For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
- BigQuestioner
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For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
The stated subject of this topic is a section header in my recently published book A Natural Afterlife Discovered: The Newfound, Psychological Reality That Awaits Us at Death. The book explains and thoroughly discusses the Theory of a Natural Eternal Consciousness (NEC), establishing it as a scientific theory. The theory states that our consciousness is not extinguished at death but (by default) is eternally, imperceptibly paused. More precisely, it becomes imperceptibly timeless and deceptively eternal to the dying person—i.e., an illusion of immortality. To the living person, while it’s timeless, it’s not eternal as the brain—and with it, all material consciousness—indeed dies. Significantly, the NEC makes possible a natural afterlife, which can be a heaven of utmost happiness. (The theory is also explained in two articles published in the Journal of Mind and Behavior, which can found by a doing internet search on its name.)
Pages 78 to 84 of book discusses "how the NEC theory relates to what philosophy currently teaches about death, immortality, and the afterlife." It does so by reviewing, in light of the theory, an actual philosophy class lecture on these topics. The review claims that in the age-old debate between the materialist, dualist, and holistic views of death, the dualist view has won out; however, those holding that view likely never envisioned that the soul’s immortality, thought very real to the dying person, is illusionary. If you understand the NEC theory and the different philosophical views of mortality, what do you think?
Pages 78 to 84 of book discusses "how the NEC theory relates to what philosophy currently teaches about death, immortality, and the afterlife." It does so by reviewing, in light of the theory, an actual philosophy class lecture on these topics. The review claims that in the age-old debate between the materialist, dualist, and holistic views of death, the dualist view has won out; however, those holding that view likely never envisioned that the soul’s immortality, thought very real to the dying person, is illusionary. If you understand the NEC theory and the different philosophical views of mortality, what do you think?
- Agent Smith
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
Intriguing idea. Seems to jibe with the received opinion on time.
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
"The theory states that our consciousness is not extinguished at death but (by default) is eternally, imperceptibly paused"
I've said that very same thing before but instead of that pause being eternal, i called it so short of a moment it doesn't seem to exist in real time. rather experience stops when consciousness stops until the universe produces that particular line of events again, which I'm hoping it must, and the 'u', which is what we call that line, happens again. now in the strictest sense we could say that we happen at least two times or more (infinitely in fact) in a sequence of real time. say, in nine frakillion years there's a similar big bang and here we go again. those occurances would be before and after each other, but, as there is no consciousness existing to experience this time sequence, the passage of time doesn't exist phenomenologically... or better, it does exist but it can't be experienced... so it isn't conceivable, isn't relevant in any way. a pause so long and yet so short. siriusly think about it.
I'm like the husserl of the eternal recurrence bro.
all this of course only if some variation of the ER (eternal recurrence) is true.
I've said that very same thing before but instead of that pause being eternal, i called it so short of a moment it doesn't seem to exist in real time. rather experience stops when consciousness stops until the universe produces that particular line of events again, which I'm hoping it must, and the 'u', which is what we call that line, happens again. now in the strictest sense we could say that we happen at least two times or more (infinitely in fact) in a sequence of real time. say, in nine frakillion years there's a similar big bang and here we go again. those occurances would be before and after each other, but, as there is no consciousness existing to experience this time sequence, the passage of time doesn't exist phenomenologically... or better, it does exist but it can't be experienced... so it isn't conceivable, isn't relevant in any way. a pause so long and yet so short. siriusly think about it.
I'm like the husserl of the eternal recurrence bro.
all this of course only if some variation of the ER (eternal recurrence) is true.
Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
Well, I haven't read the book, however, upon a quick Google search of the book's title, this was the first thing to pop up...BigQuestioner wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:04 pm If you understand the NEC theory and the different philosophical views of mortality, what do you think?
So, if the author (BigQuestioner) wants to know what I think, then based on that summarizing blurb, I think it's one of the most horrifying visions of the afterlife I've ever heard of."The theory of a natural afterlife defines a vastly different, real possibility. The natural afterlife embodies all of the sensory perceptions, thoughts, and emotions present in the final moment of a near-death, dreamlike experience. With death this moment becomes timeless and everlasting to the dying person—essentially, a never-ending experience."
