A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

How does science work? And what's all this about quantum mechanics?

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chaz wyman
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by chaz wyman » Mon May 16, 2011 2:10 am

HexHammer wrote:
John wrote:I don't want to be overly rude but how do we know you're not just a liar?
There has been endless accounts of such phenonenom, where dead people would either appear to a close relative or the relative would sense that the other has died.

That is complete rubbish. There is not one single verified and substantiable example in the whole history of the human race that cannot be put down to selective bias, rebound memory or many other mundane explanations.

There has been a documented case where a danish school "København" (Copenhagen) ship would be out of radio contact at Australia, even though it was perfectly normal that ships would be out of radio contact in that area, some of the mothers would have death appearances of their sons on the ship, later it was reported missing and was assumed sunk, it never appeared again.

This is BS, and deep down you know it.

Some time before a sailor on the ship would have a terrible nightmare about the ship wrecking, and the sailor faked a fever and was hospitalized some place in South America, his father would ask where his sone was, and the answer was "he's amongst people in uniform".

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Bernard
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by Bernard » Mon May 16, 2011 12:38 pm

Whoah! slow down a bit guys! I'm not offering proof. The experiences I had I took with a grain of salt and put no more weight in them then that. Indeed, I only just recalled them this morning after being interested in this thread for some weeks now. They're just personal experiences that don't matter a damn to anyone else in the end. There were no thunderbolts; nothing more than spaces between gusts of wind where the quietness of love came to the fore in ways I'm not interested in explaining much. Why are people so interested - or disinterested - in substantiating insubstantial things? Its stupid.

We perceive. This is a hard fact. But what we perceive is not a fact of the same kind, because we learn what to perceive.

Don Juan Matus,
The Wheel of Time
Last edited by Bernard on Mon May 16, 2011 12:44 pm, edited 2 times in total.

chaz wyman
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by chaz wyman » Mon May 16, 2011 12:42 pm

Bernard wrote:Whoah! slow down a bit guys! I'm not offering proof. The experiences I had I took with a grain of salt and put no more weight in them then that. Indeed, I only just recalled them this morning after being interested in this thread for some weeks now. They're just personal experiences that don't matter a damn to anyone else in the end. There were no thunderbolts; nothing more than spaces between gusts of wind where the quietness of love came to the fore in ways I'm not much interested in explaining much. Why are people so interested - or disinterested - in substantiating insubstantial things? Its stupid.
So why are you bringing them up in a thread above telepathy?

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Bernard
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by Bernard » Mon May 16, 2011 12:54 pm

I am still interested. Its just that I find that there is a lot of over-interest and under-interest.


My argument has been that there is no point in looking for proof for something that can't be proved (scientifically). The lead post was a stab at the possible explanation of telepathy via a wild sort of physics... still physics nonetheless. I say no to that. Philosophy however is not subservient to nor bounded by science, so can insubstantial phenomena (alleged) be upheld philosophically when it can not be done so scientifically?

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Bernard
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by Bernard » Mon May 16, 2011 1:10 pm

There are miracles and there are miracles. Do you think that if a person was diseased with terrorism and prayed to Osama Bin Laden that he/she would be cured of it and OB canonised, like the way that person with Parkinsons prayed to John Paul, who had Parkinsons - I seem to recall - and was cured, and which then led to JP's beatification?

True miracles don't shout, they lie quietly within the fabric of day to day life.

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HexHammer
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by HexHammer » Mon May 16, 2011 2:18 pm

Bernard wrote:There are miracles and there are miracles. Do you think that if a person was diseased with terrorism and prayed to Osama Bin Laden that he/she would be cured of it and OB canonised, like the way that person with Parkinsons prayed to John Paul, who had Parkinsons - I seem to recall - and was cured, and which then led to JP's beatification?

True miracles don't shout, they lie quietly within the fabric of day to day life.
There are things like placebo, which the many can be cure with.

chaz wyman
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by chaz wyman » Mon May 16, 2011 2:42 pm

Bernard wrote:I am still interested. Its just that I find that there is a lot of over-interest and under-interest.


My argument has been that there is no point in looking for proof for something that can't be proved (scientifically). The lead post was a stab at the possible explanation of telepathy via a wild sort of physics... still physics nonetheless. I say no to that. Philosophy however is not subservient to nor bounded by science, so can insubstantial phenomena (alleged) be upheld philosophically when it can not be done so scientifically?
There is no phenomenon to prove here.
It is so far from the need for proof - you have to start with some evidence. There is none.

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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by chaz wyman » Mon May 16, 2011 2:43 pm

Bernard wrote:There are miracles and there are miracles. Do you think that if a person was diseased with terrorism and prayed to Osama Bin Laden that he/she would be cured of it and OB canonised, like the way that person with Parkinsons prayed to John Paul, who had Parkinsons - I seem to recall - and was cured, and which then led to JP's beatification?

True miracles don't shout, they lie quietly within the fabric of day to day life.
A miracle is a fantasy.

No one has been cured through prayer.

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Bernard
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by Bernard » Mon May 16, 2011 11:00 pm

chaz wyman wrote: There is no phenomenon to prove here.
It is so far from the need for proof - you have to start with some evidence. There is none.
Why does anyone have to start with evidence as you wish it? This is not a science forum, and even if it was I don't think it would be an obligation, just a courtesy. But this is not a science forum and philosophy is not to be hijacked by your reason. Its too narrow for philosophy. If philosophy is anything its the expansion of reason rather than the limiting of it through imprisonment in physics.

