints or angels. I see people cashing in on every decent impulse and every human tragedy.
Next up: when I look down.
He was a self-made man who owed his lack of success to nobody.
Pick one:
1] genes
2] memes
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day
Doris Lessing from The Golden Notebook
Art is the Mirror of our betrayed ideals.
He wondered what that made philosophy then.
How boring these emotions are that we're caught in and can't get free of, no matter how much we want to...
For example? The part they always leave out.
I'm going to make the obvious point that maybe the word neurotic means the condition of being highly conscious and developed. The essence of neurosis is conflict. But the essence of living now, fully, not blocking off to what goes on, is conflict
In other words, you're probably not neurotic enough.
People are just cannibals unless they leave each other alone.
You know, eventually.
I don't know why I still find it so hard to accept that words are faulty and by their very nature inacurate.
How [probably] ridiculous is that?
Words. Words. I play with words, hoping that some combination, even a chance combination, will say what I want.
Or, sometimes, to at least come close to not saying what I don't want.
Art is the Mirror of our betrayed ideals.
He wondered what that made philosophy then.
How boring these emotions are that we're caught in and can't get free of, no matter how much we want to...
For example? The part they always leave out.
I'm going to make the obvious point that maybe the word neurotic means the condition of being highly conscious and developed. The essence of neurosis is conflict. But the essence of living now, fully, not blocking off to what goes on, is conflict
In other words, you're probably not neurotic enough.
People are just cannibals unless they leave each other alone.
You know, eventually.
I don't know why I still find it so hard to accept that words are faulty and by their very nature inacurate.
How [probably] ridiculous is that?
Words. Words. I play with words, hoping that some combination, even a chance combination, will say what I want.
Or, sometimes, to at least come close to not saying what I don't want.
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iambiguous
- Posts: 7431
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
The Onion
Tide Unveils New Guy Who Will Lick Stains Off You
Just out of curiosity, anyone here been licked?
‘It’s Like I Can’t Do Anything Right,’ Says Woman Pretty Much Hitting Nail On Head
You, right?
Vegetarian Option Just Iceberg Lettuce On Bread
Whole wheat bread of course.
Twins Switched At Birth In Essentially Meaningless Mix-Up
Tell that to them.
NASA Completes 52-Year Mission To Find, Kill God
Again, right Nietzsche?
Congress Approves Empty Paper Towel Roll For NASA To Use As Telescope
So long Webb.
Tide Unveils New Guy Who Will Lick Stains Off You
Just out of curiosity, anyone here been licked?
‘It’s Like I Can’t Do Anything Right,’ Says Woman Pretty Much Hitting Nail On Head
You, right?
Vegetarian Option Just Iceberg Lettuce On Bread
Whole wheat bread of course.
Twins Switched At Birth In Essentially Meaningless Mix-Up
Tell that to them.
NASA Completes 52-Year Mission To Find, Kill God
Again, right Nietzsche?
Congress Approves Empty Paper Towel Roll For NASA To Use As Telescope
So long Webb.
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iambiguous
- Posts: 7431
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Erich Maria Remarque from All Quiet on the Western Front
What use is it to him now that he was such a good mathematician at school?
Indeed, tell that to the Germans.
And men will not understand us—for the generation that grew up before us, though it has passed these years with us already had a home and a calling; now it will return to its old occupations, and the war will be forgotten—and the generation that has grown up after us will be strange to us and push us aside. We will be superfluous even to ourselves, we will grow older, a few will adapt themselves, some others will merely submit, and most will be bewildered;—the years will pass by and in the end we shall fall into ruin.
And that was after a war that we won. Then there was Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq.
And in the night you realize, when you wake out of a dream, overcome and captivated by the enchantment of visions that crowd in on each other, just how fragile a handhold, how tenuous a boundary separates us from darkness - we are little flames, inadequately sheltered by thin walls from the tempest of dissolution and insensibility in which we flicker and are often all but extinguished. Then the muted sounds of battle surrounds us, and we creep into ourselves and stare wide-eyed into the night.
Next up: PTSD.
From the earth, from the air, sustaining forces pour into us--mostly from the earth. To no man does the earth mean so much as to the soldier. When he presses himself down upon her long and powerfully, when he buries his face and his limbs deep in her from the fear of death by shell-fire, then she is his only friend, his brother, his mother; he stifles his terror and his cries in her silence and her security; she shelters him and releases him fro ten seconds to live, to run, ten seconds of life; receives him again and often for ever.
