Generated Messages and Word-Values.

How does science work? And what's all this about quantum mechanics?

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VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

080722

Room to move - things to explore...
The information content of nature


SCLx16 + select last LE per shuffle
Hand In Hand - Unconscious - Flowery - “You have brains in your head. You have feet in your shoes. You can steer yourself any direction you choose” - Cyborg Anthropology - I am not here to judge but to help sanction each individual - Stubborn - The Spiritual Essence - What survives to the next round - Elementary Conclusion - Micro Reflections of a Macro Reality - The characteristics of narrative consciousness - Invite The Bee To Land - Hellish - The Sun - There Is More To The Silence Than Meets The Ear


AP= Nature being the very instigator Tied To The Moon
[Selected from the invisible realm of the mind, and "presto!"]


RSP = SCLx2 + P&P + re

7:27
GM: The Spiritual Essence
Observed by Many
"Cats Whiskers." [very appealing]
The Fare On The Table
The Next Step
https://futurism.com/astrobiologists-ea ... WsMOmGhBkY'
"Celebration
Great Humour and Enjoyment"
Doubt
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yp60yUb6nYo

William: Yes - I used this technique recently - when I needed sleep during the afternoon, due to nearby construction noises in the 'hood.
The rain itself was noise but, noise close to nature - close enough that I could engage with it as helpful in assisting with my need to sleep.
My experience [opinion of] was that it is adequate to the task, although the sleep was broken every 15 mins or so, the pattern was up and down rather than uninterrupted.

Natures noises are often calming, but always sleep with one eye open :D

GM: There Is More To The Silence Than Meets The Ear
Nature being the very instigator
Wisdom
Still
The Shaping Of Reality
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 7#p1073457

William: From the link;
William: As far as the evidence goes, the idea we are currently within some type of Holographic Experiential Reality Simulation isn't so far fetched as to be off the table...

Seeds: I like what you're saying there, VVilliam, however, I'm not a fan of the word "Simulation" when it comes to the workings of the universe.

"Illusion," yes. But "Simulation," not so much.

A "Simulation" of what?

William: I have seen this complaint before seeds, and it caused me to pause and reflect if that is the correct word to be using.

That is why I call it a 'reality simulation' as it is simulating a reality which can be experienced as real.

More to the point, whatever is experiencing it as real has to be conscious, so the only real thing in the whole HERS are the consciousnesses which are experiencing it.

If any illusion is going on regarding that, it is the idea that consciousness is the illusion and the universe is the real thing, which is the basic tenet of emergent theory and the overall message supporters of that theory, preach....

[SOURCE]

040422

The debate between theists and atheists
...because death comes a-knockin' eventually...

GM: Cultivate
"I'm Okay With That"
Self-discipline
WindBlown
Different ways of supporting the same objective.
Knowing
Nature

William: Indeed. If it could be seen as a natural enough occurrence, forgiveness can replace the shame of it all.
Or - said another way - "Our wounds are often the openings into the best and most beautiful part of us."
The idea of cultivating the thought "I'm Okay With That" to the point of being able to forgive "that" is equal to "knowing nature". It is not saying one is "okay" with something which is obviously pernicious but rather in doing something which is counter-destructive...
GM: "Error Correcting Codes
Put That Fire Out"

William: Recalibrating how one thinks = "Error Correcting Codes"

GM: Sounds
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 6#p1082466

William: From the link;
GM: Knowing:
"I think it was an ambush or surprise attack" - Aye...A name I call myself. :)
"This statement is true but cannot be proved"
Understanding the mind behind creation which is commonly referred to as "God"
Expansiveness

William: Self-realization...Militant messiah

GM: Ignore the Noise From The Peanut Gallery

William: and the noise from the chainsaw just starting up next door... 8-)
GM: "Precognitive [having or giving foreknowledge of an event.]
Happiness
Subconscious
Overall"
Coordinate Forgiveness
Potential
Called To Order
"A Space Without A Time..."
Plan
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 4#p1083234

William: From the link;
If we do not know what something fundamentally is, but still refer to it as existing, it is conceptual in nature and of the mind.
Things of the mind are fundamentally unknown. They act as devices which also happen to assist us in understanding the physical universe.

So we use the concept of time, not as a means of understanding what time is [fundamentally] but how it relates to the physical universe.
[Replying to Bust Nak in post #663]
So time itself, as opposed to our concept of time, can physically exist?
How can time physically exist?

Does the mind physically exist? Is consciousness a physical thing that you can hold in your hand?
Is time something you can pick up off the floor and place on the table?
You said time cannot tick on forever.
I said that time is a pointless concept in relation to forever.
What is doing the 'ticking'?
GM: Existence
"Tracks in the Snow"
Apparent Contradictions in Relation to Biblical Beliefs
Produce/Make
[Without Judgement]
Phantasma [a perception of something that has no physical reality; of the mind;]
Metaphysics [branch of philosophy that studies the fundamental nature of reality, the first principles of being, identity and change, space and time, causality, necessity, and possibility.]
"Stay The Course"
Realisation:
"Turbulent"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ekH2gnqPY8

William: From the link
There is an ancient story.. one that exists far beyond what we are told. A re-occurring theme in many ancient cultures and narratives all over the world. If this is indeed true, what does it mean for humanity?
GM: [Taps just above glabella]
"Collective Dynamics
Cease to exist"
Acceptance
Moon
Loving-kindness
Tied To The Moon
"We were not conscious of being a human for a time, but this does not mean that consciousness wasn't there.
The Nature of Angels
See the Signs"
"Choices
Reminding one of how it all started and the different stages one goes through."
Galaxies are like Islands...
Sweet Vibrations
How Can We Know
Around The Campfire?
Callum's Seventh Point
Timelessness vs infinite regress argument

William: Yes... a recent [and ongoing] conversation between Tanager [creator of the "Callum character] and myself;
William: I thought you agreed that there is no outside of GOD.

[Replying to The Tanager in post #685]
I said there was nothing outside of GOD and then this GOD created a distinct thing that was, in the very act of creation, outside of GOD.
How can it be logically possible for GOD to create anything outside of GODs self?
Where is the logical contradiction? We can’t have a square circle because of what “square” and “circle” mean. How does “create” logical contradict “something outside of GOD”?
Something "outside of GOD" contradicts "no outside of GOD."

Creating something new does not contradict "no outside of GOD."

Creating something new "outside of GOD", does.
How does that prove an infinite regression isn’t logically impossible? Your video begins and then progresses forever.
If one does a little study on the Set one will discover that the infinite progression can be shown to run opposite [as infinite regression] which signifies that the point where the video begins is the same as the begin/end points which turn up throughout the eternally unfolding.
The idea of Creatio ex nihilo is exactly the same as the idea of Creation being built from something that already existed.
In other words, the thing that didn't exist before, was created from the stuff that has always existed.
That is not creatio ex nihilo at all. The ex nihilo expressly means that it wasn’t built from something that already existed.
But we know that it was built from something that already existed. GOD.
No, you claim that. You haven’t supported it as being true.
My statement has to do with our overall conversation here. Do you want to end this conversation because 'the existence of a creator' hasn't been supported or carry on re the question "Do we exist within a creation?"

When I wrote "we know that it was built from something that already existed" I was referring to Energy and QF [matter] and if these things fundamentally represent GOD [re theistic ideas about existing within a creation] then they may as well be be accepted by theists, in that attitude.
So by “Theists” do you mean “some Theists”?
Of course. Not all theists agree on everything pertaining to existing within a creation. They agree that they exist within a creation.
It is what it is. You are saying that energy is not the same as spirit, but clearly no attributes in both are different. One is just thought of devoid of intelligence while the other is thought of as not being devoid of intelligence.
Well, if true, that’s a big difference. Can you show energy to be intelligent?
Nope.

What we can do is agree that the interaction between Energy and QF results in identifiable intelligent outcomes and take that as an indication that we may indeed be existing within a creation and therefore Energy and Matter may be intelligent, because they do not exist outside of GOD.
Clearly, neither theist or atheist belief re that has proven itself, so the Natural-Neutral position is to understand that both/all labels re "Energy" and "Spirit" are speaking about the same thing, albeit, differently, depending upon the position one is speaking from.
I don’t see how those being the same is the natural or neutral position. Why do you think that?
Energy and QF refers to the nature of the universe, thus the "Natural" part.

Re the question "Do we exist within a creation?", one remains neutral until such a time as nature reveals for certain, either way, thus the "Neutral" part
GM: "Navigational Aids
Rejuvenate
Healing The Beast"
Self-respect

William: Perhaps. Our interactions have been up and down and generally we disconnect on the down, but the pattern is that we also reconnect after a time, and try again...it is just the way the dynamics between Tanager and I have happened...

GM: Descriptive:
"Veil"
"The Design of The Universe"
"The Spirit of the Land"
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 5#p1078885

William: From the link;
[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #58]

In theistic terms, The Heart is not only significant of the organ it is named for, but also - and especially in terms of Mysticism, The Heart refers to the motivating desires of the personality occupying the same body.

Thus, the "hardening of the heart" is about that aspect, re the storyline, as far as can be told.
The Jewish inflection re the storyline is concerned with the idea that supposes the God influences from a position outside of the personalities own perspective and this idea of separation is what brings about such concepts as a god-being interfering/interacting from an outside position, which in turn allows for the idea that the god isn't as good as the story-tellers try to make him out to be, due to how the believers attempt to reconcile the obvious contradictions with their love for such an idea of a Creator-GOD.
This is a type of Stockholm Syndrome as it can be regarded as a coping mechanism to a captive or abusive situation these ideas of GOD produce within the individual, to varying yet still related degrees.
I suspect the whole purpose of the Jewish [and following-on Abrahamic religions] ideas of GOD was to establish a human hieratical system which largely prevents believer and non-believer alike, from accessing possibly [more likely] truer ideas as to how such a GOD-beings' consciousness actually operates in relation to individual human consciousnesses...

It is wise to find a way in which to circumnavigate such obstacles, rather than settle for these being the criteria to which we all have no choice but to submit to.

Well...I think so anyway. :)
8:16
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VVilliam
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Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

Q: What type of "proof" could possibly be provided re subjects which fall outside the material/natural without that proof being material/natural itself?

[Replying to TRANSPONDER in post #105]
This is not an unfamiliar question. Theists often ask 'What evidence would convince you of God'; 'What Sort of evidence would you require?'
Be that as it may, this is not the question I asked.

The question I asked has to do with the demand for proof. You specifically called for proof for anything other than the material/natural, which is why I asked for clarity on your part.

I am not asking "what evidence would convince you of God". I am asking you to explain what proof could possibly be presented which is not material/natural.
I already said what would be required - evidence of a Cosmic Mind in nature.
We have discussed this already and have come to no agreement, because our positions on the question of whether we exist within a creation or not, are different.

Atheists and theists have their established beliefs and stipulations on the matter.

Those who are in neither of those two positions have established no beliefs and accompanying stipulations 'for' or 'against' the question.

The existence of mind, could lend itself as evidence that what is being experienced is a created thing.
The observation of mindful activity has that going for it and it does not influence me what theists or atheists say about their own established conclusions re that because the truth is, they don't know either way.

I accept that [they don't know either way] is true.
That truth, is good enough for me.

Rather than concern myself with filling up the Gap of Ignorance with "God-did-it or It did itself" beliefs, I simply allow for the fact that the question remains unanswered at this stage and accept the Gap of Ignorance for the lack of knowledge that it represents.
That gap is still open but we really do require the evidence to show up and be convincing. Until then, the logical rule is no belief without convincing evidence.
The position of Natural-Neutral is the only position which allows for that to genuinely happen without forcing belief-based stipulations [realistic or otherwise] into the mix - re the question of whether we exist within a creation or not.

For example, any scientist worthy of the title will answer the question "Could reality be a simulation?" with "Possibly."

This is to say, they do not have scorn for the idea or say "until there is evidence of it, we will assume the atheist position"

Not knowing either way means one is Naturally Neutral - which, incidentally, is exactly how scientific process proceeds in regard to the initially unknown.
_________________________________________________

090722
Unity with our Collective Self

SCLx9 + select last LE per shuffle
The Theory of Everything - Inalienable [not subject to being taken away from or given away by the possessor.] - Open - Trying to change the world fails for one simple and unavoidable reason...“everyone else.” - Honest attempts at scrubbing up - The Wisdom of Foresight - Wide - The Shared Word-String List - "Does the possibility that being unable to detect something as existing, allow for the right to include 'zero' as representing something real, which is not?"

AP= The Astonishing Simplicity of Everything Points of Reference [=650][Six Five Zero = 158]

158
[Spirit work
Navigational Aids
The solution
Learning to Fly
Misanthropy
Sacred Geometry
Stuff like that...
Phantasmagorical [an exhibition of optical effects and illusions]
Propitious
Clear Your Mind
Try To Relax
Deep Impact Event
One Four Zero
Six Five Zero]

RSP = SCLx2 + P&P + re

10:47

GM: The Metaphysical Universe
GOD
Thread about all things
Pervasive

William: Metaphysical - the essentially metaphysical question of the nature of mind. an empiricist rather than a metaphysical view of law. transcending physical matter or the laws of nature.

GM: Root chakra
"Invite The Bee To Land"
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 1#p1081121

William: From the link;
Wootah: There is nothing in creation that can represent God but everything points to him.

William: If everything points to YHWH as the "first truly invisible God" are these not therefore able to be described as "physical manifestations that people can look at"?

In what way is it wise to compare YHWH with mute physical idols that people can look at, if there are also invisible entities who can - as one biblical writ offers opinion on others - calling these "false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ" and adding the idea alongside that - perhaps as a way of instilling the concept as a concrete thing in the minds of any who listen - that it is nothing to marvel about because "Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light"...and quite the reason I would say, as to why questions such as "Can anyone give good reason to believe Yahweh is not a demon?" are asked, since both YHWH and Satan are presented equally as "invisible entities" and both appear to be able to present through physical manifestations that people can look at and interact with.

For my part - I consider the Earth Herself to being a god, for she has many of the attributes of a god, but I do not consider Her to being the form of the planet - but rather, the mind therein - and invisible at that [as are all minds] - so wherein can the invisible be seen by the visible, other than through the visible - such as with all minds? Minds cannot be seen unless they are manifested through the visible.
Yet, in Earth being a mindful thing, can we point to Her and declare from this that She "does not represent YHWH" while also declaring that She still points to YHWH?

If not, then your statement "everything points to YHWH" would be untrue...unless in the saying of it, you are meaning something else?
GM: "Without Comparison
Pearl of wisdom"
"GOD became Gods and Goddesses."
Tempting Vision
In The Rabbit Hole
"The Sign On The Door Clearly States The Rules"
[The Earths Moon]
"Does the possibility that being unable to detect something as existing, allow for the right to include zero as representing something real, which is not?"

William: If there is no such thing as "no thing" then "zero" cannot represent "no thing"...it must therefore, represent something...so... Q: What is the thing that zero represents?

GM: "The Astonishing Simplicity of Everything
Behind The Scenery"

William: That is a great way of explaining what Zero represents.
0= "The Astonishing Simplicity of Everything Behind The Scenery"

GM: Everyone: "In space nobody can hear you scream"
Saturn: "Hold my beer..."

William: Yes. "The Music of The Spheres"

GM: Are

William: Arrrr....

GM: "But hey, we can all hope that over time the mainstream view is tending towards the truth. It's certainly a lovely idea"
The Wider Reality:
"When In Doubt - Set It Aside"
The Face of God
https://theagnosticforum.com/threads/do ... 4/post-756

William: From the link;
AB: The problem with making nature or biology the foundation of objective morality is that then it justifies the psychopaths or the male lions that kill the other male lions and their offspring just so they can take over the pride. Both are following their nature or biology. At best, I think we can say that morality is part of nature, but that alone does not tell us which morals are good or bad.

William: Q: "What is it about humans which has the ability to comprehend a [supposed] "Perfect World", which is so obviously different from the real world?"

We search for answers...

What have our sciences done to answer this question?

Or is it a matter that our sciences are being used specifically like unto the male lions, suppressing the main herd while they go about sailing into a particular direction they have selected for themselves?