I say that because it seems to imply that this unfortunate ISIS captive...
...will be trapped in some sort of inescapable nightmare where he (in an endless recurring loop) will forever experience "...all of the sensory perceptions, thoughts, and emotions present in the final moment..." of being burned alive by madmen.
Or, imagine being forever trapped in the mind-searing fear and panic one would experience as one drowns,...
...or, is strangled by a serial killer,...
...or, is...(well, you get the point).
Anyway, perhaps the author, instead of using this thread as a quick advertisement for his/her book, could reappear and provide us with a less terrifying interpretation of the "NEC".
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- BigQuestioner
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
seeds seems to have ignored the phrase "dream-like experience" in the given quotation as seeds gives only examples of horrifying real awake experiences. The last moment of such experiences can be overridden before death by dream-like experiences, i.e., near-death experiences (NDEs) and dreams. They can also be naturally suppressed by the mind via amnesia as are many horrifying experiences as evidenced by those who survive them. That is, the mind "rewinds" to a previous moment before the horrifying experience.
Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
First of all, I respect and appreciate where you are coming from with your theory, for I too have an afterlife theory that involves the substance of our dreams. So, please don't think of this as being any sort of an attack, but more of a probe into how deeply you've considered your theory's implications.BigQuestioner wrote: ↑Tue Mar 07, 2023 7:37 pm seeds seems to have ignored the phrase "dream-like experience" in the given quotation as seeds gives only examples of horrifying real awake experiences. The last moment of such experiences can be overridden before death by dream-like experiences, i.e., near-death experiences (NDEs) and dreams. They can also be naturally suppressed by the mind via amnesia as are many horrifying experiences as evidenced by those who survive them. That is, the mind "rewinds" to a previous moment before the horrifying experience.
And, of course, if I am misinterpreting the theory, then by all means, set me straight.
Okay, so we get to pick a more pleasant ("dream-like") experience.
Then what?
Are we then simply going to stagnate in that singular moment (say, for example, the peak of a sexual orgasm) for eternity?
I mean, that may sound nice, but it holds no logical and evolvable "purpose" for us, for I'm thinking that after the first million years of that same orgasmic dream...
(never mind the implied isolation from being cut-off from any other sentient beings)
...one might go insane from the lack of any sort of variety in the dream or contact with (real) others.
So then, unless you are suggesting that our mental status in the afterlife will be something akin to this,...
...then what is your solution to that potential problem?
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- BigQuestioner
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
There's no problem. You will find the solution in my three journal articles on my theory or in my book. I'm sorry, but I don't have the time to engage people about my theory who've not first read up on it.
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
What makes this a "scientific theory" rather than just wishful thinking like most people's hopes for the afterlife?
- BigQuestioner
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
Quoting from my book's Prologue, A Natural Afterlife Discovered: The Newfound, Psychological Reality That Awaits Us at Death:Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 9:08 am What makes this a "scientific theory" rather than just wishful thinking like most people's hopes for the afterlife?
"It [the natural afterlife] is “psychologically based” ... . It is not a place in three-dimensional space. It is within your mind at death and just timelessly lingers on in your consciousness forever. Being psychological, it is subjective, relativistic, and illusionary. It is subjective in that it is as only you perceive it and may even be personalized for you. It is relativistic in that to understand and envision it now as one of the living, you must put yourself into the proper frame of reference, that of a dying person. It is illusionary in that it is not a reality in the material, sensory sense (like this book you are now seeing through your own eyes). It is, however, very real to the dying person."
Quoting from the first page of Chapter 1:
"Its [the natural afterlife's] discovery was possible because this afterlife is natural, unlike all others envisioned. That is, it’s supported by human experiences and scientific principles. There’s nothing supernatural (i.e., paranormal) about it. Its name is not an oxymoron."
Because of the above noted support and the imperceptibility of our moment of death, Chapter 9 "Validity Via Testability: A Scientific Theory" is able to establish that the theory of a natural eternal consciousness (NEC), which makes possible the natural afterlife, can be verified and falsified.
Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
Philosophy teaches all kinds of things of which it hasn't got a clue.BigQuestioner wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:04 pm
Pages 78 to 84 of book discusses "how the NEC theory relates to what philosophy currently teaches about death, immortality, and the afterlife."
