Evolution and free will

So what's really going on?

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Sculptor
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:56 pm
Sculptor wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:27 pm
bahman wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 2:51 pm
That is simply not true. I have difficulty understanding sometimes but I counter well when I understand you. Do you have the feeling of free will?
Define free will
The ability to choose between options unbiasedly.
No one has that.
We could not have an opinion were we to have no bias.
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Sculptor
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:58 pm
Sculptor wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:28 pm
bahman wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 2:54 pm
It is possible. Any agent who has free will is an uncaused cause. You don't believe in free will so I cannot help you. I believe that you cannot see the link between free will and uncaused cause too.
So you are an uncaused cause??
how much more ridiculous can you get?
Yes, I am uncaused caused sine I am free to choose.
You did not chose to be born you idiot.
Walker
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by Walker »

Can't choose another ending to the saga, either, which is where duality falls flat on its face.
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bahman
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by bahman »

Age wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 1:24 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:56 pm
Sculptor wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:27 pm

Define free will
The ability to choose between options unbiasedly.
But this is an IMPOSSIBILITY.
We do it most of the time.
Age wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 1:24 pm But if you removed the last word, or the last three words, then that definition would FIT IN PERFECTLY with EVERY thing else.
No.
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bahman
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by bahman »

Sculptor wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 4:02 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:56 pm
Sculptor wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:27 pm

Define free will
The ability to choose between options unbiasedly.
No one has that.
We could not have an opinion were we to have no bias.
We have been through this before. Are you able to do anything when you have no idea what is going to happen to you?
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bahman
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by bahman »

Sculptor wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 4:03 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:58 pm
Sculptor wrote: Sun Sep 18, 2022 4:28 pm

So you are an uncaused cause??
how much more ridiculous can you get?
Yes, I am uncaused caused sine I am free to choose.
You did not chose to be born you idiot.
My mind was not created. Just think about it, I am free therefore I am the uncaused cause.
CHNOPS
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by CHNOPS »

Age, or bahman:

Is just that your comments have a strong force like if you are a stubborn.

When I read your comments I inmediatly realize that whatever I tell to you, you will no change your thoughts about that.

That is the image we percieve in your comments.
CHNOPS
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by CHNOPS »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:51 pm
Sculptor wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 4:03 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:58 pm
Yes, I am uncaused caused sine I am free to choose.
You did not chose to be born you idiot.
My mind was not created. Just think about it, I am free therefore I am the uncaused cause.
Sorry, can you explain to me what do you mean by "free to choose" ?

Let see if you really want to learn, ok?
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bahman
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by bahman »

CHNOPS wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 6:25 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:51 pm
Sculptor wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 4:03 pm

You did not chose to be born you idiot.
My mind was not created. Just think about it, I am free therefore I am the uncaused cause.
Sorry, can you explain to me what do you mean by "free to choose" ?

Let see if you really want to learn, ok?
By free I mean that your decision is not biased by options. Think of a situation in which you are on a road that takes you to a destination. Suddenly the road forks and you don't know which road to take. You cannot be biased with one of the roads yet you are free to choose one. Think of a situation where you want to invest in the market but you don't know whether the price for a share increases or decreases. Your options are whether to invest in the market or not. Can't you decide in such a situation? The number of cases where we don't know what to do yet we do something is very vast in our lives.
Belinda
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by Belinda »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 6:34 pm
CHNOPS wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 6:25 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:51 pm
My mind was not created. Just think about it, I am free therefore I am the uncaused cause.
Sorry, can you explain to me what do you mean by "free to choose" ?