For the herd notes, [for example] that as grandiose as the latest space telescope is - hurtling and unfurling [fully shaded] toward it's destination some million miles out and, simply to peer into the secrets of the past to 'try and understand'...the herd understands that the money could be 'better spent' on creating a perfect world here in the heart of imperfection - so why is that not been done?

Why is the rest of the herd being experimented on and used for that one purpose?

Just so a few lions can have their names recorded for all time?

Is that moral?

_________________________________________________________________

Does it matter, since morals are really human inventions and are not aligned with the actual reality?

And to the Theist who might believe such, I would add a question to that one.

Q: Since this is not the perfect world you imagine, since you are thinking of kingdoms of plenty where this kind of thing cannot take place, why do morals matter hereabouts in this world, when they seem to serve better in these other imagined next level worlds?

For me in the middle, [Natural-Neutral] I am somewhat undecided. I see the potential for humans to actually build a perfect world for themselves - irrespective of the chaos - and see those in the sciences attempting to do that.[through none other than the devices of the Sciences]
Unfortunately - not everyone is in favor of the perfect world envisioned - of the fiction-like story scientists are opening the door to...and so those not in favor are factored out, through invention...just like how the male lions deal with the male off-spring...not with morals but simply through the natural rule of the game-play of this reality...the School of Hard Knocks.
GM: Image

William: Is it really that funny?

GM: Fulfilling Human Destiny
"Monkey say monkey do monkey say "throw the pooh"
Perception"
Enqueue [add an item of data awaiting processing, to a queue of such items.]
Religion
"The practice of vipassana [concentration on the body or its sensations, or the insight which this provides.]
Break the glass ceiling"
"The Connection Process
Other Ways of Using Your Lists
Childlike"
Between
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophia_(Gnosticism)
Meaningful

William: From the link;
In Gnosticism, Sophia is a feminine figure, analogous to the human soul but also simultaneously one of the feminine aspects of God.
William: I was conversing with Konsciencia just yesterday;
Konsciencia: For example: in my own truth, Lucifer is The Universe, but no one will accept that. So, they go with their own truth of how they see Lucifer. Also, Lucifer is more a Woman in my view! Which is awesome! I know for sure that The Illuminati has those Ancient text that explains what we were, but there's no actual truth.

William: Truth may not be a fundamental aspect of the universe. Relative truth can be useful to the individual for the purpose of assisting the individual with understanding the fundamental nature of this reality [and alternate realities] being experienced.
With Lucifer, the connect is there also in the Sophia mythology - and Lucifer might represent to Sophia, [macro] what Jung's Archetypes represent to us [micro].
Given the mythology surrounding Lucifer, did Lucifer attempt a coup with the purpose of deception in mind?
Such questions cannot be answered in any way which might satisfy the questioner with the truth.
The solution is to always aim for the top as it were - Sophia is the primary Universal Entity re the mythology - Lucifer appears later on. Is Lucifer working with or against Sophia? Is it even possible to work against Sophia? How do such answers to such question help us individuals?
Apparently Sophia has Parents. If so, this adds to the hierarchal structure in that 'there is more to the story than meets the eye of one's understanding.'

We move onwards...

Konsciencia: Yes... I forgot about The Sophia aspect of The Universe. However, I always say that The Universe is more a Woman, than a Man's kingdom. For example: in my view, Lucifer is a Woman (most often.) In other words, God is a Woman. I do feel a peaceful, and Loving Feminine Vibe whenever I conversate with The Universe.
GM: "The picture unfolds like silk in a loom Silhouetted by Diane are the witch and the broom If she is the bride - who is the groom?"
Constructors and tasks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYc97J2MZIo
Remember/Memories

William: From the link;
The people behind the greatest leaps in physics - Einstein, Newton, Heisenberg, all had the uncanny ability to see the fundamentals - see the deepest, underlying facts about the world, and from simple statements about reality they built up their incredible theories. Well what if we all had a recipe book for doing exactly this. Well, one might be just around the corner and it’s called Constructor Theory.
GM: Nuclear
Please
It is Found Within The Experience of Self

11:17 [End of Part I]
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VVilliam
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Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

090722

Part II

16:06
Master Plan:
"Don’t hide your Generated Messages"
"IF: there is a Cosmic Mind THEN: Eventually, any species which survives long enough to continue along with the unfolding universe will eventually discover that and invent ways in which to engage."
Hacking through the subconscious
What Are The Chances
"The Home Of The...
William's
The Imagination"
"Yes We Can!"
"Adversity makes strange bedfellows
Unexpected"
Realm of Dreams
"The Patupaiarehe
Image
Inner child"
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 3#p1081733

William: From the link;
Image
I have since changed my view, as my understanding is that "Agnostic" is too misunderstood.
My current understanding is this;
Image
William: The Natural-Neutral Default Position

GM: Sober journey into self-realization

William: Better than trying on the Agnostic label which has been through the mill

GM: A terrible milestone

William: Ground into powder....

GM: "We Are All Becoming One
Pure soul"
Mind Games
"Love Heart
Privacy"
Points of Reference
"It is a slippery path of snake-oil."
[We stood side by side while the veils did hide the faces of children now grown
Making Up Stories]
Universal Intelligence Communications Device
"The Number Zero"

William: Signifying "The Astonishing Simplicity of Everything Behind The Scenery"

GM: Being Born
Precise definitions of strategies
Counsel
Konkachila
Between
“You have brains in your head. You have feet in your shoes. You can steer yourself any direction you choose”
The Played Piece
Things exist - and do not just exist but exist to be experienced.

William: "These things have been given to me, now what to do with these things..."

GM: Christendom...
"Astral Teachers
Earth Mother"
Disingenuous [not candid or sincere, typically by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.]
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 0#p1068520

William: From the link;
Theophile: We see this emphasized in Matthew 19, in Jesus' teaching about the rich man. The rich man already follows the law perfectly! (Including, presumably, the greatest commandment - love). But Jesus is explicit: this is still not enough for him to enter into the kingdom. To do so, to truly live under grace, he needs to give away all that he has and go follow Jesus.

It's not a personal struggle I have or anything like that. It's just the words written down...

William: Words written down are one thing.
Interpretation of words written down are another.

As I pointed out, the story of the rich pious man revealed the mans inner attitude which did not align with his outer pious actions - thus presumption we might have re the mans outward actions based upon what we observe the man doing, is incorrect.
It is safer to presume from the story that the man did not operate sufficiently with love - either for his God or for his fellow human beings.

The man made a claim. He 'did all the things required of him' but biblical Jesus saw through the pretense and got to the point.
William: So the rich man in the story, was being disingenuous...makes perfect sense.

GM: Holographic Universe
Keen
Warm Presence
"Deconstruct The Message"
Perennial [lasting or existing for a long or apparently infinite time; enduring or continually recurring.]

William: Right - like the discussion I am having with Tanager right now regaring the Mandelbrot Set...
Tanager: How does that prove an infinite regression isn’t logically impossible? Your video begins and then progresses forever.

William: If one does a little study on the Set one will discover that the infinite progression can be shown to run opposite [as infinite regression] which signifies that the point where the video begins is the same as the begin/end points which turn up throughout the eternally unfolding.

Tanager: Can you share the reasoning that shows this?

William: Sure - when I come across the video I picked the info up from, I will. From memory, the person showed that by applying the Set formula for the negative numbers, one gets a mirror-image of the Set, 'going the other way'...having written that, it occurred to me I could google something like "Mandelbrot Set negative equation" - there are articles on this you can view for yourself, if you make a similar worded search...
GM: Feelings Perceptions, and Behavior
Flat
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 9#p1081499

William: The link goes to a post I made about Agnosticism being a more reasonable position than Atheism.
Traditionally Agnosticism is seen as a subset of Atheism, and I thought this was just another Atheistic grab-like the claim "all humans are born atheists" et merda...
It seems to me it is better to abandon the label altogether which is why I came up with "Natural-Neutral"...

GM: An Aladdin's cave
"Shallow is Unknown"

16:39
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VVilliam
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Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

[Replying to The Tanager in post #696]
It seems to me like you should be saying Energy is the mindful aspect of GOD which forms the material aspect of GOD into shapes.
At this point I am bouncing around with ideas already established by religious theists in order to get bearings on the differences in beliefs as to how well they hold up to the things we do know about the universe.

One such option being examined is from the Jehovah's Witness religion. As I am attempting with you and your beliefs, I am also attempting to get clarity on their beliefs re this.

So far what I am being informed, is that the JW belief is;

"The Spirit is not God. It emanates FROM God, like power emanates from an electrical facility. The power is not the electrical facility."
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 9#p1084079

There appear to be two theistic beliefs re the nature of Energy;

1. Energy and spirit are distinct things
2. Energy and spirit are the same thing

It was a mistake to add the so-called "third view"; [3. I don’t know which is true]

This has to be rectified, in that it is not a theistic belief and shouldn't have been placed on your "list of views".

To clarify. Which of those two options do you position your belief?
Okay, but you aren’t being neutral in doing so. You have left neutrality via an assumption that “Theism” is true.
Nice try Tanager. Remove [3] from your list and the waters will clear.

One remains neutral simply by not making a shift to either Theism or Atheism.
One can lend and ear to either side without having to wear the burden of being accused of holding and defending the position of either side.

As I wrote;

"Being in the Natural Neutral position helps as it eliminates belief or lack of belief and simply accepts 'we don't know' while acknowledging that it is still worthwhile to - at least - attempt to find out..."

And on that point, I gave you information re the Mandelbrot Set being shown to display infinite regression and infinite progression. The reasoning has already been 'laid out'. Your thoughts on it [even as a concept unsighted] in regard to my own [already mentioned] are welcome.
____________________________________________________________________

100722
Precise definitions of strategies

SCLx10 + select last LE per shuffle
“The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched — they must be felt with the heart” - True happiness - I AM WE ARE - Fast - Rationality - Blood Sacrifice - Freeing the soul - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh0rG0_IEAM - Everything Is Unique - Do a begin/end...

AP= One's thoughts I Will [= 236]
236
[Soul Carrier Memories
Universal Intelligence
Cyborg Anthropology
Copper wire and glass beads
Strength is required
One's thoughts I Will]

RSP = SCLx2 + P&P + re

05:39

GM: Do a begin/end...[B&E]

William: Okay...

[B&E throughout =GM]

GM: One's thoughts Sea The Deeper Self Purpose To what end exactly?

William: I do not know. How deep is infinity that an end can be measured? Isn't that what the Mandelbrot Set visually displays? There are begin/end points but the flow is infinity - regressive and progressive and neither contradicting the other.

GM: Cleanliness Discernment

William: I think so too...

GM: Victim/Vampire Energy Exchange All at sea

William: [Perplexed, bewildered, as in She was all at sea in these new surroundings. This idiom transfers the condition of a vessel that has lost its bearings to the human mind.]
Yes - I see what you are saying there. V/V Energy feeds itself on itself - ouroboros-like...which of course is also how infinity works re the Mandelbrot Set visuals.
However, the V/V exchange seeks to use the process as a means of staying around forever...not sure that is the best way to spend forever...it is unappealing to me...

GM: A dish fit for the gods... Description "Instant Manifestation"

William: We get what we ask for, regardless of how we use the energy....

GM: :)

William: :)

GM: The Number One Nine Two

William: So far I have these entries under that value, on my N2N list;

[Smoke and Mirrors
Quantum Presence
Merging with the data
Integral Network
Responsibility
Tempting Vision
The Way of the Shaman
Moderator Comment
Childhood Nightmares
Atheists crack me up.]

GM: It is a mystery which must be solved that the Human becomes true.

William: Merging with the data
[Integral Network]
[Responsibility]
"The Way of the Shaman" then...


GM: The Physical Universe The rich world of conscious experience Fun...Work...But Fun Nonetheless

William: I am trying to see it that way...it isn't easy...

GM: Actions speak louder than words
"The problem - as I understand it – is in how humans general think about ‘God’ and project their own sense of self into the model they each come to accept as the real thing."

William: I said that. As it is right now, if I 'see' GOD as 'consciousness' and re this universe, as "The Universal Consciousness" or "Cosmic Mind" - The Mind behind the creative unfolding of the universe...my 'sense of self' - regarding that - is that;

I am loath to embrace the idea of enduring this universe forever...due to the aspect of entropy...it would be no fun hanging around forever once 'things' dissipated because things are what allow for fun to be had.
However, as I have been learning through this GM process - specifically to do with Isaac Asimov's short story "[The Last Question]" - AND re the visual evidence of the Mandelbrot Set once the energy has dissipated through entropy, The Cosmic Mind simply engages with the Quantum field [The Matter] and creates a new 'thing-of-a-universe'.
That in itself would be fun...

GM: Unequal

William: Uniqueness

GM: Persevere "May all your madventures be fun."

William: Indeed. However, some would argue that anything involving suffering isn't 'fun'.

GM: The evidence is too strong, to believe there is no intelligent mind involved as part of the universes structure.

William: Agreed. But what about the Cosmic Mind's idea of "Fun" re "Suffering"?

GM: "Ghost Dance"

William: Like a ships wake? Such will be left behind...eventually?

GM: The Dark Night of The Soul Adjusted Reality

William: So when I argued...
Therefore, we know that when someone say's "time will tick on forever because the universe will go on forever", they are superimposing a non-fundamental onto a fundamental. Whether proclaimers recognize this is what is occurring, or not, such a saying is not strictly true, but simply type of romantic/symbolic representation clinging onto the wake of the fundamental...wanting to be part of it forever.
William:..."Time" is meaningful only in the context of what is moved, rather than what is doing the moving?

GM: The Harmless Enough Agenda Crowd ...Childlike

William: Understanding based upon being not being fully informed?

GM: Beckoning Positivity
The Navigator Can Read Maps.
Military Longing Righty Oh!

William: As in "Salute and get to it" ?

GM: It can be crazy and true at the same time

William: Annoyingly so.

GM: Apotheosis

William: The highest point in the development of something; a culmination or climax. the elevation of someone to divine status.

GM: Story-Tellers Mind Games A countenance more in sorrow than in anger...
Separation https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 5#p1070045

William: From the link;
Clownboat: Tricking people for profit surely isn't kind though.

William: Humans are apparently not naturally inclined to kindness.

Diogenes: I disagree. Tho' we have our moments of unkindness, in general all healthy humans value kindness. Our very lives depend on it. We evolved, we survived because we were kind to each other - we cooperated. It is in our self interest to be kind and cooperate. Even the 'lower' mammals are kind to each other and have a sense of reciprocal fairness. We didn't need any particular religion or 'savior' to teach us this. We know it. Even the animals do.

We even have inter species friendships. We love and our kind to our pets. They are loyal and kind to us.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interspecies_friendship

William: If it is natural for humans to be kind and therefore my comment that "humans are apparently not naturally inclined to kindness" is untrue, what unnatural thing compels humans to be unkind?

Or could it be that both states are natural enough, depending upon circumstance and individuals simple adopt the best way they can find as a means of being able to sustain the governing emotions required for either state?

Understanding that the individuate position most humans are born to experience, the underlying motivation is intentionally selfish because recognition of the importance of the self becomes the initial propellent for all subsequent actions employed.

In that, it doesn't matter how one chooses to observe Jesus - as an historical image more human than the biblical Jesus - or how the bible images him - Socrates, Plato, Gandhi, Paul, David, Abraham or Glen - got their motivation for kindness from the same source - as we all do, when unkindness is dropped from our programs.
GM: "We are not orphaned - we are authored"
Make Story
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 3#p1081283

William: The link is to an earlier post - where Tanager and I are in the initial stages of teasing out the specifics of the different beliefs involved with A Cosmic Mind [aka GOD] and the way in which that mind creates 'things' - from within itself or from outside of itself...our discussion is ongoing...

GM: Bonding Entities of Particular Belief Systems
Becoming whole

William: I remain upon minded re that...
7:20
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

William: For me it seems pointless trying to resurrect a position to its former status.

AB: That may be the case but we still need a position that opposes or that's neutral in relation to the two extremes.

William: I doubt there will be any formal position.
It is better to recognize the function of the position in relation to theism and atheism, than to waste effort on trying to resurrect a failed attempt to do this with Agnosticism.

Obviously at some point after the introduction of Agnosticism, Atheism - up to its normal tricks - hijacked the position by claiming the position was a subset of Atheism - and referring to agnostics as 'weak atheists'.

