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The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:01 pm
The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

***The speed of light is 300,000 km per second. You will see miles. The point is irrelevant, as the argument says both are possible.

In a complete vacuum, with only light existing, the light effectively would be measured only against itself as all speed is an observation of relation. The problem is that as the "only thing" existing in the vacuum the light would exist ad-infinitum through itself and any measurement of speed would imply one portion of the light particle wave is faster than the other part, hence multiple speeds would occurs simultaneously.

The problem occurs, that movement implies a degree of vacuum already, and a perfect vacuum would not allow any movement what so ever because there would be no where to move.

Light, as one directional, would effectively have to invert to another direction if it is to progress anywhere. This is considering light must move somewhere in a void, but as it is a a void there is no where for it to move; hence it has to project past itself.

In projecting past itself, it must project in another direction. Light is now divided into 2 directions when beginning with the premise it starts as 1 projective direction.

A. These 2 directions of light, progressing from 1 direction, still maintains light as projecting in one direction through time and the process repeats.

B. Secondly moving from 1 to 2 directions necessitates light effectively halves itself prior to the first direction it exists through. Considering 1 direction exists, then 2 directions these two directions as now existing exist in and of themselves. Light effectively divides in half relative to a prior starting point, however double itself relative to its current state as two directions.

C. This process of light simultaneously dividing relative to a prior starting point, and multiplying relative to its current state, observes light as its own system of measurement. This continual "individuation" observes that as the light multiplies, relative to its original state it is a fractal approaching point zero.

D. The current foundation of light, as projecting in one direction, observes it as an infinite standard always manifesting itself through the individuation of light into further directions. Simultaneously, as this process of individuation occurs in time, light as projecting towards a point 0 is synonymous to 1 as manifesting a line of fractions as it approaches point 0. Each of these fractions, whether viewed as a number or linear particle of light, however is a whole number or multiple directions.

E. Light as ever fractating through time, is light simultaneously multiplying itself. Light sets its own standard of speed in a void, and any percieved "speed" is strictly one unit of light being composed of or composing further units of light.

300,000 mps observes light as the foundation for the second, in the void, as a series of oscillations relative to another fix point of light. Miles is strictly a length of space respectively considering the length of a mile, exists through the light projecting.

Hence in a void, light is a length. This length, a mile in this case, is a fraction of the original length of light (infinite) where this infinite length is divided into a series of units.

The seconds is effectively light revolving around a fix position, under a light only in a void interpretation. 1 second is the amount of time a point cycles from A to A again. These movements of A to A exist as a series of degrees. These degrees are the breakdown of one cycle of light into multiple parts.

So the "Mile" as "length" and the second as a cycle (which in turn exists as a length) observes miles per second as the number of lengths light multiplies itself within a given length. It is a ratio of one length to another, with light being the set standard.

To argue that light is 300,000 mps is to argue it exists as a ratio of 300,000 lengths to one length where both the mile and second are lengths.

Inversely, with the speed of light, as the only variable in the void. Each second is equivalent to 1/300,000 of a mile and the second is actually a length of space.

The problem occurs that as light being the standard projective length as 1 directional in the void, it is infinite and a regress occurs considering this 1 unit by continually individuating into further directions, exists through infinite units. In simpler terms light as projecting in one direction continually fractates into further lengths of light so that the original 1 direction of light is composed of infinite lengths of light, which all on there own terms exist through the same process.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:19 pm
Eodnhoj7 wrote: Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:01 pm ...
300,000 mps ...

To argue that light is 300,000 mps is to argue it exists as a ratio of 300,000 lengths to one length where both the mile and second are lengths.

...
You got it wrong again and in the same post where you got it right to boot. It's either 300,000 km/s or 186,000 mi/s.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:43 pm
Arising_uk wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:19 pm
Eodnhoj7 wrote: Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:01 pm ...
300,000 mps ...

To argue that light is 300,000 mps is to argue it exists as a ratio of 300,000 lengths to one length where both the mile and second are lengths.

...
You got it wrong again and in the same post where you got it right to boot. It's either 300,000 km/s or 186,000 mi/s.
Save it. The *** Marks show the correction and even with the correction the speed is irrelevant, that is what the whole post is about, the speed is wrong. It can be "x" for all I care, and the argument would still be the same.

In light of the beginning statement, your just proving you look for chicken shit details to pick.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:42 pm
Eodnhoj, I can't follow a word you say, and I have enough physics and mathematics to be pretty sure it's because you don't know what you are talking about.

In a complete vacuum, with only light existing, the light effectively would be measured only against itself as all speed is an observation of relation.

1. The vacuum of space is not absolute, but for measurement purposes is near enough, so that estimating the time it takes for light to travel across Earth's orbit (by taking multiple timings of the orbits of Jupiter's moons for example) provides a practical measurement of the speed of light in vacuum. Note the existence of Jupiter's moons and the Earth doesn't destroy the vacuum between them.