Let see if you really want to learn, ok?
By free I mean that your decision is not biased by options. Think of a situation in which you are on a road that takes you to a destination. Suddenly the road forks and you don't know which road to take. You cannot be biased with one of the roads yet you are free to choose one. Think of a situation where you want to invest in the market but you don't know whether the price for a share increases or decreases. Your options are whether to invest in the market or not. Can't you decide in such a situation? The number of cases where we don't know what to do yet we do something is very vast in our lives.
But Bahman, that's not freedom of choice, that's random choice. We do random choosing when we gamble .
CHNOPS
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by CHNOPS »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 6:34 pm
CHNOPS wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 6:25 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:51 pm
My mind was not created. Just think about it, I am free therefore I am the uncaused cause.
Sorry, can you explain to me what do you mean by "free to choose" ?

Let see if you really want to learn, ok?
By free I mean that your decision is not biased by options. Think of a situation in which you are on a road that takes you to a destination. Suddenly the road forks and you don't know which road to take. You cannot be biased with one of the roads yet you are free to choose one. Think of a situation where you want to invest in the market but you don't know whether the price for a share increases or decreases. Your options are whether to invest in the market or not. Can't you decide in such a situation? The number of cases where we don't know what to do yet we do something is very vast in our lives.
Just stay with one example, ok?

This:

"Think of a situation in which you are on a road that takes you to a destination"


In this situation I was yesterday. I just drive my car, I didnt think in going to anywhere, just drive, and I have to decide if I go the left or right.

I didnt create any thoughts, I didnt think anything. I just smell bacon comming from the right side, so I drive to the right side, because I was hungry.


That is a free choise?
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Sculptor
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:47 pm
Sculptor wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 4:02 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:56 pm
The ability to choose between options unbiasedly.
No one has that.
We could not have an opinion were we to have no bias.
We have been through this before. Are you able to do anything when you have no idea what is going to happen to you?
I do not think you know what bias means
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Sculptor
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:51 pm
Sculptor wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 4:03 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:58 pm
Yes, I am uncaused caused sine I am free to choose.
You did not chose to be born you idiot.
My mind was not created. Just think about it, I am free therefore I am the uncaused cause.
No you are not an uncaused cause and you are not free.
You were born with a set of DNA into an environment over which you had no control or choice. Events happened to you which formed your knowledge and volition. At all times as a result of your DNA and environment. YOur choices were made through these conditions; your choices as what you like to call a "free" agent were caused by your situation and how you reacted to them all determined by the conditions you found yourself in.
You can express your will, but it is based on your current situation, all determined by a series of events over which you had no control.
All these influences are what caused you to be the confused person you are now.
CHNOPS
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by CHNOPS »

There are only 2 options, Determinism vs Azar

There is no such a thing like "free will".

When people who defends "free will" try to define it, what happens is that they dont define nothing or they define what we call Azar, and so there is no need to call it "free will" when you are just using the same meaning.

But brahman, remember when I see you have a strong ego. Remind that when you answer, ok?

Is not like you are just wrong in everything. Remember I am not a materialist.

I am not like Sculptor, if you understand in this way :P
Age
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Re: Evolution and free will

Post by Age »

bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:19 pm
Age wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 1:24 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 12:56 pm
The ability to choose between options unbiasedly.
But this is an IMPOSSIBILITY.
We do it most of the time.
So, if you want to CLAIM that 'we' choose between options, UNBIASEDLY,, most of the time, then I suggest you now provide an example of when 'we' do this JUST ONCE. That is, of course, if you want to be taken seriously.

If, however, you do NOT provide ANY examples of when 'we', supposedly, choose between options WITHOUT BIAS, then, REALLY, what you CLAIM is just your very OWN UNPROVEN view or BELIEF.

So, I suggest you now either STAND UP and PROVE your claim here absolutely true, or just ACCEPT that this is ONLY what you think or BELIEVE is true, and which may NOT be true AT ALL.
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 5:19 pm
Age wrote: Mon Sep 19, 2022 1:24 pm But if you removed the last word, or the last three words, then that definition would FIT IN PERFECTLY with EVERY thing else.
No.
LOL

"No", in regards to 'what', EXACTLY?

And, as YOUR CLAIM stands now, it is, OBVIOUSLY, UNPROVEN, to 'us'.
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