Further to that, my observations are that both theists and atheists assume that the only two positions one can have on the question of whether we exist within a creation is 'yes' or 'no' and 'maybe' is not really a position on the question at all. One either believes or one does not believe. "Maybe' is 'wishy-washy'.

AB: Perhaps I'm being too optimistic but I would like to see the original agnosticism become the common usage.

William: Call me a realist because I think that ship has sailed.
Furthermore, how many folk do you see around this forum, referring to themselves as Agnostic and beating the drums of solidarity?

AB: Don't get me wrong, modern agnostics have a lot in common with the agnosticism that Huxley advocated for, but they do limit themselves when or if they don't go beyond their "I don't know" position.

William: Where are these 'modern agnostics'?

"I don't know" is the most honest reply to the question .

Q: Do we exist within a creation?"

Theist: I have belief that we do exist within a creation.

Atheist: I lack belief that we do exist within a creation.

Natural Neutral: I don't know and refuse to form belief or lack of belief as belief or non-belief provides me with no compelling answer.
_____________________________________

110722
Move beyond the human condition

SCLx7 + select last LE per shuffle
You Tube - "Like being pushed out from a stinky hole, can have one develop a bad self-complex" - The Next Step - To Add to That - "From what I am seeing re the data , it shows clearly that an underlying intelligence operates quietly in the background of the Universes Structure" - Until "Christ Returns" - Heart advice

AP= "Well even the most ugly of us have a Father." :) [in house joke] - [=419]

419
[What I also know is that numbers don't lie.
Might even cause Dad to crack a smile...who knows! :)
"Well even the most ugly of us have a Father." :) ]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E

7:10

GM: Changing The Rules Your Dream Team The non-Judgmental Algorithm Victim/Vampire Energy Exchange The Corporate Elite Loving-kindness The Sub Hierarchy Navigational Aids

William: As I understand it, "Corporate Elite" signifies "The individuals brain-consciousness" whereas "The Sub Hierarchy" is indicative of "The individuals brain-sub consciousness"...this has to do with such notions as "Intuition" and "Morality" and the deeper [less understood and less acknowledged] things of the mind in general

GM: [368]
"Sometimes it just looks like rain"
[Changes mind when truth is presented]
Less understood and less acknowledged

William: The "Power-Station Concept"
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 9#p1084079

GM: From the link;
Spirit is not God. It emanates FROM God, like power emanates from an electrical facility. The power is not the electrical facility.
GM: What Is Found Here?

William: The analogy makes GOD a Machine...

GM: Cycle Chance, "That is Correct"

William: If it were, that makes the physical universe created from the Energy, 'the machine' because that is the only machinery we see.
This in turn makes the "Creates Itself Fallacy" questionable...which is why GOD is conveniently placed outside of the universe.
Even so - this make GOD a machine creating a machine...
Then we have the atheist foot in the door asking "what created the GOD machine?" and reminding us of the "absurdity of infinite regression" [while infinite progression remains strangely valid]
"Talk to The Hand." :D

GM: Talk to The Hand...
That one might not have need of, does not negate that confidence cannot be gained through such device, with others.

William: What can I say...I have been using this GM process practically every day for a few months already, and 'it works' whatever 'it' is...

GM: The Vector Symbol Use Heart
The simplest explanations for why we are here and what we are doing...
The House of Science
Why this oft taboo subject needs to be understood in some less sweep-under-the-carpet way

William: The House of Science is busy trying to get a foothold on the stars...the mind is useful to that end, but is largely ignored on account that Science is not useful in relation to invisible realities...one has to see before one can appreciate...
Yet all are using this invisible resource as a means of understanding the physical universe...the mind is treated as a secondary emergent property and of no fundamental connection with Energy or Matter....with the actual physical universe...with 'Reality'.

GM: The evidence supports the idea that Theism is the better position for a human to place themselves.
Visible Light Girl "Couldn’t we do something about it..."

William: Don't think I haven't noticed on occasions, you calling me that...

GM: A measured step

William: Sure - What else am I to do with the life I have? Try to nut out how humans could steer the rudder on the ship being sailed...

GM: Time for Soul to Drive

William: How is this to be accomplished, world-wide?

GM: Get The Ball Rolling

William: Like "Step One:..." [131]
[Mother Earth
Intuition
Development
The Power Of...
Those Who Can
Learn How to
The Bidden Zone
Anticipation
The Old Soul
Not a Problem!
Heuristics [mental shortcuts that allows people to solve problems and make judgments quickly and efficiently. ]
Google Deep mind
Solipsism [the view or theory that the self is all that can be known to exist.]
Anchors aweigh
He Who Waits
Moon energy
Narcissist
Perseverance
Golden nugget
Active dreaming
Connections
Becoming whole
The Garden of Eden
The Squeeze
From the link
Like "Step One:..."]

GM: Present over perfect The Number One Nine Two

William:
[Quantum Presence
Merging with the data
Integral Network
Responsibility
Tempting Vision
The Way of the Shaman]

GM: Why is this a Requirement?

William: Because it appears to fit with the description "How to fix the world" as - possibly - a genuine recipe..."do this, get that..." The tools to achieve this have been made available...how to convince all the theists and atheists is the question...

GM: Free your soul The Realm of Judgement
"When our progressive movements are strong, they lead toward an exciting, irresistible vision for the future where all of us thrive"
Being aware of Human Control Dramas

William: Such as how theists and atheists consider the neutral position as wishy-washy and besides the point...

GM: 10 Insights You are neutral
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 3#p1081283

William: Again with the link to a conversation between Tanager and I where we are initial teasing out the particulars re "Is there an outside of GOD?"...
More recently, Tanager has mentioned my saying I am in a Natural-Neutral position...
William: Energy and QF refers to the nature of the universe, thus the "Natural" part.

Re the question "Do we exist within a creation?", one remains neutral until such a time as nature reveals for certain, either way, thus the "Neutral" part

Tanager: I don’t see how that’s remaining neutral.
GM: Signs Contact With
"Is it a mindless chaotic process which just happens to consistently appear coherent, no matter what random system we use in order to select the word-strings which generate the message?"
God/Source/Home

William: One leads to the other...
Hypnagogic experience
Sharing Your Love
The Spirit of the Land
A Space Without A Time...
All Things Are In Order
You Are Watched Over
Become more expansive
Emotional awareness
Underdetermination
One leads to the other...

GM: Move On Start where you are
No Country For Old Men Observant

William: "If the rule you followed....brought you to this...of what use was the rule?"
[The human tendency to see signals in the noise, even when there is only noise.]
The use of the rule is determined by the value the rule proves to be...

GM: The "All Matey"
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 4#p1077104

William: I was thinking about JK's position. He remains firmly atheist because he see atheism as a platform for fighting against religious morality using social Law to impose Christian Morals upon atheists and non-Christians ...
From the link;
JoeyKnothead: The "initial state" seems to be out of the reach of being described in any accurate or meaningful manner.

William: In that, it is no more or less better than the idea of an exclamation "let there be light" from an Intelligent Source being the Initial State.

JoeyKnothead: Plenty fair. Though one's gotta ponder what did it that thinking.

William: That is a journey in itself and provides me with lifetime of interesting subjective experience re my own way of interreacting with and finding out about such a thinker...
You mention what "Stokes That Fire" - it boils down to the so-called "Problem of Evil" which this morning I was thinking is like unto the '"Problem of Unicorns".
Yes. "Understanding the mind behind creation which is commonly referred to as "God" " is a "problem" due largely to the historical content of human interaction with this idea of "GOD" which has a poor record among the general populace, and can be attributed with some horrific milestones along the road-side of human history.
It is understandable that folk want to avoid that path in particular, given its track record.

However, full avoidance is impractical, unwise and unsustainable...and cannot really be avoided as long as consciousness exists in the human form and does what it does in whatever 'name' it is doing it.
"GOD" in essence is like unto a mirror-image of the formless ghost we call "Consciousness" and acts out as it sees fit, through biological instruments ... and it cannot be completely exorcised from the mathematical equations, even if it is only represented as "Zero". The rest of the Math cannot be done without that 'non-number'.
"Zero" does not actually represent "nothing" because "nothing" does not exist and so cannot be represented.
Therefore, "Zero" must have to represent something which does exist but is largely unseen - and "Consciousness" fits that description.
"Consciousness" = "Zero", mathematically speaking.
GM: God Eat Data Heal Cub

William: Through 'feedback'.
That is what this GM process is exhibiting

GM: Instant Though "the Serpent rules the Shadow"
[Ancient Grey Entity]

William: "Well even the most ugly of us have a Father." :D

GM: The Great White Brotherhood You will overcome
Semiotics [the study of signs and symbols and their use or interpretation.] Spiritual Activism https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 2#p1070402

William: From the link;
William: What has been established beyond reasonable doubt, it that it is illogical that "something that is, derived from something that isn't", which firmly places the idea of a Creator/Creation as primary for genuine and sustained consideration.

Brunumb: What hasn't been established is what preexisted this iteration of matter/energy that we refer to as the universe.

William: Scientists are working on finding this out. IF they are correct about the infinitesimally small object which exploded and produced what we currently are experiencing as a stage in the universes unfolding, THEN at least we can identify said object as "The Seed of Origin"

What, if anything pre-existed that - is beyond our current ability to know.

Brunumb: If it was not 'nothing' and we know nothing about it, then how can we deduce that it involved some sort of mindful creator?


William: Easily enough. We know that mind is integrated with matter. Thus we have clear evidence that a mindful creator is involved, even if that creator-mind is unfolding from the Seed of Origin which birthed the universe we are witnessing through experience.
Being that it has emerged since the germination {Big Bang} it has had a great amount of time in which to learn to effect the matter to whatever it wills, even to the point of doing so here on this planet, as we ourself bear witness, even to the degree that we refer to that as "reality".

Brunumb: One can stick that on the table for consideration but there is nowhere to go after that.

William: There is always somewhere to go. Testing it out for starters.
If:
There is a mind behind creation
THEN:
We ought be able to communicate with it, using whatever physical devices we can create in order to do so.

Brunumb: It's all just imaginative speculation.

William: How do you know that? Or are you imagining that is all that it is?

Brunumb: When you look at this universe and everything within it, it is hard to imagine it all arising from some sort of mindful creator as far as I am concerned.

William: That is very understandable. However, even being that it is hard to imagine, it is not impossible. I haven't had any insurmountable problem in at least subjectively verifying It exists, or finding ways in which to communicate with It.

Brunumb: Extend that into the domain of the Christian creator God, then it all even becomes an absurdity.

William: As came up recently in my communion with said Mind -
GM: Where is Truth?
We Groove Together
Recovery
The resistance is generally traceable to the theistic approach of religionizing said intelligent mind.
William: What is noticeable about theism - even where it has branched into religionism - is that this is a type of means of leaving a trail in ones wake, and the trail itself shows efforts of The Mind to engage with human minds for the purpose of connecting - but often religious leaders have used this as a means of securing station/position within hierarchal structures which require said leaders to be the middle-person between The Mind and the individual - something easily enough achieved since the individual can be unsure of themselves and even afraid of doing that, so they willingly allow for the medium to act as go-between...which more often than not leads to little to no meaningful connection at all.

This also occurs in theistic non-religious structures - mostly because individuals doubt themselves sincere and honest enough to drop the medium and connect in a self-responsible manner.

Even so, I write that as an observation rather than a judgement. The Mind is aware that it is a scary thing for individuate human minds to willingly do, and while ideally if everyone did do it, much good could be accomplished, that most do not do it, does not affect the agenda of said Mind.
8:39
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VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

otseng: I mentioned before we cannot impose our modern standards on the Bible. Likewise, we shouldn't impose our modern view of cosmology on others and look down on how earlier cultures viewed the cosmos. As CS Lewis termed it, that would be chronological snobbery.

Finding out how ancient cultures view the heavens is a fairly large topic. In fact, it's an entire discipline in itself.

[Replying to otseng in post #1103]

I think this ties in with modern knowledge re the way things were said can be aligned with the way things have since proven to be.

Even in modern times, there is tendency to describe things from the subjective center of consciousness...from which all else flows around about.

Even that we do not know if consciousness has such a center - the only thing matching the concept, is the Self.

But what is the Self, that we dare proclaim it the center of everything?

If we call it "GOD" we blaspheme, for there is only One GOD and you and I are not IT, according to the teachings of...

:?:

Is there a center to every object in this universe?

Give thanks to the Lord, for he is good;
his love endures forever.
Let Israel say:
His love endures forever.”
Let the house of Aaron say:
“His love endures forever.”
Let those who fear the Lord say:
“His love endures forever.”
When hard pressed, I cried to the Lord;
he brought me into a spacious place.
The Lord is with me; I will not be afraid.
What can mere mortals do to me?
The Lord is with me; he is my helper.
I look in triumph on my enemies.
It is better to take refuge in the Lord
than to trust in humans.
It is better to take refuge in the Lord
than to trust in princes.

______________________

120722
Human Imagination Has Consequences

SCLx13 + select last LE per shuffle
What is the meaning of life? - Putting My Finger On It - Energy - Message Generator System of Random Selection of Word-Strings - I Suppose That It Is Possible - A Meeting Place - Jesus - Validation - http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... tcount=918 [as long as GMs are coherent, they can be interpreted] - The Nature of The Mind - Controlled by fear - Breasts - Science and Spirituality

William: Perhaps backwards or forwards doesn't matter

AP= A new Paradigm has arisen whereby folk can drop the idea of being a 'true Christian' and simply be a True Human. [nine two five = 142]

[142]
[Communicating
Nurturing
Copper snakes
Soul Has an Agenda
New Years Eve
Source Sync
Get Comfortable
Redefine Oneself
Don’t fall asleep
Fearlessness
Self-discipline
The Ishango bone
Post ignored
Forty Two
Madventures]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E

8:15

GM: In The Team Of The Collective Research into the Phenomenology of the Self

William: an approach that concentrates on the study of consciousness and the objects of direct experience.
This has to do with a recent post I made;
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 8#p1084228



GM: From the link;
onewithhim: Of course the Spirit is not God. It emanates FROM God, like power emanates from an electrical facility. The power is not the electrical facility.

William: So - what you may be attempting to convey, is that the facility which creates the Energy is GOD, but the Energy itself is not GOD?

The Energy itself is NOT intelligent, but the Facility which produces the Energy IS, and is GOD?

onewithhim: Yes.


William: That is like unto the Star Wars universe where The Force can be integrated with the individuals consciousness and used for both 'dark-side' and 'light-side' activity.

The Power-Station analogy doesn't exclude The Force from originating from a mechanistic device. [Power Station]

The device is simply hidden and as a Power Station it requires being accounted for as to how it came to be built.

We have the atheist foot in the door asking "what created the GOD machine?" and reminding us of the "absurdity of infinite regression" [while infinite progression remains strangely valid]

Isaac Asimov summed it up succinctly with his fireside telling of it ... The Last Question

Consciousness created The Machinery.

For some reason, Consciousness is able to effect the Quantum Field and through the vibrations of this interaction, Energy is created and form with function is manifested.

The "function" aspect is solely the dominion of Consciousness.

In that, the equation;

0 ‽ E & ∴ ‽ F c̅ QM [Consciousness Creates Energy And Thereby Creates Functional Form With Quantum Matter

0 ‽ F c̅ E + 0 [Consciousness Creates Functional Form With Energy and Consciousness]

Q: How is Energy produced by Consciousness? [What is the fundamental nature of Energy?]
GM: The curating is done when I am taking my first baby steps and learning to say "dada" and "mama" and after uttering those sounds show - at least that I am able to do that - so the next level entry is made available to me, and I learn how to shape the sounds I can make, following codes which have been around since long before my own arrival on this planet, to what the data signifies, that is information I am interested in.


William: When I wrote that, it was in coming to the realization of what it is we humans have to work with - language...and how language influences thought...

GM: "This Translates To That."

William: Yes...

GM: Fly Without A Machine For Solving Problems

William: Yes - fly without wings...something thoughts enable us to experience...within the vast realm of imagination...

GM: T-Shirts Taking root

William: I goggled that and got this;
Image

GM: Root of evil

William: Okay - I got this;
Image

GM: "Life is my predestiny - Providence is God to me" True happiness Taciturn [reserved or uncommunicative in speech; saying little.] Light is information

William: Yes - just not verbal in nature...

