Mind has no location

So what's really going on?

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henry quirk
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Re: Mind has no location

Post by henry quirk »

roydop wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 4:45 pm Even conventional methods of determining location are all relative. There is no base for locating physical objects. Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle addresses this.

Your wave function exists at all locations at the same time.

The wave function is a mathematical description/model of "mind".
sure seems to me: when my 14 year gives me a friendly punch on the shoulder, he locates me pretty damn easy

I got the bruise to prove it
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henry quirk
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Re: Mind has no location

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Impenitent wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 9:32 pm
henry quirk wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 1:27 pm Then if your mind is located inside you, then you know location, and this location must be infinitely everywhere at once ...right?

of course not

right now, I'm sittin' in a chair in my livin' room, in a house, in Church Point, LA.

I'm in one place...my bones, blood, muscles, brain are in one place...my mind (or soul or spirit) is irrevocably intertwined with my flesh, so my mind is in one place
your spirit is entangled in every word you utter (communication you make...)

-Imp
nah...I craft & direct the codifications but I'm not actually in the communication
Greylorn Ell
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Re: Mind has no location

Post by Greylorn Ell »

Skepdick wrote: Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:09 am
Greylorn Ell wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 10:21 pm I made a living with computers for half a century, and found that it was no big deal getting rubes to believe that a thought process controlled their behavior; however, that thought process was in the mind of a programmer, not a machine.

Computers are incapable of abstract thought, as are way too many humans.
GL
Feynman made a fine point here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipRvjS7q1DI

If you are beginning to compare things abstractly then any answer goes.

Can a computer play chess like a human? No!
Can a computer win at chess against a human? Yes!

The way computers think and the way humans think are both "different" and "the same". Depending on your "sameness" and "difference" heuristic.

If you think the "thought process" is in the "mind of the programmer" then you never stepped outside of the imperative programming paradigm.
In Logic programming you define the goal, and then the optimiser takes over.
After looking up "logic programming," my first thought is that the term is dreadfully unimaginative, like the names given to atomic particle properties.

It would have been worthless for my purposes, which were typically spacecraft and instrumentation control, even if the cumbersome "compiler" could have fit into the PDP-8 computers I was using at the time (4K 12-bit words, no multiply/divide instructions). But this is irrelevant.
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Re: Mind has no location

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henry quirk wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 11:47 pm
Greylorn Ell wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 10:27 pm
henry quirk wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:05 pm

in my neck of the woods, we call that the soul
That's a perfect definition for a few good old boys parked on stumps in the woods, sharing a few 6-packs and being careful not to ask about the origin and purpose of the soul, or how, if the soul is a spirit as commonly believed, can it interact with a material body.
as I sit here, sippin' shine, fingerin' my banjo: I reckon souls grow...man is a composite being: an irrevocable mix of spirit (or soul) and flesh, or -- if you prefer -- information and matter...it's not too far off to think of mind or spirit or soul as software and the body/brain as hardware, each radically different from the other, each useless without the other

as to purposes: god will tell you (first, I hope)
What does "irrevocable mix" mean? Is the ratio of body stuff to soul stuff a constant? If so, how would it be measured?
GL
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Dontaskme
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Re: Mind has no location

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henry quirk wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 1:27 pm Then if your mind is located inside you, then you know location, and this location must be infinitely everywhere at once ...right?

of course not

right now, I'm sittin' in a chair in my livin' room, in a house, in Church Point, LA.

I'm in one place...my bones, blood, muscles, brain are in one place...my mind (or soul or spirit) is irrevocably intertwined with my flesh, so my mind is in one place
Well there is only ONE PLACE

just as there is only one space.

and that space is everywhere at once, then obviously the contents of space is made out of the space it’s appearing and disappearing in.

There is no inside or outside of space, there is only space and it’s relative contents, relative to itself ALL ONE PLACE.

.
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henry quirk
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Re: Mind has no location

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What does "irrevocable mix" mean?

inseparable


Is the ratio of body stuff to soul stuff a constant?

hell if I know


If so, how would it be measured?

hell if I know
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Re: Mind has no location

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Well there is only ONE PLACE

there's a big ass box...we call it Reality or Universe...inside the box there's a little bit of stuff...the stuff is spread out unevenly throughout the box...there's an awful lot of space between various concentrations of stuff...not one bit of stuff ever occupies the same point in space, at the same point in time, as another bit of stuff ('cept, mebbe, in a singularity, sumthin' which may not exist)

a tiny amount of stuff is complex in structure...this stuff is animated...we call it life...most of this animated stuff operates accordin' to rules encoded in its substance...natural robots, you can call it: automated...but, some tiny fraction of this animated stuff is aware of itself and aware of the rules encoded in itself...this self-aware stuff can choose...it can choose to ignore some of the rules encoded within it...it can overlay new rules on itself...this self-aware stuff, however, is subject to a new set of rules, rules extendin' out of its unique nature...we call these new rules morality ...we call this self-awareness mind or soul or spirit or self-organizin' information...this self-awareness is confined to, bound to, bits of complex stuff...like stuff, this self-awareness never occupies the same point in space, at the same point in time, as another self-awareness

the box is real...the clumps of stuff, simple and complex, are real...mind is real...location (here and now compared to there and then) is real

thus ends the lesson
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Re: Mind has no location

