VVilliam wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:32 pm
I think posters here are forgetting an important observation.
We know this universe exists as something we are experiencing.
If we were not experiencing this universe, for us - it would not exist. [even though it does - but we know this only because we are experiencing it.]
We can surmise that 'nothing' also exists, because we have experience of it [as memory or lack of memory of it. It doesn't matter which, because is it nothing.]
If something [this universe] derived from nothing, then that would signify a beginning point to the universe.
It may not be that the nothing is actually what created the universe. Nothing may be a type of curtain between us and something else.
But in every instance, be it something or nothing there is always the same something [not nothing] which acknowledges the existence of something or nothing.
The Observer.
And, as I say; EVERY 'thing' is relative to the observer.
Now, I suggest BEFORE ANY of 'you', human beings, even START surmising or even just imagining that there could or was 'nothing' before 'something' just ONE of 'you' explains how this could even be a POSSIBILITY. If NONE of you can do this, then maybe some of you will START LOOKING AT and SEEING what thee One and ONLY ACTUAL Truth IS.
If ANY of 'you' can explain HOW thee One and ONLY Universe COULD EVEN have 'a beginning' through ANY 'logically reasoned' explanation' and/or even be an 'empirical possibility' let alone an 'empirical actuality', then please do.
Since NO human being EVER HAS hitherto, to the days when this was written, then WHY some of 'you' think or even BELIEVE that 'a beginning' could even be true, only you would KNOW because ONLY 'you' can LOOK back on your past experiences to FIND where this completely and utterly DISTORTED THINKING came from.
Also, the CLAIM that the 'nothing' might be a 'type of curtain' between us and something else, is just ANOTHER PRIME EXAMPLE of someone who say just about ANY thing to 'try to' "justify" their OWN ALREADY HELD ASSUMPTIONS and/or BELIEFS.
Saying that 'nothing' might be 'something' becomes MORE ABSURD, the more this is LOOKED AT and thought about.