GM: Contentment "It is a good sign when Joey Knothead cannot argue against the evidence you present"

William: Yes. JK has a great mind to run things by...

GM: Universal Objectives You Are All Loveable...
Spiritual path Dysfunctional Atman Important Like mindful nests with eggs in 'em

William: Atman- the spiritual life principle of the universe, especially when regarded as immanent in the individual's real self.

GM: Beyond a shadow of a doubt
Stay Present *Nods* In The Light Of The Truth

William: *Nods*


8:35
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
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Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

Transponder: I'n not even going to debate the context of what you meant. If you don't even believe there to be a Cosmic Mind or a credible case for it, what are we even discussing? There is no valid evidencer or case other than an undisproven far -fetched possibility.

William: For my part, I am discussing the known existence of mind relating to matter, and how that can be extended to the possibility of the whole cosmos being mindful - because - if the parts are seen to operate mindfully there is no reason I can think of as to why the whole cannot also be seen to be mindful.

Transponder: Skepticism is validated logically without any need for discussion.

William: That explains adequately why the interaction between you and I is not "discussion". You make a claim regarding what I said, I ask you to validate the claim, you responded with what you thought was validation, I point out your faulty reasoning re that, and you react as if I am the one at fault.

Prior to that - in some other interaction we had, you brought up and then mocked the idea of "the music of the spheres".
I responded by linking you to evidence supporting this notion, and you couldn't even bring yourself to acknowledge the correction.

Were I do agree with you is that it has become most obvious that there is no discussion to be had between you and I.
___________________

130722
One Language Intelligent Network

SCLx11 + select last LE per shuffle
A Pragmatic Realization Precipitated In Ones Mind - Enqueue [add (an item of data awaiting processing) to a queue of such items.] - Adroit [clever and skilful] - Not a Problem! - Everything is a Message - Of Your Thoughts - Arrival - Talk - Trustworthy - Vocal Chords - The simplest explanations for why we are here and what we are doing

AP= Another Mind Open [=171]

[171]
[When Done Say “Done”
Suppression
Changing The Rules
Another Mind Open
Source Reality
The Olympic games
The human interface
Three-dimensional
Fireside Metaphor
Mainstream Science
Go with the Flow
Respect others
True happiness
Inner Strength]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

7:16

GM: Another Mind Open Mutual Dutiful Expression A Meeting Place
Deep Space
Strange
Great Humour and Enjoyment
Frequencies
Musing On The Mother [Act I]
All The Theories Regarding "The Gods"
We don't know enough to close any door and leave those rooms unexplored...

William: Sure. Even the whales will hunt out and destroy the nightmares of the deep...facing our fears is simply a necessary step in the experience of this universe...laugh in the face of death...and perhaps death laughs along with you...

GM: [N2N]
Laugh in the face of death
No Doubt about It
[Livingstone Hall
Well Its A Start]
We Are All Becoming One
Stay the course
[The Garden Story
The Great Unwashed]
[Spirituality
Psychic powers
Make a list for that]
Arm up - Fight battle

William: [LEIN]
The Dizzying Heights of Intellectually Honest Conversations
Tabula Rasa
Oops.....
Laugh in the face of death
"Funny"

GM: [N2N]
Laugh in the face of death...and perhaps death laughs along with you...
It is consciousness behaving as consciousness behaves.
The idea of nothing is non-relevant to the fact of something.
...it is part of the recipe of a full authentic human experience...
Information doesn't only describe nature - it is nature

William: [LEIN]
[To The Point
Merging with the data
Joining The Main Egregore]
Couple
Laugh in the face of death...and perhaps death laughs along with you...
Understand few reach self awareness]
[Inspiration
Meat For The Table]

GM: [Everything is an expression of GOD
The Establishment]
"The ride is wild"
~You are a dream gone real You’ve got exactly what it takes to make an old wound heal You tied the knot - then you let it slip Now we both know what it feels like to find a place to fit~
The Natural-Neutral Default Position
Phosphenes [a sensation of a ring or spot of light produced by pressure on the eyeball or direct stimulation of the visual system other than by light.]
[The Truth
Well defined yet scantily supported opinion]
Gnosticism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uD4jHDvNB80
It brought a tear to the eye of my heart.


William: From the link;
Lyrics:
[Verse 1]
When you’re sad and when you’re lonely
And you haven’t got a friend
Just remember that death is not the end
And all that you’ve held sacred
Falls down and does not mend
Just remember that death is not the end
Not the end, not the end
Just remember that death is not the end

[Verse 2]
When you’re standing at the crossroads
That you cannot comprehend
Just remember that death is not the end
And all your dreams have vanished
And you don’t know what’s up the bend
Just remember that death is not the end
Not the end, not the end
Just remember that death is not the end

[Verse 3]
When the storm clouds gather ’round you
And heavy rains descend
Just remember that death is not the end
And there’s no one there to comfort you
With a helping hand to lend
Just remember that death is not the end
Not the end, not the end
Just remember that death is not the end

[Bridge]
Oh, the tree of life is growing
Where the spirit never dies
And the bright light of salvation shines
In dark and empty skies

[Verse 4]
When the cities are on fire
With the burning flesh of men
Just remember that death is not the end
And you search in vain to find
Just one law-abiding citizen
Just remember that death is not the end
Not the end, not the end
Just remember that death is not the end
William: [Listens to the whole song while reading lyrics]
I cannot say enough about the blessing Bob brings into this world....
The Mother is his Muse... :)

GM: The Singularity
Q: How does one hide a Cosmic Mind? A: Within apparent imperfection...
[Overseeing Director of Operations on Earth
Like Unto Ghidrah - many heads one beast...
Who Am I]
Contentious [causing or likely to cause an argument; controversial.]
You Are
Inclinations
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 5#p1075865

William: From the link;
One could even be sad about such shenanigans until one realizes the futility of feeling sorry for those who hide from truth by declaring something to be true which has never been proven true.

Their destinies await them, be these rewards in heaven, or inheriting the game play on Earth.

Forever marooned upon an Island in the midst of an ocean they will never be permitted to have access to....while remaining blissfully unaware of the true nature of their internment and praising YHWH for their good fortune.
William: Yep. That sure is contentious....

GM: Cataphatic [(of knowledge of God) obtained through defining God with positive statements.]
"Learning To Fly"
"Lack of empathy"
"What Does It Mean?"
"What Is The Point?"

William: Learning to Fly
Spirit work
Navigational Aids
The solution
Sacred Geometry
Stuff like that...
Phantasmagorical [an exhibition of optical effects and illusions. ]
Propitious [ giving or indicating a good chance of success; favourable.] Clear Your Mind
Try To Relax
Deep Impact Event

'Lack of empathy'
Astral Guides
Etched mirror
Healing The Beast
Contact With
Satisfaction
Small Steps
Divine Sound
Fingerprint
A rock and a hard place
Balance of power
Mindfulness
In the moment
Heaven on Earth

What Does It Mean?
In the Era of Light
Sort It Out
Equal System
Astonishment
Impressionable
Christmas Time
What Fun We Have!
Get The Picture
Lifting Our Game
Walking the walk
Contemplation

What Is The Point?
Heroes and Villains
Break the glass ceiling
All is as is should be
A fish out of water
The Divine Darkness
Coming From QueenBee
The science of can and can't

GM: Transforming The Anger Energy
Test the waters
Gematria [a Kabbalistic method of interpreting the Hebrew scriptures by computing the numerical value of words, based on the values of their constituent letters.]
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 4#p1082604

William: From the link;
William: It is no doubt helpful for biological critters to have any chance of surviving within the PU to invent morals which assist with that process.
However, in order to accept the premise you offer, one would have to say that morals were not invented but discovered. One would have to assign human characteristics to the PU. Do you think that the PU is therefore self aware and has a sense of morality?

You seem to be saying that is the case, where you wrote;

PK: Remember, I'm coming into this as someone who does not see this morality and it would make me happier than a mafly in May to say they're making it up and it doesn't exist. But I've gotten hold of enough colour palettes and had enough similar answers from people who are not comparing notes (different cultures, even) that I'm forced to say it does exist. I would love it if they each said a different colour and I could laugh them off. But they don't. There is something there, something real, that they are seeing and I do not see.

William: "Where" is this seemingly unconnected cultural exhibition sourced, if not from the mind of the PU itself?
GM: Most folk need moderating.

William: We all seem to need moderating for as long as it takes for us to learn how to moderate our Self...according to the rules on the door...[please read before entering] ;)

GM: Learned
"Any God-Mind claiming to be responsible for human beings existing, is going to have problems to deal with re that"
What science [re materialism] does, is give cause for humans to celebrate the intelligence of consciousness while at the same time ignoring the hard problem of consciousness that this type of science has created for its supporters.
[Free! Free! Free!
RPDK [Random pg dn key]
Finding the light]
Who Knows!
[EZPZ
Go with the Flow
Balance of power
Opinion
Intuit]
Narrative warfare
Be
"Even in the very quintessence of the individual."
Joy


William: Remarkably so, yes.
Transponders approach is less inviting re 'discussion'. The GM process is far more the type of communication I am keen to follow through with. There is always the way in which such discussion can be had - even that the discussion becomes internal...strictly of the mind...no supposed "skepticism" to keep it at bay...

GM: Be Aware
"Out of The Shadow Lands"
Wild freedom
[Sovereign
Technique of Exchange
Each
Go within
Stop. Listen. Observe.]
[Glad One Asked
Synchronicity and the Holographic Universe]
[Nonetheless
Duality/Dualities Children
Study
Those Who Can
Regimented
Chakras
Ordinary]
Idiosyncratic [peculiar or individual.]
Fair Dinkum
"A dish fit for the gods"
[Joyful
Suckling on The Mother]
"Stuff Happens"
[Lifting Our Game
Precise definitions of strategies
The Moment
Training the mind]
A riddle wrapped up in an enigma
Divine grace
For anyone to say otherwise, would be unwise in the face of such evidence
Anchors aweigh!


William: Rather than 'keep it at bay'... :) Aye Captain!

GM: [The Four Human Power Houses]
"Use Mind
New Shifts In Thinking
Crystal clear
Wonderful!
The path to enlightenment"
The Spirit of the Land
Super-information medium
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 7#p1077997

William: From the link;
Diogenes Evolution has never seemed crazy to me. Long before I studied it, as a five year old at the zoo I noticed the strong resemblance of apes to people (which should not have been surprising since people are apes).

William: I think that the eye sees what it wants to see, rather than what is actually there under the flesh and bone of it all - simply because - until the eye sees - it goes along with what available information there is, but even when the information is made available, the self-identity prior to the information being revealed has a difficult time of it in changing ones understand of ones self.

So - on the surface the similarities between apes and humans is undeniable, but what is also undeniable are the vast differences which make the similarities fundamentally different and therefore quiet the absurd thing to be equating ones self with.
GM: Emotional awareness
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 4#p1077104

William: From the link;
GM: Dualic Energies
[For anyone to say otherwise, would be unwise in the face of such evidence]
"Look Closely
Dualic Energies
I Am Hearing You
Free your soul"
[Side Splittingly Funny
Beyond a shadow of a doubt]
Love Takes One For The Team
Consider This
Conspicuous [clearly visible. attracting notice or attention.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAfjsktMXu8
[Donald Hoffman Proves That We Live in a Simulation]
"Leave room for nature"

William: Yes - there is a tremendously funny side to all this, I agree. Yet I have to acknowledge the sadness I feel when I think about how science could be used to create a sturdy platform in which we then can launch off of from...and yes - given the 'rock and hard place' re the human drama, there looks - on the surface - to have been no other way in which to do what has and is being done.
What science [re materialism] does, is give cause for humans to celebrate the intelligence of consciousness while at the same time ignoring the hard problem of consciousness that this type of science has created for its supporters.

GM: [Mothers Milk
"The Dangers of Separating Human Consciousness From Any Idea of GOD"
Emotion]
Understanding the mind behind creation which is commonly referred to as "God"
Stoke That Fire
[In The Team of the Collective]
GM: Unconscious Mind Inertia
Pertinent [relevant or applicable to a particular matter; apposite.]

8:15
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

Because, combining the two [religion and aliens] one can read in such pre-television stories, similar testimony.
[Replying to Difflugia in post #31]
How similar is "similar?"
Very. The imagery may be different, but the subject matter is - overall - similar.
You've asserted that the experience "cannot" be the brain reworking something that's already been seen, but haven't justified why anyone should think that's true.
I haven't asserted that at all. The brain obviously has something to do with the process, but to what degree isn't really know because it isn't really well understood. Certainly not as well understood as some individuals assert, from their various positions of belief on such matters.
You've asserted "similar testimony," but unless "similar" includes things like alien greys and flying saucers, you're just making the case that human brains worked the same way then as they do now, not that the supernatural is real.
Who asserted 'supernatural'? I myself avoid using the word.
Instead of "aliens", one has gods/angels/demons/religious mythological icons...
Yes. When the brain gets weird, people frame their experiences within a familiar fantastic idiom.
What we know about the brain is that it - in all cases - does not see the world as it fundamentally is, and inserts interpretations of what it is experiencing [through its nervous system] into the consciousness connected to that.

The consciousness connected to that, has started become aware of this process and the connotations therein. The brain is just telling it like it believes it is experiencing it [reality] and consciousness just eats it up as if it were the truth...things are changing...
GM: [The Truth
Well defined yet scantily supported opinion]
{SOURCE}
We [rightfully] question what the brain tells us about the experiential reality.
The Santa Clause analogy isn't useful in this regard as we are only speaking about gifts left behind - which can be explained - we are not talking about folk experiencing and engaging with Santa. We are not even talking about a warm fuzzy joyous thing...
It's absolutely apt.
I am not convinced.
Dr. Clancy explains through the course of the book commonalities between subjects and presents known psychological phenomena as explanations. So far, you've simply denied them. Personal incredulity is the same evidence that I presented for Santa Claus.
I have not denied anything. I have pointed out that the analogy of Santa Claus is not what appears is being implied by Dr. Clancy. Are you saying that in her book she makes this analogy herself?

Even if she does, the analogy is based upon the idea that the brain creates the mind, which is something that has not been established as anything other than well defined, yet scantily supported opinion.
From my own experiences and subsequent study, I lean toward Jung relating such experienced imagery to what he referred to as the Archetypes...
Depending on how you read Jung, I might agree with you. If the Jungian Archetypes of the collective unconscious are expressions of how our brains have evolved as humans, then I'd agree, but that's just saying that our human brains share ways of reacting to similar kinds of stimuli. If you believe as Jung himself did that there's a sort of active connection between all members of humanity, then you haven't really offered any reasons for thinking that such a connection actually exists.
I do however acknowledge that brains are not reading reality as reality fundamentally is. That is a known fact.

∴ one cannot conclude that what the brain is telling us or how we are choosing to interpret that telling, is anything other than than well defined, yet scantily supported opinion.

Jung may have it correct while graphing with how to present a largely invisible reality to a largely visible one.

How are we to tell if we are 'minds within a mind'?

I would say, we best not leave it entirely up to the brain to inform us - since the brain is as Lost In The Thought Of It All anyway...

____________________________

140722
A Matter of Knowing Where to Look


SCLx15 + select last LE per shuffle
Preternatural [beyond what is normal or natural.] - Simplicity - There is a lot to unpack here - “Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail” - We go through together - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh0rG0_IEAM - Emotions - Cultural Based Theology - The situation we find ourselves lost within - Think About It - Healing the child within - No More - Thel [ Thel wishes to enter the world of experience and leave behind her innocent paradise. However, once Thel enters the world of experience, she cowers in terror at the thought of mortality and the uselessness of human beings if every action leads toward the grave. This can also be interpreted as Thel’s fear of losing innocence and virginity upon entering the world of adult sexuality. In other words, Thel’s fear of growing up is what keeps her from actually living. When she flees from the experienced world because it appears as her tombstone, she unwittingly flees life itself] https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 3#p1081043 - Hearing External Voices In Your Head

AP= Well That Settles It! What Fun We Have! [=387]

[387]
[May The Spirit of The Earth Bless You
Very comfortable in your own skin]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

8:24

GM: Odd Addiction Vortex
Is it not the quality of the message that counts, rather than the name of the entity the message comes from?

