Ask an atheist..?

Is there a God? If so, what is She like?

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Blaggard
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Ask an atheist..?

Post by Blaggard » Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:15 am

I know that sounds flippant, and possibly to some like a troll, but I have been a religious person and lost faith so implore you to ask an atheist what he knows. I am well versed in Christian practices and a few other religions too, so, feel free to discuss the ins and outs of religion. I feel by the nature of my post though I must defend atheism, so have at me. :)

I promise to keep it polite and to respect all religions regardless of how unsubstantial they are.

tbieter
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by tbieter » Sun Jan 18, 2015 3:23 pm

Blaggard wrote:I know that sounds flippant, and possibly to some like a troll, but I have been a religious person and lost faith so implore you to ask an atheist what he knows. I am well versed in Christian practices and a few other religions too, so, feel free to discuss the ins and outs of religion. I feel by the nature of my post though I must defend atheism, so have at me. :)

I promise to keep it polite and to respect all religions regardless of how unsubstantial they are.
An atheist is one who believes that no deity [God] exists in reality.

That said, what I don't understand is the atheist's continuing interest, more or less, in religion.

I do not believe in astrology; hence, I have absolutely no interest in the subject.

Why is the atheist still interested in religion? And how can he justify such continuing interest in view of his negative doctrinal belief?

artisticsolution
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by artisticsolution » Sun Jan 18, 2015 3:56 pm

tbieter wrote:
That said, what I don't understand is the atheist's continuing interest, more or less, in religion.

I do not believe in astrology; hence, I have absolutely no interest in the subject.

Why is the atheist still interested in religion? And how can he justify such continuing interest in view of his negative doctrinal belief?
I think I can answer that, even though I am not an atheist. I think it is because, unlike astrology, most theists are trying to convert you, pray for you, and basically have a general attitude that you are to be distrusted until you convert. Some theists can be overbearing at best and downright dangerous at worst.

Plus, there is a disrespect there on both sides. Sometimes I think that the theist disrespects the atheist on purpose in an antagonistic way by fighting so hard for things that they could otherwise be kind about.

Do you remember Tom when we had the discussion on manners? Well, it's sort of like that..for example...the relatively recent bombardment by Fox news to push/force the 10 commandments to be recited in schools and other public places. Not to mention their fight over merry Christmas vs. happy holidays. I think the polite thing is to just wish people you don't know, happy holidays. It's ambiguous. Because now, since the Christian "fight" in Jesus's name, saying "Merry Christmas" to someone you don't know. is more like an act of aggression. It is like the theist is wanting and provoking a fight in honor of jesus or something.

Seriously, you have to admit, the kind words, 'Merry Christmas" aren't so kindly spoken on Fox News. Instead, those words are said in a belligerent and aggressive/provoke a fight....sort of like "I dare you to say something".

Really? Is that what Christmas is all about?

I think it's more important to mind our manners and be respectful of others instead of use words of holiness and peace in order to get someone's goat.

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Bill Wiltrack
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Sun Jan 18, 2015 7:28 pm

.


Excellent post.






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Image





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Blaggard
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Blaggard » Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:17 am

I think articsolution did very well there. There's more to anything though but as said atheists in general don't give a shit about religion, they do only when it becomes something that is forced on you, like you need it to live your life when there is only one way of life, it being your own.

I think tbh I can quite happily be converted by any one to any religion. And that is the point, they are all much of a muchness and always have been. There are a thousand gods but only one religion, if that is the case why are there more than a thousand religions? Is any god that bad at convincing anyone, and yet still perfect too? I somehow doubt religion is any more than man vacillating and genuflecting on the unknowable.

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Lev Muishkin
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Lev Muishkin » Mon Jan 19, 2015 1:29 pm

tbieter wrote:
Blaggard wrote:I know that sounds flippant, and possibly to some like a troll, but I have been a religious person and lost faith so implore you to ask an atheist what he knows. I am well versed in Christian practices and a few other religions too, so, feel free to discuss the ins and outs of religion. I feel by the nature of my post though I must defend atheism, so have at me. :)

I promise to keep it polite and to respect all religions regardless of how unsubstantial they are.
An atheist is one who believes that no deity [God] exists in reality.

That said, what I don't understand is the atheist's continuing interest, more or less, in religion.

I do not believe in astrology; hence, I have absolutely no interest in the subject.

Why is the atheist still interested in religion? And how can he justify such continuing interest in view of his negative doctrinal belief?
Last time I looked, there were no astrologers trying to plot the downfall of free-thinking in the world.

There are several reasons.
Historically religion has been a powerful mover in political situations. Even in completely secular societies religious views colour and can determine the sort of laws that are made, rules that are imposed and restrictions that govern us. This still happens today.
Atheists suffer from prejudice and can be overlooked for jobs. I have experienced this myself.
Atheists face the death penalty in over 30 countries world-wide.
As a person is only an atheist whilst there persists a belief in God; whilst Theists exist. There will always be a tension of truth between the two.
As nearly everyone is interested in truth. Religion and the beliefs it propagates fly against truth in the eyes of people who refuse to believe without basis.

It might have escaped your attention, but there is a massive war of religion going on. Atheists are the scape goat for both sides. Knowing about religion is a safeguard for atheists; know those who would make you an enemy.

As an atheist I do not have a 'doctrinal negative belief". If I had then you would be answering your own question: beliefs require continual interest. As an atheist I seek to believe nothing. I seek only to know.

