The world is getting dumber every second

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philosopher
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The world is getting dumber every second

Post by philosopher » Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:45 pm

The election of president Trump despite there already being heavy suspecion that his election campaign was paid by Putin - or at least that Putin thinks Trump would be a good president for U.S, or the election and re-election of Orban in Hungary or even the referendum in Turkey to revert democratic institutions and become a dictatorship, along with the re-election of Erdogan, and all the sceptics of the man-made climate change and the vaccine-resistance movement etc. etc. is all evidence that the world is getting dumber.

Fact is that people don't listen to scientists or clever people in general. They only listen to their so-called gut-intuitions and layman's psychology, popular science books at best.

If anyone is showing evidence of having read a scientific paper - and understood it properly or even enganged in intelligent conversations, they are marked as "outsiders", "wierdos" and what else. Nobody listen to them.

In other words, clever people are not rewarded. They are punished.

Is there anything we can do about it?

FlashDangerpants
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by FlashDangerpants » Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:34 pm

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:45 pm
The election of president Trump despite there already being heavy suspecion that his election campaign was paid by Putin - or at least that Putin thinks Trump would be a good president for U.S, or the election and re-election of Orban in Hungary or even the referendum in Turkey to revert democratic institutions and become a dictatorship, along with the re-election of Erdogan, and all the sceptics of the man-made climate change and the vaccine-resistance movement etc. etc. is all evidence that the world is getting dumber.

Fact is that people don't listen to scientists or clever people in general. They only listen to their so-called gut-intuitions and layman's psychology, popular science books at best.

If anyone is showing evidence of having read a scientific paper - and understood it properly or even enganged in intelligent conversations, they are marked as "outsiders", "wierdos" and what else. Nobody listen to them.

In other words, clever people are not rewarded. They are punished.

Is there anything we can do about it?
And what evidence have you that this is all new? People have always been susceptible to error and always will be. Populists and hard men have gained power through democratic elections before - like Hitler and Mussolini for instance, worse people than Trump.

Most people do listen to scientists on the whole, global warming deniers and anti-vaxers are a minority, and as such an exception that proves the rule. Vocal minorities have always opposed various sciences. There are fewer people today who deny evolution than there used to be, your hypothesis would require that this was reversed.

Are you of the opinion that you are one of the smart people? You shouldn't be. You are a devoted practitioner of baseless assertion and foolish hyperbole.

philosopher
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by philosopher » Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm

FlashDangerpants wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:34 pm
And what evidence have you that this is all new? People have always been susceptible to error and always will be. Populists and hard men have gained power through democratic elections before - like Hitler and Mussolini for instance, worse people than Trump.

Most people do listen to scientists on the whole, global warming deniers and anti-vaxers are a minority, and as such an exception that proves the rule. Vocal minorities have always opposed various sciences. There are fewer people today who deny evolution than there used to be, your hypothesis would require that this was reversed.
In the past - I'm talking about the time when democracy was only a dream of the merchant classes - laypeople were FORCED to listen to the experts - scientists, philosophers etc. And do what they were told by those people.

This was the Age of the Enlightenment. They did not have a whole lot of knowledge back then, but at least they did an effort to gain as much knowledge about the world as possible.

Then came the French Revolution, and the laypeople installed a reign of terror - the most popular leader of France was Robespierre.

As you mention, Hitler, Mussolini were popular as well. But this is all new, it came with democracy.

But I'm also talking about the time after the Berlin Wall was teared down, then we had peace in most of Europe. Until Trump got elected president of U.S, withdrew U.S. from NATO and let Putin attack northern europe.

This is all happening now, because people don't want the politicians and elite from the 1990's and 2000's to keep Russia in check.

At least, back in the 1930's there were opposing ideologies. Today we only have one ideology: Right Wing Populism.
Left wing no longer exists. There are only different versions of the extreme populist right. Even the islamic countries are all dominated by right-wing-populism - this is not confined only to the West.

Right wingers opposing right wingers. That's what we've got today.

And THAT's all new because in the past we also had the LEFT-wing.
Hippies, peace-loving people who didn't want military service, who wanted welfare states, and more education.

