The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Is there a God? If so, what is She like?

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Atla
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Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:43 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:40 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:22 pm
But that's your hypothesis. :D Why do you think the universe is a consequence?
Naturally. It may or may not be a consequence.

But the question: "Is The Universe a consequence?" is a decision problem: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decision_problem
And now you are back in my realm - computation!

The question has three possible answers: Yes/No/I don't know.

"I don't know" being the default position any certainty on the matter requires the person answering to produce the algorithm by which the answer was produced. So - you've answered 'No'. Provide the reasoning.

I've already demonstrated my reasoning. IF you value logic and consistency, then by the exact same principle by which "energy" is deemed "real" (has testable consequences), then God is real too. The testable consequence for God is The Universe itself!
Then why did you keep insisting on "Yes" as the default view? :)

Atla
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:48 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:40 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:22 pm
But that's your hypothesis. :D Why do you think the universe is a consequence?
Naturally. It may or may not be a consequence.

But the question: "Is The Universe a consequence?" is a decision problem: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decision_problem
And now you are back in my realm - computation!

The question has three possible answers: Yes/No/I don't know.

"I don't know" being the default position any certainty on the matter requires the person answering to produce the algorithm by which the answer was produced. So - you've answered 'No'. Provide the reasoning.

I've already demonstrated my reasoning. IF you value logic and consistency, then by the exact same principle by which "energy" is deemed "real" (has testable consequences), then God is real too. The testable consequence for God is The Universe itself!
And how do you "test" the universe itself? :D

TimeSeeker
Posts: 2372
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:42 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by TimeSeeker » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:49 pm

Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:43 pm
Then why did you keep insisting on "Yes" as the default view? :)
I don't? I keep insist that I don't know!

I am merely demonstrating that IF you employ statistical reasoning (exactly like science works) the weight of evidence is towards 'YES'.
Because all the things around us have causes and causality, then through deductive reasoning one would conclude that the universe would too (which is an error in reasoning because particular->general is not deduction).

For things without a cause do not exist. If the universe is it - it's beyond the realm of science to answer it.
Last edited by TimeSeeker on Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.

TimeSeeker
Posts: 2372
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:42 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by TimeSeeker » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:49 pm

Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:48 pm
And how do you "test" the universe itself? :D
The exact same way you determined it's a circle.

Atla
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:56 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:49 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:43 pm
Then why did you keep insisting on "Yes" as the default view? :)
I don't? I keep insist that I don't know!

I am merely demonstrating that IF you employ statistical reasoning (exactly like science works) the weight of evidence is towards 'YES'.
Because all the things around us have causes and causality, then through deductive reasoning one would conclude that the universe would too (which is an error in reasoning because particular->general is not deduction).

For things without a cause do not exist. If the universe is it - it's beyond the realm of science to answer it.
Of course it's beyond the realm of science to answer it, you are just now realizing the obvious? :)
The exact same way you determined it's a circle.
But I haven't determined it :D

TimeSeeker
Posts: 2372
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:42 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by TimeSeeker » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:01 pm

Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:56 pm
Of course it's beyond the realm of science to answer it, you are just now realizing the obvious? :)

But I haven't determined it :D
So you pre-supposed it? ;)

Like God.

Atla
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:03 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:01 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:56 pm
Of course it's beyond the realm of science to answer it, you are just now realizing the obvious? :)

But I haven't determined it :D
So you pre-supposed it? ;)

Like God.
Then you have pre-supposed that the universe was caused by something.

TimeSeeker
Posts: 2372
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:42 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by TimeSeeker » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:07 pm

Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:03 pm
Then you have pre-supposed that the universe was caused by something.
Non-sequitur. I am not talking about the origin of the universe (which I do not know).

I am talking about the shape of the universe (which I also don't know).

Have you concluded or assumed that it's a circle ? :)

Atla
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:09 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:07 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:03 pm
Then you have pre-supposed that the universe was caused by something.
Non-sequitur. I am not talking about the origin of the universe (which I do not know).

I am talking about the shape of the universe (which I also don't know).

Have you concluded or assumed that it's a circle ? :)
I haven't concluded or assumed it.

TimeSeeker
Posts: 2372
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:42 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by TimeSeeker » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:09 pm

Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:09 pm
I haven't concluded or assumed it.
Then by what thought process did you reach the conclusion?

Atla
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:11 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:09 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:09 pm
I haven't concluded or assumed it.
Then by what thought process did you reach the conclusion?
It's not a conclusion :roll:

TimeSeeker
Posts: 2372
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:42 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by TimeSeeker » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:12 pm

Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:11 pm
It's not a conclusion :roll:
A priori knowledge? Revelation?

By what process did you acquire the idea?

Atla
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:20 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:12 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:11 pm
It's not a conclusion :roll:
A priori knowledge? Revelation?

By what process did you acquire the idea?
Not circle, just circular.
It's the simplest model of the universe I can think of that actually makes sense, solves all logical problems.

TimeSeeker
Posts: 2372
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:42 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by TimeSeeker » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:33 pm

Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:20 pm
TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:12 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:11 pm
It's not a conclusion :roll:
A priori knowledge? Revelation?

By what process did you acquire the idea?
Not circle, just circular.
It's the simplest model of the universe I can think of that actually makes sense, solves all logical problems.
Well. It solves almost all of your logical problems.

The circular non-circle is somewhat logically dubious.

Atla
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: The Neural Basis of NonDuality

Post by Atla » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:40 pm

TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:33 pm
Atla wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:20 pm
TimeSeeker wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:12 pm

A priori knowledge? Revelation?

By what process did you acquire the idea?
Not circle, just circular.
It's the simplest model of the universe I can think of that actually makes sense, solves all logical problems.
Well. It solves almost all of your logical problems.

The circular non-circle is somewhat logically dubious.
I tend to doubt that the shape of the universe would be a perfect 4-dimensional sphere.

There are also other possibilities: for example maybe there is a chain of universes, that form a circular structure. A closed chain of cyclic universes, 6 for example.

Again: these are metaphysical guesses, not conclusions or whatever.

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