Don't even pretend to understand this.
Iron Youth! Youth! We are none of us more than twenty years old. But young? Youth? That is long ago.
Don't even pretend to understand this.
This book is to be neither an accusation nor a confession, and least of all an adventure, for death is not an adventure to those who stand face to face with it. It will try simply to tell of a generation of men who, even though they may have escaped shells, were destroyed by the war.
This post too.
What use is it to him now that he was such a good mathematician at school?
Indeed, tell that to the Germans.
And men will not understand us—for the generation that grew up before us, though it has passed these years with us already had a home and a calling; now it will return to its old occupations, and the war will be forgotten—and the generation that has grown up after us will be strange to us and push us aside. We will be superfluous even to ourselves, we will grow older, a few will adapt themselves, some others will merely submit, and most will be bewildered;—the years will pass by and in the end we shall fall into ruin.
And that was after a war that we won. Then there was Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq.
And in the night you realize, when you wake out of a dream, overcome and captivated by the enchantment of visions that crowd in on each other, just how fragile a handhold, how tenuous a boundary separates us from darkness - we are little flames, inadequately sheltered by thin walls from the tempest of dissolution and insensibility in which we flicker and are often all but extinguished. Then the muted sounds of battle surrounds us, and we creep into ourselves and stare wide-eyed into the night.
Next up: PTSD.
From the earth, from the air, sustaining forces pour into us--mostly from the earth. To no man does the earth mean so much as to the soldier. When he presses himself down upon her long and powerfully, when he buries his face and his limbs deep in her from the fear of death by shell-fire, then she is his only friend, his brother, his mother; he stifles his terror and his cries in her silence and her security; she shelters him and releases him fro ten seconds to live, to run, ten seconds of life; receives him again and often for ever.
Don't even pretend to understand this.
Iron Youth! Youth! We are none of us more than twenty years old. But young? Youth? That is long ago.
Don't even pretend to understand this.
This book is to be neither an accusation nor a confession, and least of all an adventure, for death is not an adventure to those who stand face to face with it. It will try simply to tell of a generation of men who, even though they may have escaped shells, were destroyed by the war.
This post too.
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iambiguous
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- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Ken Kesey from One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest
The flock gets sight of a spot of blood on some chicken and they all go to peckin' at it, see, till they rip the chicken to shreds, blood and bones and feathers. But usually a couple of the flock gets spotted in the fracas, then it's their turn. And a few more gets spots and gets pecked to death, and more and more. Oh, a peckin' party can wipe out the whole flock in a matter of a few hours, buddy, I seen it. A mighty awesome sight. The only way to prevent it—with chickens—is to clip blinders on them. So's they can't see.
You tell me.
But I remember one thing: it wasn't me that started acting deaf, it was people that first started acting like I was too dumb to hear or see or say anything at all.
Tell me that's not an important distinction.
One flew east, one flew west, one flew over the cuckoo's nest.
The Indian this time.
I discovered at an early age that I was -- shall we be kind and say different?
Kind it is then.
But, gee, the other nurse says, what on earth would make a man want to do something like disrupt the ward for, Miss Ratched? What possible motive...?
You seem to forget, Miss Flinn, that this is an institution for the insane.
That can make all the difference in the world.
I don't think I can give you an answer. Oh, I could give you Freudian reasons with fancy talk, and that would be right as far as it went. But what you want are the reasons for the reasons, and I'm not able to give you those.
The reason for the reasons. That's where we come in, right?
The flock gets sight of a spot of blood on some chicken and they all go to peckin' at it, see, till they rip the chicken to shreds, blood and bones and feathers. But usually a couple of the flock gets spotted in the fracas, then it's their turn. And a few more gets spots and gets pecked to death, and more and more. Oh, a peckin' party can wipe out the whole flock in a matter of a few hours, buddy, I seen it. A mighty awesome sight. The only way to prevent it—with chickens—is to clip blinders on them. So's they can't see.
You tell me.
But I remember one thing: it wasn't me that started acting deaf, it was people that first started acting like I was too dumb to hear or see or say anything at all.
Tell me that's not an important distinction.
One flew east, one flew west, one flew over the cuckoo's nest.
The Indian this time.
I discovered at an early age that I was -- shall we be kind and say different?
Kind it is then.
But, gee, the other nurse says, what on earth would make a man want to do something like disrupt the ward for, Miss Ratched? What possible motive...?