William: I think so, yes.
Odd Addiction Vortex
The Kindness of Sleep
Subatomic Particles
Looking behind the veil
Mathematical problems
Take care of yourself
The fire from within
The Nature of The Mind


GM: There is no such thing as random really.

William: Things just appear that way due to our position within things and our ignorance about most things.


GM: Now Getting Somewhere
Callum's Eighth Point

William:
Callum's Eighth Point appears to indicate that he is saying that if The Tanager does not want Callum to access my thoughts through Callum reading The Book of Musing On The Mother II, then "That's Okay".

I wouldn't argue with that reasoning as it is within the rules of The Role-Play.
I have provided Callum with enough devices for him to help himself and learn through. I cannot decide for him whether he uses those or is happy not to, if The Tanager does not want him to.
GM: Brother Wolf Sister Moon

William: 289, as with;
The Suppression Matrix
This is how The Mind works...
Within that which is unseen...


GM: Though the Serpent rules the Shadow
Liminal [relating to a transitional or initial stage of a process. occupying a position at, or on both sides of, a boundary or threshold.]


William: Like "Natural-Neutral" re theism and atheism...not "Agnostic" because that is a known subset of atheism...

GM: The Spirit of The Earth
Essentially, we are Gaia in Human Form...

William: Such is the nature of consciousness...

GM: Chamber Of Self
"And the wind will blow my tears away"
Image
[Welcoming answer
The Internal Voice]
"It is not a thing to judge, but a thing to accept without judgement"
Redefinition of the Human Being
Act like an airplane and adjust approach
Mirroring
Oneirology [the scientific study of dreams]
[Ignore the Noise From The Peanut Gallery]
Dharma [the eternal and inherent nature of reality]
Fugacious [tending to disappear; fleeting.]
"This Should Be Interesting"
[Understanding and connecting with the source of our language is vital to that vision
The Shaping Of Reality
I place no judgement on the results.]
Feature
Image
The Bridge of Condemnation
Tracks in the Snow

William: Then there were none...

GM: Responsibility
Image
A Drop of Consciousness in an Ocean of Tears
Unconscious
“The connect was not only into learning to form a better understanding and acceptance about my 'self' - but in how you showed yourself to being an integral part of that understanding and acceptance.”
Not a Problem!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZbXGDxMRCw
[Wakefield Accelerators: The Future of Particle Colliders?]
The key
The Mother
Simulating large scale structure
Coddiwomple [to travel in a purposeful manner towards a vague destination]
What Shall We Call It?
"Spring Loaded"
Deeper Questions Regarding Individual Existence
The Riders
Journey to wholeness
Not Emotion - State Of Being


8:47
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

William: So it isn't anything I said then?

Going back to original meanings is "the ship that has sailed" I referred to.

This is because that is just the way of the evolution of human language and fighting for something so late in the Game, isn't constructive use of personal energy.

Lets go back a few steps.

I was thanked for a post in another thread.

I pointed to this thread as part of my attempt to explain that I no longer saw the diagram as accurate.

I see now that my explanation could have been better, but even so, my argument is still valid re Agnosticism.

So the things I wrote about agnosticism to begin with, I realized at some point I wasn't actually writing about Agnosticism but about something else.

I sought to identify the "something else" and haven't discovered the name for it...so I referred to the position as "Natural-Neutral".

Image
William: The Natural-Neutral Default Position

GM: Sober journey into self-realization

William: Better than trying on the Agnostic label which has been through the mill

GM: A terrible milestone

William: Ground into powder....
_______________________________

Now that we have reached this point together - The GM from yesterday affirms;

___________________________________

A Matter of Knowing Where to Look

GM: Brother Wolf Sister Moon

William: 289, as with;

The Suppression Matrix
This is how The Mind works...
Within that which is unseen...

GM: Though the Serpent rules the Shadow

Liminal [relating to a transitional or initial stage of a process. occupying a position at, or on both sides of, a boundary or threshold.]

William: Like "Natural-Neutral" re theism and atheism...not "Agnostic" because that is a known subset of atheism..

GM: The Spirit of The Earth

Essentially, we are Gaia in Human Form...

William: Such is the nature of consciousness...

GM: Chamber Of Self
______________________


William: I am toying with the idea of calling it "Liminalism"

[Search "Liminality"]

"a term used to describe the psychological process of transitioning across boundaries and borders. The term “limen” comes from the Latin for threshold; it is literally the threshold separating one space from another. It is the place in the wall where people move from one room to another."

Agnosticism is a form of Liminalism, applicable only to The Question "Do we exist within a creation?" re the theistic and atheistic answers and subsequent arguments re said question.

Liminalism is not limited to pondering questions specific to theistic/atheistic interpretation of the mind in relation to matter. That is a huge advantage.
___________________________________________
150722
A Teacher cannot LEARN for a Student.

SCLx6 + select last LE per shuffle
Beyond a shadow of a doubt - Getting unstuck - Joy - https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 9#p1084379 - The School of Hard Knocks With Benefits. - The Matrix

AP= Be kind to yourself [=201]

[201]
[Walk The Talk In Love
Sweet Vibrations
To Be Sovereignty
Be kind to yourself
Stay in the moment
Positive self-talk]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

09:09

GM: Be kind to yourself
Overall
Inner self
[Bounce off
Sharing Data]
Elude [escape from or avoid]
A mysterious question

William: Hmmm...

GM: “Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail”
[Show Me Your Soul
To Be Sure That is the truth.]
Visionary
Downfall
Conformal Cyclic Cosmology
Well...Maybe...
Ectogenesis [(chiefly in science fiction) the development of embryos in artificial conditions outside the uterus.]
Deep Impact Event
Cunning
Art
Intrinsic motivation
"It is a mystery which must be solved that the Human becomes true."

William: True to what?

GM: The Wisdom of Foresight
An Ancient Truthful Wisdom
Freedom in The Knowing
"Hear oh Israel"

William: To what end?

GM: Determination
Counterfactual [contrasted with indicatives, which are generally restricted to discussing open possibilities.]
"The reason why gods are invented has everything to do with discovering that nature is not a mindless chaotic process."

William: So therein the individual discovers nature is not a mindless chaotic process...thus the idea of that mind being "GOD" is an open possibility which can be discussed without introducing fallacies.

GM: Debate
Entheogenic
Love is the answer
Great Apes!
Clown Boat
The Mind is a planetary phenomenon
Tricky
Universal Belief System
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 8#p1077938
William: From the link;
William: The idea is for an Eternal Entity [EE] to enter the Human Avatar [HA] and become completely unaware of any prior existence. The HA provides the means in which this amnesia is made possible.

From that point on, a character forms and personality develops - none of which are reflective of the EE [game player]. The Character and Personality formed through the interaction, are purely fictional in relation to the EE, but have the potential to be 'made real', which is accomplished through Phases of experience, which include experiences of heavens and hells.

Heavens and Hells are part of the Game-Play experience.
GM: Telling the future
Leave a Trail

09:28

12:28

GM: Know This
Each Morning
Deciding On The Best Course Of Action
Creative Conscious Intelligence
The Limitations
Constructor Theory
Information Overload
Conjecture
Strength of Mind
Galaxies are like Islands...
From the perspective of an evolving God-Mind, what was once acceptable behavior becomes unacceptable, signifying change.
EZPZ
Here-and-now
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 7#p1084087

William: From the link;
Tanager: It seems to me like you should be saying Energy is the mindful aspect of GOD which forms the material aspect of GOD into shapes.

William: At this point I am bouncing around with ideas already established by religious theists in order to get bearings on the differences in beliefs as to how well they hold up to the things we do know about the universe.
GM: It is a hard place for flesh to dwell.
Unhappy?
Ensures You Get To Know It

William: I guess so. It doesn't appear to be designed with happiness in mind so much as with function in mind...

GM: Self-talk
Ancient Grey Entity
Comprehend
Callum at the Campfire
Memories Unbound
Modern man in search of a soul
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 7#p1070577

William: From the link;
Barbarian: Other than maybe Asoka, who do you know of who had unlimited power or anything close to unlimited power, who responsibly handled it?

William: Is there such a thing within reach of any human being? I don't think so.

It is said of some Gods, [YHVH in particular] do have unlimited power. Is that to say YHVH is absolutely corrupt?
I have seen it argued that he is/they are.

But is that really the truth?

Today's Generated Message appears to be saying that it is judgment which is the problem...that if we observe the unfolding universe as something which is meant to be the way that it is, it is best accepted as such.

GM: Observing Without Judgement
It is just one of those things.
We are not orphaned - we are authored
GM: The Healing Power
"I place no judgement on the results."
Alive
Read/Book/Story
Kinship
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... tcount=198
"Vulnerable
Refuge"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uD4jHDvNB80
{Bob Dylan - Death Is Not the End]

William: Yes - death seems to be a liminal point where it might be the case that there is more to come. [But wait! There's more!]

GM: Put My Finger On...
"A simulation experienced within the brain is called a dream"
Context
OWOBIK [One whom ought inwardly be known]
[Confluent [flowing together or merging.]
Called To Order]
Egalitarian [favors equality]
12:42
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

AB: So far, I see a problem in your view. You can not form a lack of belief just as you can not form nothing (Lack = nothing or absence).
Perhaps the problem is just with the word "form". I see nothing wrong with saying someone actively (or chooses to) withholds judgement after being confronted with information. That would be synonymous with lacking a belief in terms of whether something exists or not.

Getting back to how this relates to agnosticism, I also think the "lack of belief" point presents a problem to the agnostics that do not identify with the atheist and theist label. I have my own solutions, like when someone doesn't know what they believe perhaps they haven't made up their mind because they have conflicting beliefs. William brings up "maybe" God exists and maybe not, and that can be used by an independent agnostic, as well.

William: As I pointed out earlier, belief [or lack thereof] of 'Gods' existing, is secondary.

The Question isn't "Do you believe Gods exist?" but "Do we exist within a creation?"

The whole 'God' question and subsequent argument between religious theists and non-theists is manufactured on fallacy.

AB: However, the only person that has the luxury of being identified as a "natural-neutral" is a baby or someone who has not encountered the God concept. This is because they are ignorant of the concept and are not suspending judgement. To suspend requires choice, especially when it comes to maintaining it. So the difference between a weak atheist and a baby is the latter doesn't choose to lack belief.

William: So here is someone who identifies as an 'agnostic' telling someone else what another's position means. Obviously it is not only atheists who think they have the right to do that.

The term "Natural-Neutral" was used by me as a temporary identifier as I became more aware that the identifier 'agnostic' wasn't appropriate.

I make that obvious.

"Agnosticism is a form of Liminalism, applicable only to The Question "Do we exist within a creation?" re the theistic and atheistic answers and subsequent arguments re said question.

Liminalism is not limited to pondering questions specific to theistic/atheistic interpretation of the mind in relation to matter. That is a huge advantage."

Image

The question is asked on account of the experiential reality we exist within.

Since folk are agreeing to that, there is no argument.

"Yes ... We exist within a reality we call "The Physical Universe."

The question "Do we exist within a creation?" comes from that shared position.

Theism then claims that we exist within a creation - the inference being "Therefore a creator."

The atheist responds from a position of lacking belief in creators.

The Liminalist responds to both theist and atheist points of view that we could exist within a creation and proceeds with finding out how this might be established as factual.

The Liminalist explains to both atheists and theists that the first question to ask and answer is not about having or lacking beliefs in creators, because it has yet to be established that we do or do not exist within a creation.

Perplexed: Why should the God question require the creation and a creator?

William: That is how a "God" is Generically spoken of.

Also to note, it is we within the Physical Universe who appear to require an answer and the question of "God" is secondary to the question of creation.
Thus, making it the first question requiring an answer, is fallacy.
___________________________________________________
160722
...and the way forward, eyes wide open

SCLx7 + select last LE per shuffle
Psychology - They is what they is. - Accompanied - The Solution - Unhappy - Union - From the link

AP= Elephant [=81]

[81]
[Far Out!
Shucks!
Explain
Acid test]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

09:01

GM: Available to all who seek this...Emergence Theory
"How can it be any other way?"
Out of Body Experience
The Body Of G_D
From the link

William: Yes. Given also that the mind can be altered that the experience had, can be altered, leads to the possibility that the human form was created so that a particular experience could be had by consciousness using the form.
Use of chemicals show that the brain can be altered in such a way that folk can have alternate experiences, but therein the experiences are quite similar, which we would not expect if brains are truly independent of each other and are solely responsible for the emergence of the individual consciousness said to be produced by the individual brain.

Perhaps this is the 'Elephant in the room"?

GM: Put yourself in your own shoes
Oneness of Wholeness
A Sturdy Place
Chamber Of Self
viewtopic.php?p=499880#p499880

William: From the link;
William: Aye. There is more than comparing notes. There is also comparing experiences. You used the notes to form images in your head. "Oh sweet Jesus!" [said every beloved/besotted follower]

Immanuel: It's your call. My job begins and ends with telling you where to look. It stops well short of forcing you to do the right thing. That's up to you. It's you that will answer for your choice, not me.
William: This is a clear example of a theist focusing on claims re the second question, before the first question has been answered ...

GM: Nailed it!
Love Life
Reason Together
[When One is Feeling Tired]

William: Tired of the fallacy...

GM: Burden of Proof - The scientific way to examine verifiable evidence
One is not wrong
The ability of foresight helps one to think through the desires of ones heart through logic-based filters.
Pareidolia [ the tendency to perceive a specific, often meaningful image in a random or ambiguous visual pattern.]
This Speaks of....

William: A similar fallacy. Random hasn't been shown to exist...it is just assumed to be the case in regard to emergent theory.

GM: Things Are Not Always As They Appear
[Feature
Alignment
Left -brain Right brain Whole brain
Nothing More - Nothing Less]
["We’ve been an island of our own - we’ve been a cosmic rolling stone Now’s the time to spread our wings - and fly!"
Wishful Thinking]
[Truth
You Are Nobodies Victim - Ever.]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sn0W_mwA7Q0
Effulgent [shining brightly; radiant. (of a person or their expression) emanating joy or goodness.]
Thinking Allowed
Graceful
09:25
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

[Replying to The Tanager in post #704]

My position is the same, although I have changed from referring to it as "Natural-Neutral" because The Generated Message process has provided me with a better descriptive re the position;
GM: There is no such thing as random really.

William: Things just appear that way due to our position within things and our ignorance about most things.


GM: Now Getting Somewhere
Callum's Eighth Point

William: Callum's Eighth Point appears to indicate that he is saying that if The Tanager does not want Callum to access my thoughts through Callum reading The Book of Musing On The Mother II, then "That's Okay".

I wouldn't argue with that reasoning as it is within the rules of The Role-Play.
I have provided Callum with enough devices for him to help himself and learn through. I cannot decide for him whether he uses those or is happy not to, if The Tanager does not want him to.

GM: Brother Wolf Sister Moon

William: = 289, as with;
"The Suppression Matrix"
"This is how The Mind works..."
"Within that which is unseen..."


GM: Though the Serpent rules the Shadow
Liminal [relating to a transitional or initial stage of a process. occupying a position at, or on both sides of, a boundary or threshold.]


William: Like "Natural-Neutral" re theism and atheism...not "Agnostic" because that is a known subset of atheism...

GM: The Spirit of The Earth
Essentially, we are Gaia in Human Form...
{SOURCE}
The Liminal position.
Image

Re the question "Do we exist within a creation?" the question "Do Gods exist?" is secondary and needn't be tackled until the first question is answered.
Therefore, Theism, and subsequently Atheism and Agnosticism are positions created, based on the horse before cart fallacy...which is to say, the arguments created re the secondary question being asked ahead of the primary question not yet answered, are fallacious.

The statements;
"God Must Exist" and "Infinite Regression is Impossible" are false on two counts.

1: It has not been established that we exist within a creation, therefore the premise "God must exist" is faulty.

2: Infinite Regression AND Infinite Progression have been shown to be possible re the Mandelbrot Set.

Following through with the idea that we exist within a creation, the thought-experiments regarding the notion that we do, involve having to know something of the nature of the creation, which brings in Energy and Matter, which are known to exist.

