woke

How should society be organised, if at all?

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Gary Childress
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Re: woke

Post by Gary Childress »

BigMike wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:19 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 6:39 pm
Gary Childress wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 6:32 pm

Sounds good. :idea:
Well, since the Wokies won't leave us alone, we're not going to have the luxury of simply focusing on ourselves. We're going to have to object to their projects and their foolish ideas, or we'll end up allowing their program to run.

Don't let the crazy people drive the train. We'll end up where we really, really don't want to be.
It's important to approach disagreements and conflicts with a calm and rational mindset. Avoid name-calling or personal attacks, and instead focus on discussing the specific issues at hand. Try to understand the other person's perspective and listen actively to their concerns.

If you find that you cannot come to an agreement or compromise, consider seeking the assistance of a neutral third party, such as a mediator or arbitrator. These individuals can help facilitate productive discussions and work towards a mutually agreeable solution.

Remember that it's possible to disagree with someone without demonizing or dehumanizing them. It's important to maintain civility and respect, even in the midst of passionate disagreements.
Well said. Something I can certainly learn from. :oops:
BigMike
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Re: woke

Post by BigMike »

Immanuel Can wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 6:22 pm
Gary Childress wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 4:23 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 4:04 pm Thus, instead of focusing on the big, global problems, over which you and I have no control whatsoever, and will never be granted any, we ought to look to ourselves, and to the choices we, personally, are making.
Let's both continue to do that, then.
I'm good with that.

The Woke Socialists are not good with you and me focusing on ourselves, though. They want control. That's why they insist, "The personal is the political." It means, "We get to mess with your private life, and you don't get to protest."
This statement is a broad generalization that isn't backed up and mixes together ideas that have nothing to do with each other.

First of all, the term "woke socialists" isn't clear and doesn't mean anything. It's not clear who or what IC is talking about, which makes it hard to take the argument seriously on any level.

Second, it is a false and unfounded claim that "woke socialists" want to be in charge. Some socialists may want the government to get more involved in health care or education, but it's not true that they want to control people's private lives or make it harder for them to protest.

Also, saying that "The personal is political" means "we get to mess with your private life, and you don't get to protest" is not an accurate way to describe the idea. The phrase "the personal is political" was first used by feminist activists in the 1960s and 1970s. They wanted to show how political and social structures shape personal experiences and relationships.

It's not a call for more control over our lives or for our freedoms to be taken away. Instead, it's a recognition that our individual experiences are linked to bigger problems of power and inequality.

Conservative media outlets, like Fox News, have been criticized for giving distorted and sensationalized versions of progressive political movements and ideas. IC's statement seems to be in line with some of these stories. It's important to get your news and information from a variety of sources so you don't fall for confirmation bias and can get a better grasp on complicated issues.
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Agent Smith
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Re: woke

Post by Agent Smith »

Please discuss abortion.
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Harbal
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Re: woke

Post by Harbal »

Agent Smith wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:25 am Please discuss abortion.
I am against it being made compulsory.
Iwannaplato
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Re: woke

Post by Iwannaplato »

Agent Smith wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:25 am Please discuss abortion.
What are you, a voyeur?
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Agent Smith
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Re: woke

Post by Agent Smith »

Iwannaplato wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 12:54 pm
Agent Smith wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:25 am Please discuss abortion.
What are you, a voyeur?
I am many things and it's possible that I am ... a ... voyeur. There's something abortionish about woke(ism). Allahu Akbar/El rachum.
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Agent Smith
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Re: woke

Post by Agent Smith »

Harbal wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 12:23 pm
Agent Smith wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:25 am Please discuss abortion.
I am against it being made compulsory.
That's an interesting proposition. As always, diggin' deeper doesn't always mean you strike oil.
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Harbal
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Re: woke

Post by Harbal »

Agent Smith wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 3:05 pm
Harbal wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 12:23 pm
Agent Smith wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:25 am Please discuss abortion.
I am against it being made compulsory.
That's an interesting proposition. As always, diggin' deeper doesn't always mean you strike oil.
No, there is no depth there. All I'm saying is that only people who want an abortion should have one.
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Lacewing
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Re: woke

Post by Lacewing »

BigMike wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:12 am
Immanuel Can wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 6:22 pm The Woke Socialists are not good with you and me focusing on ourselves, though. They want control. That's why they insist, "The personal is the political." It means, "We get to mess with your private life, and you don't get to protest."
This statement is a broad generalization that isn't backed up and mixes together ideas that have nothing to do with each other.