Today politicians keep speaking about the neccessity of not educating too many people, because it is "immoral" to be highly educated.
At least, this is what they say in my country. Work yourself to death instead of wasting tax money on education. This is the new ideology. At least where I live.
FlashDangerpants wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:34 pm
Are you of the opinion that you are one of the smart people? You shouldn't be. You are a devoted practitioner of baseless assertion and foolish hyperbole.
At least I'm doing an effort in trying to understand this damned world I live in.

FlashDangerpants
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by FlashDangerpants » Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:40 pm

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:34 pm
And what evidence have you that this is all new? People have always been susceptible to error and always will be. Populists and hard men have gained power through democratic elections before - like Hitler and Mussolini for instance, worse people than Trump.

Most people do listen to scientists on the whole, global warming deniers and anti-vaxers are a minority, and as such an exception that proves the rule. Vocal minorities have always opposed various sciences. There are fewer people today who deny evolution than there used to be, your hypothesis would require that this was reversed.
In the past - I'm talking about the time when democracy was only a dream of the merchant classes - laypeople were FORCED to listen to the experts - scientists, philosophers etc. And do what they were told by those people.

This was the Age of the Enlightenment. They did not have a whole lot of knowledge back then, but at least they did an effort to gain as much knowledge about the world as possible.
The title of the thread says getting dumber every second. If you didn't want to imply a consistent linear descent, you made a lazy or a stupid choice there.

You are making up preposterous bullshit about the AoE anyway. Scientific discoveries of the day had virtually no effect on the day to day life of the poor back then, and would not have been a concern attended to by the average stable hand or milk maid very often.
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
Then came the French Revolution, and the laypeople installed a reign of terror - the most popular leader of France was Robespierre.
I don't know what point you are trying to make here, but I think you need to do some better research. The leaders of the French revolution were for the most part wealthy, and educated, and considered themselves very scientific. Robespierre was an excellent schemer, but not all that popular. Marat on the other hand was personally very popular. He wrote Recherches Physiques sur l'Électricité (Research on the Physics of Electricity).
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
As you mention, Hitler, Mussolini were popular as well. But this is all new, it came with democracy.
I don't know what point you are trying to make here, but I think you need to do some better research. Hitler and Musllini were not the first popular demagogues. You've already claimed a guy in the French Revolution was such, so wtf are you up to?

Earlier predecessors though are easily available. Here's a couple to get you started... Titus Oates The Gracci Brothers

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
But I'm also talking about the time after the Berlin Wall was teared down, then we had peace in most of Europe. Until Trump got elected president of U.S, withdrew U.S. from NATO and let Putin attack northern europe.
Putin hasn't attacked Northern Europe and he isn't going to. And frankly we in Northern Europe should be capable of dissuading him without hiding behind America's skirts, and if we can't done that, given how much more populous the rest of Europe is than Russia, and how much richer we are than them ... then we've made some poor choices that aren't America's fault.
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
This is all happening now, because people don't want the politicians and elite from the 1990's and 2000's to keep Russia in check.
I only really noticed it in your thread about UBI, but you are totally faking a concern for the poor aren't you? You are basically an elitist patrician and you just want to boss them all around because you know so much better than them what they should believe.
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
At least, back in the 1930's there were opposing ideologies. Today we only have one ideology: Right Wing Populism.
Left wing no longer exists. There are only different versions of the extreme populist right. Even the islamic countries are all dominated by right-wing-populism - this is not confined only to the West.
Well I'm not a right wing populist, so does that mean I don't exist? You are indulging in nonsense hyperbole, calm down and try to make some sense.
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
And THAT's all new because in the past we also had the LEFT-wing.
Hippies, peace-loving people who didn't want military service, who wanted welfare states, and more education.
We have welfare states, and we have more education. Few developed countries have conscription. Nobody is planning to change any of that. So ... either you have lazily failed to describe actual left-wing politics, or the left already won to such an extent that all their ideas became the centre.
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
Today politicians keep speaking about the neccessity of not educating too many people, because it is "immoral" to be highly educated.
At least, this is what they say in my country. Work yourself to death instead of wasting tax money on education. This is the new ideology. At least where I live.
I don't believe you. There is no serious political party in Europe that has a policy of removing education because education is immoral. Don't bullshit me.
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:40 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:34 pm
Are you of the opinion that you are one of the smart people? You shouldn't be. You are a devoted practitioner of baseless assertion and foolish hyperbole.
At least I'm doing an effort into trying to understand this damned world I live in.
No you aren't. You make up rubbish to spin a fairy tale rather than expend effort to understand.