You seem to forget, Miss Flinn, that this is an institution for the insane.
That can make all the difference in the world.
I don't think I can give you an answer. Oh, I could give you Freudian reasons with fancy talk, and that would be right as far as it went. But what you want are the reasons for the reasons, and I'm not able to give you those.
The reason for the reasons. That's where we come in, right?
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Gary Childress
- Posts: 8325
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2011 3:08 pm
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Re: Quote of the day
I have to say, this one gave me a good laugh, kind of like the guy in the back of the bus who suddenly breaks out in unexplainable laughter for reason no one else on the bus, including himself, can understand. Don't think all you're posts in this thread are going unnoticed, iambiguous. I saw the two below this one also. Very profound. Thank you (for whatever "thanks" are worth).iambiguous wrote: ↑Tue Feb 28, 2023 4:19 pm The Onion
Tide Unveils New Guy Who Will Lick Stains Off You
Just out of curiosity, anyone here been licked?
‘It’s Like I Can’t Do Anything Right,’ Says Woman Pretty Much Hitting Nail On Head
You, right?
Vegetarian Option Just Iceberg Lettuce On Bread
Whole wheat bread of course.
Twins Switched At Birth In Essentially Meaningless Mix-Up
Tell that to them.
NASA Completes 52-Year Mission To Find, Kill God
Again, right Nietzsche?
Congress Approves Empty Paper Towel Roll For NASA To Use As Telescope
So long Webb.
I had never read the book or paid much attention to the dialogue in All Quite on the Western Front. Up until now I just remember it from childhood as a "war movie", something like an action/adventure with guys doing stuff in soldier uniforms.
I've never seen nor read One Flew Over The Cuckoo's nest. However, I can intimately relate to the quotes you've posted from it (book or movie, whichever).
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promethean75
- Posts: 5033
- Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:29 pm
Re: Quote of the day
... and u wouldn't know it until u tried but it's not the easiest thing to do well. sometimes there are pat replies that you'd think to give for any given quote... but then he hits these very clever ones that you'd not have thought to say. the art here is packing as much depth into quick cynical reflections or sarcastic dismissals as possible so that what sounds profound - insert favorite philosophical quote - ends up being useless, superficial or ridiculous.
Siriusly try to do a few.
Siriusly try to do a few.
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iambiguous
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- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Jack Kerouac from On the Road
My aunt once said that the world would never find peace until men fell at their women's feet and asked for forgiveness.
You know, for starters, right Satyr?
We agreed to love each other madly.
Next stop: the mad dash to divorce court.
Or was that just me?
I was halfway across America, at the dividing line between the East of my youth and the West of my future.
Not that, for some, it can't be the other way around.
I just won't sleep, I decided. There were so many other interesting things to do.
Get back to him after about, oh, a week without it. Right, Olivia?
Sure baby baby, mañana. It was always mañana. For the next few weeks that was all I heard––mañana. A lovely word and one that probably means heaven.
Or, if you know what I mean, hell. And not just tomorrow.
Better to sleep in an uncomfortable bed free, than sleep in a comfortable bed unfree.
Or: Better to sleep in a comfortable bed if you can easily afford it.
My aunt once said that the world would never find peace until men fell at their women's feet and asked for forgiveness.
You know, for starters, right Satyr?
We agreed to love each other madly.
Next stop: the mad dash to divorce court.
Or was that just me?
I was halfway across America, at the dividing line between the East of my youth and the West of my future.
Not that, for some, it can't be the other way around.
I just won't sleep, I decided. There were so many other interesting things to do.
Get back to him after about, oh, a week without it. Right, Olivia?
Sure baby baby, mañana. It was always mañana. For the next few weeks that was all I heard––mañana. A lovely word and one that probably means heaven.
Or, if you know what I mean, hell. And not just tomorrow.
Better to sleep in an uncomfortable bed free, than sleep in a comfortable bed unfree.
Or: Better to sleep in a comfortable bed if you can easily afford it.
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iambiguous
- Posts: 7431
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
The Onion
Note From Shein Worker Hidden In Order States How Much He Loves Doing Sweatshop Labor
Of course, he was only a kid.
12-Year-Old Job Applicant Asked To Explain 12-Year Employment Gap On Résumé
Twelve years and nine months to be exact.
Leader Of Aryan Prison Gang Covered Head To Toe In Dilbert Tattoos
Yo, Alexis Jacobi! Can you top that?!
Bored Baby Wishes It Had Something To Choke On
Next up: bored fetus.