My, my! How the human beast lusts for immortality while ironically and at the same time, not know WHY he should be worth it.
Why is it that so often a consciousness in advance of its other mammalian brethren is thereby assumed to have an afterlife? Could it be that it's only our imagination which provides for one simply because we have a hard time accepting our return to the oblivion from whence we came? Imagination often denotes what we wish for which is not in the realm of physics to ever actualize.
- BigQuestioner
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
If one would read about the natural afterlife, they would discover that it is not just for humans. Also, "the realm of physics" can currently account for only about 95% of the matter and energy in the universe and has very little to say about consciousness. Actually, physics is dumbfounded about it. So stating that something about consciousness "is not in the realm of physics to ever actualize" is simply absurd.Dubious wrote: ↑Thu Mar 09, 2023 4:36 amWhy is it that so often a consciousness in advance of its other mammalian brethren is thereby assumed to have an afterlife? Could it be that it's only our imagination which provides for one simply because we have a hard time accepting our return to the oblivion from whence we came? Imagination often denotes what we wish for which is not in the realm of physics to ever actualize.BigQuestioner wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:04 pm
Pages 78 to 84 of book discusses "how the NEC theory relates to what philosophy currently teaches about death, immortality, and the afterlife."
Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
Actually physics is not dumbfounded about it because consciousness is not something physics would be terribly concerned about; nor would chemistry though in that respect we're getting closer.BigQuestioner wrote: ↑Thu Mar 09, 2023 2:31 pmIf one would read about the natural afterlife, they would discover that it is not just for humans. Also, "the realm of physics" can currently account for only about 95% of the matter and energy in the universe and has very little to say about consciousness. Actually, physics is dumbfounded about it. So stating that something about consciousness "is not in the realm of physics to ever actualize" is simply absurd.Dubious wrote: ↑Thu Mar 09, 2023 4:36 amWhy is it that so often a consciousness in advance of its other mammalian brethren is thereby assumed to have an afterlife? Could it be that it's only our imagination which provides for one simply because we have a hard time accepting our return to the oblivion from whence we came? Imagination often denotes what we wish for which is not in the realm of physics to ever actualize.BigQuestioner wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:04 pm
Pages 78 to 84 of book discusses "how the NEC theory relates to what philosophy currently teaches about death, immortality, and the afterlife."
Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
Sorry, folks, move on, nothing to see here. As soon as you read the phrase "utmost happiness", you should have realised you were reading about Dr Miracle's Snake Oil.
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
Man revives a thread that hadn't been commented on in a month just to say 'nothing to see here'.
Yeah mate, that's why nobody was looking.
- BigQuestioner
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Re: For Philosophy, a New Type of Immortality: the NEC
To
From someone who in this case does not know what they do not know, this kind of reply does a great disservice to any discussion. They will never know what they do not know if by simply reading "the phrase 'utmost happiness'" completely closes their mind. They will remain stuck in the ignorance of current orthodoxy. Worse, and unfortunately, their peachy comment attempts to lure others into also never knowing.
My book A Natural Afterlife Discovered: The Newfound, Psychological Reality That Awaits Us at Death claims that human consciousness is imperceptibly paused at death, which provides a "A New Type of Immortality, the NEC." It goes to great length basing this claim on human experience and cognitive science principles. So, until one has reviewed it's scientific basis and can refute it at this level, I feel they have no business chiming into this discussion to simply claim it as "Snake Oil."
To know what you know and what you do not know, that is true knowledge.--Confucius
From someone who in this case does not know what they do not know, this kind of reply does a great disservice to any discussion. They will never know what they do not know if by simply reading "the phrase 'utmost happiness'" completely closes their mind. They will remain stuck in the ignorance of current orthodoxy. Worse, and unfortunately, their peachy comment attempts to lure others into also never knowing.
My book A Natural Afterlife Discovered: The Newfound, Psychological Reality That Awaits Us at Death claims that human consciousness is imperceptibly paused at death, which provides a "A New Type of Immortality, the NEC." It goes to great length basing this claim on human experience and cognitive science principles. So, until one has reviewed it's scientific basis and can refute it at this level, I feel they have no business chiming into this discussion to simply claim it as "Snake Oil."