Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Is there a God? If so, what is She like?

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Greatest I am
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Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Greatest I am » Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am

Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Religions tout themselves as being the final word in moral issues, even though secular law has rejected as too barbaric most of those laws. Not that they were original to Christianity as many of the older traditions had variants of the same laws.

To me, a moral god would cure and never kill. That is the position Jesus took towards the non-believers.

Jesus said to love all people including your enemies and if Jesus is Yahweh then he too must love all and save all just as Jesus would.

Jesus would say that God killing instead of curing is evil.

Jesus would say that God curing instead of killing is good.

If god cures instead of killing then there is no hell as a good god or Jesus would have no use for purposeless torture and death.

Thoughts?

Regards
DL

gaffo
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by gaffo » Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:17 am

Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Proof of god is a moral question.
why so?

if God/s exist why must he/they be moral.

to me is see he/them as being 50/50

so no moral mandate on his/their perspective.

Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Thoughts?

Regards
DL
given.

gaffo
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by gaffo » Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:18 am

gaffo wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:17 am
Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Proof of god is a moral question.
why so?

if God/s exist why must he/they be moral.

to me i see he/them as being 50/50

so no moral mandate on his/their perspective.

Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Thoughts?

Regards
DL
given.

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HexHammer
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by HexHammer » Sun Jul 14, 2019 4:37 am

If god is the almighty god then there's 2 scenarios:

- either he is a jealous and vengeful god, that punish people with overwhelming force for minor offenses, even if they have good intend they are still punished, King Saul was punished overly harshly for not following god's bidding.

- if he isn't the supreme god and the devil have power too, to bring misery and mischief upon the world, then god is weak and our good behaviour seems inconsequential since too many are punished and lives in misery, why atheist countries seems to do better than the very religious ones.

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Harbal
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Harbal » Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:47 am

Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Proof of god is a moral question.
No it isn't. It's only when you start to talk about the nature of God that morality comes into it. Morality is a human construct and so is god, it is up to us whether we associate them.
Jesus said to love all people including your enemies and if Jesus is Yahweh then he too must love all and save all just as Jesus would.
That argument could only be sold to a Christian; what about everyone else?

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HexHammer
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by HexHammer » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:39 pm

Harbal wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:47 am
Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Proof of god is a moral question.
No it isn't. It's only when you start to talk about the nature of God that morality comes into it. Morality is a human construct and so is god, it is up to us whether we associate them.
WTF?!?!? ..for once I actually agree with Harbal!! ..FUCK ME!!!

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Harbal
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Harbal » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:43 pm

HexHammer wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:39 pm
..for once I actually agree with Harbal!! ..FUCK ME!!!
Thank you, Hex, but I think a handshake will suffice.

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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Greatest I am » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm

gaffo wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:17 am
Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Proof of god is a moral question.
why so?

if God/s exist why must he/they be moral.

to me is see he/them as being 50/50

so no moral mandate on his/their perspective.

Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Thoughts?

Regards
DL
given.
Hey buddy.

Man is a moral creature as clearly shown by science.

We are made in god's image, so they say, so god must be a moral entity if we believe that. Right?

Further, if immoral, we might be better off to idolize Sayan as she kills a lot fewer of us in scriptures.

Regards
DL

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HexHammer
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by HexHammer » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:56 pm

Greatest I am wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm
Man is a moral creature as clearly shown by science.

We are made in god's image, so they say, so god must be a moral entity if we believe that. Right?

Further, if immoral, we might be better off to idolize Sayan as she kills a lot fewer of us in scriptures.
Humans are both moral and immoral.

We are created in his image with all good and negative effects, even the 10 commandments states that god is jealous which implies that he can have hissy fits like jealous people have, just look around you, mass shootings, war, crime, corruption ec

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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Greatest I am » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:58 pm

HexHammer wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 4:37 am
If god is the almighty god then there's 2 scenarios:

- either he is a jealous and vengeful god, that punish people with overwhelming force for minor offenses, even if they have good intend they are still punished, King Saul was punished overly harshly for not following god's bidding.

