The Problem with Us.

So what's really going on?

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o0oEdgarElemento0o
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The Problem with Us.

Post by o0oEdgarElemento0o » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:52 am

The Problem with Us
If you've got the time; Finish this. With an open mind you can learn much.

If you post before reading the entire thing, you're doing it wrong; as i have responded to common rebuttals already. If your issue is still unanswered, and you've read the entire thing, please feel free to respond with your concerns. Thank you!

. We like to observe everything from a distance and make sure it's safe before we interact with it. Even then it's with the aid or protection of our creations. {This effectively renders us trapped within a bubble of our own creation. Yes, the bubble protects us and prolongs each of our individual lives, and yet it causes us to deteriorate physically over the many generations} If you argue that prolonged life is necessary for the survival of our species, i ask you to look at the mayfly. It lives only hours, yet the species continues to exist to this day.

. Partially linked to the first problem; fear. Fear is a vital tool that instinctually forces an organism to make decisions that lead to his survival. Fear is good unless you let it control you. Sadly, humans have done just this. They have allowed the fear of individual death to grip them so fiercly, that they ignore the detriments to their physiology over the generations just to see a few more years per person.

{For instance, allow me to suggest to you a crossroads of choice for a pre caveman human.

This ancient human has no tools, no weapons, no fire, no shelter, no clothing; only his naked pure self. This human is with three of his kin and a sabre cat has just leapt from behind a cluster of bushes. Frightened with the fear of imminent death, our human ancestors must make a choice.

On the left path we have a snapped branch that the human will use as a makeshift weapon to stab the sabre cat and live on to foster offspring that, many generations later, will develop advanced weaponry, medicine, transportation, and shelter.

On the Right Path there is nothing but the faith in his own species to survive. With a gutteral roar he, and the 3 other ancient humans leap upon the sabre cat, killing it; a marvelous feast for the pack. Unfortunately the cat manages to kill our subject before succumbing to it's wounds, yet the three kin live on; fostering offspring that, many generations later, will develop incredible physical and mental prowess; relying upon cooperation and courage to survive; further evolving as time marches onward.}

The difference between these two choices is that one ends in our species relying so much on our creations that we no longer improve ourselves; instead improving our creations to better preserve our fragile species, and one that ends in our species improving our bodies and minds along side eachother.

Which one do you feel is superior? Before you suggest that without our creations we would surely become extinct, explain how so many other creatures manage to survive without the need to manipulate their surroundings for their own comfort?
If you suggest that we cannot "go back" to the wild because we are so reliant upon our creations that we would surely die... I say to you, patience. Take one step at a time.

That moves me to my next point. Re-entering the wilds is like entering a cold lake. At first, you dip your toe in and cant bear the cold, but over time you are able to endure the cold; becoming used to the cold lake's environment. This analogy also applies to space itself.

Imagine that; instead of relying upon space ships to take us into space when we are clearly not ready; we instead evolved over many generations to enter it personally.

Before you say, "foolish Mr.Element, this is not possible"; hear me out.

As i stated earlier about the cold lake analogy for the wilds, this analogy also applies to the ocean.
Imagine a sect of humans, completely naked, no tools, no clothing, no shelter, choosing to instead attempt to improve their ability to swim, lived by the ocean for many centuries. As the generations progress, as they live and die, they become increasingly better at swimming.

Fast forward another couple thousand years and we see these humans emulating the flying fish; launching themselves out of the surface of the water over and over for another few hundred thousand years.
The next time we see our descendants they are flying and gliding on the winds; no longer resembling anything like their ancestors.

Here it comes. Flip your perspective and view space as... just another cold lake for you to get used to.
The first humans to skim the outer edges of the atmosphere die from lack of oxygen or being flung out of the gravitational pull.

As these humans learn, and exist out in space for longer periods of time, they further change to let go of the obsolete bodily functions such as breathing, eating, and even sight.
If you view this manner of existence to be inferior or impossible, please think for a moment on the nature of who we are as a species.

The reason we have lungs, eyes, and stomachs is because the environment in which we exist demanded these functions from us in order for us to survive.

When you alter the environment in which you are currently existing, it demands it's own unique functions for you to be able to exist in it; much like our tolerance to the lack of heat being a prerequisite for swimming in the cold lake.
When you begin to let go of the rigid routines that have defined your species, it is then that you truly know whether or not you can fly.

Long after i am dead, these words will live on in the hearts of a special few who did not fear failure. They feared only that they would never really know the truth; for our telescopes will never show us what is truly out there. Our quantum theories will never be able to explain to us the nature of the universe. If we remain comfortable behind our protective bubbles, the best we will ever get is educated guesses.

If that is to be the fate of the human species, i think i might decide to become something else.
I'll be waiting for you all, my brothers and sisters; do not let fear control you any longer. Let not doubt deterr your action; let only the faith in yourself, as well as others, lead you down the Right Path. :D

Impenitent
Posts: 2773
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:04 pm

Re: The Problem with Us.

Post by Impenitent » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:58 pm

Frank Herbert has left the building

welcome to the boards

-Imp

o0oEdgarElemento0o
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:40 am

Re: The Problem with Us.

Post by o0oEdgarElemento0o » Wed Jul 15, 2015 9:15 pm

It would appear that i am not alone in the feeling that our species can achieve much if unhindered by their own fear. I am both pleased and saddened to see this. I'm happy to know there are others out there with similar theories on human evolution, and i am saddened to know that, despite this, nothing is being done to pursue this endeavor.

My thanks to you for the hearty welcome to the board. I hope i can learn much here.