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attofishpi
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by attofishpi » Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:37 am

Lev Muishkin wrote:As an atheist I seek to believe nothing. I seek only to know.
Then eventually you may stumble upon 'its' existence.

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Lev Muishkin
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Lev Muishkin » Tue Jan 20, 2015 8:30 pm

attofishpi wrote:
Lev Muishkin wrote:As an atheist I seek to believe nothing. I seek only to know.
Then eventually you may stumble upon 'its' existence.
No, only you can stumble over your own delusion. You can't expect others to believe in it.

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attofishpi
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by attofishpi » Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:53 pm

Lev Muishkin wrote:
attofishpi wrote:
Lev Muishkin wrote:As an atheist I seek to believe nothing. I seek only to know.
Then eventually you may stumble upon 'its' existence.
No, only you can stumble over your own delusion. You can't expect others to believe in it.
Ah, yes the favourite word of the atheist towards the theist, deluded. You say you seek to know and i'm sure in this quest you will do everything to avoid a critical analysis of the potential existence of God.
It exists, ergo you are deluded in your quest.

Blaggard
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Blaggard » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:27 am

attofishpi wrote: Ah, yes the favourite word of the atheist towards the theist, deluded. You say you seek to know and i'm sure in this quest you will do everything to avoid a critical analysis of the potential existence of God.
It exists, ergo you are deluded in your quest.
Deluded is a harsh word, I wouldn't say that, I would however refer the honourable gentleman to the argument I gave some moments ago. ie you are always making apologies for the inconsistencies of any religion, not just one God. If one of the thousands are true it should shine. Or to put it bluntly: that God or gods is/are really bad at his/her or them's message.

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Lev Muishkin
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Lev Muishkin » Wed Jan 21, 2015 6:08 pm

attofishpi wrote:
Lev Muishkin wrote:
attofishpi wrote: Then eventually you may stumble upon 'its' existence.
No, only you can stumble over your own delusion. You can't expect others to believe in it.
Ah, yes the favourite word of the atheist towards the theist, deluded. You say you seek to know and i'm sure in this quest you will do everything to avoid a critical analysis of the potential existence of God.
It exists, ergo you are deluded in your quest.
Show me the 'critical analysis of the potential existence of God"!
I've not seen much here, but you do not have any reason to assert I am going to ignore what is not even present.
So no analysis, no evidence, no warrant to say "It exists".

What is "it" anyway?

Melchior
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Melchior » Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:43 pm

Blaggard wrote:I know that sounds flippant, and possibly to some like a troll, but I have been a religious person and lost faith so implore you to ask an atheist what he knows. I am well versed in Christian practices and a few other religions too, so, feel free to discuss the ins and outs of religion. I feel by the nature of my post though I must defend atheism, so have at me. :)

I promise to keep it polite and to respect all religions regardless of how unsubstantial they are.
I am an atheist now; I was raised as a Roman Catholic. It's not sad. It's not like having a love affair end or anything like that. You just realize the whole religion thing is stupid beyond belief, and you find other things to do with your time. I don't have much interest in talking to other atheists because they are atheists. I do avoid strongly religious persons if I can, because they are so impenetrably stupid I can't deal with it.

Blaggard
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Blaggard » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:36 pm

Where are you from Melchior? US or Awstraylia, 'cause some people are very mad in those countries. :)

Blaggard
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Blaggard » Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:39 pm

And incidentally if I might say the political implication has been underplayed, most wars are about the self interest of a country and always have been. There are no good wars in any religion, except those against evil, a lot of religions from Buddhism to Druidism to Christianity et al including Shaminism et al: ascribe to the good life, but aside from Buddhism they are not hypocritical enough to expect anyone to live it by going to church...

The biggest killer in Europe for example was politics not religion, that's just the icing on a dumb cake of self involvement and nationalist pride. Think on, religion gets blamed for anything, but even Islam is really about land acquisition both in advance and retreat.

"God on our side"

on every good soldiers belt, even in Germany, and that megalomaniac wanted it scraped after world supremacy, and he was a "Catholic", we all know how useful icing is, even if it is cosmetic.

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Lev Muishkin
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Re: Ask an atheist..?

Post by Lev Muishkin » Thu Jan 22, 2015 12:12 am

Melchior wrote:
Blaggard wrote:I know that sounds flippant, and possibly to some like a troll, but I have been a religious person and lost faith so implore you to ask an atheist what he knows. I am well versed in Christian practices and a few other religions too, so, feel free to discuss the ins and outs of religion. I feel by the nature of my post though I must defend atheism, so have at me. :)

I promise to keep it polite and to respect all religions regardless of how unsubstantial they are.
I am an atheist now; I was raised as a Roman Catholic. It's not sad. It's not like having a love affair end or anything like that. You just realize the whole religion thing is stupid beyond belief, and you find other things to do with your time. I don't have much interest in talking to other atheists because they are atheists. I do avoid strongly religious persons if I can, because they are so impenetrably stupid I can't deal with it.
I know exactly where you are coming from.

It's more like finding the way out of a small room. Some people are scared to open that door, fearing there is no Jesus behind it, just the wide open spaces of possibility, leaving behind a lot of rules. The religious are cognitively agoraphobic in this sense, and cling to the same worn out phrases and dogma the has sustained them and their co-followers for millennia. They find the rules and restrictions comforting, like a baby in swaddling cloth mimicking the womb.

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