Is Emptiness Actually Depression?

[Arising_uk]

.I don't know about the fear, the emptiness, the depression. It's too close to me to see it as something separate from what I am.

I just sit with it. I recognize it but I try not to react to my outer surroundings based upon this condition I find myself in.

It seems deep. Not like an issue or an outer object that I can directly deal with.

Fear, distilled from the knowledge of dying. The ultimate emptiness that is life. The subtle slipping of life into death. It's not that different when you think about it.

Depression. Depression, even in the apex of all life itself..

Seek professional help.

[Bill Wiltrack]

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Insight does not come without a price.

Tremendous insight comes at a tremendous price.


Just don't know if I am paying for past insight or if I am making some sort of a down payment upon future, more dynamic insights.

Do know I am willing to pay the price.





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[tbieter]

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Yeah. I don't know what learning is. Don't know how to learn.

Perhaps we evolve a bit during a normal lifetime. Perhaps not.

Perhaps nothing means anything.


In a way, I hope this crushing emptiness, this relentless depression that I am experiencing is a down-payment of sorts.

Hope I'm paying some sort of dues ahead of time...but that is completely speculation.

...there is a fear that is creeping-in. Don't know how to characterize it. I shouldn't try.







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Above, Bill has written the following:
"Although what I have been experiencing has pushed me to my very limits, that heaviness of my soul...this, Dark Night of the Soul
is something that I, at least so far, have been able to bear.
I think, if this isn't a preclusion my immediate demise, I will survive. And possibly be larger for it.
This emptiness, this sadness has expanded me to emotions I have not been able to experience before." (Emphasis added)
One of my mentors, James V. Schall, S.J., repeatedly writes that the philosopher, in his investigations, must be open to the totality of reality. Upon that counsel, I dare to sugget an answer from the world of Christian religous thought. Your condition may be from the vice of sloth. Perhaps you should do some reading on sloth, or consult a trustworthy learned priest.

If this suggestion offends you, Bill, disregard it and accept my sincere apology.

In the past I read quite a lot about monks and sloth. It is a special danger to them. As I read this thread, I thought of those readings and also what I know about sloth.

Sloth
'When many of us think of sloth, we probably conjure up images of an ugly South American animal that eats shoots and actually hangs around. Or maybe we think of unshaven Joe Sixpack lying on the sofa all weekend, not lifting a finger except to open another cold one.

The latter is a fairly apt image of the vice of sloth or its synonyms such as boredom, acedia, and laziness. Boredom refers to a certain emptiness of soul or lack of passion; acedia refers to the sadness that comes from our unwillingness to tackle the difficulties involved in attaining something good; laziness more generally refers to the torpor and idleness of one who is not inclined to exert himself.

Sloth encompasses all these ideas and more.
http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articl ... n-of-sloth

[Buddhist guy]

Bill,
I am inclined to agree with Arising uk. Sometimes we get so lost in our own mental distortions that they feel as though they swallow us up to the point it feels there is nothing else Therapy gives us the benefit of another's perspective on our experience that is not "swallowed whole" by it as it were. Have courage my friend, look deeply at your experience, be with it. Question your perceptions in the moment if you observe or sense BS. We all have an in built bullshit detector. What feels true for you and why?

[Bill Wiltrack]

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What feels true for me is that you and the other member that you referred to in the above post must have a good relationship with your therapists.

Both of you probably have had great experiences as a result of your therapy. Possibly both of you have had an epiphany of sorts resulting from seeking professional help.

I am happy for you.

I thank both of you for participating within this thread and appreciate both of you revealing a small part of yourselves.




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[Dalek Prime]

I don't think your sick, Bill. I think you've thought things through and are trying to come to grips with what you've found. I'm going through the same thing, to be honest, as did Camus. His solution was to accept the absurd and continue. I go further. But its not for me to prescibe how you deal with it. One size does not fit all. But I'm always willing to lend an ear and discuss things with you.

[Bill Wiltrack]

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You are a gentle soul and I think we share some common ground.


I'm glad you are here upon this forum.





