IF the universe was created THEN...

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seeds
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by seeds »

VVilliam wrote: Thu Feb 25, 2021 6:19 am ...the lucid dream analogy might not be the best one to use...
seeds wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 11:48 pm I have more. :D   I invite you to explore the more than 100 drawings and illustrations I created and uploaded to my website: http://www.theultimateseeds.com/
VVilliam wrote: Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:26 pm Would you say that the image below has something to do with how you see this inner emperor of your consciousness?
Image
Yes, but in a purely metaphorical sense.

It is meant to demonstrate that whatever our ultimate and eternal form truly is, it is the same form as God.

It is a form that is imbued with the same abilities and potential as God.

It is a form that (in the context of eternal life in a higher context of consciousness and reality) will be capable of creating its own universe out of the (holographic-like) mental fabric of its very own being, just as God has done.

In a nutshell, if you consider the implications of the following illustrations, then you should be able to understand the premise of my theory...

Image

Notice that the seeds each contain an "embryonic" replication of that which they are the seeds of. Yet the implication is that most of the seeds would never be able to comprehend that the entire reality in which they are suspended is, in fact, the fully-fruitioned "adult" version of that which they are each destined to become like.

Image

As per the above, remember what I stated in an earlier post, that...
seeds wrote: Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:31 pm ...quantum science has discovered that the phenomenal features of the universe seem to be created from an infinitely malleable, informationally-based (holographic-like) substance that is capable of becoming absolutely anything "imaginable" (just like the substance from which our thoughts and dreams are created).

In other words, the outer-workings of the universe seem to resemble the inner-workings of our own minds.
Hence, a clear parallel between our minds and the mind of God (as in "created in the image of").

Image

(For a clearer view of the dialogue, click on the following link and expand the image: http://www.theultimateseeds.com/Images/ ... ge%207.jpg)

If there truly does exist the possibility that our minds and consciousnesses will continue on (allegedly forever) in a transcendent context of reality after exiting our physical body (after exiting our '"seed pod") via death, then we simply must have something logical to do to occupy our time (something that is forever evolving and forever fruitful).

And thus the creation of a universe out of the mental fabric of our very own being...

(a universe in which we will eventually be able to conceive and give birth to our own cosmic offspring, just as God has done with us)

...is the only thing that makes any sense for beings whose primary attribute is the ability to shape the inner-reality of their minds into absolutely anything imaginable; - beings who have a literal eternity (eternal life) in which to bring order and perfection to that reality.

Now, as your common sense is fighting against all of this, keep in mind how even right now while on earth, our dreams seem to be almost as solid and "real" as the reality we experience outward.

In which case, what I am suggesting is that after our minds (souls/consciousnesses) have been "delivered" out of our bodies via our second and final "birth" (again, via death),...

...we will then gain full consciousness and full control over our mental substances (to the same degree to which God has control over his mental substance), to the point where what we do create within our minds, it will indeed be just as "real" as the reality of the universe (not as ordered, of course, but just as "real").

Now it is needless to say that I could be completely wrong about all of this.

However, I challenge anyone to come up with a more "natural" vision of our ultimate destiny.

Indeed, what I am proposing is a confirmation of that old Hermetic axiom...

"As above, so below" - or - "As below, so above"

In other words, it is an expression of "nature" at the highest level of reality in which the highest lifeforms in all of existence, replicate themselves by conceiving their own offspring within themselves...

Image

(Again, for a clearer view of the dialogue, click on the following link and expand the image: http://www.theultimateseeds.com/Images/ ... %20109.jpg)

Image
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VVilliam
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by VVilliam »

seeds wrote: Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:26 am
VVilliam wrote: Thu Feb 25, 2021 6:19 am ...the lucid dream analogy might not be the best one to use...
seeds wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 11:48 pm I have more. :D   I invite you to explore the more than 100 drawings and illustrations I created and uploaded to my website: http://www.theultimateseeds.com/
VVilliam wrote: Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:26 pm Would you say that the image below has something to do with how you see this inner emperor of your consciousness?
Image
Yes, but in a purely metaphorical sense.

It is meant to demonstrate that whatever our ultimate and eternal form truly is, it is the same form as God.

It is a form that is imbued with the same abilities and potential as God.

It is a form that (in the context of eternal life in a higher context of consciousness and reality) will be capable of creating its own universe out of the (holographic-like) mental fabric of its very own being, just as God has done.
Understand. You should therefore enjoy my version of the same principle, which can be read;

Here.

