Lacewing wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:00 pm
RCSaunders wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:23 pm
IC is definitely NOT a liar. He truly believes what he argues for and even those arguments that seem disingenuous are sincere, however mistaken, because he believes their validity.
I can see his commitment to his beliefs. Is deception in discussion different than lying? Is avoidance, redirection, and willful distortion truthful?
When someone calls these out, they are said to be hateful -- even though they are just describing what is being done. Is it
not hateful to do all of the above?
Well, let us say I am the lowest, lying skunk that ever crawled out of a hole. Let's go with that for a minute, Lace. Whatever you want.
What has that got to do with anything?
As RC has already pointed out, it's merely
ad hominem. The Devil himself would be forced to speak truth at least half the time, if only to fortify his deceptions. So too must I, even were I a skunk.
Let me be whatever you want me to be. Either way, it won't change the essential question. And the essential question is not, "Is IC a skunk," but rather "Is what IC has said about God true or false?" That's all that matters.
And what has IC said is true about God? That God exists. That He is righteous. That He is also love. That He is the source of salvation, and the hope of the World. That He is also the God of justice, and will set to right all that now seems wrong. That His Word is the Bible, and consummately, is Jesus Christ, the living Word of God. And that people only become what they were intended to be when they know God and are in living connection with Him.
And if IC's wrong, neither you nor I will ever know it, because death ends all. But if IC is telling the truth, you and I will both know it one day. What's more, I'm as committed as anyone can be that you have the right to live and die by what you think is the truth.
So, in point of fact, it's not me you have to like. It's the message.
And what will you do about that?