Self-liberation

So what's really going on?

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waechter418
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Self-liberation

Post by waechter418 » Wed Aug 30, 2017 4:59 pm

Liberation from the confines of mind, has been tried for at least two millennia, and proven to be a Sisyphean task, as the respective undertakings tend to add to the complexity of mind.
Since the beginning of the twentieth century, mind is apparently able to liberate itself through Self-realisation.

Impenitent
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Impenitent » Wed Aug 30, 2017 10:29 pm

and I was expecting a riff on Houdini...

-Imp

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waechter418
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by waechter418 » Thu Aug 31, 2017 1:21 am

this is just the beginning of the illusion - follow it through, and you will get a surprise :lol:

Walker
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Walker » Thu Aug 31, 2017 1:35 am

I thought, Yogananda. However, the lineage of Kriya Yoga is said to begin with the ageless Babaji.

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waechter418
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by waechter418 » Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:03 pm

Mind accumulates and transforms external/internal events - Self is the core of Mind

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Harbal
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Harbal » Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:43 pm

Walker wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 1:35 am
is said to begin with the ageless Babaji.
How can anything be ageless? However long the Babaji has been around, that's how old it is.

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Harbal
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Harbal » Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:47 pm

waechter418 wrote:
Wed Aug 30, 2017 4:59 pm
Liberation from the confines of mind, has been tried for at least two millennia, and proven to be a Sisyphean task,
We all achieve it eventually, whether we want to or not.

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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Walker » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:21 am

Harbal wrote:
Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:43 pm
Walker wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 1:35 am
is said to begin with the ageless Babaji.
How can anything be ageless? However long the Babaji has been around, that's how old it is.
Merriam or Webster or both insist that ageless means not growing old or showing the effects of age. They say nothing of origin point that begins the countdown to the end of the universe, and anyone who does is just speculating. Find the oldest thing you can find and that still doesn’t say where it came from.

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Harbal
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Harbal » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:12 am

Walker wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:21 am
Merriam or Webster or both insist that ageless means not growing old or showing the effects of age.
In what way am I responsible for what Merriam or Webster say? I attribute age according to how long something has been around, in this case the Babaji which, incidentally, is better eaten fresh.
Find the oldest thing you can find and that still doesn’t say where it came from.
I don't think I said anything about where anything came from.

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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Walker » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:34 pm

You did when you equated age with ageless, for age implies a beginning: a birth point to begin counting the seasons, the rings in the tree, the age of the universe. Ageless does not imply that beginning. What does not begin, does not end. Dualistic mind says that all things begin and end and makes it so in the understanding, discarding what doesn't fit the mold.

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Harbal
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Harbal » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:44 pm

Walker wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:34 pm
Ageless does not imply that beginning. What does not begin, does not end. Dualistic mind says that all things begin and end.
Ageless implies non existence and if something has no beginning or end that also implies non existence. You may talk about having no beginning or end but your mind, albeit "dualistic" or not, cannot even conceptualise what that means.

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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Walker » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:50 pm

Don’t you instead mean that ageless implies ever-existent, rather than never existent?

Some say the universe has always been.

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Harbal
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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Harbal » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:55 pm

Walker wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:50 pm
Don’t you instead mean that ageless implies ever-existent, rather than never existent?
No, I don't mean that.
Some say the universe has always been.
Well I'm not saying that and it's what I'm saying that you seem to be challenging, I don't really see the relevance of what some others say.

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Re: Self-liberation

Post by Walker » Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:01 pm

:|

It is true that ageless is a modifier used in description, as are many words. For instance, I would be inclined to say the humorous Harbal, whereas other folks might be inclined to say The Harbal, others might simply say Harbal, and others might say God knows what.

Any particular inclination is the activation of latent samskaras by conditions which allow the burning off of the tendency through karma, or action bound to time. Karma implies rebirth of that which is not born which clings along for the ride until karma leaves only that which is not born. The microcosm of a single lifetime, no matter the form of the life, embodies the eternal, although you may not have mentioned that.

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Re: Self-liberation

Post by osgart » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:17 pm

why would someone want to be liberated from mind in the first place?

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