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Very good Henry. 👍. I like your descriptions...

henry quirk wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 2:19 pm Well there is only ONE PLACE

there's a big ass box...we call it Reality or Universe...inside the box there's a little bit of stuff...the stuff is spread out unevenly throughout the box...

Nice story Henry. Now I’ll give you my version .... there’s a big ass box ( consciousness / mind ) ....we call it a thought processing mechanism couched within pure infinite awareness...inside the consciousness/ mind there’s a little stuff [ conceptual clumps ] ...the clumps are spread out unevenly throughout the consciousness/ mind but are inseparable from the pure infinite awareness that knows them. And this KNOWINGNESS is the exact same SPACE/ PLACE in every sentient clump from the perspective of that clump, and while each perspective is being experienced individually according to that clumps algorithm and conditioning, there is NOTHING else happening...because this knowing is the only knowing there is at this one particular point in time and place...aka space aka awareness. 👍🤣
CONTINUING ON WITH MY VERSION... there's an awful lot of empty space aka pure infinite awareness between various concentrations of finite clumps not one bit of clump ever occupies the same point in space, at the same point in time as another bit of clump because without mental conscious knowing there are no clumps and without clumps there is no conscious knowing aka any thing to be aware of. So BOTH the object (clump) and the subject (mind) have to be in PLACE together in conjunction with each other, at exactly the same time and space for there to be any KNOWN show...however, the apparent separation between clump and the knowing awareness space that knows the clump is an illusion.
CONTINUING ON ....a tiny amount of clump is complex in structure...these clumps are animated...we call it life...most of this animated clumps operatate accordin' to rules encoded in its substance...natural robots, you can call it: automated...but, some tiny fraction of this animated clumps is aware of itself and aware of the rules encoded in itself...this self-aware clump can choose...it can choose to ignore some of the rules encoded within it...it can overlay new rules on itself...this self-aware clump, however, is subject to a new set of rules, rules extendin' out of its unique nature...we call these new rules morality ...we call this self-awareness mind or soul or spirit or self-organizin' information...this self-awareness is confined to, bound to, bits of complex clumps like stuff, this self-awareness never occupies the same point in space, at the same point in time, as another self-awareness because the mind is alway identifying itself as an object aka clump within the dream of separation known only to infinite awareness, in the dream of space time duality aka the show ...where life is seen frame by frame..where the space aka infinite pure awareness and the thought processing mechanism clump / mind appear to be separated from the awareness that knows the thought into a form of duality.

the consciousness is real...the clump is simple and complex, are are real...mind is real...location (here and now compared to there and then) is real

thus ends the lesson of word salad 🧐🤓🤪
It’s different that’s all Henry...the same one spirit energy dreaming difference where there is none....difference as in how the nondual nature of reality is described and written, there are infinite ways of expressing infinity.

👍👍👍
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henry quirk
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Re: Mind has no location

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Very good Henry. 👍. I like your descriptions...

yeah, I did a pretty good job with that post
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Re: Mind has no location

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henry quirk wrote: Fri Oct 09, 2020 3:26 pm Very good Henry. 👍. I like your descriptions...

yeah, I did a pretty good job with that post
Yes you did Henry, you did indeed.

Good job from the Henry mind of excellence. 👌😎

KUDOS ! 😜
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henry quirk
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Re: Mind has no location

Post by henry quirk »

Dontaskme wrote: Fri Oct 09, 2020 7:11 pm
henry quirk wrote: Fri Oct 09, 2020 3:26 pm Very good Henry. 👍. I like your descriptions...

yeah, I did a pretty good job with that post
Yes you did Henry, you did indeed.

Good job from the Henry mind of excellence. 👌😎

KUDOS ! 😜
high praise from a droplet of pure god-consciousness...now I'm all warm and fuzzy inside
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Re: Mind has no location

Post by Dimebag »

From the point of view of the mind itself, mind has no location, because mind is all pervasive from its own perspective.

From an external 3rd person observer, or even an imagined 3rd person perspective, the mind’s location exists inside the brain.

The mind itself can only know itself from itself. But, it can also conceptualise, and imagine, or infer, this external observation, which allows itself to be located by inference, in the brain.

