The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

Moderators: AMod, iMod

User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Brian William Drisko states that...

If you think you need to practice to awaken,
if you think you need to learn something to awaken,
then instruct the stone in my pocket,
for it is just as capable of awakening as I am.
Or is the stone already awakened?
Or is there no thing and no one to awaken?
So what is there to practice or to learn?
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Enlightenment was
here before humans,
here before life on earth,
here before the earth itself;
And it will still be here
long after humans are gone,
long after life is gone,
long after the earth itself is gone.

This points to the fact that
Enlightenment has nothing to do with
the human mind, or even life itself.

This points to the fact that
Enlightenment is not dependent on the mind.
Enlightenment is not an experience of the mind,
but rather the mind is an experience of Enlightenment.

Enlightenment will continue to exist
even after there are no minds for it to experience,
just as it did before there were minds for it to experience.

There were no minds for most of the history of existence,
and there may be no minds for most of the future of existence.
But it is the mind that depends on existence,
not existence that depends on the mind.

Enlightenment and existence are not separate.
Enlightenment is all of existence -- As It Is.
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Meditation practice is a way for the human mind to know clearly that there is no one who is meditating, and that there is no one who becomes enlightened as a result of the practice. Meditation is simply an empty practice that can only point to the illusory nature of a person practicing meditation, in the illusory hope of reaching a state of 'thought free awareness'

There is no such state as a 'thought free awareness'.
To know of a 'thought free awareness' state existing, requires thinking about that state.
So even when the 'thoughtless' state is reached, there is simply no one there to experience it anyway, no one to validate, verify, or endorse the 'thoughtless' state, exists.

So the very idea of a 'thought free awareness' state, is just another mind made myth that does not exist in reality whatsoever.


Spiritual gurus are selling you a CON and making themselves appear as though they are some idolised entity who deserves reverence.
But, it's really all rather silly, and quite cringy, and narcissistic actually. But then that's the nature of the human mind, to share it's findings with others, to sell them on, and even make money out of writing books about it. It's one form of income I suppose, this claim for fame business.
User avatar
Lacewing
Posts: 6604
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2015 2:25 am

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Lacewing »

Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 29, 2022 3:05 pm Spiritual gurus are selling you a CON and making themselves appear as though they are some idolised entity who deserves reverence.
Some do that!

I think most probably don't idolize themselves as their followers do, and they are genuinely trying to assist others through various veils (their own and other's) of this Earth reality.

Perhaps it's like we're doing a Dance of the Veils, here on Earth. :D Beauty and creativity and seduction and drama... woohoo! Very entertaining.

Maybe love helps to part the veils. Technique/style is just part of the performance.
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Lacewing wrote: Thu Sep 29, 2022 5:27 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 29, 2022 3:05 pm Spiritual gurus are selling you a CON and making themselves appear as though they are some idolised entity who deserves reverence.
Some do that!

I think most probably don't idolize themselves as their followers do, and they are genuinely trying to assist others through various veils (their own and other's) of this Earth reality.

Perhaps it's like we're doing a Dance of the Veils, here on Earth. :D Beauty and creativity and seduction and drama... woohoo! Very entertaining.

Maybe love helps to part the veils. Technique/style is just part of the performance.
:lol: ╰(*°▽°*)╯


Yes, it's all about the drama of being human, all vanity and entertainment really. I certainly wouldn't enjoy being followed though. I can't think of anything more absurd than for someone to follow anything I personally had to say. :lol:
User avatar
Lacewing
Posts: 6604
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2015 2:25 am

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Lacewing »

Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 29, 2022 6:16 pm I certainly wouldn't enjoy being followed though. I can't think of anything more absurd than for someone to follow anything I personally had to say. :lol:
I feel the same! A friend of mine just asked me about this recently when we were imagining a potential healing ability that could be used 'invisibly' to help people. He asked if I wouldn't want some kind of recognition for it, and without hesitation my heartfelt response was NO! That would creep me out. That would turn it into something else entirely.

I think we're all channels of energy that can be accessible to anyone. No one owns it. And no one is a gatekeeper of it! :D
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Lacewing wrote: Thu Sep 29, 2022 6:32 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 29, 2022 6:16 pm I certainly wouldn't enjoy being followed though. I can't think of anything more absurd than for someone to follow anything I personally had to say. :lol:
I feel the same! A friend of mine just asked me about this recently when we were imagining a potential healing ability that could be used 'invisibly' to help people. He asked if I wouldn't want some kind of recognition for it, and without hesitation my heartfelt response was NO! That would creep me out. That would turn it into something else entirely.

