Imperefct God

Is there a God? If so, what is She like?

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Immanuel Can
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by Immanuel Can »

Belinda wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:52 pm There are those who claim man was installed by God to be permanently at the top of a power hierarchy i.e. to have dominion over all else except the angels.
You're one of them. You eat plants and animals. Moreover, you hold mankind to moral accountability: I thing which, if I'm not mistaken, you never do in regard to lower animals and trees.

Correct me, if I'm wrong.
This hubris will lead to the downfall of civilisation by way of environmental degradation.
You've forgotten: mankind isn't given the right to destroy. He's given stewardship. In other words, he answers to God for what he does with the environment.

And you think he does, too. For otherwise, you'd accuse some of the higher animals like foxes and monkeys of "hubris" for thinking they're above the lower animals and plants. But you know very well that they're neither self-aware nor morally capable.

So that's interesting: you know that mankind is uniquely morally capable and self-aware. And you hold them to higher standards. And you eat lower creatures. All of that shows your complaint isn't a bit warranted.

You don't even believe it yourself. :shock:
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by Immanuel Can »

Belinda wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:56 pm Jesus is historical: Christ is mythical.
God says otherwise. Jesus is both Lord and Christ, historically.

As Peter says, "Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christthis Jesus whom you crucified.” (Acts 2)
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Lacewing
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Re: Imperefct God

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Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:34 pm
Belinda wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:56 pm Jesus is historical: Christ is mythical.
God says otherwise.

As Peter says...]God has made Him both Lord [/color]and Christthis Jesus whom you crucified.”
God or Peter? God via Peter? Who claims that? All very questionable.

The Bible is full of ideas and beliefs from varying human speakers and interpreters.

You apparently choose to believe that all or some of these people were channeling the same god... rather than their interpretations/creations and beliefs of their era.

When you say "God says otherwise", you are claiming to be in a position of knowing such a thing that you cannot know (unless you are speaking only of your own god, which you do not acknowledge). You frequently base your arrogant claims on an archaic storybook that you pick and choose from to validate your own self-serving beliefs. It's all questionable.

Surely, from many people's perspective, you have no clue what 'God' says. You just fancy seeing yourself in that way.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by Immanuel Can »

Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:22 pm "God says otherwise", you are claiming to be in a position of knowing such a thing that you cannot know...
Why not? If there's a Supreme Being, why would you doubt He is capable of communicating, a thing ordinary people do every day? :shock:
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Lacewing
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Re: Imperefct God

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Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:28 pm
Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:22 pm "God says otherwise", you are claiming to be in a position of knowing such a thing that you cannot know...
Why not? If there's a Supreme Being, why would you doubt He is capable of communicating, a thing ordinary people do every day? :shock:
Because there are countless interpretations of 'God'... all rather self-serving. So, either such a god is incompetent at communicating clearly and consistently, or people are making up their own ideas about what this 'God' is saying, and how their belief must surely apply to everyone else. It's absurd.
uwot
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by uwot »

Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:34 pmGod says otherwise.

As Peter says...
Really Mr Can? Even that goes over your head?
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by Immanuel Can »

Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:28 pm
Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:22 pm "God says otherwise", you are claiming to be in a position of knowing such a thing that you cannot know...
Why not? If there's a Supreme Being, why would you doubt He is capable of communicating, a thing ordinary people do every day? :shock:
Because there are countless interpretations of 'God'... all rather self-serving.
Some are. And some are imaginary, as well.

But I doubt that either epithet applies to Christianity. It's actually quite demanding, and not the sort of thing human beings are inclined to have reason to want to invent.
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Greatest I am
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Re: Imperefct God

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Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:46 pm
Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:28 pm
Why not? If there's a Supreme Being, why would you doubt He is capable of communicating, a thing ordinary people do every day? :shock:
Because there are countless interpretations of 'God'... all rather self-serving.
Some are. And some are imaginary, as well.

But I doubt that either epithet applies to Christianity. It's actually quite demanding, and not the sort of thing human beings are inclined to have reason to want to invent.

Demanding???

You have to really low morals and demands for excellence to settle for a genocidal p**** of a god who favors discrimination without a just cause against women and gays.

That is why Christians never want to discuss the morals of the Yahweh Jesus genocidal combo.

Moral Cowards are everywhere.

Regards
DL
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Imperefct God

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Greatest I am wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 11:17 pm Regards
DL
I'm still wondering what you think "regards" means.
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Lacewing
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Re: Imperefct God

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Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:46 pm
Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 pm Because there are countless interpretations of 'God'... all rather self-serving.
Some are. And some are imaginary, as well.