Dalai Lama Worried There’s Nothing More To Life Than Feeling Deep Connection With All Existence
Cue Keith Raniere.
Nation’s Overthinkers Convene To Determine What That’s Supposed To Mean
Let's overthink that ourselves.
Note From Shein Worker Hidden In Order States How Much He Loves Doing Sweatshop Labor
Of course, he was only a kid.
12-Year-Old Job Applicant Asked To Explain 12-Year Employment Gap On Résumé
Twelve years and nine months to be exact.
Leader Of Aryan Prison Gang Covered Head To Toe In Dilbert Tattoos
Yo, Alexis Jacobi! Can you top that?!
Bored Baby Wishes It Had Something To Choke On
Next up: bored fetus.
Dalai Lama Worried There’s Nothing More To Life Than Feeling Deep Connection With All Existence
Cue Keith Raniere.
Nation’s Overthinkers Convene To Determine What That’s Supposed To Mean
Let's overthink that ourselves.
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Gary Childress
- Posts: 8325
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2011 3:08 pm
- Location: Professional Underdog Pound
Re: Quote of the day
Epictetus on economics:iambiguous wrote: ↑Wed Mar 01, 2023 6:51 pm Jack Kerouac from On the Road
Better to sleep in an uncomfortable bed free, than sleep in a comfortable bed unfree.
Or: Better to sleep in a comfortable bed if you can easily afford it.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯Has somebody received more honour than you at a feast or in a greeting or in receiving advice? If these things are appropriate, you should be happy they happen to that person. If they are inappropriate, then don’t be bothered that they don’t happen to you. Remember that you cannot claim the same things if you don’t do the same things to get what is not in our control. For how can somebody get the same things as someone who visits a man’s door frequently if he doesn’t visit the door frequently? Or get the same as someone who escorts him if he doesn’t escort him? Or get the same as someone who praises him if he doesn’t praise him? You will be unjust and greedy if you want to take them as a gift instead of paying the price for which they are sold. But for what price are lettuces sold? A coin (obol), if it so happens. So if somebody pays the coin, he gets the lettuce. But if you don’t pay and don’t get it, do not think you have less than the person who gets the lettuce. Because like that person has the lettuce, you have the coin that you didn’t give away. It is exactly the same in the current case, if you are not invited to someone’s feast: you have not paid the host the price for which the meal is sold. He sells it for praise; he sells it for attention. Then give it to him, if the difference with the cost is profitable for you. But if you don’t want to pay the person and still get the things, then you are greedy and foolish. So don’t you have anything instead of the meal? You have received not praising the person that you didn’t want to praise and not facing his people at the door.
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promethean75
- Posts: 5033
- Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:29 pm
Re: Quote of the day
bro i love it when ancient greek or roman philosophers do this whole long thing on some moral or principle or whatever and all they have to use to articulate the concept is a dispute between two guys trading a goat or something and still after reading it u walk away with some new profound wisdom.
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promethean75
- Posts: 5033
- Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:29 pm
Re: Quote of the day
"... that god is cruel and unjust becuz he visits suffering on innocent humans of a scope and scale that would embarrass the most ambitious psychopath..." - Harris, Sam
Lol
Lol
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promethean75
- Posts: 5033
- Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:29 pm
Re: Quote of the day
in the god debate part 2 @ 1:26:39 in Craig's horrible closing statement after sam puts a whoopin on em he tries the anslem spin and then the old 'god provides a foundation for morality' bit.
ever really thought about what that means, what that entails? what does 'foundation' mean? if that means 'a reason for', there would be 'reasons' why human beings behaved morally without there being a god, so that means nothing. perhaps he means 'a reason for wanting to be moral'? in that case, one still doesn't HAVE to be moral. one could be a crazy person and want to go to hell. so being merely a deterent isn't enough either.
Do u philosophers ever think about what u say?
the truth is I don't even know if Craig knows what he means. he's just repeating all the old half-baked stock arguments.
ever really thought about what that means, what that entails? what does 'foundation' mean? if that means 'a reason for', there would be 'reasons' why human beings behaved morally without there being a god, so that means nothing. perhaps he means 'a reason for wanting to be moral'? in that case, one still doesn't HAVE to be moral. one could be a crazy person and want to go to hell. so being merely a deterent isn't enough either.
Do u philosophers ever think about what u say?
the truth is I don't even know if Craig knows what he means. he's just repeating all the old half-baked stock arguments.