Religious Wars are born out of the BELIEF in Separation.

[Dontaskme]

Snoopy Dog,

You shouldn't encourage this girl, she's a bit of a nutter.

It's no coincidence that man's best friend cannot talk.

Imagine the battle for power and position.

And that's why animals are luckier than humans.

Whoof! Whoof!

[Dontaskme]

Just "religious wars"...lol?

Wars results from desire.

Desire from an unbalanced mind.

An unbalanced mind is disturbance.

Disturbance is a sense of seperation.

This seperation occurs by what is imprinted on us and how we reform these imprints and project them.

It is a loop.

War is a downward spiral to point 0, where everything rebalances again.

Enlightnement is an upward spiral past these base impressions, again to a point 0.

The problem is good and evil, the dichotomy. All evil is a lesser grade good, thus what we see as evil is fundamentally good seperated.

Having heros means there is seperation, as one must have villains. Noone wants villains.

Get rid of all the "good" causes and evil will diminish.

Get rid of all the clever schemes and plans to control the chaos and chaos will diminish.

Get rid of trying to make the world a better place, and the world will no longer be your enemy.


People tell you not to do what you want assuming we all want to smoke meth, kill old women, and have orgies. We where raised being told we are villians... and we just assume it.

Noone just assumes that the people who commit to these lifestyles (the above examples are extremes) are not happy.

Noone is content when on drugs, they do it to kill the pain.
Noone is content with murder and war, they do it to kill the pain.
Noone is content with sleeping with multiple people, they do it to kill the pain.

And why all the pain? Made up illusions about what the world should or should not be. We call these illusions Gods. And these gods? They are stories we mold our behaviors too, and further believe when these stories reciprocate some internal desire when we embody them.

Everyone desires to be the hero or the good guy.



We have too many good guys...that is the problem. It isn't the drug addicts or the murders or the prostitutes, the good guys created all of these.

Holy people create demons.

Very good /intelligent post. Thanks Eodnhoj7

Sorry I'd almost let this one slip, I nearly forgot about it...but yeah, excellent...well said.



I understand where you are coming from on a human level Eodnhoj7
The ones addicted to their vices are just looking for God in their weed or at the bottom of their bottles.

A lot of people are touch starved, nothing a good cuddle and a friendly voice wouldn't cure.

Awakening cures every ailment and mental disturbance, I really wish awakening upon all humanity. I think we have the capacity to be exceptionally great beings, if we only knew it and believed in ourselves more.



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[Immanuel Can]

The only WAR happening in REALITY is the MIND in which the 'sense of separation' is believed to be real.

This is really goofy.

As any Hindu can tell us, the only reason ANYTHING exists is because they have a "sense of separation." If they didn't, they'd collapse into an immense, unknowable singularity. Things only "exist" by being different from other things.

As for "religious" wars, why are you agitating about that? Religious wars, by secular academic count, are maximally 8% of the historical wars, and almost none in the last two centuries.

Up to the year 2000, Islam had created 4% of the wars in history...they might be a little higher now. The other 4% comprises all other religions combined...Buddhism, Sihkism, Shinto, Hinduism, Polytheism, Catholicism...and some religions have never created any wars. EVER.

So what is all this empty foment about "religious wars"? The number one cause of wars, historically, has been secular ideologies like Nazism and Communism...and their death tolls vastly outstrip everyone else's.

We should be worried instead about the revival of Neo-Marxism in the universities...now, THERE'S a verifiably homicidal creed...

[Dontaskme]

The only WAR happening in REALITY is the MIND in which the 'sense of separation' is believed to be real.

This is really goofy.

As any Hindu can tell us, the only reason ANYTHING exists is because they have a "sense of separation." If they didn't, they'd collapse into an immense, unknowable singularity. Things only "exist" by being different from other things.

You're just saying the obvious which is not really necessary, but maybe you are right to correct what you see missing. Yes, I forgot to include the opposite is also true. Without the 'sense of separation' there would be no duality. This is obviously obvious.
I might have to start using a disclaimer saying the opposite is also true.

The 'sense of separation' is only possible because of MIND. But even when the mind knows separation it can still be at peace even amid the war because of it's dual nature. So going back to my point, the only war going on is in the BELIEF that the separation is REAL...when obviously separation is just an illusory idea. So of course the illusion has to look and feel REAL. THAT'S the whole point of the trickless trick.
Mind being a two way mirror. In which the opposite is also true. Not really goofy, unless you care to be semantic about it.

As for "religious" wars, why are you agitating about that? Religious wars, by secular academic count, are maximally 8% of the historical wars, and almost none in the last two centuries.

Ok then forget religious wars. How about ALL wars...no matter what shape and form they come in?
All wars are born out of the BELIEF in Separation.

Up to the year 2000, Islam had created 4% of the wars in history...they might be a little higher now. The other 4% comprises all other religions combined...Buddhism, Sihkism, Shinto, Hinduism, Polytheism, Catholicism...and some religions have never created any wars. EVER.

Still even 4% is 4% of wars created by the belief in separation, even 4% is too many.

ALL WARS, are due to some form of religious belief. Religion can mean anything we are ritually passionate towards with 100% devotion and faith. It doesn't just have to mean one thing - religious belief can pertain to any human's conscience in regard to their ethics, practices and beliefs.

