What Book Changed Your Mind?

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doolhoofd
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by doolhoofd » Wed May 29, 2019 12:11 am

Fatal Strategies by Jean Baudrillard.

"How do our allegedly rational and programmed societies function? What moves the populations, what gets them going? Scientific progress, objective information, insight into the facts and causes, the punishment of those truly guilty or the growth of collective happiness? Absolutely not, nobody cares about that. What fascinates everyone is the debauchery of appearances, that reality is always and everywhere debauched by appearances. That's an interesting game, and it's played out in the media, in fashion, in advertising - more generally in the spectacle of technology, of science, of politics - in any spectacle whatsoever. The veritable contemporary social bond is the concerted partaking in seduction. If a revolution wants to take place then it must first seduce us, and it can only do so with the signs. But while a revolution might alter the course of history, only its sight is truly sublime. And what do we choose? 'The people didn't actually desire a revolution, they merely desired its view,' said Rivarol. For such a simulation-effect, for such a seduction-effect we are willing to pay any price, far more than for the 'real' quality of our lives. The spectaclistic drive is stronger than the self-preservation instinct, you can count on that." - Jean Baudrillard, Fatal Strategies

Walker
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by Walker » Fri May 31, 2019 9:41 am

The quote and the lyrics to Revolution (Beatles) have a similar message.

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doolhoofd
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by doolhoofd » Sun Jun 02, 2019 6:15 pm

Walker wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 9:41 am
The quote and the lyrics to Revolution (Beatles) have a similar message.
Incorrect.
Perhaps you merely glanced at the quote I posted.
The association is understandable, but what Baudrillard is saying is that aesthetics is primary.
Basically, what he is saying is that there will be no revolution, because people are too busy posting their selfies and watching Game of Thrones and other assorted pulp.
( https://www.deviantart.com/gkuehn/art/p ... -714685416 & http://www.basfeijen.nl/worldview/syste ... inment.htm )
The Beatles were simply singing about the desire for change in a non-violent instead of a violent way.

Walker
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by Walker » Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:23 am

Similar means broad strokes. It doesn't mean corresponding to every detail.

The Beatles are telling people who want revolution (inexperienced young people) that they don’t know what revolution entails, which is a similar message to just desiring the view of revolution without actual revolution.

College students wearing the Che Guevara T-shirt want the spectacle, not what Guevara actually did in the name of revolution.

*

Lyrics commentary:

You say you want a revolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world

Singing to young people. We’re all idealists when young. We all want to change the world.


You say you got a real solution
Well, you know
We'd all love to see the plan

If you did have a real plan for after the revolution you would have already mentioned it, however, all you want is the spectacle of revolution.

You ask me for a contribution
Well, you know
We're doing what we can
But if you want money for people with minds that hate
All I can tell you is, brother, you have to wait

Hate as revolution motive. You present the affectation of hating what is. Youths seeking the spectacle of the revolution are focused on the No spectacle of revolution. If they were focused on the Yes of a positive plan, that’s what they would be talking about. Berets look cool with a goatee or soul patch, somewhere along the line the artistic types began wearing berets backwards.

This is similar to talking about impeaching a president, but having no charges to impeach with.


You say you'll change the constitution
Well, you know
We all want to change your head

How ‘bout that. The advice is learn a thing or two before talking about revolution.

You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You better free your mind instead

Turn that critical eye upon your own limitations.

But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao
You ain't going to make it with anyone anyhow

Finally, the real motive for the campus revolutionaries.
Cultivating an image to get laid.

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-1-
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by -1- » Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:02 pm

Impenitent wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:48 pm
-1- wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:11 pm
...I'll see you on the dark side of the Moon.
I appreciate the Floyd quote but it made me think...

how does one "see" in total darkness?

-Imp
I think they meant to match your bet with monetary equivalency or, in our case, with philosophical equivalency.

As in Poker. "I'll see you and raise you another five bucks", e.g.

Impenitent
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by Impenitent » Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:39 pm

I bet it had more to do with Syd

"The lunatic is on the grass.
The lunatic is on the grass.
Remembering games and daisy chains and laughs.
Got to keep the loonies on the path.

The lunatic is in the hall.
The lunatics are in my hall.
The paper holds their folded faces to the floor
And every day the paper boy brings more.

And if the dam breaks open many years too soon
And if there is no room upon the hill
And if your head explodes with dark forebodings too
I'll see you on the dark side of the moon.

The lunatic is in my head.
The lunatic is in my head
You raise the blade, you make the change
You re-arrange me 'til I'm sane.
You lock the door
And throw away the key
There's someone in my head but it's not me.


And if the cloud bursts, thunder in your ear
You shout and no one seems to hear.
And if the band you're in starts playing different tunes
I'll see you on the dark side of the moon.

I can't think of anything to say except...
I think it's marvelous! HaHaHa!"

-Imp

p.s. the lobotomy reference is highly progressive

jayjacobus
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by jayjacobus » Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:22 pm

"Stages of Faith" by James Fowler. I learned more about faith then I ever knew.

Walker
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Re: What Book Changed Your Mind?

Post by Walker » Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:20 am

-1- wrote:"The lunatic is on the grass.
The lunatic is on the grass.
Remembering games and daisy chains and laughs.
Got to keep the loonies on the path.
Like a crafty, old rich bird leading a young flock down the yellow brick road, singing songs of indoctrination into naiveté, learned by rote at University.

Bernie Sanders pushes for drastic change to US economy: 'We need a political revolution'
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/bernie-sanders

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