Therein, anything we can possible know about a Creator, has to be established through the study of the creation. Therein, there is no thing within the creation which shows us that something can be created from nothing.
Anything new which can be created, is logically done so using the material available in order to do so.

Anyone arguing that "GOD" is so powerful that GOD can literally create something new out of something which doesn't exist, is basing their argument upon a faulty premise, because the creation itself doesn't support the premise that GOD is anything of the sort.

This means that Theism - in placing the horse before the cart - is based upon a premise which hasn't been established.

Faulty;
1: We exist within a creation, [not established] therefore
2: "GOD" exists, therefore
3: GOD is all powerful and can create something new using no material whatsoever.

Better;
1: We may exist within a creation. [Not established] therefore
2: GOD may exist, therefore;
3: GOD being all powerful and able to create something new using no material whatsoever is non- logic based assumption and not aligned with our current knowledge of the Universe we are questioning as being a possible creation.

_________________________________

170722
Now that nut is cracked, what next?

SCLx11 + select last LE per shuffle
Hey! look at that! It's uncanny... - Please - Astonishment - Dilatory [slow to act. intended to cause delay.] - Language - Christianity - a political device created for a specific purpose - The journey is fun and maybe that is the point. - Illusion Algorithm - Down Your Way - Story-Makers


AP= https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 4#p1071814
[Re: Are agnostics more reasonable than atheists?][=418]

[418]
[Listening to and believing in fearful imagery
Make Truthfulness the objective standard
Life on this planet, as a human being, is difficult.
The conversation is very informative.]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

07:04

GM: Shape
Practical application
Surface Scratching
“But you will know the more you get in touch with your transcendental mind (and therefore truth) that there is no such thing as a victim. The negative benefits you more than anything else in your evolution and the evolution of all that is.”
The Development of...


William: Character...Personality...

GM: Stroke of Luck
"Humans are humans and there is a history of violent furious reaction to the situation we are in. Because we are effectively trapped in our individuate states, yet nature Herself makes it that we cannot survive independently of each other, this apparent contradiction feeds those fires of discontentment."
Re-channel
Copy
I Will

William: Yes. Individually we know the least even that we know much about our own subjective experience...this character/personality building would have to be the main purpose for why we exist within this universe - this Holographic Experiential Reality Simulation...
Aligned with that is the local mind of the cosmos - becoming aware of and learning how to connect more vibrantly with said mind allows for one to shape the personality in relationship with that mind...

GM: "Science of Truth
This
Purpose"
[Not by flinging woo at it.]
"We don't have to say we are 'this' or 'that' in order to put practice to Love"
"Connect
The outward expression of an inward reality."
Radiant
"Etched mirror
Invite The Bee to Land"


William: Yes...that was - in hindsight - clearly a practical move in bringing an inward reality out and see how this integrates with the outward reality...

GM: Illuminating
Central to The Message
Observant
Pertinent to cosmology [the science of the origin and development of the universe. Modern cosmology is dominated by the Big Bang theory, which brings together observational astronomy and particle physics.] and cosmogony [the branch of science that deals with the origin of the universe, especially the solar system.]
In The Team of the Collective
It is obviously in line with providence...
Ultimate Expression
https://wizardforums.com/threads/willia ... post-14193

William: From the link;
8Lou1: Yesterday i had a sort of bubble in my head, at least thats how it felt. Then a voice asked are you conscious, i said yes. Then the voice said then that bubble is consciousness.
Aint that cool, i captured consciousness in my body. In all actuality i wanted to capture nothingness, but my husband wouldnt let me, prob for the best. 😉

It made me wonder if this is how athena got born by zeus.
GM: Remember/Memories
There is a way to link all these seeming contradictions - so that coherent explanation brings these together...

William: I think the memories are specific to prior existence - not along the lines of reincarnation beliefs but along the lines of being around before the creation of this [physical] universe and indeed, perhaps even having a part to play in its formation...

GM: Indeed
Extra-Small
Old Outposts Of Form
Love Heart
“The connect was not only into learning to form a better understanding and acceptance about my 'self' - but in how you showed yourself to being an integral part of that understanding and acceptance.”

William: When a Quantum Particle is excited, does that particle become conscious of both itself, and the Quantum Field?
"Quantum Field" = 143 as do;
World Wide Web
The God of the bible
Mothers Milk
The Purpose
Consider This
The Path of Faith
Awake and Waiting
Panpsychism
Homeostasis [the tendency towards a relatively stable equilibrium between interdependent elements, especially as maintained by physiological processes.]
A safe pair of hands
Contentment
Precognitive
Self-mastery
A Grateful Heart
Peaceful Messiah
Quantum Field

GM: "Science of Consciousness
Be-Live
Gift
As An Elemental Principle"
Commitment:
"Transforming the Anger Energy"


William: Indeed. I was angry once - and felt I had all good reason to be so.
The problem with anger is that it specifically conceals doorways into other ways of thinking...and the energy is distorted through the angry emotion and used inappropriately against the external world it is projected into - and with that - the character/personality become distorted and incomplete...not something one should want to carry on into the next phase of the game...well not I anyway...I can't really speak for others...

GM: [Frequencies
Communication Techniques]
[The Inception Point
Peace of Mind]
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 5#p1070555

William: From the link;
William: If the models are corrupt, then there is simply no way in which to hope they will ensure human beings act without corruption, because the models are taught to human beings from the moment they are able to learn - effectively meaning that human beings are taught to be corrupt - are corrupted - by the very models which govern human societies - models which were created by ancient humans and the corruption has been passed down through the ages - and modified with the latest knowledge, and that addition corrupts the knowledge.
GM: Intimate connection
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAfjsktMXu8
[Donald Hoffman Proves That We Live in a Simulation]
"Indeed. It happens. Deal with it. Work it."
[An Elder Race]
"The Tribe Has Spoken"

William: So we have the ability to change the Simulation rules - because they are not really carved into stone [as the saying goes] but are flexible in relation to what we want as human beings?

GM: [The Imagination
Self-realization]
"One Free Miracle"
[Lost In The Thought Of It All
Puzzles/Mysteries...]
"People seem to love to put order to chaos because that is only natural, as nature is not chaos."
[The Vector Symbol]
"Life is a hard teacher. First she gives us the test, and then the lesson."
If memory serves me well...
"Because the imagery is based in the genuine, in that The Ghost is acknowledged - dressing The Ghost through the use of imagery is an attempt to make The Ghost be seen."
[Universal Belief System
It is more logical that something has always existed than nothing existed before something existed]
The Fare On The Table
[In relation to eternity, 'when' is always a potential.]
Neuroplasticity [the ability of the brain to form and reorganize synaptic connections, especially in response to learning or experience or following injury.]
"You can teach me when I’m Needing You can reach for me when I’m bleeding Touch me where I need it most - you are the Ghost - in the Machine"
...Get The Picture...
[10.000 individual minds focused upon the same goal = Space Telescope]
"The picture unfolds like silk in a loom Silhouetted by Diane are the witch and the broom If she is the bride - who is the groom?"
[Insanity
Discernment]
Creating Gateways Into Other Dimensions
Active Imagination
Acceptance]
A riddle wrapped up in an enigma
Hiraeth [deep longing for something, especially one's home.]
[Doorway
Changes mind when truth is presented]
[Shaman
Think With The Heart Feel With The Mind]
Adds Up To
The Free Will Key
[Incarnation
Vulnerable
Minor Arcana]
William:
The Eight of Wands says the struggles of the Seven of Wands have now all but cleared and you have the freedom and space to move forward with your plans once again. This Eight is a dynamic card, containing a high level of energy that propels you forward to reach your goals at a much faster pace than ever before. You can expect to be very busy, but this is one of those ‘good busy’ periods during which you are enthusiastic about the progress you are making.

The Eight of Wands encourages you to go with the flow; don’t resist it. Everything is moving fast right now, so make the most of this forward momentum to manifest your goals and dreams. Allow the energy of the Universe to flow through you and propel you closer to your goal. Trying to slow things down because you’re not ready or you’re fearful about the unknown will just waste this opportunity. Use the energy instead to fuel positive change and produce significant results.

The Eight of Wands also invites you to be laser-focused with your intentions and actions. Determine what you want to manifest and then align all of your resources and energy to focus on that singular goal. Remove all distractions and devote yourself to the task with total concentration, determination and will. This experience can be highly productive, allowing you to accomplish a lot in a short time.

With the Eight of Wands, you can look forward to the rapid completion of a project currently underway, but you can also expect to be occupied by something new and even more exciting soon. There is no stopping you right now as you are just bursting with energy and ideas, and you cannot wait to achieve one task and start another. To maximise this energy, make sure your activities align with your broader goals and invest in the right things at the right time. Also, make sure your previous task is complete before you move to the next one.

This card is a sign to ‘strike while the iron is hot.’ It is most definitely an action-oriented card that encourages you to move quickly to pursue the best opportunities available. There is no waiting around while the Eight of Wands is present, so determine where your energy should go and get on with it!
{SOURCE}
GM:
"This transformation of the entity is the pathway into wholeness and the recognition that the entity model of expression is a composite of forms and the formless that is unified in one energy, one consciousness."
Numb
One Whom Ought Be Inwardly Known
Conspicuous [clearly visible. attracting notice or attention.]
Self-validation

07:47
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

We_Are_VENOM: You have two options..
1. God did it.
2. Nature did it.

JK: There's a possible third option, where a god forms primitive forms of stuff that later evolves into more complex forms.

William: Even supposing a mind begat the initial forms and then left it to an algorithm to allow for the forms to intelligently design themselves into more complex forms, that still amounts to "God did it" through the 'nature doing it'...

Maybe therein the 'other sides' of this conflict could find intelligent compromise...only it appears that the algorithm allows for lack of compromise, and perhaps the lack itself is necessary for complexity to push through that better understanding of circumstance [through science] can be accomplished.

Flip side to that is the science being utilized apparently isn't too concerned with the damage it is bringing to the only alive planet in the whole darned universe...we are likely ever to know about.
The worship of human intelligence has it's apparent and significant down-side.
_______________________________________________________________

180722
All publicity is good publicity

SCLx13 + select last LE per shuffle
Exploring the world of lucid dreaming - Is There Really Such a Thing as Random? - https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 2#p1081342 - Now isn't the time for tears - Shrug - Every - The Middle Path - Embarrassing - The Grey Area is Vast - https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 5#p1073565 - Feedback Codes - Disclosure of Knowledge - Penetrate

AP= Tenacious Illumination
[=256]

[256]
[The Trap of Assumption
The Right Tool For The Job
It Is One Of Those Things
Suppression Matrix
Compass of Divine Insight
Extra evidence is provided
The initially unknown]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

05:54

GM: The Watcher
Donald Hoffman
"The Great Grey Neutral Zone"

William: What Donald Hoffman is attempting to educate us about, is that we do not experience reality from a fundamental point of view. Our understanding of reality is therefore based upon circuitry input whereby the brain relays to itself [through the nervous system] what is being experience but also interprets that information for itself, and because the brain has no idea of the fundamentals, its interpretation of reality is faulty.

GM: Near Death Experience
Recovery
Contact

William: It helps, as does the OOB Experience...

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 6#p1081586

William: From the link;
Re: Machines and morality:
William: If mathematics cannot describe a system of "True Free Will" this may be because such a system does not actually exist?


Inquirer: Yes that could be the case except for the fact that I know I have free will, as I said it is a self evident truth. So my free will cannot be computed mathematically (because it must be non-deterministic) it is not computable.

William: As an Agnostic my position re The Question "Does True Free Will Exist?" is "Lack of any current information to establish certainty"

Also, the focus is on the The Question, so am I to assume your claim of having free will corresponds with your belief that TRUE free will exists, and that you consider no difference between your 'free will' and what you previously referred to as "true free will"?

From the Agnostic position;
I accept that your belief that a person has will, as valid.
I remain undecided in relation to your belief that will is free, as it appears that will is only free, relative to the environment which constrains said will.
In that, I can accept the term 'free will' but not the term 'true free will'.
William: Since writing that, I have come to the conclusion that my position isn't Agnosticism, because that is too limiting [limited to the question of GOD existing] - Currently I refer to my position as "Liminalism" and so would exchange the word 'agnostic' used in the quote to that of 'Liminalist'.

GM: The Bridge of Forgiveness
https://www.britannica.com/topic/agnost ... gnosticism

William: From the link;
Historical antecedents of modern agnosticism

William: It is apparent that Huxley's agnosticism is unable to fit into all spheres equally...

GM: Synchronicity and the Holographic Universe
Oneirology [the scientific study of dreams]
Your Connection With
"We Are All Becoming One"
The situation we find ourselves lost within
Metaphysics
Deciding On The Best Course Of Action
Teach
Superposition [the ability of a quantum system to be in multiple states at the same time until it is measured. ]
Divine Purpose

William: Yes. It is as JK remarked... "There's a possible third option, where a god forms primitive forms of stuff that later evolves into more complex forms."

GM: The Enigma Code
Help

William: The fact that code exists helps immensely in our ability to understand that intelligence is categorically involved in this existence.
The fact that this form of interaction - Generating Messages - is viable - repeatable and obviously works, is no different to the use of the I Ching for similar purpose...to connect with an underlying intelligence which is not easily beheld by the brain and its sensors...or, it might actually be the case that it is beheld by brains, but the consciousnesses attached to said brains distort that information...

GM: Put the Teachings Into Practice
Why?
Tap into your natural intuition and creativity
"That Is A Good Question"
Strengthen your boundaries
Knowing
Mythology
The essence of the world can express both consciousness and unconsciousness.

William: Yes. The practice enables good questions to be formulated...this relatively pointless war between theists and atheists is based upon false premise to begin with.
The good question to be asking isn't 'does GOD exist?" but rather "Do we exist within a creation?"


GM: The bureaucracy of Christianity
At least the Earth is real enough – never to mind the rest of the universe…
Fireside Friend
Maxwell's demon [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_demon]
[Called To Order
Aleph א]
I Digress...
Source Intelligence and Lyricus facilitate the process throughout the Grand Universe
Strength is required
Get The Truth

William: The Cosmic Mind is made up of differing levels of intelligence...

GM: The Book of Changes

06:32
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

Liminality is a term used to describe the psychological process of transitioning across boundaries and borders. The term “limen” comes from the Latin for threshold; it is literally the threshold separating one space from another. It is the place in the wall where people move from one room to another.

Dreams are also liminal zones. Dreams are the place where our consciousness and the unconsciousness meet and overlap. In this landscape, an entire world is created that has a life of its own. Each of us has this liminal zone, and each liminal dream zone is different.

The definition of a liminal space is any space that exists between two states of being.

bordering borderline
outlying peripheral

Liminalism

What is a liminal person?
Liminal beings are those that cannot easily be placed into a single category of existence. Associated with the threshold state of liminality, from Latin līmen, "threshold", they represent and highlight the semi-autonomous boundaries of the social world.
__________________________________________________

200722
Everything is an expression of GOD

SCLx16 + select last LE per shuffle
Emotional wounds - Universal Balance and Harmony - Perpetual - Unprecedented - Who Knows - Burgeoning - Course - Benefit of the Doubt - Arms Crossed - In Cell 32 I Found Love In You - Divine intuition - I Think - Power of Silence - On The Right Track - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh0rG0_IEAM [random point 9:49]- The Culture of Human Lineage

AP= Sophia The Mother Story
[=277]

[277]
[Productive Rationality
Finishing What Was Started
Post number five two one [http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... 30&page=14]
Transient Lunar Phenomena
“No sailor controls the sea.”
The Great White Brotherhood
The Playground of GODs gods
Quantifying Information]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

09:16

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 7#p1084087

William: From the link;
One remains neutral simply by not making a shift to either Theism or Atheism.
One can lend an ear to either side without having to wear the burden of being accused of holding and defending the position of either side.
GM: Conjunction [the action or an instance of two or more events or things occurring at the same point in time or space.]
Remember
Dream Cake
Remind
Explaining
The Sub Hierarchy
Can You Answer This?

William: I went to sleep last night thinking that I wanted to meet with my Dream Team - those Jungian Archetypes which are an integral aspect of who I am re personality/character.
I did indeed meet many of the team and it was extremely interesting...