So what is all this empty foment about "religious wars"? The number one cause of wars, historically, has been secular ideologies like Nazism and Communism...and their death tolls vastly outstrip everyone else's.

Obviously.

We should be worried instead about the revival of Neo-Marxism in the universities...now, THERE'S a verifiably homicidal creed...

Just more religious dogma, doesn't matter what form it take on, it's all just the same ole human dogma believed to be real.

Also, I forgot to include, war doesn't have to involve physical weapons - it can also include 'words' like the word BIGOTRY.

People separate themselves from others when they accuse others of being BIGOTS.

That's another form of religious WAR that goes on in the MIND.

.

[surreptitious57]

The number one cause of wars historically has been secular ideologies like Nazism and Communism ... and their death tolls vastly outstrip everyone

The number one cause of all wars was the taking of that one did not have a right to and / or the defending of that one did have a right to
This is true regardless of whether the wars in question were secular or religious and so in that respect such distinctions have no relevance
Secular conficts might have claimed more lives but that does not make religious ones any more morally acceptable simply because of this

[surreptitious57]

The belief that one has the absolute moral right to the land of others is a religious one even if the invader is non religious
A belief that is held to be true to that extent is religious by definition because religion itself deals in such moral absolutes

[Dontaskme]

The belief that one has the absolute moral right to the land of others is a religious one even if the invader is non religious
A belief that is held to be true to that extent is religious by definition because religion itself deals in such moral absolutes

Very good point, thank-you surreptitious57

This entire earth belongs to all of us. It's degrading to think we have to use a passport to get into our own land.



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[surreptitious57]

Hitler may have been an atheist but his belief in creating a Third Reich was nothing less than religious conviction
Because his absolute belief that he had the moral right to govern Europe was fundamentally religious in principle

So one does not have to believe in God to be religious - one just has to believe in something with absolute single mindedness
Hitler in that respect was therefore no different to the religious rulers of the past who waged war in order to create empires

There is no difference in principle between a secular empire and a religious one because all empires are fundamentally the same
Some may be more benevolent than others but that is simply a qualitative difference as they all still share the same raison d etre

[surreptitious57]

Wars results from desire

Desire from an unbalanced mind

An unbalanced mind is disturbance

Disturbance is a sense of seperation

I would say disturbance is more a sense of interference but I accept the general principle of what you are saying here
Were we able to eliminate the wars within our own minds then there would be no religious or secular wars any where
Buddhism says that all of suffering is caused by craving or desire and so reducing that is the way to resolving all wars

[Age]

Wars results from desire

Desire from an unbalanced mind

An unbalanced mind is disturbance

Disturbance is a sense of seperation

I would say disturbance is more a sense of interference but I accept the general principle of what you are saying here
Were we able to eliminate the wars within our own minds then there would be no religious or secular wars any where
Buddhism says that all of suffering is caused by craving or desire and so reducing that is the way to resolving all wars

Other than life, itself, really what else would a person crave or desire?

Why are people not happy with just life, itself?

[surreptitious57]

Other than life itself really what else would a person crave or desire

What are people not happy with just life

I cannot truly answer that question because I am just one person
I however do not do happy but simply accept the life that I have

Happiness for me is not a state that can be maintained whereas contentment is
And I am therefore content rather than happy purely for reasons of practicality

[Age]

Other than life itself really what else would a person crave or desire

What are people not happy with just life

I cannot truly answer that question because I am just one person

But you could have answered the first question right?

I however do not do happy but simply accept the life that I have

Happiness for me is not a state that can be maintained whereas contentment is
And I am therefore content rather than happy purely for reasons of practicality

By the way that was meant to be 'why' and not 'what' in the second question.

[surreptitious57]

But you could have answered the first question

I would crave or desire not merely life itself but a quality of life as well
Life without quality would not for me be a life that I would want to live

[Immanuel Can]

Yes, I forgot to include the opposite is also true. Without the 'sense of separation' there would be no duality. This is obviously obvious.
I might have to start using a disclaimer saying the opposite is also true.

But this is the Hindu mistake. It's to see "existence" as a kind of curse, and liquidation into the great Oneness or Nirvana as a preferable alternative. It's the mistake that life is nothing but suffering, and the end of suffering (samsara) by way of extinction of the self is some kind of good thing.

It's not. It means you're gone. It means no more you. That's bad.

The 'sense of separation' is only possible because of MIND.

Then mind is a very good thing.

Ok then forget religious wars. How about ALL wars...no matter what shape and form they come in?
All wars are born out of the BELIEF in Separation.

EVERYTHING (as you said) is "born out of" separation. Good stuff as well as bad. So what's the point?

ALL WARS, are due to some form of religious belief.

Oh, come on...that's obviously untrue.

Wars have been fought much more often for territory, resources, race or tribe, booty, pride, secular ideology, water, women, reputation...unless you broaden the term 'religious' too include practically everything that exists and causes war. But if you do that, then the term 'religion' simply becomes so inclusive it fails to pick any particular feature out. It merges all explanations into a great, vacuous sameness. It explains nothing.

[Immanuel Can]

Secular conficts might have claimed more lives but that does not make religious ones any more morally acceptable simply because of this

Absolutely true.

But it does mean that the "religion causes wars" meme is nonsense. It is, at most, and extremely minor motivation for wars, except perhaps in the Islamic world -- for some explanation seems in order for the fact that that particular religion occasions as many wars as all other "religions" in the world combined. But that's all.