I just posted this image in trying to explain the same concept to another...
Image

Have you had time to follow those other links I posted?
seeds
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by seeds »

VVilliam wrote: Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:45 am Have you had time to follow those other links I posted?
Did you not see my post to you at the bottom of the page just prior to this one?
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VVilliam
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by VVilliam »

seeds wrote: Mon Mar 01, 2021 2:20 am
VVilliam wrote: Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:45 am Have you had time to follow those other links I posted?
Did you not see my post to you at the bottom of the page just prior to this one?
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Nope...Thanks for the heads up
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VVilliam
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by VVilliam »

seeds wrote: Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:25 am
seeds wrote: Fri Feb 26, 2021 11:48 pm All humans are basically sleepwalking through life, and most (not all) are simply not conscious enough to experience a visceral understanding of how utterly strange it is that we are magnetically adhered to a sphere that is not only moving laterally through space at approximately 67,000 mph,...

...but also spins gigantic oceans and huge human metropolises - around and around (topsy-turvy) in a rotisserie cycle that only takes a mere 24 hours to complete.

And the point is that if people such as DPMartin are oblivious to the fact that we are all already deeply immersed in "la la land," then I'm afraid that the irony will be lost on them due to the depth and degree of their somnambulism.
VVilliam wrote: Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:26 pm Perhaps then, those who know can show the way...here is my reply...in song form...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=df3Zn1V ... e=youtu.be
Nice.

Assuming that is you in the video, you look like an old hippie like me. :D
Yes - that is I in the video - and the song is one I wrote...
Also, your website appears to be a good place for friendly (metaphysical) chats.
It is a Forum User Group which I was allowed to create on a site which does not belong to me...the thread is nestled in a Christian Debating Forum owned and moderated by otseng.
Well done, VVilliam.
And you too Seeds.

Please consider joining the group, but if you decide to, then first check out the forum rules re role-playing related to threads therein....

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I think it is safe to say that we both agree our cosmologies [etc] are similar enough to be called the same...
Dimebag
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by Dimebag »

Seeds,

Regarding your proposal of universal fractal consciousness, do you see any solution to the problem of the first creation, I.e. the first universe? Could this process go back infinitely? Or do they all somehow blend together? What is the solution?
seeds
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by seeds »

Dimebag wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:09 pm Seeds,

Regarding your proposal of universal fractal consciousness, do you see any solution to the problem of the first creation, I.e. the first universe?
Hello Dimebag, and thank you for looking at this deeply enough to notice that the main (and insurmountable) problem with the theory is that it does seem to imply a "first" universe, and thus a "first" Creator consciousness.

And no, I do not see any solution to the mystery of how the "first" could have come into existence.

Indeed, to me, the problem of how anything whatsoever (be it mind or matter) first came into existence is so profoundly mysterious that I have often wondered if even God knows the answer.
Dimebag wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:09 pm Could this process go back infinitely?
Yes, it no doubt does, which implies a probable infinity of living universes, but that still does not resolve the problem of how the "first" came into existence.

However, I will speculatively suggest that if there truly is a "first" Creator consciousness who somehow managed to come into existence as far back as eternity itself, then not only would the first still be alive...

(after all, eternal life means ETERNAL life)

...but the highest and most generous act that this original consciousness could have performed is the replication of itself (and its creative abilities) to the absolute and fullest degree (as in conceiving its own "familial" offspring).

In other words, by sheer force of will over the mental fabric of its very own being, it was somehow able to awaken into existence, fully autonomous lifeforms (just like itself) with no subservient strings attached.

And what that means is that not only was the "post partum" separation from the first Creator done in such a way where the continued existence of its offspring is not dependent on the existence of the first Creator, but also that the first Creator holds no dominion or control over its offspring (again, "As Below, So Above").

And the point is that if my theory regarding the ontological makeup of "true reality" is correct, then not only are there no devils, or demons, or angels, or barely conscious entities waiting to reincarnate into an earthly body in order to advance, etc., etc....

...but also, there are no "bosses" in true reality.

Indeed, there is just an exponentially growing infinity of autonomous "bubbles" of consciousness (as in "Berkeleyan-like" Creator-minds) who are all equal members of the same (and highest) species of being.