Some of us here share the evidence that the heart reveals.

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John
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by John » Tue May 17, 2011 12:51 am

Bernard wrote:
chaz wyman wrote: There is no phenomenon to prove here.
It is so far from the need for proof - you have to start with some evidence. There is none.
Why does anyone have to start with evidence as you wish it?
You have provided evidence via testimony though when you referred to the incident concerning your uncle so once you've presented the evidence why shouldn't its validity be tested?
Bernard wrote:This is not a science forum, and even if it was I don't think it would be an obligation, just a courtesy. But this is not a science forum and philosophy is not to be hijacked by your reason. Its too narrow for philosophy. If philosophy is anything its the expansion of reason rather than the limiting of it through imprisonment in physics.

Some of us here share the evidence that the heart reveals.
I think it's more than courtesy to expect someone making a claim to be able to provide evidence for their claim. If your only evidence is "I know it in my heart" then that's all well and good for you, and you're entitled to believe what you want, but it would be a gullible fool who takes the word of someone on the internet to just start accepting the existence of a phenomena that no one has ever been able to demonstrate under controlled conditions.

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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by chaz wyman » Tue May 17, 2011 11:35 am

Bernard wrote:
chaz wyman wrote: There is no phenomenon to prove here.
It is so far from the need for proof - you have to start with some evidence. There is none.
Why does anyone have to start with evidence as you wish it?

Because of there is no evidence, there is nothing to look at, nothing to examine, nothing to talk about. Seem like you are asking a silly question to me.


This is not a science forum, and even if it was I don't think it would be an obligation, just a courtesy.

Evidence takes part in every aspect of our lives, not just science. I need to consult the evidence of food in the kitchen before I go shopping.

But this is not a science forum and philosophy is not to be hijacked by your reason. Its too narrow for philosophy. If philosophy is anything its the expansion of reason rather than the limiting of it through imprisonment in physics.

Nothing whatever to do with physics. Do you believe a thing for which there is no evidence? Do you believe there is eggs in the fridge so you can believe you are able to make a omelette?


Some of us here share the evidence that the heart reveals.

Who is that?

That just sounds like believing shit that you WANT to believe. In fact that is EXACTLY what it means.


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Bernard
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by Bernard » Tue May 17, 2011 12:05 pm

chaz wyman wrote:
Bernard wrote:
chaz wyman wrote: There is no phenomenon to prove here.
It is so far from the need for proof - you have to start with some evidence. There is none.
Why does anyone have to start with evidence as you wish it?

Because of there is no evidence, there is nothing to look at, nothing to examine, nothing to talk about. Seem like you are asking a silly question to me.


Not at all, unless science owns philosophy, which it doesn't. Life is not primarily physical, and therefore evidence of experiences had need not be so either.

This is not a science forum, and even if it was I don't think it would be an obligation, just a courtesy.

Evidence takes part in every aspect of our lives, not just science. I need to consult the evidence of food in the kitchen before I go shopping.


Yes, science and daily living reflect each other, but philosophy is a step beyond.

But this is not a science forum and philosophy is not to be hijacked by your reason. Its too narrow for philosophy. If philosophy is anything its the expansion of reason rather than the limiting of it through imprisonment in physics.

Nothing whatever to do with physics.
Exactly
Do you believe a thing for which there is no evidence? Do you believe there is eggs in the fridge so you can believe you are able to make a omelette?


My contention is that there are alternative ways of perceiving that have very little to do with the physical interpretation of our environs. Science has no clout beyond physics but philosophy does


Some of us here share the evidence that the heart reveals.

Who is that?

You roundin' up a posse?

That just sounds like believing shit that you WANT to believe. In fact that is EXACTLY what it means.

If what hearts tells you is shit then we cannot agree on anything.



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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by chaz wyman » Tue May 17, 2011 1:10 pm

Bernard wrote:

If what hearts tells you is shit then we cannot agree on anything.
What MY heart tells me is one thing, what YOUR heart tells you is another. I am say the latter is shit, not the former.

Agreement is rarely the result of two fantasies coming together.
Where such fantasies come together with delusion we have religion.
For everything else there is reason.

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Bernard
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by Bernard » Tue May 17, 2011 9:43 pm

The Road Not Taken


Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;

Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim
Because it was grassy and wanted wear,
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I marked the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way
I doubted if I should ever come back.

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I,
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.


Robert Frost

chaz wyman
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Re: A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

Post by chaz wyman » Tue May 17, 2011 11:49 pm

Bernard wrote:The Road Not Taken


Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;

Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim
Because it was grassy and wanted wear,
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I marked the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way
I doubted if I should ever come back.

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I,
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.


Robert Frost
I've stayed on the road to reason - you have taken another path..


Do you seek the road to Fairyland.....
I'll tell; it's easy, quite.
Wait till a yellow moon gets up
O'er purple seas by night,
And gilds a shining pathway
That is sparkling diamond bright
Then, if no evil power be nigh
To thwart you, out of spite,
And if you know the very words
To cast a spell of might,
You get upon a thistledown,
And, if the breeze is right,
You sail away to Fairyland
Along this track of light.


-Ernest Thompson Seton

Neither of which are evidence for telepathy.
And do not lead to the phenomenon being anything more than imagination.

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