Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

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philosopher
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:37 pm

Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by philosopher » Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:56 pm

Why do evil right wing fascists always win elections - if not now, then in the near future?

* Trump getting voted in office.
* Turkish Erdogan voted by the general turkish population in- and outside of Turkey, to become a dictator.
* Hungary's Orban abolishing several democratic institutions and principles in a EU-country.
* British vote to first leave EU, then re-electing the Tories and win no-confidence vote.
* Italy's openly Fascist-parties with veneration for Mussolini, getting in office.
* AFD-party becoming the largest opposition party in Germany - threatening to topple the current government in the near future.
* Sweden Democrats becoming the largest opposition party in Sweden, threatening tot topple the current government in the near future.

What is it with Right Wing Fascism that makes it so much more popular than say left-wing liberalism?

Or to put it in another saying:

Why do evil people always win in this god-forsaken world?

Remember that Hitler, Mussolini and Franco enjoyed enourmous popularity even after WW2.
Several polls were made in the years 1946-1960 showing that Hitler enjoyed support from 50+ % of the German population.

No wonder why fascism persists even to this day. But I do wonder, why is Fascism so popular?

Frank N Stein
Posts: 135
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:03 am

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by Frank N Stein » Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:11 pm

Which of Trump's policies are 'right wing'?

philosopher
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:37 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by philosopher » Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:48 pm

Frank N Stein wrote:
Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:11 pm
Which of Trump's policies are 'right wing'?
His alliance with Putin is enough.
Putin's government is right wing. He wants to restore the Tzarist Empire.

Trump also handed out tax cuts for the wealthy, hate immigrants, is a nationalist amongst other stuff that really do belong to the right wingers.

He also refuse to do anything about the climate changes and pollution in general. Support the arms lobby and the big corporations + private oil companies.

FlashDangerpants
Posts: 1407
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 11:54 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by FlashDangerpants » Wed Jan 16, 2019 11:15 pm

philosopher wrote:
Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:56 pm
Several polls were made in the years 1946-1960 showing that Hitler enjoyed support from 50+ % of the German population.
Please show your evidence for this highly unlikely claim. You have form for bullshitting. It's well known that in that period Germans were extremely reluctant to discuss Hitler at all, there would have been no realistic way to take a survey of his popularity at that time.

Frank N Stein
Posts: 135
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:03 am

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by Frank N Stein » Wed Jan 16, 2019 11:21 pm

philosopher wrote:
Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:48 pm
Frank N Stein wrote:
Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:11 pm
Which of Trump's policies are 'right wing'?
His alliance with Putin is enough.
Putin's government is right wing. He wants to restore the Tzarist Empire.

Trump also handed out tax cuts for the wealthy, hate immigrants, is a nationalist amongst other stuff that really do belong to the right wingers.

He also refuse to do anything about the climate changes and pollution in general. Support the arms lobby and the big corporations + private oil companies.
So it's guilt by association? He's a nationalist? Aren't all Americans? What you are describing is 'business as usual', American style.

philosopher
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:37 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by philosopher » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:13 pm

FlashDangerpants wrote:
Wed Jan 16, 2019 11:15 pm
philosopher wrote:
Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:56 pm
Several polls were made in the years 1946-1960 showing that Hitler enjoyed support from 50+ % of the German population.
Please show your evidence for this highly unlikely claim. You have form for bullshitting. It's well known that in that period Germans were extremely reluctant to discuss Hitler at all, there would have been no realistic way to take a survey of his popularity at that time.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denazification
The U.S. conducted opinion surveys in the American zone of occupied Germany.[85] Tony Judt, in his book Postwar: a History of Europe since 1945, extracted and used some of them.

A majority in the years 1945–49 stated National Socialism to have been a good idea
Source:
Judt, Tony (2007), Postwar: a History of Europe since 1945, Pimlico, p. 58, ISBN 1446418022

Logik
Posts: 1695
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:48 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by Logik » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:15 pm

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:13 pm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denazification
A majority in the years 1945–49 stated National Socialism to have been a good idea
Source:
Judt, Tony (2007), Postwar: a History of Europe since 1945, Pimlico, p. 58, ISBN 1446418022
The majority of those polled said HIllary would win also.

philosopher
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:37 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by philosopher » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:16 pm

Logik wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:15 pm
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:13 pm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denazification
A majority in the years 1945–49 stated National Socialism to have been a good idea
Source:
Judt, Tony (2007), Postwar: a History of Europe since 1945, Pimlico, p. 58, ISBN 1446418022
The majority said HIllary would win also.
FlashDangerpants asked me for sources. I provided sources.

Logik
Posts: 1695
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:48 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by Logik » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:18 pm

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:16 pm
FlashDangerpants asked me for sources. I provided sources.
Does the word 'reliable' need to be stated explicitly every time people ask for sources?

I would've thought it's implicit.

philosopher
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:37 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by philosopher » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:19 pm

Logik wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:18 pm
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:16 pm
FlashDangerpants asked me for sources. I provided sources.
Does the word 'reliable' need to be stated explicitly every time people ask for sources?

I would've thought it's implicit.
It is reliable. What makes you think the sources are not reliable?

Logik
Posts: 1695
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:48 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by Logik » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:20 pm

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:19 pm
It is reliable. What makes you think the sources are not reliable?
It's a poll. Small sample size.

https://sciencing.com/disadvantages-sma ... 48532.html

Logik
Posts: 1695
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:48 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by Logik » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:22 pm

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:19 pm
Logik wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:18 pm
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:16 pm
FlashDangerpants asked me for sources. I provided sources.
Does the word 'reliable' need to be stated explicitly every time people ask for sources?

I would've thought it's implicit.
It is reliable. What makes you think the sources are not reliable?
2nd reason. You misquoted it. I have highlighted the parts you left out.
A majority in the years 1945–49 stated National Socialism to have been a good idea but badly applied

philosopher
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:37 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by philosopher » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:24 pm

Logik wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:22 pm
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:19 pm
Logik wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:18 pm

Does the word 'reliable' need to be stated explicitly every time people ask for sources?

I would've thought it's implicit.
It is reliable. What makes you think the sources are not reliable?
2nd reason. You misquoted it. I have highlighted the parts you left out.
A majority in the years 1945–49 stated National Socialism to have been a good idea but badly applied
Makes no difference.
They still said National Socialism was a good idea. That's all it matters.

philosopher
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:37 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by philosopher » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:26 pm

Logik wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:20 pm
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:19 pm
It is reliable. What makes you think the sources are not reliable?
It's a poll. Small sample size.

https://sciencing.com/disadvantages-sma ... 48532.html
How do you know it is a small sample size?

http://germanhistorydocs.ghi-dc.org/sub ... nt_id=4094
Sample: unspecified number, representing a cross-section of the adults in the American Zone and the American and British Sectors of Berlin.
Interviewing dates: between November 1945 and August 1947. (5 pp.)

Logik
Posts: 1695
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:48 pm

Re: Evil Right Wing Fascism will eventually win

Post by Logik » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:29 pm

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:26 pm
How do you know it is a small sample size?
How do you know it was statistically significant to justify your conclusion?

Burden of proof, buddy. Goes the other way...

You'll answer your own question soon enough.

The population of BERLIN is NOT the population of Germany.

Even if they had interviewed every single person in Berlin in 1946 (3 million people), that only represents 4% of the 65 million Germans.
Even if you could interview a representative sample you can't get from "X was good idea badly implemented" to "we support Hitler".

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