I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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Bill Wiltrack
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I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:41 pm

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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:45 pm

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What you just experienced is philosophy.




What you just experienced is the beauty of being human.




What you just experienced is your consciousness changing your focus from your right brain to your left brain.




What you just experienced is the miracle of the universe seeing itself.






Enjoy!








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Arising_uk
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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Arising_uk » Tue Dec 27, 2011 7:57 pm

We call it Phenomenology in Philosophy and what you said about it Metaphysics.

Although I see you're still punting this left/right brain metaphor, so tell me, how is this visual illusion split across the 'brains'? Given that you think such processing as the visuals is located in one half?

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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:54 am

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When you first observe the image you do it with a more open, overall perspective. A right-brain type of perception.


When you direct your focus onto the little red ball, that tiny focus, is characteristic of left brain thinking. We focus upon minutia and almost miraculously, the outer sphere disappears...an accepted sacrifice for the change in attention.







Thank you for responding to my thread and allowing me to explain this simple yet fascinating aspect of philosophy in practice!







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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by evangelicalhumanist » Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:05 am

Bill, if we follow your "instruction" ("I want you to focus upon this red ball...") we are not then, I think, doing philosophy at all. Yes, if we follow your instruction the background -- and possibly larger, possibly more important -- information can disappear.

For me, however, that did not happen. Why not? Because in following your instruction, I also followed my basic philosophical instinct. I looked at the red ball in it's context, shifting back and forth between the two -- and even further out, into the rectangle of it's inclusion in this thread -- and tried to understand what the relationships of all of these were.

And yes, as my consciousness slipped back and forth between figure and ground (and beyond) relative importance (and sometimes even the existence) of each changed. And that set me wondering "why?"

So I rather think that your explanation, while containing a smattering of the truth of the experience, leaves out a whole lot, too.

And THAT is, I think, closer to philosophy.

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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:11 am

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Thank you for participating in my exercise!


The complete philosophical experience does require the ability to focus; to concentrate.


At times this is difficult because of inner or outer distractions.


Please feel free to try again at another, perhaps quieter, time.







I think you will be AMAZED!





Good luck and thank you for responding!








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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Impenitent » Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:13 am

Bill Wiltrack wrote:.












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ok, I'll say it...

"philosophy" of a boob...

-Imp

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Bill Wiltrack
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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:24 am

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OK...umm...remember FOCUS.


It's not a boob.


It's a blue circle with a tiny red dot.




Remember...we are philosophers here.



We're studying philosophy.


Boobs - no.




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Arising_uk
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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Arising_uk » Wed Dec 28, 2011 2:25 am

Bill Wiltrack wrote:...
Thank you for responding to my thread and allowing me to explain this simple yet fascinating aspect of philosophy in practice! [/size]
Phenomenology numbnuts.

Your phenomenological explanation leaves a lot to be desired even in the terms of the 'left/right' 'brain' metaphor you cling to, as in your previous posts upon this metaphor you claim that visual perception is in one half only. How do you reconcile this?

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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Wed Dec 28, 2011 4:31 am

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um...I have the feeling the exercise did not work for you.



If you are unable to experience the philosophical exercise in the way that I have relayed it I can understand how you would be less than excited towards the outcome of the exercise.

There is no way I could go beyond the description that already accompanies this thread.


If you are unable to focus upon the red ball that does not mean you are less of a philosopher than me, or less of a philosopher than those who are able to experience the full exercise.


I understand your frustration.






Just move-on.


There are other thread that you can enjoy upon this forum.



We can experience these other topics together.



You are no less of a philosopher than the rest of us.




Again, thank you for commenting upon my thread.







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Arising_uk
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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Arising_uk » Wed Dec 28, 2011 4:34 am

You're an idiot. Of course I made the illusion work, the frustration is yours. Do not delude yourself that you are philosopher.
p.s.
Its not even a blue circle.

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Bill Wiltrack
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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Wed Dec 28, 2011 4:45 am

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I don't get what you are trying to articulate.


Do you feel as if you are competing with me?





I told you and I am being sincere; Not being able to experience this one philosophically directed exercise does not mean a thing towards your ability to experience philosophy.



Believe me, I do not think anything less of you.



I'm sorry that I brought this exercise up.


I did not mean for this exercise to reflect negatively towards anyone.






Perhaps you should just move on. We'll all move on.




I do thank you and everyone for opening up and sharing upon this thread.





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Arising_uk
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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Arising_uk » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:45 pm

Tell me why this 'exercise' is philosophical rather than psychological?

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Bill Wiltrack
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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Wed Dec 28, 2011 5:17 pm

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I don't to appear that I am talking down to you or dismissing your input but I respectfully request that you re-read ALL of my posts upon this thread.


I honestly don't think that I can make this exercise any clearer...



I know you look up to me and I get the fact that you are frustrated. Believe me, that comes across.


I don't know that I can walk you through this. Each of us are philosophers in direct relation to our capacities. Our individual capacities.




I'm sorry and I am not dismissing you as a student. It's just that some of the questions you ask of me are not mine to answer. Do you understand?

You have to think for yourself at times. I cannot give you all the answers. You cannot be given all the answers from a book or a direct teacher.




Your comments and questions are appreciated and they are useful.


Thank you.



And I wish you all the well.







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Re: I want you to focus upon this red ball...

Post by duszek » Wed Dec 28, 2011 5:37 pm

I stare at the ball and the blue part disappears and when I blink then it reappears.

Why is it a question of the hemisphere ?
I thought it would be just an effect of your eyes growing tired.

The philosophy behind this experiment is: things are not always as they appear and our senses cannot be trusted. David Hume wrote a treaty about the subject.

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