I think we're all channels of energy that can be accessible to anyone. No one owns it. And no one is a gatekeeper of it! :D
I agree with you Lacewing. :D
Maia
Posts: 800
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2022 8:11 am
Location: UK

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Maia »

It's true, I think, that we're all part of a greater whole, namely, nature. But this doesn't mean that we should abandon our individuality.
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 11:02 am It's true, I think, that we're all part of a greater whole, namely, nature. But this doesn't mean that we should abandon our individuality.
It's impossible to abandon our individuality simply because that would involve the experience of experiencing our own absence, which is not possible. Also, there are those who speak of stopping one's thoughts as if to experience a ''thought free awareness'' ..but this idea is a myth simply because a 'still mind' is like a 'still wind', there is no way to stop thoughts from appearing. All we can do is be aware of 'thought' as and when they pass through awareness. For human beings, 'thoughts' are only ever passing through, never lingering for more than a few seconds, in fact they can pass through so quickly that it is hard to hold onto a thought that is desired as being useful. And so thoughts are only passing visitors, in what is always this unmoving, unchanging, empty, still and silent pure awareness.

This pure awareness does not need or require to be practiced, because it's already what you are.

The spiritual people have just turned it all into another marketing racket, that's all, but it's not for sale.
Maia
Posts: 800
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2022 8:11 am
Location: UK

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Maia »

Dontaskme wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 12:03 pm
Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 11:02 am It's true, I think, that we're all part of a greater whole, namely, nature. But this doesn't mean that we should abandon our individuality.
It's impossible to abandon our individuality simply because that would involve the experience of experiencing our own absence, which is not possible. Also, there are those who speak of stopping one's thoughts as if to experience a ''thought free awareness'' ..but this idea is a myth simply because a 'still mind' is like a 'still wind', there is no way to stop thoughts from appearing. All we can do is be aware of 'thought' as and when they pass through awareness. For human beings, 'thoughts' are only ever passing through, never lingering for more than a few seconds, in fact they can pass through so quickly that it is hard to hold onto a thought that is desired as beng useful. And so thoughts are only passing visitors, in what is always this unmoving, unchanging, empty, still and silent pure awareness.

This pure awareness does not need or require to be practiced, because it's already what you are.

The spiritual people have just turned it all into another marketing racket, that's all, but it's not for sale.
I'm more inclined to take a practical approach to these sorts of things, including my spiritual exercises. I don't actually think it matters much what happens to be going through your mind at the time. What's important is what you do.
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 12:54 pm
I'm more inclined to take a practical approach to these sorts of things, including my spiritual exercises. I don't actually think it matters much what happens to be going through your mind at the time. What's important is what you do.
What I discovered upon pondering was that I'm not doing anything, and that I am being done. After that discovery, there was nothing left to do, and no one to do it.

This whole spirituality thing is a fools paradise in my opinion. And the buddha that is all of us laughed out loud uncontrollably.
Last edited by Dontaskme on Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Maia
Posts: 800
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2022 8:11 am
Location: UK

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Maia »

Dontaskme wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:23 pm
Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 12:54 pm
I'm more inclined to take a practical approach to these sorts of things, including my spiritual exercises. I don't actually think it matters much what happens to be going through your mind at the time. What's important is what you do.
What I discovered upon pondering was that I'm not doing anything, and that I am being done. After that discovery, there was nothing left to do, and no one to do it.
I prefer actively doing something.
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:25 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:23 pm
Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 12:54 pm
I'm more inclined to take a practical approach to these sorts of things, including my spiritual exercises. I don't actually think it matters much what happens to be going through your mind at the time. What's important is what you do.
What I discovered upon pondering was that I'm not doing anything, and that I am being done. After that discovery, there was nothing left to do, and no one to do it.
I prefer actively doing something.
There is no way for you to avoid it, doing is just happening, and you are not making any of the doing happen.
Maia
Posts: 800
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2022 8:11 am
Location: UK

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Maia »

Dontaskme wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:28 pm
Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:25 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:23 pm

What I discovered upon pondering was that I'm not doing anything, and that I am being done. After that discovery, there was nothing left to do, and no one to do it.
I prefer actively doing something.
There is no way for you to avoid it, doing is just happening, and you are not making any of the doing happen.
I do have agency, as we all do, and can therefore make at least some of it happen.
User avatar
Dontaskme
Posts: 16940
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2016 2:07 pm
Location: Nowhere

Re: The myth of spiritual meditation practice.

Post by Dontaskme »

Maia wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:35 pm
I do have agency, as we all do, and can therefore make at least some of it happen.
The sense of I having agency that has some form of control over what happens is an illusion. This illusion is held in the mind, and the mind's only reference point is with itself which is illusory.
Post Reply