Impenitent
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by Impenitent » Fri Jan 04, 2019 12:09 am

and during the 10 years before trump became president, comrades obama and bush forced all the nations of europe to accept millions of jihadists as new citizens...

multicultural caliphate...

-Imp

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henry quirk
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"At least I'm doing an effort in trying to understand this damned world I live in."

Post by henry quirk » Fri Jan 04, 2019 12:30 am

Actually, you just seem to be bitchin' about the 'state of man' (which is what it always has been and always will be).

We're smart apes (some a lot smarter than Koko, some not so much). Some play with their own crap; others climb the trees to see further. I reckon the ratio of crap players to tree climbers is pretty stable, so -- if you take the time, put out the effort -- you can find some climbers to slowly go neurotic with.

My advice: go, have a life (get a job, a wife, make babies, etc.), quit worryin' so much about 'man' (cuz 'man' doesn't, as a writhin' mass, give a flip).

commonsense
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by commonsense » Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:31 am

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:45 pm
The election of president Trump despite there already being heavy suspecion that his election campaign was paid by Putin - or at least that Putin thinks Trump would be a good president for U.S, or the election and re-election of Orban in Hungary or even the referendum in Turkey to revert democratic institutions and become a dictatorship, along with the re-election of Erdogan, and all the sceptics of the man-made climate change and the vaccine-resistance movement etc. etc. is all evidence that the world is getting dumber.
These things do not mean that the world is getting dumber. These are the passions of any person who laments current events and recent history as he sees it.

Yet it is true that the world is getting dumber—and smarter, too. The cause of this just isn’t disagreeable conditions. It’s something else.

commonsense
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by commonsense » Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:43 am

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:45 pm
Fact is that people don't listen to scientists or clever people in general. They only listen to their so-called gut-intuitions and layman's psychology, popular science books at best.

If anyone is showing evidence of having read a scientific paper - and understood it properly or even enganged in intelligent conversations, they are marked as "outsiders", "wierdos" and what else. Nobody listen to them.

In other words, clever people are not rewarded. They are punished.
This is called anti-elitism. Because there are by definition fewer elites than non-elites, the shunning of the few should be viewed as affirmation of the legitimacy of the majority.

Walker
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by Walker » Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:25 pm

In the specific terms and visionary scope of the elites which has succeeded in dumbing-down meaning, the majority of people in fact do believe that climate exists.

The fact that scientists think they have a good lock on reality simply by asserting that climate exists, is further evidence of maroons in nature.

The fact that an educated adult would use such a silly term as "climate-denier," when most people in fact do believe that climate exists, is more evidence that the dumb-gene is no longer recessive in many.

Slogans are a handy-dandy replacement for thought and analysis.

Frank N Stein
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by Frank N Stein » Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:30 pm

By 'the world' I assume you are referring to the USA? One would have hoped that the internet made humans better educated and smarter. The same was said about the advent of television. Unfortunately the opposite has been the case in both instances. Humans like to choose the path of instant gratification. We are generally a lazy bunch. Aware of our own mortality, we don't like to have to wait for anything, and the faster things become, the more impatient we become.
Remember the early days of the 'web' and dial-up connections? I think that would drive people crazy today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsNaR6FRuO0

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-1-
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by -1- » Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:28 am

Frank N Stein wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:30 pm
By 'the world' I assume you are referring to the USA? One would have hoped that the internet made humans better educated and smarter. The same was said about the advent of television. Unfortunately the opposite has been the case in both instances. Humans like to choose the path of instant gratification. We are generally a lazy bunch. Aware of our own mortality, we don't like to have to wait for anything, and the faster things become, the more impatient we become.
Remember the early days of the 'web' and dial-up connections? I think that would drive people crazy today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsNaR6FRuO0
Why bash your own race? Animals believe in instant gratification a thousand more times more compellingly than humans. And allegedly they don't even have a concept of an afterlife!

The web made people more stupid and smarter at the same time. Its main educational feature is to get answers instantly. That speeds up the learning process, as thirty years ago you had to take the bus to the library to find things out, and you only did if you got lucky.

This speed of affairs made information cheap for people. Information became a cheap whore, and people fuck her. Men fuck her. Women fuck her. Children fuck her. Your own dog, cat and dromedar fucks her. Crocodiles, orange groves and waterfalls and fantasies fuck her.

