metaphysics is...

So what's really going on?

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Skepdick
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Skepdick »

Advocate wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:27 pm The way a biological brain changes is fundamentally different than they way a mechanical
Does this fundamental difference make a difference?
Advocate wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:27 pm , or whatever, one would, the cumulative nature of which means they are fundamentally different substrates.
Does this fundamental difference make a difference?
Advocate wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:27 pm Likewise the idea of transferring any particular mind to any other brain.
Is the idea of "copying files" from one computer to another computer. The software runs even if the hardware is different.
Advocate wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:27 pm The mind is substrate-dependent, individually and universally. We are firmly and fundamentally embodied beings and only a gradual persistent change of state can meaningfully alter that status.
So... when you use the word "meaningfully" are you not saying the same thing I am saying as "difference that makes a difference" ?

How do you account for amnesiacs having change of personality/taste?
Skepdick
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Skepdick »

Belinda wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:14 pm Of set [ABCDEF] each member has qualities pqrs and t. These qualities of each member are the same when the set is enlarged by GHIJ and K.
Yep, yep! I get it.

You are invoking Liebnitz's identity of indiscernables.

All the members of the set have identical properties (even though the set is expanding).

Belinda wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:14 pm The set I have in mind is nature which we may presume has infinite number of members. Each member has mental and physical qualities.
The question here is whether nature (if conceptualised as a set) is a set that keeps getting enlarged.

I think this is a fundamental category error on human part. What we are observing growing is not nature ... it's the human body of knowledge. Individual and collective.
Belinda wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:14 pm Unless one is a believer in panpsychism it is hard to credit a stone with mental quality. This is an objection to neutral monism.
Yeah, but that's the eternal problem of line-drawing.

It's where all monism falls apart. Where it devolves to pluralism for all practical purposes.
Belinda wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:14 pm However neutral monism or especially dual aspect monism are useful in a practical , political, and moral sense.
I agree, but for very different reasons. In order to have effective discourse, denying your interlocutor's feelings as "not real" because your fundamental categories distinguish between feelings and reality as being "fundamentally different" - it's a recipe for miscommunication.
Age
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Age »

Skepdick wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:35 pm
Age wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 3:05 am LOL Creation (of systems) is ALREADY Truly WELL UNDERSTOOD. Well by some of 'us' that is.
You could simply say that you are a Posthumanist and spare us the verbal diarrhoea.
Either way; Creation of systems, and even Creation, Itself, is ALREADY Truly UNDERSTOOD.

If ANY of 'you', adult human beings, here in this forum are OPEN and Honest enough to want to CHALLENGE 'me' on this, then go right ahead.

Otherwise, REMAIN at that 'human' evolutionary stage of being, in and by your human BELIEFS, and thus STUCK in NOT being able to gather and learn more and new knowledge at a rate that exponentially grows.

You OBVIOUSLY BELIEVE wholeheartedly without a shadow of doubt what you do here and so 'you' are a COMPLETELY CLOSED person and thus are NOT able to learn ANY more on this.
Age
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Age »

Skepdick wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:13 pm
Age wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 3:03 am What 'you', adult human beings, synthesize the idea of 'space' from; is just distance,itself, and, the idea of 'time' from; is just duration, itself.
So where did you synthesize the ideas of "distance" and "duration" from?
The SAME place you did. Through the ability to SEE PAST the 'here' and the 'now'.
Skepdick
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Skepdick »

Age wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 11:13 pm The SAME place you did. Through the ability to SEE PAST the 'here' and the 'now'.
So where did you synthesise the ideas of "here", "now" and "sameness" from ?
Belinda
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Belinda »

Belinda wrote: ↑Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:14 pm
However neutral monism or especially dual aspect monism are useful in a practical , political, and moral sense.
Skepdick replied:
I agree, but for very different reasons. In order to have effective discourse, denying your interlocutor's feelings as "not real" because your fundamental categories distinguish between feelings and reality as being "fundamentally different" - it's a recipe for miscommunication.
I agree. If I may, I add at that juncture absolute communication aligns with omniscience, and effectiveness with ethics. I see a clear connection between dual aspect monism and the best of political, diplomatic, international, inter-ethnic, clinical, and all interpersonal decisions.
Age
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Age »

Skepdick wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 11:18 pm
Age wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 11:13 pm The SAME place you did. Through the ability to SEE PAST the 'here' and the 'now'.
So where did you synthesise the ideas of "here", "now" and "sameness" from ?
I REALLY hope you do go ALL the way with this.