Wyman
Posts: 974
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2014 2:21 pm

Re: The Problem with Us.

Post by Wyman » Wed Jul 15, 2015 10:04 pm

From Wiki:

High-altitude adaptation is an evolutionary modification in animals, most notably in birds and mammals, by which species are subjected to considerable physiological changes to survive in extremely high mountainous environments. As opposed to short-term adaptation, or more properly acclimatisation (which is basically an immediate physiological response to changing environment), the term "high-altitude adaptation" has strictly developed into the description of an irreversible, long-term physiological responses to high-altitude environments, associated with heritable behavioural and genetic changes. Perhaps, the phenomenon is most conspicuous, at least best documented, in human populations such as the Tibetans, the South Americans and the Ethiopians, who live in the otherwise uninhabitable high mountains of the Himalayas, Andes and Ethiopia respectively; and this represents one of the finest examples of natural selection in action.[1]

Oxygen, essential for animal life, is proportionally abundant in the atmosphere with height from the sea level; hence, the highest mountain ranges of the world are considered unsuitable for habitation. Surprisingly, some 140 million people live permanently at high altitudes (>2,500 m) in North, Central and South America, East Africa, and Asia, and flourish very well for millennia in the exceptionally high mountains, without any apparent complications.[2] This has become a recognised instance of the process of Darwinian evolution in humans acting on favourable characters such as enhanced respiratory mechanisms.[3][4] As a matter of fact, this adaptation is so far the fastest case of evolution in humans that is scientifically documented.[5][6][7][8][9] Among animals only few mammals (such as yak, ibex, Tibetan gazelle, vicunas, llamas, mountain goats, etc.) and certain birds are known to have completely adapted to high-altitude environments.[10]

These adaptations are an example of convergent evolution, with adaptations occurring simultaneously on three continents. Tibetan humans and Tibetan domestic dogs found the genetic mutation in both species, EPAS1. This mutation has not been seen in Andean humans, showing the effect of a shared environment on evolution[11]

o0oEdgarElemento0o
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:40 am

Re: The Problem with Us.

Post by o0oEdgarElemento0o » Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:55 am

Wyman wrote:From Wiki:

High-altitude adaptation is an evolutionary modification in animals, most notably in birds and mammals, by which species are subjected to considerable physiological changes to survive in extremely high mountainous environments. As opposed to short-term adaptation, or more properly acclimatisation (which is basically an immediate physiological response to changing environment), the term "high-altitude adaptation" has strictly developed into the description of an irreversible, long-term physiological responses to high-altitude environments, associated with heritable behavioural and genetic changes. Perhaps, the phenomenon is most conspicuous, at least best documented, in human populations such as the Tibetans, the South Americans and the Ethiopians, who live in the otherwise uninhabitable high mountains of the Himalayas, Andes and Ethiopia respectively; and this represents one of the finest examples of natural selection in action.[1]

Oxygen, essential for animal life, is proportionally abundant in the atmosphere with height from the sea level; hence, the highest mountain ranges of the world are considered unsuitable for habitation. Surprisingly, some 140 million people live permanently at high altitudes (>2,500 m) in North, Central and South America, East Africa, and Asia, and flourish very well for millennia in the exceptionally high mountains, without any apparent complications.[2] This has become a recognised instance of the process of Darwinian evolution in humans acting on favourable characters such as enhanced respiratory mechanisms.[3][4] As a matter of fact, this adaptation is so far the fastest case of evolution in humans that is scientifically documented.[5][6][7][8][9] Among animals only few mammals (such as yak, ibex, Tibetan gazelle, vicunas, llamas, mountain goats, etc.) and certain birds are known to have completely adapted to high-altitude environments.[10]

These adaptations are an example of convergent evolution, with adaptations occurring simultaneously on three continents. Tibetan humans and Tibetan domestic dogs found the genetic mutation in both species, EPAS1. This mutation has not been seen in Andean humans, showing the effect of a shared environment on evolution[11]
Magnificent! Now if only there were a sect of humans that would first start in the ocean so they could one day fly... Makes you wonder if we truly need spaceships or airplanes.

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Greta
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Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2015 8:10 am

Re: The Problem with Us.

Post by Greta » Mon Aug 31, 2015 6:01 am

It's true that we have hangups about death. 93% of all human who have ever lived in dead so death is a prosaic event, despite its personal profundity.

Still, survival is only one of the driving forces behind the human "flight from nature". Comfort - not just living, but living well - is just as influential. Like any other mammal, we want shelter and protection from heat, cold, wind, rain and hail. We want reliable sources of food and fresh water, to not be riddled with parasites, to be able to protect our food supplies, to not significantly risk death during childbirth or lose our children during birth or at a young age. We want to feel confident that we will wake each morning with minimal possibility of having our head or innards chewed out. Returning to the savagery of the ocean would be species wide suicide. There's a good reason why sea animals moved from the ocean to dry land - less competition for resources and less chance of being someone else's resource.

Like every other animal, we have never been interested in species-wide issues, just the welfare of ourselves and our own. Few would consider it wise to risk their or their families' comfort and safety for such an endeavour and those who claim they do most likely seriously underestimate the privations of wild living. Further, they would do so in what would seem a futile hope that less scrupulous types wouldn't simply exploit those self-imposed limitations and out-compete the idealistic ones.

For a positive spin on things, despite the damage we've caused, at least with humans the biosphere has grown a species that eventually may be able to protect the Earth from asteroids and whose distant descendants or successors may be able to leave and prosper elsewhere before the Earth is fried in about a billion years' time.

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