2. it is also possible to determine the speed of light in vacuum by determining the values of the electromagnetic constants ε0 and μ0 and using their relation to c.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_ ... easurement

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:03 am
Were the Universe an almost perfect vacuum with only a single photon within it the speed of light could not be measured
But this would not be a problem as there would be nothing else to observe it and so it would be completely undetectable
But given that a photon can not experience time the one in question would travel the Universe in precisely no time at all

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:21 pm
mickthinks wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:42 pm Eodnhoj, I can't follow a word you say, and I have enough physics and mathematics to be pretty sure it's because you don't know what you are talking about.

In a complete vacuum, with only light existing, the light effectively would be measured only against itself as all speed is an observation of relation.

1. The vacuum of space is not absolute, but for measurement purposes is near enough, so that estimating the time it takes for light to travel across Earth's orbit (by taking multiple timings of the orbits of Jupiter's moons for example) provides a practical measurement of the speed of light in vacuum. Note the existence of Jupiter's moons and the Earth doesn't destroy the vacuum between them.

2. it is also possible to determine the speed of light in vacuum by determining the values of the electromagnetic constants ε0 and μ0 and using their relation to c.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_ ... easurement
Most physicists agree on a subject if they agree upon the framework of testing. It is a democratic process of determining truth and subject to fallacy.

Science, as a framework, is as much a process of creating truth through testing as it is about finding it. Looking at the history of science observes its continual fracturing nature.

Measuring the speed of light, between planets is not void. Various forms of radiation, gravity, electromagnetism, as well as the nature of dark matter ( which noone agrees on what it is) aaffect it.

Light, in a void (absolute nothing), is instantaneous and self sustaining as only it exists. Any measurement of speed is a localization of one frequency of light relative to another where all possible speed exist.

1. If the vacuum is not absolute, then the speed of light is not absolute.

2. If electromagentism is used as the framework for determining the vacuum, and electromagnetism exists and forms the movement of light, then the speed of light is determined by using electromagentism as a framework, not void or vacuum.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:24 pm
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:03 am Were the Universe an almost perfect vacuum with only a single photon within it the speed of light could not be measured
But this would not be a problem as there would be nothing else to observe it and so it would be completely undetectable
But given that a photon can not experience time the one in question would travel the Universe in precisely no time at all
Is light only a photon though? This is considering the nature of the photon is measured relative to electrons, and protons, etc.

Self sustained light, in a vacuum, would be it's own measurement system manifesting infinite speeds while setting a foundation for consciousness as "self aware" through "self measuring".

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:40 am
Eodnhoj wrote:
Is light only a photon though ? This is considering the nature of the photon is measured relative to electrons and protons
Electrons and protons are particles within atoms and are entirely separate from photons which exist independently of them
There are however different frequencies existing across the electromagnetic spectrum ranging from ultra violet to infra red

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 3:46 am
surreptitious57 wrote: Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:40 am
Eodnhoj wrote:
Is light only a photon though ? This is considering the nature of the photon is measured relative to electrons and protons
Electrons and protons are particles within atoms and are entirely separate from photons which exist independently of them
There are however different frequencies existing across the electromagnetic spectrum ranging from ultra violet to infra red
Not necessarily considering all frameworks used to measure...well anything...not just light...contains protons and electrons.

You cannot separate a variable from another variable without applying that eliminated variable in some other way.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:05 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:01 pm The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

***The speed of light is 300,000 km per second. You will see miles. The point is irrelevant, as the argument says both are possible.

In a complete vacuum, with only light existing, the light effectively would be measured only against itself as all speed is an observation of relation. The problem is that as the "only thing" existing in the vacuum the light would exist ad-infinitum through itself and any measurement of speed would imply one portion of the light particle wave is faster than the other part, hence multiple speeds would occurs simultaneously.

The problem occurs, that movement implies a degree of vacuum already, and a perfect vacuum would not allow any movement what so ever because there would be no where to move.

Light, as one directional, would effectively have to invert to another direction if it is to progress anywhere. This is considering light must move somewhere in a void, but as it is a a void there is no where for it to move; hence it has to project past itself.

In projecting past itself, it must project in another direction. Light is now divided into 2 directions when beginning with the premise it starts as 1 projective direction.

A. These 2 directions of light, progressing from 1 direction, still maintains light as projecting in one direction through time and the process repeats.

B. Secondly moving from 1 to 2 directions necessitates light effectively halves itself prior to the first direction it exists through. Considering 1 direction exists, then 2 directions these two directions as now existing exist in and of themselves. Light effectively divides in half relative to a prior starting point, however double itself relative to its current state as two directions.