First of all, the term "woke socialists" isn't clear and doesn't mean anything. It's not clear who or what IC is talking about, which makes it hard to take the argument seriously on any level.

Second, it is a false and unfounded claim that "woke socialists" want to be in charge. Some socialists may want the government to get more involved in health care or education, but it's not true that they want to control people's private lives or make it harder for them to protest.

Also, saying that "The personal is political" means "we get to mess with your private life, and you don't get to protest" is not an accurate way to describe the idea. The phrase "the personal is political" was first used by feminist activists in the 1960s and 1970s. They wanted to show how political and social structures shape personal experiences and relationships.

It's not a call for more control over our lives or for our freedoms to be taken away. Instead, it's a recognition that our individual experiences are linked to bigger problems of power and inequality.

Conservative media outlets, like Fox News, have been criticized for giving distorted and sensationalized versions of progressive political movements and ideas. IC's statement seems to be in line with some of these stories. It's important to get your news and information from a variety of sources so you don't fall for confirmation bias and can get a better grasp on complicated issues.
Thank you, BigMike, for highlighting the truth. It's really up to each of us to be broader-minded than any skewed sources (news, political, religious, etc.) might lead/direct/incite us to be. When we are more fulfilled by balanced clarity than titillated by extreme sensationalism, skewed sources lose their power in driving us.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: woke

Post by Immanuel Can »

BigMike wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:12 am ...the term "woke socialists" isn't clear...
"Socialist" is a perfectly definable term, referring to an identifiable political orientation. "Woke" is the term we're debating...so surely you don't want to go back to defining it again now, do you?

Since both parts of the term are perfectly clear, then, your objection is pointless.
Second, it is a false and unfounded claim that "woke socialists" want to be in charge.
It's an analytic claim. It's based on the definition of "Socialism." Socialism requires all means of production to be regulated and owned by the State.

So if they don't "want to be in charge," then they aren't "Socialists," by definition.
The phrase "the personal is political" was first used by feminist activists in the 1960s and 1970s. They wanted to show how political and social structures shape personal experiences and relationships.
They wanted an excuse to meddle with elements of private life to which they had formerly legitimately been denied access. That's the truth. It means, "You can't tell me anything is private anymore, and you can't deny me the right to dicate to you what you do with your personal life."
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Agent Smith
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Re: woke

Post by Agent Smith »

Harbal wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 4:27 pm
Agent Smith wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 3:05 pm
Harbal wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 12:23 pm

I am against it being made compulsory.
That's an interesting proposition. As always, diggin' deeper doesn't always mean you strike oil.
No, there is no depth there. All I'm saying is that only people who want an abortion should have one.
I concur.
Iwannaplato
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Re: woke

Post by Iwannaplato »

Wokism is cultural appropriation from afro-americans.
Gary Childress
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Re: woke

Post by Gary Childress »

Iwannaplato wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 9:11 am Wokism is cultural appropriation from afro-americans.
Woke seems to generally refer to equal acceptance of all, including 'deviation'. I wonder if it ought to include 'evil' too, just to be more 'inclusive'? And does that mean there is nothing worth striving for either more or less, if everything is equally acceptable? :|
popeye1945
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Re: woke

Post by popeye1945 »

Gary Childress wrote: Sun Apr 02, 2023 2:51 pm
Iwannaplato wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 9:11 am Wokism is cultural appropriation from afro-americans.
Woke seems to generally refer to equal acceptance of all, including 'deviation'. I wonder if it ought to include 'evil' too, just to be more 'inclusive'? And does that mean there is nothing worth striving for either more or less, if everything is equally acceptable? :|
Traditionally the social order was the function of the male, considered by many a function the male has done poorly at. The women's movement in alliance with self-define victims which number in the legions, has taken over this function largely. These legions have set about to correct society and, in many instances, have had remarkably positive successes. The one thing that is creating chaos is in being all-inclusive, which means the lack of the establishment of standards of behavior and morality. This destroys the order of society, all well-meaning, but one must govern with both the heart and the mind. One just cannot have standards where all behaviors and/or moralities are to be included within the norms of society, it necessarily spells decline. The striking thing about the victimhood movement is that there are real victims, but victims lose credibility when it has taken to idealistic/utopian self-proclaimed victimhood levels. All-inclusive spells societal decline. This is my last politically incorrect post for this week.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: woke

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Wokie guide to debating:



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