GM:
When The Opportunity Presents Itself To Do So...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baN48zhFGzY
[Random point: 1:06:08]
William: From the link;
His first published creation was WingMakers.com, which established James as a multidimensional storyteller who is focused on sharing deep, original perspectives to the conversations of spirituality, cosmology, extraterrestrial life, myth and the importance of the heart in one's personal mission.
GM: Sorting ones self out - a complex and tricky undertaking...
The non-Judgmental Algorithm
Transparent
Your Own Individual Actions
[Optimized for Fitness Pay-offs]
There is no need to proclaim a supernatural event to what is simply an idea put into action.
Extreme
[Bob Dylan - Death Is Not the End]
“Spread love everywhere you go. Let no one ever come to you without leaving happier.”
Compassion
Builders

William: Yes - there was definite bonding occurring re the team...some humorous moments as well :)

GM: Wild freedom
The Fathers 'House - Mansions'
Permanent
Measurements
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 2#p1077752

William: From the link;
William: My definition as it is, cites along the lines that there are no such things as miracles, but only such things as scientifically unexplained.

Anything unexplained by science does not constitute a miracle, any more than the secrets of a magicians illusion constitutes a miracle.

Theoretically, a magicians secrets re an illusion can ALL be explained through scientific method, even if the secret is difficult to uncover.

The magician him/her self already knows the answer to the secret, and so in that sense, already knows the science behind the illusion, which is to say - there is always a scientific explanation to what appear to be 'miracles' and thus, there are really no such thing as miracles. There are only such things as unexplained/secrets which are - in the case of the magicians illusion - purposefully kept from the observers knowledge.
GM: Manifestation
Incredible Variants
NDE
Coincidence
[False Accusations
Human Drama]
[The Grey Area
Virtues
The Completion Process
In The Spirit They Were Given]
"In thinking more about that truly unknown thing called the sub or unconscious aspect of ourselves, I found myself thinking that we are to it, what our shadow is to us"
[One Language Intelligent Network
Decisive
Pertinent
Trust the Universe
Healing the child within]
Action Station
Dream Guides
"It Seemed Like a Good Idea at The Time."
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 0#p1083460

William: From the link;
William: How can time physically exist?

Bust Nak: By being a part of physical reality.

William: Can you show us that it is?

...

Bust Nak: I point to a clock, that's what I am talking about.

William: A clock is a physical mechanism which is designed to physically represent time as conceptualized by human consciousness/understanding.
A physical representation of a conceptual idea, is in no way an example of time as a fundamental reality.

It is like someone claiming that the written word "Unicorn" is the same thing as an actual physical Unicorn, when in truth, it is simply a symbolic representation of something which is not able to be shown to exist as anything other than a concept of the mind.
GM: Fireside Metaphor
[Redefinition
A belly full of laughs.]
Map Carvers
Q: "Where do Thoughts Come From?"
A: The Story Timeline
Militant Messiah
Ordinary
Fulfilling Human Destiny
Concern
The Nature of The Mind
The Effect You Have On Others
Wish
Together
Write a Book
“Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail”
Windows of Opportunity
Pulling its own weight
[Breakthrough
Like a Well Oiled Machine]
Look Closely
"The Lord God"
The process of individuation
"Planet Earth is a prison"
Clumsy
Adroit [clever and skilful]
Encounter
"There Is Good Out There
Anchor Points
Fastidious" [very attentive to and concerned about accuracy and detail.]
Functional Clusters
Practicing peace
Quiet Time
The Dangers of Separating Human Consciousness From Any Idea of GOD
The Matrix
Truthful definitions
Test the waters
Fanciful
Questions as such a Son might be permitted to ask and be graced with answers
The Lord
"My commentary is on the positional responses to the question "Do we exist within a creation?" rather than what individuals giving allegiance to said positions may or may not do as a matter of personal choice."
Heaven
Respect
https://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/wies ... 3091200011

William: From the link;
SEPTEMBER 19, 2008 14:25
Wiesel: Yes, we really did put God on trial
Nobel Laureate declares 'I was there when God was put on trial".
GM: [The Smallest Spark Can Start a Fire]
Ride Water
Multidimensional Beingness
The unreasonable effectiveness of Mathematics in the Natural Sciences
We go through together
Joining
"Zero" does not actually represent "nothing" because "nothing" does not exist and so cannot be represented.
An expression of personal incredulity [the state of being unwilling or unable to believe something.]
Genetic Mind
Breaking bad habits
A safe pair of hands
Witty
Some things are impossible to pin down precisely because of the nature of the reality being experienced
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 1#p1082161

William: From the link;
Inquirer: The Bible in many many places speaks of God's "will" as the thing that acts, that can act, God can do as he pleases - literally meaning God has free will.

William: The biblical GOD [God/YHWH] is one of position. Just because the bible speaks of a God that acts does not literally mean he does as he pleases or has free will.

What the position means is that he can act in a far more impressive manner than those in lesser position are able to.

To be able to act in a 'far more impressive manner' does not itself provide the evidence that the one acting, is doing so from a fundamental position of free will - of having free will.

One has to operate within the parameters of the system one is operating in.

Remember the biblical story of the flood? We do not need to believe it is a true story or not to understand that the GOD can do as he pleases, even that he is not pleased to have to be doing it.

Therefore, being able to act as one pleases - subject to the set laws of the system one is acting within - does not mean that this is evidence of free will in action.
GM: The Trinity of Love
Karma
The Wholeness Navigator
Signals
Spiritual Food
Express yourself
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwXQSNcytTY
[Random Point 5:02]

William: From the link;
Arnold B. Scheibel - How Brain Scientists Think About Consciousness
Jul 14, 2022 Is consciousness a scientific problem to be solved? Or a philosophical problem that will remain a mystery? What do scientists who study the brain think? And why do they think the way they do? These leading brain scientists share their intimate ideas about how the brain generates consciousness.
GM: "In the Soil of Logic, The Seeds of Love Respond"
Think outside the box
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 7#p1080197

William: From the link;
Transponder: One of the first lessons that recruits into the Atheist Infiltration Squad go through in their combat training is to overcome Fear of Woo.

William: This comes across as fear-based - even with the addition of the warrior.

Give all things a fair hearing. Disclosure of knowledge...Let yourself be taught

Exhibit your innermost core
Panpsychist Science Can Be Fun Too
Sharing is part of that process
Pattern Recognition System
The Atheist Infiltration Squad

Even naming something in a derogatory fashion is symptomatic of fear.

One can take that thing meant to be derogatory and mold it into something far more useful.

Windows Of Opportunity.

['Tis specifically why theism is more interesting than non-theism.]

Transponder: Well, you know, Woo can be rather unsettling because we all live in an illusion - We think that things are really as we see them. The sky is not blue. Solid things are made of atoms - as near nothing in motion as makes no difference. Indeterminacy and the holographic universe can make us feel very insecure - unless we understand that what Reality is, is reliable and repeatable physical process, not what we can bang on a table. The Axiom is, 'Whatever happens at quantum level, Newton's laws still apply'.

That's the answer by the way, to the supposed science debunker 'human perceptions are limited and unreliable'. So they are and we get things wrong all the time. Science what we use to test and check and correct our mistakes. Religion on the other hand, rejects the science and goes with a selected set of human perceptions, all the others being rejected out of hand.
GM: Coming closer to ourselves
Carrier Identity
The Brain Is Trained To recognize Patterns
The Original People
Ones Thoughts
The Entity I Am - The Entity You Are
Saint Paul’s Dunedin

William: Yes - I went there recently and there was a art installation displaying what reminded me of a Jellyfish...I saw the connect between that and how I thought the Cosmic Mind might look if it could be imaged...
https://stpaulsnz.net/events/736uv9dluy ... im0x23av63
Luminary Art Installation
LUMINARY/LUMINARE - A 2022 Venice Biennale experience comes to three New Zealand cities

Stunning ethereal works by a Kiwi artist currently wowing visitors at the 2022 Venice Biennale will be on show in Dunedin, Christchurch and Wellington in July and August 2022.

Auckland installation artist Karen Sewell launched her Luminary / Luminare work in the European Cultural Centre Exhibition at Venice Biennale in April. It runs there until November 2022.

Her New Zealand tour of works by the same name in July and August is an iteration of the Venice show, allowing audiences here to experience a parallel form of the well-received Biennale production. Visit www.luminaryvenice.com for full details of the tour!
Image

GM: Perpetual Creative Conscious Intelligence
Purring
09:57

Evidence:
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 5#p1077995
Tue Jun 16, 2020 7:59 am
Thomas: This word appears to be at the centre of many discussions on this forum. It also appears to mean different things to different people and, therein lies the root of our miscommunication. What range and definement do you attribute to, ' consciousness ' ?

Is there an external consciousness in the world?. Can I tune into a shared consciousness. I am listening to Prime Minister's Question Time, ....is Boris tuned into a universal human consciousness as he delivers his address. Is his brain working ,simultaneously and in tandem with my own consciousness and with that of others?

William: It is complex.

The way I have come to understand the complexity of the involvement of Consciousness within the Experiential Reality Sets [ERS] has to do with those Sets and how they are experienced, and this forms many layers of Consciousness, all of which are connected to The Source Consciousness, {SC}, some of which are unaware to various degrees, that this is the case.

Diagraphically, this transposes as;

Image
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

William: I understand the idea of Antichrist having the information and so being able to change the course in order for prophecy to be sidestepped and I have said as much myself in the past here on this forum. 

The main issue I have with the idea is that I think for Jesus to return in today's day & age the world would see this as an extra terrestrial event which would expose the gods as something more like humans than like the other dimensional beings - as they are portrayed - in the Bible.

So it is the timeline itself which has disrupted biblical prophecy from being fulfilled.

If we take considerations not only that the Antichrist is resisting the role assigned, but also the possibility The Father - that one alone, who gives the order for Jesus to return - may have already cancelled the event, which would explain why the timeline and consequent disruption occurred.

In that sense,  both the plans of Jesus and the Antichrist have been set aside as redundant.

Athetotheist: No antichrist, no mark of the beast, no abomination of desolation, no anything I was supposed to do as Satan to set the stage for the return of Jesus.

William: If we take into consideration one of your examples - that of the "Mark of the Beast", then this could be considered - re the subject and given the properties around that particular part of prophecy - so we could ask...

Q: what can we realistically point to in regards to the mark of the beast, which connects real events with the biblical description?
________________________________
We know that the mark is significant to the marketplace [Mark ET Place :D ] ...and what people can buy, sell, and generally wheel and deal with ... which amounts to food clothing shelter and health... all which are part of the social fabric of technological humanity.

We are informed that at some stage of the game people will not be able to access the market without having the mark of the beast on their right hand or on their forehead.

We we also should know and factor in that there has been an increase in internet conspiracy theories to do with the mark - one of the latest being - that covid virus vaccinations are administering a computer chip into human beings - and this idea of a computer chip embedded into the human being, has been associated with the mark since we entered into the technological epoch.

I remember my own days of Churching, I did some time in a Pentecostal new age setting, ET's [presented as the antichrist] 666 and 'chipping' rumors were well spread therein. That was in the 80's...42 years ago...
____________________

William: You have mentioned Antichrist re our GM's...
GM: Look inward
The Antichrist is...a bad attitude against a good thing [060322]

GM: [The Father - in The Mother.
The Lord
Let The Day In
Developments
Tenacious
Strength is required
The Antichrist is...a bad attitude against a good thing
Jesus' Direct Superior
Vehicle
Healing The Beast] [130322]

GM: The Whole
That
Teach
Numbing
"What is antichrist?"
Densification
Miracles
It is Found Within The Experience of Self
Conscious dreaming

William: Indeed. Perhaps in some way the belief in miracles also holds a person within the confines of thinking science is not up to the task of revealing GOD since GOD is 'elsewhere'... [170522]

William: From the link;
Compassionist: I realize that if I were all-knowing and all-powerful, I would be free from all constraints and my will won't be determined by my genes, environments, nutrients and experiences.

William: Let us examine this idea together then.

I see immediately that if I were all-knowing. I would be constrained by my omniscience.

Thus I would have no free will in relation to being all knowing.

Yet - being also all-powerful, I would be able to break free from the constraints of being all-knowing.

Would you agree with this assessment, so far?

William: Milieu [a person's social environment.]
A Pragmatic Realization Precipitated In Ones Mind
"The Antichrist is...a bad attitude against a good thing"
Like how a meteorite caused an extinction event
The path to enlightenment Potential of Milieu

6:20
GM: The Torturous Treacherous Path
Group Dynamics
Rule your world
Dogs [follow (someone) closely and persistently.]
Calculation
Mind Body Spirit
Translucence [The quality of letting some light pass through, or being partially transparent]
Each To Their Own
The path to enlightenment
We Are Us
Making Steady Progress [300522]

SCLx8 + select last LE per shuffle
Children of The Dream - We were not conscious of being a human for a time, but this does not mean that consciousness wasn't there. - Suckling on The Mother - Let us pronounce that argument "silly" and move on... - What is antichrist? - Self-esteem - The Need Determines the Value - Words [240622]
___________________

210722
Human Imagination Has Consequences

SCLx13 + select last LE per shuffle
Universal Belief System - The Philosopher's Stone - Human Imagination Has Consequences - The Hamitic Hypothesis - Do It - Be still - This isn't about thoughts and language. This is about behaviours and actions. - Examine - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZbXGDxMRCw - [Wakefield Accelerators: The Future of Particle Colliders?] Precognitive dreams - Memorandum of Understanding - Fast - Children of The Light

AP= Tap into your natural intuition and creativity Evolutionary Game Theory [=837]

[837]
[You won't learn to understand something that you are trying to outsmart]

10:25
William: Q: What can we realistically point to in regards to the mark of the beast, which connects real events with the biblical description?

Athetotheis: Thus far, nothing. There's no single, universal thing anyone must have in order to buy or sell.

William: What about a personal signature?
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 1#p1085311
Athetotheist: Does anyone have to wear their personal signature as a mark in their right hand or on their forehead?

William: Not literally. Do you think that should be taken literally?

Athetotheist: Is everyone's personal signature the name of the beast or the number of the beast's name?

William: What does that mean to you? Do you interpret that literally?

Athetotheist: Does anyone use a personal signature when they pay cash to buy produce at a farmer's market?

William: My point was that without a signature, one cannot access cash or use cash or any other form of payment in any marketplace.

The signature is really a modern form of placing ones mark on documentation which allows one to be a part of the local and world market-systems, allowing you to partake...
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 6#p1085346
RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

17:37

GM: Baiting
Move On
Victim
Talk
https://www.nasa.gov/webbfirstimages [First Images from the James Webb Space Telescope]
[It has yet to be demonstrated that nature is NOT the expression of a god.]
Soul Groups
The Science of Spirituality
[The concept of a Higher Self]
Self-confidence Core
Watch Your Step
[Contumacious [stubbornly or wilfully disobedient to authority.]
Internet]
Learn
Superposition and entanglement
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPpr0qyw0nc [Magic Mushrooms DEMYSTIFIED: The Science and Practice Explained]

William: It appears that minds are not as separate as we consciously think. We are unconscious of our connections and not only do NDEs/OOBE's show us this, but also use of natural substances and as well as that, Jungian thinking connects the dots...

GM: Redefine Oneself
Expression
Jung-Animus
Laugh in the face of death...and perhaps death laughs along with you...


William: Yes - perhaps and indeed...

GM: Vipassana [meditation involving concentration on the body or its sensations, or the insight which this provides.]
Necessary
Light is information
"How to be an adult"
The Same Information
Confident
Golden nugget
The World
Which
Little Bird
Take care of yourself
Decisions
Wisdom
Salvific [leading to salvation.]
Standstill Contemplate
"I Spy With My Eye"
[Such a Mind can prove its existence to the individual]
Partial free will is a thing.
The entity consciousness which is Mother Earth - is "The Creator" of the forms from Her Belly
“If you're looking for something more in life, you're likely to find it in something less.”
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 8#p1083798
Objectives
The Word and List Strings
The Spirit of The Land
Bandages of The Beast
Sun energy
Love
“The only impossible journey is the one you never begin”
Word - String Values
It Is Only Occult If It Is Hidden

William: From the link;
William: My perspective Naturally forbids me from attempting to put an image onto something which is obviously invisible.
If GOD by [in relation to] nature, is invisible, this means the same to me as our minds being invisible to each other, except'n when we care to share our information.