C. This process of light simultaneously dividing relative to a prior starting point, and multiplying relative to its current state, observes light as its own system of measurement. This continual "individuation" observes that as the light multiplies, relative to its original state it is a fractal approaching point zero.

D. The current foundation of light, as projecting in one direction, observes it as an infinite standard always manifesting itself through the individuation of light into further directions. Simultaneously, as this process of individuation occurs in time, light as projecting towards a point 0 is synonymous to 1 as manifesting a line of fractions as it approaches point 0. Each of these fractions, whether viewed as a number or linear particle of light, however is a whole number or multiple directions.

E. Light as ever fractating through time, is light simultaneously multiplying itself. Light sets its own standard of speed in a void, and any percieved "speed" is strictly one unit of light being composed of or composing further units of light.

300,000 mps observes light as the foundation for the second, in the void, as a series of oscillations relative to another fix point of light. Miles is strictly a length of space respectively considering the length of a mile, exists through the light projecting.

Hence in a void, light is a length. This length, a mile in this case, is a fraction of the original length of light (infinite) where this infinite length is divided into a series of units.

The seconds is effectively light revolving around a fix position, under a light only in a void interpretation. 1 second is the amount of time a point cycles from A to A again. These movements of A to A exist as a series of degrees. These degrees are the breakdown of one cycle of light into multiple parts.

So the "Mile" as "length" and the second as a cycle (which in turn exists as a length) observes miles per second as the number of lengths light multiplies itself within a given length. It is a ratio of one length to another, with light being the set standard.

To argue that light is 300,000 mps is to argue it exists as a ratio of 300,000 lengths to one length where both the mile and second are lengths.

Inversely, with the speed of light, as the only variable in the void. Each second is equivalent to 1/300,000 of a mile and the second is actually a length of space.

The problem occurs that as light being the standard projective length as 1 directional in the void, it is infinite and a regress occurs considering this 1 unit by continually individuating into further directions, exists through infinite units. In simpler terms light as projecting in one direction continually fractates into further lengths of light so that the original 1 direction of light is composed of infinite lengths of light, which all on there own terms exist through the same process.
nice word salad - welcome clarification of your point/s assuming you have one.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:07 am
mickthinks wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:42 pm Eodnhoj, I can't follow a word you say, and I have enough physics and mathematics to be pretty sure it's because you don't know what you are talking about.
me also, Eod likes word salads.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:12 am
mickthinks wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:42 pm Eodnhoj, I can't follow a word you say, and I have enough physics and mathematics to be pretty sure it's because you don't know what you are talking about.

In a complete vacuum, with only light existing, the light effectively would be measured only against itself as all speed is an observation of relation.

1. The vacuum of space is not absolute, but for measurement purposes is near enough, so that estimating the time it takes for light to travel across Earth's orbit (by taking multiple timings of the orbits of Jupiter's moons for example) provides a practical measurement of the speed of light in vacuum. Note the existence of Jupiter's moons and the Earth doesn't destroy the vacuum between them.
yep, no pure vacuum within the Big Bang Space - well i guess there is in the spherical realm (shell) bet the Space Expansion edge and the fastest proton............in our Universe, but affirm your point as apt in the real world.

mickthinks wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:42 pm 2. it is also possible to determine the speed of light in vacuum by determining the values of the electromagnetic constants ε0 and μ0 and using their relation to c.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_ ... easurement
I'll take your word on this one. beyond me.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:15 am
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:03 am Were the Universe an almost perfect vacuum with only a single photon within it the speed of light could not be measured
But this would not be a problem as there would be nothing else to observe it and so it would be completely undetectable
But given that a photon can not experience time the one in question would travel the Universe in precisely no time at all
??????????

all matter regardless of its speed (always lower than that of light) experience time.

light/radio/x-ray/etc............i.e. energy , travels light speed and experiences no time.

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:17 am
surreptitious57 wrote: Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:40 am
Eodnhoj wrote:
Is light only a photon though ? This is considering the nature of the photon is measured relative to electrons and protons
Electrons and protons are particles within atoms and are entirely separate from photons which exist independently of them
There are however different frequencies existing across the electromagnetic spectrum ranging from ultra violet to infra red
yep

Re: The Problem of Light and Speed in a Vacuum

Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:18 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: Thu Dec 27, 2018 3:46 am
surreptitious57 wrote: Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:40 am
Eodnhoj wrote:
Is light only a photon though ? This is considering the nature of the photon is measured relative to electrons and protons
Electrons and protons are particles within atoms and are entirely separate from photons which exist independently of them
There are however different frequencies existing across the electromagnetic spectrum ranging from ultra violet to infra red
Not necessarily considering all frameworks used to measure...well anything...not just light...contains protons and electrons.

You cannot separate a variable from another variable without applying that eliminated variable in some other way.
nonesence.