But I doubt that either epithet applies to Christianity. It's actually quite demanding, and not the sort of thing human beings are inclined to have reason to want to invent.
So, you think Christianity is above and immune to human inclination and inventions? :lol:
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Dontaskme
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Re: Imperefct God

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Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:33 pm You've forgotten: mankind isn't given the right to destroy. He's given stewardship. In other words, he answers to God for what he does with the environment.
Why do you believe God gave humans the responsibilty of stewardship of an environment they did not even create? Remember, every one is born into an environment they personally did not ask for, nor did they have a desire or need to be here, nor did they create it with their own bare hands. Rather, everyone who is ever born has just randomly appeared here from out of the ethers. If your parents had never indulged in that random fleeting moment of intercourse resulting in a pregnancy that just happened to appear in the image of IC ... then you would never have existed at all, never ever ever.

So just who are you to know what the heck you are talking about. How does anyone who just randomly appears from nowhere, know what the heck they are talking about, it's very clear that anyone who says I am alive has no idea how they are alive, as no one has ever been alive before. And yet, as if by magic, they act as though they already know what they are talking about...yeah ok, bluffers. Bluff away to your hearts content, it's all just your meaningless story with about as much truth and reality to it, as the noise coming from barking dog.

Why didn't God just step up to the plate and govern his own creation, why expect a temporal pile of rotting flesh and bone to clean up the big bloody gory mess that nature dumped upon itself?

And then there's that ridculous claim that God the formless incarnated as and through Jesus the flesh, as his relation. So in essence, as the stupid story goes, the word ''relation'' can only mean the knowledge of opposites by association. ..meaning, if good exists, it's because bad exists, and that good can only be known in the absence of it's opposite which is bad. Flip the coin over, and know that bad can only be known because of the absence of it's opposite which is good.

So it's impossible for there to be a one sided knowledge....opposites have to exist in the exact same moment, and that all action is one unitary action and reaction in the moment. Absolutely is there ever a situation in life where it is both good and bad at the same time...in knowing, there is only known a reaction to every action... there is known only one or the other side of the story, not two sides of the story simultaneously...each side being possible because each side cause the other one to exist or not exist depending on which side is being known at the time of knowing by the only knowing there is which is you.

So God, in his incarnated relational manifestation state, at one with himself can NEVER be just one sided. Do you get that? Do you get that God is only ever answering to himself here as and through it's relationship with knowledge of which the concept man is that knowledge.

It's all a frigging story you've created.


God can only be another word for you.
Why don't you understand this simple fact?
.
Belinda
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by Belinda »

Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:28 pm
Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:22 pm "God says otherwise", you are claiming to be in a position of knowing such a thing that you cannot know...
Why not? If there's a Supreme Being, why would you doubt He is capable of communicating, a thing ordinary people do every day? :shock:
Because He has not used explicit English, or any modern vernacular. His poetic tropes are those of a culture that ceased to exist long ago. Sadly, even the parables of Jesus are aimed at a very rural society so it's hard for literalists to parse them.
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by Belinda »

Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:34 pm
Belinda wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:56 pm Jesus is historical: Christ is mythical.
God says otherwise. Jesus is both Lord and Christ, historically.

As Peter says, "Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christthis Jesus whom you crucified.” (Acts 2)
How do you know Peter knew the truth? How do you know Peter's speech was not polemical?
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Imperefct God

Post by Immanuel Can »

Lacewing wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:28 am
Immanuel Can wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:46 pm
Lacewing wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 pm Because there are countless interpretations of 'God'... all rather self-serving.
Some are. And some are imaginary, as well.

But I doubt that either epithet applies to Christianity. It's actually quite demanding, and not the sort of thing human beings are inclined to have reason to want to invent.
So, you think Christianity is above and immune to human inclination and inventions?
I think Christianity -- the kind Jesus Christ actually taught -- is not at all the kind of belief system that serves the venial inclinations of man. Mankind would invent a rather different version of "Christianity," such as one with clergy, wealth, opportunities for abuse and indulgence, and so on: in other words, exactly the kind of pseudo-Christianity the world is, in fact, at such pains to produce.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Imperefct God

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Belinda wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 am How do you know Peter knew the truth? How do you know Peter's speech was not polemical?
In the passage, Peter is resting his case on the Resurrection.

If God did, as Peter says, raise Christ from the dead, then that is the reason for his declaration. Not only that, but the people to whom he was speaking were in Jerusalem at the time of the Resurrection. So if he had been bluffing or mistaken, there would have been a vast number who could have easily refuted such an argument. They could have simply said, "Peter, you're talking nonsense; the grave of Jesus is right over there. Let's go have a look."

But they didn't. And Peter himself died for the truth of what he said. That would be unaccountable, unless both he and his listeners knew the credible evidence of the Resurrection.
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