A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Is there a God? If so, what is She like?

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Age
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:10 am
Iwannaplato wrote: Mon Sep 26, 2022 5:55 am
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 7:16 am Morality is a myth.

Truth is a lie.

Existence is meaningless.

Embracing our beliefs is better than to be destroyed by them because we have no other choice than to be a living conscious species who is able to make up a belief structure.

In reality, No one knows any thing, no one ever chose to be born. No one can know how or why or what is conscious experience except what has been imagined in the form of belief, thought, images, words and symbols.

It's perfectly normal to believe whatever gets you through your life, because at the end of our life, it's lights out, it's goodnight sweetheart, as deep dreamless sleep takes us all like a thief in the night. So sleep tight, until we meet again, some sunny day. Because at the end of the day, nothing really matters. And really when you think about it, matter is all that matters, and is all that can be known. Matter matters, you matter, until you don't.
I see some beliefs and some lacks of beliefs. It seems like there is no diety in the beliefs here.
I don't see anything that constitutes a religion. Pretty much everything fits with physicalism/materialism, even a current scientific one. The only thing that hints at anything outside of current science is 'until we meet again'.
What's the religion here?
The religion here pertains to a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.
Of which "dontaskme", "lacewing", "harry baird", "immanuel can", among many "others" here in this forum provide GREAT EXAMPLES of 'devotion', by continually 'pursuing' their OWN 'interests' and what they BELIEVE is absolutely true here.
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:10 am In this particular case: the idea that there is an I who claims to know itself to be the creation of a supreme deity being known as God.

Which is all just a hypothetical imagined story within the human brain. None of which is real, except as belief.
Does ANY one CLAIM 'this' here?

If yes, then who, EXACTLY?
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:10 am No one has ever met itself. There is only self being itself always. Meeting oneself is a fictional claim to know yourself within the artificial dream of separation - where there is none.

The notion “until we meet again” is being inferred as a simple pointing to the dream state where there is an awareness of knowledge. Namely, the knowledge of I ..albeit illusory.
Age
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:01 am
Walker wrote: Sun Sep 25, 2022 11:00 pm

Here's why your thread title is wrong. Observation shows:

- What matters is the profound knowledge, that colors every moment, that life as you know it will totally change when you cannot ever take the next breath.
- That knowledge perspectivizes any doing to be done.
- That’s the important thing that folks do know all the time, sooner or later.

- Religions and their people also know enough to intentionally worship the greater, or the greatest.
- Religions don’t intentionally worship the lesser, although they may inadvertently end up doing so.
- This is simply human nature, obvious in all the folks who informally worship the lesser, even outside of a religion.
- For example, some folks worship the lesser in the form of vices, such as gambling.
- Worship is bhakti devotion in thought and deed.

This is why Ayn Rand was an atheist. She figured that nothing is greater as an object of worship than uncorrupted human as a principle, which she personified through characters.
I do not know what you are talking about Walker.

Religion: a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.
The only religion here that can be known is the interest in the I that knows.
LOL But 'you', "dontaskme", are living PROOF that there can be 'devoted interest' in OTHER things than the one you just CLAIMED here.
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:01 am The pursuit of I is a religion. The pursuit of an I who believes it has control over it's autonomy which then extends out to something else who is controlling the controller known as I .. in this case: A supreme Being known as God.

But there is no such thing...except as concept, which is illusory.
There is, SUPPOSEDLY, NO such 'thing' as 'what', EXACTLY?

1. A supreme Being known as God.

Or,

2. The pursuit of an I who believes it has control over it's autonomy which then extends out to something else who is controlling the controller known as I
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 10:01 am This all inclusive universe has no other requirement to be just as it is in every moment, and has absolutely no need for the belief in the existence of a supreme being known as God.

Belief is a mental construction, belief is an artifical superimposed add on to what is already everything, requiring nothing, and does not exist except as a mental concept in this conception. The Belief that there is a 'someone' called I who lives and dies, is just story, it's a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

The opposite is also true, which is a lie.

A pursuit of interest simply implies an object of my desire. In other words, to objectify a reality from what can never be objectified, or be made into an object. Except in this conception, which is obviously happening within the mind so as to make some constructive sense of this apparent sense of self...albeit illusory, since the self is just a mental construct, it's an idea that can never be seen physically as an object separate from the mind, rather, the self can only be known as an object conceptually. And because objects are not conscious, the whole idea of self is an illusion.

The 'Self' has never been seen, there is no physical sighting of a 'SELF' anywhere in reality.

The 'Self' is only known. By the only knowing there is which is consciousness.

And no thing knows what or how consciousness is, just that it IS..but not how or why or what it is.