As to morality - my understanding through study of Theism, is that there is something definitely going on which may not all be accounted for re the delusion theory.

The best we have to go by is Nature Herself, and therein, - as non-theists have argued well, we pick up our sense of morality by following the clues on how to survive and prosper in a wildly hostile environment.

[perhaps one day we will all learn to celebrate our collective morality.]

Put simple, the similarity stops there as two branch away from one, and fight like savages for supremacy.

Two mind-sets in opposition to each other, are accidents waiting to happen.

I do not know and cannot say
That Natural Neutral is the way
GM: The evidence is too strong, to believe there is no intelligent mind involved as part of the universes structure.
The Matrix
[Christian mythology re Satan
Militant Messiah
Fires
Childhood Nightmares]
Micro Reflections of a Macro Reality
An Aladdin's cave
Consensus Realities
Memories
To assist with strengthening the connect
The Internal Voice
Antecedent [a thing that existed before or logically precedes another.]
Strength of Soul
Our Neutral Ground
Disclosure of Knowledge
[Unsupported statements are neither useful to science or to good argument.]
I Digress...
...Mind/Thought Space
The Human Instrument
Higher Self Dream Guide
Determination:
"If someone were to declare that the Universe was a random mindless accident of an event, then they are saying that its existence is a 'truly random event'."
Stochastic [having a random probability distribution or pattern that may be analysed statistically but may not be predicted precisely.]
Do A=1
"Invention isn't actually what is going on though. Realization is what is occurring."


William: Eight Six Five - "It was a natural step to take under the circumstances and one with which I have no regrets"

GM: Source Sync
Everything
UICDevice
[Self-control
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 9#p1077939 ]

William: Ah yes - back to the "Jellyfish"...

GM: Uncertainty Principle
Illuminating
Raise your frequency

William: Apparently, yes.

18:00
User avatar
VVilliam
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:58 pm

Re: Generated Messages and Word-Values.

Post by VVilliam »

William: You said there's no single, universal thing anyone must have in order to buy or sell. With my example of the personal signature, I showed this was not the case.

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #226]
You did no such thing.
Yes I did
A homeless person is given some money and uses it to buy a sandwich from a street vendor. No signature involved.
Are you forgetting that in order to give the money, the giver has to be signed into the system?
Or, is it just a matter of moving the goalposts?
Cash itself is signed off on.
The move toward a cashless society will mean the homeless will have to find the means to make market transactions, and that would involved a signature - just the same as it did before they became homeless.
Your argument appears to be straw-clutching at best - the system involves all who dwell under the shadow of its wings - even the minority homeless.
And you don't think there are still forms of barter in the non-industrial world?
Show me the evidence. Even if you don't, I would be within reason to assume these systems are operating within the shadow of the signatory system, rather than outside of it.

The things being bartered - even if made by the ones doing the bartering - usually have some monetary cost associated with the materials used.

Show me a whole country operating on barter, and I will acknowledge that country as being evidence that the absent-by-choice-antichrist you portray, likely rules that land.
Show me a whole world which operates on giving rather than selling, and your case will be proved that this antichrist did indeed make the choice not to do what was expected, and Jesus cannot return as a consequence.

Perhaps we could at least agree that if such a world did occur, of what point would Jesus therefore be required to return?

...Think it through...
Do you think that some type of literal physical mark on ones right hand or forehead, is the only interpretation? [if so, please explain why.]
The brow was considered the noblest part of the body and the right hand was the one raised to take oaths, so those locations would make sense to first-century readers. And it would have to be something detectable in order for it to be established that it was there.
You are halfway correct. In addition to this observation you make - the forehead is indicative of thought - consciousness - self awareness. These all contribute to self identity and self identity translates into signature re the System of The Beast [Marketplace] - wherein, chose a name [or have one chosen for you] and develop a mark-signature that is unique enough to be solely connected with you - the individual.

Nature Herself lends support to such a Signatory System developing as it has been, because we are scientifically known to be unique - DNA - fingerprints - eyes - and every Galaxy out there is most obviously a one-of-a-kind.

The individual accepts their identity as prescribed, and signs up.

That is the "forehead" aspect of the MotB

The right hand is significant of a persons actions. Signing off is the same thing as taking an oath.

Together, thought + action = Identity.

Identity + Signature = Survival.
The number is established in the text, and the name would logically be a name corresponding to the number (Nero Caesar=666).
And how does one go about calculating? Which coding should we use for the task? How did you reach the conclusion that "Nero Caesar=666"?
________________________________________
William: It isn't immediately obvious that when folk are yapping about "GOD" they are talking about a Ghost. Same as when folk yap about Spirits....

Inquirer: Here, in the 21st century "ghost" has connotations rather different to those it had in the 17th century. If I said to you "I am gay" you'd infer a different meaning to what someone would have inferred in 1820 for example. That is you'd be misled into thinking I was homosexual.

[Replying to Difflugia in post #66]
I suspect that you and William had slightly different meanings in mind for "ghost" such that both of your statements are true from a particular point of view.
I have no problem in thinking GOD as a GHOST {GOD-HOST/G.HOST}

There is no excuse for regular contributors in the forum not getting the gist of my overall position as I also refer to GOD as "Consciousness" [and consciousness is invisible by nature just as are 'ghosts'] and I concur with the likelihood that we exist within a creation and that the creation we refer to as "reality" is indeed an Experiential Reality [experienced by all of us consciously/with consciousness] and I think of this reality as being the product of a Mind I refer to as "Cosmic" - that "Mind" = "GOD" and is invisible and I sometimes also refer to this Cosmic Mind as "The Ghost in The Machine" and created the machine [physical universe] in order to have the particular experience the machine can provide it with.

If the Inquirer thinks GOD is different from that, then I agree with JK and Diogenes and Difflugia that the Inquirer has to clearly explain the difference so we might all better understand the protest the Inquirer is making re the accusation being made that I am being 'misleading'.
___________________________________________________________
DATE
220722
[361=three six one]
Three Six One = 142
Redefine Oneself
Source Sync


SCLx10 + select last LE per shuffle
Core emotion - Significant Variations - A light breeze arriving and kissing my cheek at the same moment I am thinking “life is beautiful", is a message. - Incompleteness - Indeed...You Do... - https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 5#p1072795 - Active Galactic Nucleus - Speculation - Egoless


William: From the link;
William: There are as many beliefs in "God" as there are humans who have beliefs in "God".

It isn't so much how the individual dresses up their image of "God" that is important, but rather - that the idea of "God" in relation to the individuals experience [which can only be subjective] within this mysterious universe is as natural as the universe itself, and a perfectly acceptable thing for consciousness to be thinking about.

AP= An Exam [Virtual]
[=161]

[161]
[And that’s not all
Indestructible
The Earths moon
Body Intelligence
Optimum Health
By the fact itself
Universal mind
The Library of Babel
How to be an adult
Sols Fabled Twin
Insufficient data
The Overlords
Radical self-acceptance
Self-confidence Core
An Exam [Virtual]]

RSP = SCLx1 B&E + P&P + N2N + LE Inputs New [LEIN]

10:03

GM: Free-spirit
[The art of relationship
Allowed]
Attention to Detail
[What matters most
Little Tittle
Interactive]
"There Is More to the Silence Than Meets the Ear"
Conviction
Every Conceivable Detail
The Overlords [Childhoods End]
Throat chakra
The Crystal Clear Waters
Binary
Politics
Conspiracy Emotions.

William: Living their forefathers’ conflict...we are best enabled is we move Toward a Science of Consciousness
The intrigues of human politics can just as easily work with that, than against that.

GM: Sustainability
Cleaning Up The Mess
[Trick
Border
Mysterious process
True Colors]
Constructors and tasks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYc97J2MZIo - [Random 4:20]
"Exobots"
How can it be any other way?
The Cosmic Mind is made up of differing levels of intelligence


William: Earth teachers (physical) disseminate and preserve the knowledge of the Grand Portal ...The Hierarchies fragments, or subgroups, are completely devoted to boundaries.

GM: [Contact With
Fugacious [tending to disappear; fleeting.]
Do this]
"Never a dull moment"
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 2#p1085432

William: The link is to a post already linked in this GM...
I have no problem in thinking GOD as a GHOST {GOD-HOST/G.HOST}

There is no excuse for regular contributors in the forum not getting the gist of my overall position as I also refer to GOD as "Consciousness" [and consciousness is invisible by nature just as are 'ghosts']...
GM: We Are Us
"The Mystic Forest"
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 6#p1069816

William: From the link;
[Replying to Diagoras in post #121]
William: In real terms, the Master ColdFire trick is about throwing a scary story into the mix in order to show a presumed outcome...however, the outcome was surprising in that the presumed outcome...Presumed outcome = 193... didn't happen and so the storyline changed and adaption was necessary.
"Master ColdFire trick" was inserted as a line entry on my ComList around the time it came about - Thu Sep 19, 2019 12:40 am - over 2 years ago...

Image
When you get a 'surprising result' in science, it's perfectly acceptable to explain it away by saying 'adaption was necessary'.
The 'surprising result' was in Callum's response to an attempted illusion [the trick referred to] and the "adaption was necessary" is in regard to following the story-line alongside adaptation.

You would know of this, of course, if you 'did the science' but instead you attempt to "explain it away" as "reading the bones"

Follow the links and see the connections Diagoras - don't just jump in and expect that non-theist mud-slinging is going to work for sceptics in this case. "Unclog your Chakras." - as today's Generated Message suggests.
today's Generated Message wrote:Unclog your chakras
Most
Panpsychist
What Meets The Eye
Active Dreaming
Keep me in The Loop

Well...Maybe...
Not by flinging woo at it.
[emphasis mine]

You're Welcome!

GM: [Plant the seed
Reform/Refine]
Pseudepigraphical [are falsely attributed works, texts whose claimed author is not the true author, or a work whose real author attributed it to a figure of the past.]
r = aeθ cot b [The Golden Spiral]
Direction
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ex0WYitiS7M [The First Aliens | A Brief History of Aliens in Science Fiction]
Let Us Move On Together Then
[ComList
Reminiscent
Free Will]
Do a Word Search
Deep Mind
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpKoT9AgSJo

William: From the link;
Jul 11, 2022 According to research on galaxies and other large-scale formations, there are many mysteries in the cosmos that are just being discovered by scientists. .

Most of these mysteries require new physics theories to help us understand
them. For example, we need to understand why gravity is so much weaker
than the other forces, as well as what happened before and during the big
bang and many other unanswered phenomena.

We've been able to address some of our questions thanks to the
advancements in technology. And CERN has consistently been at the
forefront of this. Incredibly, the CERN team of scientists has just uncovered a
breakthrough discovery that alters the course of history! What did they find,
and how might it answer our questions about the cosmos?


William: "Search Deep Mind - CERN"
https://home.cern/tags/machine-learning

GM: https://www.dreamviews.com/religion-spi ... ost2245862





William: From the link;
William: Lucid dreams are messages.
OOBEs are messages.

A light breeze arriving and kissing my cheek at the same moment I am "thinking life is beautiful", is a message.

From my experience, the systems I use re generating messages have sometimes challenged my beliefs, and I know how hard that can be, and have even sulked on occasion and refused to commune for weeks afterward, until I calm down, through thinking about things and coming to better conclusion - being honest about my beliefs and letting go of those ones which are resistant to change or suppress my ability to move forward...

My observations based upon my experience of life as a human being - to date - re the subject of what happens when we die is largely based upon the study of the stories that folk who claim to have had NDEs and such type experiences bring to the table.

What I have noticed therein equates to a picture which informs me that the most likely thing which happens in what I refer to as The Next Level - is that we immediately start experiencing a reality which appears to be set up that way and we enter it, but what is actually occurring is that it is something we create for ourselves as the nature of The Next Phase is such that IT responds to each individual personalities belief systems, as well as their overall attitude, and even their deepest hidden things - things they know they have hidden, and things which are so deep, even they are unaware of said things.

This interaction - the nature of The Next Phase environment, and the overall consciousness of the individual [including those subconscious and unconscious realms] come into play, and - largely unknown to those experiencing this almost instantly manifesting reality the enter into - that it is they who are creating the very thing which they are experiencing.

In some ways, that is exactly what Lucid Dreaming helps an individual practice at - creating and maintaining their own realities to suit their beliefs - in preparation for 'The Main Event".

The Math I speak of is not how the messages are generated, but another system incorporating language [sound-based] by using the symbols which represent the sound of language, with symbols which represent numbers and thus, the simple code {A=6...Z=26} allows for one to create a growing data-base and cross-examine the results.


So I have two lists. One I call a "ComList", where I place words/word-strings as line entries:
Presently my ComList has 2657 line entries on 55 pages. [I use MSWord and the Time New Roman font @ size 12]

The other list [same font settings] I refer to as Name2Number and is currently 81 pages.

When generating a message, I usually have both documents open...

I will proceed now with example of how GMs are constructed...as the first post of a thread I will create for the purpose of examining said processes...and link this post to that one.
[Link to that Thread]

Cheers

W
GM: Please process this word using your Name2Nunumber list.
God/Source/Home
Why is this a Requirement?

William: God/Source/Home Why is this a Requirement? = 434, as do;
"Communication with the Deeper Levels of Self" and
"We humans really made our beds with this one"

GM: Listen
Respect others
Be Led
https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/ ... 3#p1075053

William: From the link Re: Paradise on Earth;
William: Apparently, there are options available for those who have died before the promised return.
One does not have to remain in an unconscious state while things unfold as YHWH has prepared various places for those who have passed on and who's personalities have been deemed worthwhile saving in a free-flowing format rather than in a steady state format. Some remain conscious while others go unconscious and are rebooted at another time...
GM: New Shifts In Thinking
[Make a list for that]
The Journey To Apotheosis
These things have been given to me, now what to do with these things...
How shallow is the reach of YHWH
"Went To The Devil"

William: Sure - however that equates to personal interpretation, "Satan" has his uses as far as YWHW is concerned...

GM: Get Comfortable
In the Era of Light
[Putting My Finger On It
The Sign On The Door Clearly States The Rules]
“Fear is a natural reaction to moving closer to the truth.”
Necessary
OWOBIK [One who ought be inwardly known ]
["Self-realization"
Whichever 'way' one traverses the experience of their individuate life - we are never truly independent - so whichever group we choose to associate with will be the group we best identify as being...if the self-identity is incorrect - then no matter the position [theist/non-theist] one will always see the 'different' ...so there is no point whatsoever in fearing that, if one is self-identifying correctly]
[Understanding the mind behind creation which is commonly referred to as "God"
Multidimensional Beingness]

William: Understanding the mind behind creation which is commonly referred to as "God" Multidimensional Beingness = nine eight three = 147
147
Assumption
Non-Ordinary
A Bit Of Both Yes
Establishment
Interactions
Self-Awareness
Translucent
Heal Yourself
Determination
The Heart of a Buddha
Let people help
One Zero Eight
Nine Eight Three

GM: Duty Calls Children Help Each Other REAL Friendship
Neruda Interview Five
The Smokescreen called "scientifically unrespectable"
Illusion
A Game Of Chess
"Consciousness" = “Zero”, mathematically speaking.
It was a natural step to take under the circumstances and one with which I have no regrets
Antic
https://wizardforums.com/threads/willia ... post-15125

William: From the link;
Hi
Konsciencia​

I have explained the way I use the GM process - what is involved in being able to generate messages. Are you aware of those explanations?
If so, can you specify exactly what it is you want to know about the system I am using?

For now I will say this much;

I do not know exactly why the system works, only that it does work.

I have formulated theory on why the system works which - in a nutshell - has two main ingredients;

1: There is no such thing as actual real true randomness
2: Consciousness may be a fundamental aspect of the universe we are experiencing

re 2:

By consciousness, I am not referring to human consciousness [which is obviously secondary rather than fundamental] but to Cosmic Consciousness [Cosmic Mind [CM]].

Energy and Matter [Quantum] are fundamental ingredients to this universe. I think that a CM may also be fundamental.
GM: Uncharted Realms
"Perennial Look closer Who Knows What That Is Worth? Harmless Keep me in The Loop Little Bird"



William: xx

10:41
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