- if he isn't the supreme god and the devil have power too, to bring misery and mischief upon the world, then god is weak and our good behaviour seems inconsequential since too many are punished and lives in misery, why atheist countries seems to do better than the very religious ones.
U C 20/20

Regards
DL

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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Greatest I am » Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:02 pm

Harbal wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:47 am
Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Proof of god is a moral question.
No it isn't. It's only when you start to talk about the nature of God that morality comes into it. Morality is a human construct and so is god, it is up to us whether we associate them.
Jesus said to love all people including your enemies and if Jesus is Yahweh then he too must love all and save all just as Jesus would.
That argument could only be sold to a Christian; what about everyone else?
Christiania's are who the question is mostly designed for. They do not usually think the way non-believers think and since arguments on god are pointless and go nowhere, I chose the moral shown for god to be the issue so that we might get to arguments that are not a dead end.

Regards
DL

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Greatest I am
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Greatest I am » Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:06 pm

HexHammer wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:56 pm
Greatest I am wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm
Man is a moral creature as clearly shown by science.

We are made in god's image, so they say, so god must be a moral entity if we believe that. Right?

Further, if immoral, we might be better off to idolize Sayan as she kills a lot fewer of us in scriptures.
Humans are both moral and immoral.

We are created in his image with all good and negative effects, even the 10 commandments states that god is jealous which implies that he can have hissy fits like jealous people have, just look around you, mass shootings, war, crime, corruption ec
We still have those around, but statistically, we are enjoying the best situation and lowest incidences of evil that we have ever enjoyed. This too has been shown by demographers.

This goodness, I hope, can maintain itself as refuge and immigration numbers grow as climate change forces huge migrations of people.

Regards
DL

gaffo
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by gaffo » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:25 pm

Greatest I am wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm
gaffo wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:17 am
Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Proof of god is a moral question.
why so?

if God/s exist why must he/they be moral.

to me is see he/them as being 50/50

so no moral mandate on his/their perspective.

Greatest I am wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:52 am
Thoughts?

Regards
DL
given.
Greatest I am wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm
Hey buddy.

hey back at ya.
Greatest I am wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm
Man is a moral creature as clearly shown by science.
agreed.

Greatest I am wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm
We are made in god's image, so they say, so god must be a moral entity if we believe that. Right?
um, no, i'm an atheist, so do not fixate on the nature of god - since i do not think he/she/they exist.

i make no claims on the nature of the gods - to me if they exist, they are as said prior 50/50 in their morality.

Man is moral because he is a product evolution, like all the other animals.

Man's morality is limited by his DNA nature. so maybe being moral is not the bigger picture? - i deny that is a bigger picture being an Athiest, but just positing here.

maybe the God have the larger picture - beyond "good" and "evil"....................I don't concern myself with the minds of the Gods, nor the concept that maybe there is something beyond my meager understanding of good and evil.

such understanding is beyond me - not saying its not worth my time/nor not worthy to understand - just that i litterally am an ant, and my nature is too limited to take on a the folly of trying to understand things beyond my nature.

and so, i do not concur with - since man i moral, the Gods that created him must be too.

maybe they are or maybe not.

not my concern, since it beyond my nature to understand.

Greatest I am wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:45 pm
Further, if immoral, we might be better off to idolize Sayan as she kills a lot fewer of us in scriptures.

Regards
DL
i now not of "Sayan", but of all the "gods", to me i think Satan is the most worthy to pray for.

so many "Christians" affirm the End of World (most even welcome it! - even when it means so many will be destroyed by Fire/end up on Hell forever/etc)..............any Christian worth his/her salt would pray for the Devil, so that he may repent and his maker and so prevent all the death of the one i refer to above (prevent The Apocalypse).

I'd be fine with Satan being "born again" and becoming saved! - for the sake of the future world!, but 99-percent of "Christians" never prayed for Satans to repent!!!!!!!! (in their mind thier God is too weak, the parchment on some papirus has more power than thier God - so Apocalypse MUST HAPPEN.............so way bother to pray for Satan to be Saved? .............so thier God is weak and they are ok with affirming thier God is too weak to allow Satan to repent/and assume Satan will never repent (they know the mind of Satan? ).

ok.....i can't type more, such self riechious christians know the mind of YHWH and his former servent Satan, the prior is too weak to prevent Armagaddon, and the latter will never repent, so no need to pray for the former to not happen and the latter to find his maker and repent of prior evil works.


thanks for reply BTW Snake.

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Greatest I am
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Re: Proof of god is a moral question. Do you see the morals shown for god as good or evil?

Post by Greatest I am » Wed Jul 17, 2019 2:37 pm

Not a problem buddy.

Regards
DL

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