...still, this crushing, invasive emptiness and depression undermines & succeeds anything I can speak of, or think of, or feel.


As you said, I recognize this and there is really nothing I can do to either increase or decrease it's presence.


Thank you for commenting.


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[Hobbes' Choice]

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The small things, things I used to get lost-in, have become transparent.

This scares me. Really scares me.

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This is boredom. You can't get lost in stupid Hollywood blockbusters, because they are all the same:

Hero meets girl; looses girl.
Sets out to find her.
Has a crisis of confidence.
Remembers something is granddad said to him: finds his confidence.
Figures out how to get the girl, and save humanity.
Fisticuffs - it always ends in fisticuffs. No matter the technology; the gun runs out of bullets, the energy ray jambs.
His buddy Mr. Expendible dies. Hero is sad. Vows to get revenge.
Hero fights the bad guy with fists!! Wins.
He gets the girl
Roll Credits.

Read a decent book.
Have you ever read The Brothers Karamazov?. If not, why not?
Have you ever seen a Shakespeare play in a theatre with real actors?
You are being fed a diet of horse-shit every day, and you wonder why you are depressed??

These are the same guys that attacked your union and gave the world multinational corporations. Is it any wonder that you don't know your arse from your elbow?

[Bill Wiltrack]

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I see. I'm the reluctant hero. I get that. I can better understand myself now.

Thank you for this perspective.





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[Hobbes' Choice]

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I see. I'm the reluctant hero. I get that. I can better understand myself now.

Thank you for this perspective.


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No. No one with a modicum of intelligence could infer from what I said that you are the 'reluctant hero'.
Lets' try this again.

Please re-read my post (above) and tell me what you think I said to you.
And don't bother with another picture. I can read pretty well without picures.

[Bill Wiltrack]

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I went back and re-read your post - and I'm going to stick with my assessment!


The reluctant hero is something that really resonates with me...deep down.

You may not have directly intended for me to make that conclusion - but I did. It just feels right.



You touched upon a lot of the bells & whistles that work with me and I, at least momentarily, feel better.

THANK YOU.


...I even re-visited a plan I developed that involves Organized Labor and me saving the world.


It's all good. I even got you a piccy to try on for size -







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Thanks again. You actually helped me a lot.





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[Hobbes' Choice]

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I went back and re-read your post - and I'm going to stick with my assessment!

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Do you noticed that I asked any questions?
Did you not feel obligated in any way to consider your answers?

[Arising_uk]

.Insight does not come without a price.

Normally the price is insight, you apparently have things arse-about-face.

Tremendous insight comes at a tremendous price.

Normally enlightenment, you appear to have achieved none.

Just don't know if I am paying for past insight or if I am making some sort of a down payment upon future, more dynamic insights.

No, you're paying the price of having not addresses the confusions and contradictions in your thoughts. You live in your feelings and flit from one thought to another. You could of course read some philosophy to straighten-out your thoughts but then that would remove your crutch.

Do know I am willing to pay the price..

Then stop wanking on about it here, take it to a psych forum where you'd be an undoubted star turn.

[Arising_uk]

.What feels true for me is that you and the other member that you referred to in the above post must have a good relationship with your therapists.

Never been to one as I have Philosophy and also took the time to train in and experience efficient techniques from Psycho-Therapy.

Both of you probably have had great experiences as a result of your therapy. Possibly both of you have had an epiphany of sorts resulting from seeking professional help.

Nope, my epiphanies have come from Philosophy and living. You could benefit from actually reading some Philosophy to deal with your existential angst but since you won't I recommend you seek professional help to deal with your megalomaniacal NPD.

I am happy for you.

Given what you say I seriously doubt such wishes are worth the bother of typing.

I thank both of you for participating within this thread and appreciate both of you revealing a small part of yourselves.[/size].

All your delusional fantasy designed to divert yourself from your obvious issues.

[Arising_uk]

Do you noticed that I asked any questions?
Did you not feel obligated in any way to consider your answers?

A defining trait of the gnu and interweeb loon is a blindness to sentences ending with question marks.