All this make-belief ABOUT worshipping a God is the dream story believed to be real. But has no more substance or reality than a subroutine does in a computer, a computer that is synonymous with the human brain.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Immanuel Can »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 6:53 am
Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:03 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 7:16 am Truth is a lie.
So is what you just said a "truth" or a "lie"? :lol:
The claim there is a you speaking is a fictional idea.
Oh. So you missed the irony of that.

Okay.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Iwannaplato »

What does one do when someone else seems to be committing self-harm?
I don't think there's a rule. And it is not always easy, for me at least, to make a decision. People should be free, one voice in me says. Other voice want to help the suffering. And to be honest then there is a part of me that sees itself in the person committing self-harm, so that needs to be worked out separately.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Dontaskme »

Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 4:16 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 6:53 am
Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Sep 26, 2022 8:03 pm
So is what you just said a "truth" or a "lie"? :lol:
The claim there is a you speaking is a fictional idea.
Oh. So you missed the irony of that.

Okay.
How so?

What is the irony here, I fail to see what is ironic about truth is a lie.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by henry quirk »

What does one do when someone else seems to be committing self-harm?
Rescue kids, leave adults be.

There's more to it, of course: but that's the gist.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Immanuel Can »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:02 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 4:16 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 6:53 am
The claim there is a you speaking is a fictional idea.
Oh. So you missed the irony of that.

Okay.
How so?

What is the irony here, I fail to see what is ironic about truth is a lie.
If you claim that statement, "Truth is a lie" is itself a "truth," then you've just declared it a "lie." If it's not a "truth," then it wasn't true, and was a lie already.

So in other words, you've just told everybody: "I'm lying." :shock: Nothing more.

That's highly ironic.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Dontaskme »

Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:30 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:02 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 4:16 pm
Oh. So you missed the irony of that.

Okay.
How so?

What is the irony here, I fail to see what is ironic about truth is a lie.
If you claim that statement, "Truth is a lie" is itself a "truth," then you've just declared it a "lie." If it's not a "truth," then it wasn't true, and was a lie already.

So in other words, you've just told everybody: "I'm lying." :shock: Nothing more.

That's highly ironic.
Any truth claim is a lie simply because there is no truth except a fictional truth. There is no claimer except as concept in this conception which is inconceivable.

No thing is making a claim here. Or everything is making a claim and that would be an unknown knowledge.

Meaning knowledge only points to the illusory nature of reality. Only useful within the story.

So I’ve basically just had to repeat this to you.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Dontaskme »

What is being discussed here is the non-dual truth IC

The Teaching Is a Lie that Tells the Truth

The Truth that there is no Truth
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Dontaskme »

The whole God story is a fantasy. The believing brain has nothing to relate to but it’s own concocted imagination. The ability to conceptualise reality is an artificial superimposed imprint upon nothing.

And the brain takes this imprint as literally real, even as it is only illusory.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Dontaskme »

If you want to get into a Nonduality discussion with me IC then go ahead ask me many questions about it.

If it’s not for you, or you don’t believe reality is non dual then you are wasting your time talking to me.

My philosophy is of a nondual context.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Immanuel Can »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:44 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:30 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:02 pm

How so?

What is the irony here, I fail to see what is ironic about truth is a lie.
If you claim that statement, "Truth is a lie" is itself a "truth," then you've just declared it a "lie." If it's not a "truth," then it wasn't true, and was a lie already.

So in other words, you've just told everybody: "I'm lying." :shock: Nothing more.

That's highly ironic.
Any truth claim is a lie...
No, no... :lol:

Please, please, please don't try to "explain" why you're right. Just don't. It's too embarassing.

Just let it go. I shouldn't have pointed it out.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Dontaskme »

Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 8:18 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:44 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:30 pm
If you claim that statement, "Truth is a lie" is itself a "truth," then you've just declared it a "lie." If it's not a "truth," then it wasn't true, and was a lie already.

So in other words, you've just told everybody: "I'm lying." :shock: Nothing more.

That's highly ironic.
Any truth claim is a lie...
No, no... :lol:

Please, please, please don't try to "explain" why you're right. Just don't. It's too embarassing.

Just let it go. I shouldn't have pointed it out.
No one is claiming to be right.

But what can the mind do with nothing claiming to be right?

And is why you reject the idea that you could ever be wrong IC

It’s normal to think like that.
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Dontaskme »

If you want to have a nondual discussion with me; then you first must resist the temptation to resist the conversation IC
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Re: A religion need not be based on a belief in the existence of a supreme being.

Post by Immanuel Can »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 8:25 pm If you want to have a nondual discussion with me...
Nope. I don't. Not even a bit.
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