Image

The (blurry/slightly altered) captions read as follows:
"Just as soap bubbles are individual entities created from the same essence of soap, so are the bubbles of consciousness [i.e., universes], individual entities, created from the same essence of life."
"The sum total of the essence of life and all of its subsequent "bubbles" represent the sum total of reality itself, beyond which nothing else exists."
"The bubbles are not contained within yet a bigger bubble as the "first cause" or the  "absolute" [or God] is oftentimes perceived.  There is no singular consciousness presiding over the rest.  The essence of life is a mutual partnership."
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VVilliam
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by VVilliam »

The answer is relatively easy to understand. The Source is both infinite regress and has always existed and never had a beginning.

The illusion one needs to see through has to do with being within one of the bubble universes and experiencing 'a beginning' - [the patterns therein repeat themselves] and in our case also an end. Thus our experience makes it difficult to imagine something which has had no beginning...Read On
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Sculptor
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

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VVilliam wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:47 am
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:34 am
VVilliam wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:33 am IF the universe was created THEN...we must exist within some type of Simulated Reality.
Non-sequitur.
The "then" does not logically follow from the "if" there.
So you say. But what is it you are saying?
He is inflicted with a belief he cannot justify and your conclusion implies that god is a games master - and that is an inevitable conclusion that horrifies him and challenges his poor head.

The Great DM in the sky denies his other delusion, free will.
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by Sculptor »

seeds wrote: Tue Mar 02, 2021 10:55 pm Image

The (blurry/slightly altered) captions read as follows:
"Just as soap bubbles are individual entities created from the same essence of soap, so are the bubbles of consciousness [i.e., universes], individual entities, created from the same essence of life."
"The sum total of the essence of life and all of its subsequent "bubbles" represent the sum total of reality itself, beyond which nothing else exists."
"The bubbles are not contained within yet a bigger bubble as the "first cause" or the  "absolute" [or God] is oftentimes perceived.  There is no singular consciousness presiding over the rest.  The essence of life is a mutual partnership."
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

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Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:41 am The "then" does not logically follow from the "if" there. That's what I'm saying. It's illogical. I honestly can't understand how you can possibly believe it, because the words you're using don't add up to coherence, let alone truth. "Simulated" is, by definition, "not real," or "artificial," or "illusory." But every illusion, unreality or artificiality is only detectable in reference to reality.

Yet you say you have no evidence of such a reality. So you have no basis on which to speak of "simulations." There's nothing to be "simulated."
Assuming there is a sense of ''you'' sensing it's reality.

You do not live the senses. You describe the senses by words. Words are auditory illusions of sound and light.
The ear and the eye are instruments of sound and light, not the hearer, or the seer.

Even the computer reminds us of this wisdom of life.

The computer works on electricity (light) in digital format signals. This implies that images, letters and words are illusions of light on a computer in daily life. Similarly, light-rays that enter the eye appear as images, letters and words in the mind as well. This implies that images, letters and words are illusions of light in the mind. The mind is a computer of life that works on sunlight, just as computer works solely on electricity and electricity is light. Also every atom of everything that exists is light.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

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Dontaskme wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:07 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:41 am The "then" does not logically follow from the "if" there. That's what I'm saying. It's illogical. I honestly can't understand how you can possibly believe it, because the words you're using don't add up to coherence, let alone truth. "Simulated" is, by definition, "not real," or "artificial," or "illusory." But every illusion, unreality or artificiality is only detectable in reference to reality.

Yet you say you have no evidence of such a reality. So you have no basis on which to speak of "simulations." There's nothing to be "simulated."
Assuming there is a sense of ''you'' sensing it's reality.
You just assumed it. You called it a "simulation," which means somebody was there to detect that it was, and to call it that. That's you.

But even if you didn't exist, whether or not reality was a simulation would not change. You might say that nobody would be "knowing" it, perhaps; but the actual conditions would not be any different on account of that.
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

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Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:54 pm That's you.

That You, cannot know the beginning or ending of that you.

That you cannot be touched. That you has no more substance than a subroutine in a computer simulation. Machines cannot know their creators.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by Immanuel Can »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:17 pm Machines cannot know their creators.
A machine doesn't actually "know" anything.

We do.
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Re: IF the universe was created THEN...

Post by Dontaskme »

Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:31 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:17 pm Machines cannot know their creators.
A machine doesn't actually "know" anything.

We do.
No, the 'we' is known, and that which is known, know nothing.
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