For the first two, from KNOWING WHERE and WHEN I am, EXACTLY, which 'you' can NOT YET do.

For the third one, from BEING ABLE to SEE 'things' as they Truly ARE, which 'you' can NOT YET do, as well.
Skepdick
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Skepdick »

Age wrote: Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:42 am I REALLY hope you do go ALL the way with this.
I doubt it's possible but I can always try...

Where did you synthesise the ideas of "ALL" from?
Where did you synthesise the idea of "hope" from?
Age wrote: Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:42 am For the first two, from KNOWING WHERE and WHEN I am, EXACTLY, which 'you' can NOT YET do.

For the third one, from BEING ABLE to SEE 'things' as they Truly ARE, which 'you' can NOT YET do, as well.
Where did you synthesise the ideas of "WHERE", "WHEN", "BEING", "SEEING" and "EXACTNESS", from?

Lets just save ourselves both the time: which was the first concept you synthesised all by yourself and what did you synthesise it from?
Age
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Age »

Skepdick wrote: Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:51 am
Age wrote: Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:42 am I REALLY hope you do go ALL the way with this.
I doubt it's possible but I can always try...

Where did you synthesise the ideas of "ALL" from?
Where did you synthesise the idea of "hope" from?
Age wrote: Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:42 am For the first two, from KNOWING WHERE and WHEN I am, EXACTLY, which 'you' can NOT YET do.

For the third one, from BEING ABLE to SEE 'things' as they Truly ARE, which 'you' can NOT YET do, as well.
Where did you synthesise the ideas of "WHERE", "WHEN", "BEING", "SEEING" and "EXACTNESS", from?

Lets just save ourselves both the time: which was the first concept you synthesised all by yourself and what did you synthesise it from?
I do not recall the first concept.

But what I synthesized 'it', and EVERY other concep,t from is from the exact same place that EVERY one synthesizes ALL of their concepts from. That is; 'agreement'.
Skepdick
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Skepdick »

Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:28 pm I do not recall the first concept.

But what I synthesized 'it', and EVERY other concep,t from is from the exact same place that EVERY one synthesizes ALL of their concepts from. That is; 'agreement'.
So where did you synthesise "agreement" from?
Age
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Age »

Skepdick wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:30 pm
Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:28 pm I do not recall the first concept.

But what I synthesized 'it', and EVERY other concep,t from is from the exact same place that EVERY one synthesizes ALL of their concepts from. That is; 'agreement'.
So where did you synthesise "agreement" from?
I thought you ALREADY KNEW the answer to this question.

Do you ALREADY KNOW the answer to your question here?
Skepdick
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Skepdick »

Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:40 pm I thought you ALREADY KNEW the answer to this question.

Do you ALREADY KNOW the answer to your question here?
Did you not think that I didn't and don't know the answer to the question? That is why I asked it. That is why I am going to ask it again.

So where did you synthesise "agreement" from?
Age
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Age »

Skepdick wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:41 pm
Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:40 pm I thought you ALREADY KNEW the answer to this question.

Do you ALREADY KNOW the answer to your question here?
Did you not think that I didn't and don't know the answer to the question?
I do now.
Skepdick wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:41 pm That is why I asked it.
So, are you implying that you NEVER know what the answer is when you ask clarifying questions?

If yes, then this explains a lot about 'you', adult human beings, as well as shows that the more clarifying questions that you pose to me, then the more you will be able to learn, and understand.
Skepdick wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:41 pm That is why I am going to ask it again.

So where did you synthesise "agreement" from?
From past experiences.

Also, WHY can I, and actually do, answer clarifying questions posed to me. But, rarely, if ever, this ability, and decency, is shown back to me?
Skepdick
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Skepdick »

Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:51 pm From past experiences.
That's not synthesis. That's learning.
Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:51 pm Also, WHY can I, and actually do, answer clarifying questions posed to me. But, rarely, if ever, this ability, and decency, is shown back to me?
The questions I ask don't give you clarity?
Age
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Re: metaphysics is...

Post by Age »

Skepdick wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:53 pm
Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:51 pm From past experiences.
That's not synthesis. That's learning.
So, what is 'synthesis' to 'you'?
Skepdick wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:53 pm
Age wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:51 pm Also, WHY can I, and actually do, answer clarifying questions posed to me. But, rarely, if ever, this ability, and decency, is shown back to me?
The questions I ask don't give you clarity?
Clarity on 'what', EXACTLY?

You have ALREADY made it KNOWN that you do NOT YET KNOW what the answers are when you ask questions.
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