We have big data. It's so big, it's bigger than life. I watched a show once on big data. A bunch of panelists were not able to say anything more on the future of big data but "woo-hoo, it's big data, whee, wahoo."

Philippe, I want to divorce you.

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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by -1- » Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:31 am

commonsense wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:43 am
philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:45 pm
Fact is that people don't listen to scientists or clever people in general. They only listen to their so-called gut-intuitions and layman's psychology, popular science books at best.

If anyone is showing evidence of having read a scientific paper - and understood it properly or even enganged in intelligent conversations, they are marked as "outsiders", "wierdos" and what else. Nobody listen to them.

In other words, clever people are not rewarded. They are punished.
This is called anti-elitism. Because there are by definition fewer elites than non-elites, the shunning of the few should be viewed as affirmation of the legitimacy of the majority.
I think the majority has no choice. They read and advocate what they are able to read and comprehend. If I showed you the legal description of the patent application for the Rubick's cube, you'd never understand it or be able to visualize it. To most people grade seven science projects read like the description of Rubick's cube on his patent application.

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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by -1- » Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:34 am

Impenitent wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 12:09 am
and during the 10 years before trump became president, comrades obama and bush forced all the nations of europe to accept millions of jihadists as new citizens...

multicultural caliphate...

-Imp
The beauty of American presidency is that you can throw as much shit at the presidents as you like without punity, AND be able to believe your own phantasm.

Frank N Stein
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by Frank N Stein » Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:52 am

-1- wrote:
Sat Jan 05, 2019 5:28 am
Frank N Stein wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:30 pm
By 'the world' I assume you are referring to the USA? One would have hoped that the internet made humans better educated and smarter. The same was said about the advent of television. Unfortunately the opposite has been the case in both instances. Humans like to choose the path of instant gratification. We are generally a lazy bunch. Aware of our own mortality, we don't like to have to wait for anything, and the faster things become, the more impatient we become.
Remember the early days of the 'web' and dial-up connections? I think that would drive people crazy today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsNaR6FRuO0
Why bash your own race? Animals believe in instant gratification a thousand more times more compellingly than humans. And allegedly they don't even have a concept of an afterlife!

The web made people more stupid and smarter at the same time. Its main educational feature is to get answers instantly. That speeds up the learning process, as thirty years ago you had to take the bus to the library to find things out, and you only did if you got lucky.

This speed of affairs made information cheap for people. Information became a cheap whore, and people fuck her. Men fuck her. Women fuck her. Children fuck her. Your own dog, cat and dromedar fucks her. Crocodiles, orange groves and waterfalls and fantasies fuck her.

We have big data. It's so big, it's bigger than life. I watched a show once on big data. A bunch of panelists were not able to say anything more on the future of big data but "woo-hoo, it's big data, whee, wahoo."

Philippe, I want to divorce you.
I don't understand what point you are trying to make.

Atla
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Re: The world is getting dumber every second

Post by Atla » Sat Jan 05, 2019 8:55 am

philosopher wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:45 pm
The election of president Trump despite there already being heavy suspecion that his election campaign was paid by Putin - or at least that Putin thinks Trump would be a good president for U.S, or the election and re-election of Orban in Hungary or even the referendum in Turkey to revert democratic institutions and become a dictatorship, along with the re-election of Erdogan, and all the sceptics of the man-made climate change and the vaccine-resistance movement etc. etc. is all evidence that the world is getting dumber.

Fact is that people don't listen to scientists or clever people in general. They only listen to their so-called gut-intuitions and layman's psychology, popular science books at best.

If anyone is showing evidence of having read a scientific paper - and understood it properly or even enganged in intelligent conversations, they are marked as "outsiders", "wierdos" and what else. Nobody listen to them.

In other words, clever people are not rewarded. They are punished.

Is there anything we can do about it?
The world was slowly getting smarter in the 20th century (despite universal suffrage), until social media came along and suddenly unleashed the voice of the 90-110 IQ majority with an unprecedented force.
So now suddenly the world is getting dumber every second, and it's like a feedback loop, unleashing even more stupidity and the voice of even dumber people. Further global deterioration is to be expected. We need to gene engineer smarter people, which probably won't happen in time.

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