The mind can also understand that, all that it observes, occurs within it (not that which it infers exists external to it, to which the contents of mind refer to). As such, it can locate itself everywhere within its own projected mind.

So, subjectively, mind is everywhere (within itself - all is mind).

Objectively, mind is located in the brain.

Objective is only inferred and never known directly, only know through the subjective.

This doesn’t negate the existence of the objective, but only relegates it to an inferred existence.
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Re: Mind has no location

Post by dxoutkast »

Tired of your bullshit on another forums mate. I had to answer this one.

Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm From the point of view of the mind itself
What do you mean by "POV of mind itself"?
There is no such thing, you have a mind, the POV of "mind itself" is YOUR POV. WHICH INDEED happens inside a brain.

Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm mind has no location
BS. IT HAS A LOCATION, inside a brain.
Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm mind is pervasive from its own perspective.
No, it's not.
Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm From an external 3rd person observer, or even an imagined 3rd person perspective, the mind’s location exists inside the brain.
No such thing as "external 3rd person view". EACH VIEW you have is FIRST PERSON view of the mind, which is located inside your brain.

Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm The mind itself can only know itself
The "mind" can't know shit, there is no such thing as "the mind, as a mini alien knowing things". You're the one who possess a mind.
Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm But, -- (not it, you) can also conceptualise, and imagine, or infer, this --- ---, which allows --- to be located by inference, in the brain.
...😂😂 so according to you, you can leave your brain as much as you want, but you "allow" your mind to be in the brain 😂😂😂. Of course this is 100% a fact. You can't be serious.
Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm The mind can also understand that
The "mind" can't understans shit, there is no such thing as "the mind, as a mini alien knowing things". You're the one who understands a mind.
Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm a̶l̶l̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶o̶b̶s̶e̶r̶v̶e̶s̶,̶ ̶o̶c̶c̶u̶r̶s̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶i̶n̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶(̶n̶o̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶w̶h̶i̶c̶h̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶i̶n̶f̶e̶r̶s̶ ̶e̶x̶i̶s̶t̶s̶ ̶e̶x̶t̶e̶r̶n̶a̶l̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶i̶t̶,̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶w̶h̶i̶c̶h̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶c̶o̶n̶t̶e̶n̶t̶s̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶m̶i̶n̶d̶ ̶r̶e̶f̶e̶r̶ ̶t̶o̶)̶.̶ ̶A̶s̶ ̶s̶u̶c̶h̶,̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶c̶a̶n̶ ̶l̶o̶c̶a̶t̶e̶ ̶i̶t̶s̶e̶l̶f̶ ̶e̶v̶e̶r̶y̶w̶h̶e̶r̶e̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶i̶n̶ ̶i̶t̶s̶ ̶o̶w̶n̶ ̶p̶r̶o̶j̶e̶c̶t̶e̶d̶ ̶m̶i̶n̶d̶.̶
What a bunch of word salad rubbish. You learning with Deepak?
Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm S̶o̶,̶ ̶s̶u̶b̶j̶e̶c̶t̶i̶v̶e̶l̶y̶,̶ ̶m̶i̶n̶d̶ ̶i̶s̶ ̶ (utter nonsense censored)
You're not even wrong 😂, mind is a subset of what a individual posses.y you're so wromg that it's hilarious how you came to this conclusion with a buvh of ridiculous false premises. Mind IS located in your brain. Your brain is located in space. And SOMEWHERE.

Even IF , you could get outside your brain with your mind, you would STILL be located somewhere as long as you flow whatever you want with your mind, each place you go would be somewhere, never ANYWHERE or "EVERYWHERE", no one can be "everywhere", no matter where your mind go you subjectively is somewhere, at some point in time. So your comment is a logical impossility.
Dimebag wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:57 pm O̶b̶j̶e̶c̶t̶i̶v̶e̶l̶y̶,̶ ̶m̶i̶n̶d̶ ̶i̶s̶ ̶l̶o̶c̶a̶t̶e̶d̶ ̶i̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶r̶a̶i̶n̶
Subjectivey one's mind IS located in the brain, there is no "objectively"
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Re: Mind has no location

Post by dxoutkast »

AlexW wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 12:59 am
bahman wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 9:50 pm Minds are not due to/subjected to ideas. Therefore, they have no location.
If "they" do not have a location, this would imply that they either:

1) Do not exist at all
or
2) That they have no boundary

Which one is it?
3) you have a mind, so whatever you are, your mind is.
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Re: Mind has no location

Post by AlexW »

dxoutkast wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:53 pm 3) you have a mind, so whatever you are, your mind is.
Is this not just another way of saying "you are what you think/believe you are" ?
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