The observer cannot be observed

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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Sculptor
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Sculptor »

Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:46 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:55 am
It's no end of amusement to me how many times poster will start with something that is clearly bollocks.
What is observing can be and often is observed.
It's already been stated here that the observer is the observed.
No you didn't.

The point being made though, is that that which is observed cannot observe, therefore any thing observed cannot be the observer....comprende ?
But you are still wrong aren't you.
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Dontaskme
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Dontaskme »

Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:11 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:46 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:55 am
It's no end of amusement to me how many times poster will start with something that is clearly bollocks.
What is observing can be and often is observed.
It's already been stated here that the observer is the observed.
No you didn't.
Yes I did.....when I wrote ...What is ''looked upon'' aka a mirror, is just a reflection of what's looking, aka emptiness appearing full, aka an image of the imageless.


But you are still wrong aren't you.
Knowledge can only point to the illusory nature of reality, as no knower has ever been seen, only known by no one.
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Sculptor
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Sculptor »

Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:37 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:11 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:46 pm

It's already been stated here that the observer is the observed.
No you didn't.
Yes I did.....when I wrote ...What is ''looked upon'' aka a mirror, is just a reflection of what's looking, aka emptiness appearing full, aka an image of the imageless.


But you are still wrong aren't you.
Knowledge can only point to the illusory nature of reality, as no knower has ever been seen, only known by no one.
What you said was this.

What is observing cannot be observed because nothing is observing appearing as something.

What you seem to be good at is writing nonsense then ignoring it and adding more nonsense.

Take a deep breath and read what you wrote.
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Dontaskme
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Dontaskme »

Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:45 pm

What you said was this.

What is observing cannot be observed because nothing is observing appearing as something.

What you seem to be good at is writing nonsense then ignoring it and adding more nonsense.

Take a deep breath and read what you wrote.

There’s many ways to paint the same picture.
Yes, that quote written above in bold is also saying the observer is the observed.
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Sculptor
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Sculptor »

Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:53 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:45 pm

What you said was this.

What is observing cannot be observed because nothing is observing appearing as something.

What you seem to be good at is writing nonsense then ignoring it and adding more nonsense.

Take a deep breath and read what you wrote.

There’s many ways to paint the same picture.
Yes, that quote written above in bold is also saying the observer is the observed.
BUT.
THE OBSERVER CANNOT BE THE OBSERVED
It's the bloody thread title.
And you clinically insane?
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Dontaskme
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Dontaskme »

Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:58 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:53 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:45 pm

What you said was this.

What is observing cannot be observed because nothing is observing appearing as something.

What you seem to be good at is writing nonsense then ignoring it and adding more nonsense.

Take a deep breath and read what you wrote.

There’s many ways to paint the same picture.
Yes, that quote written above in bold is also saying the observer is the observed.
BUT.
THE OBSERVER CANNOT BE THE OBSERVED
It's the bloody thread title.
And you clinically insane?
That’s right, the observed cannot observe. There’s only Observing ..as the observer and the observed are inseparable one unitary action.

The observer is the observed means the observed is a known concept known only within this immediate knowing non conceptual observing.

A concept known does not know...it’s already being known by that which is unknowable.

All knowns are appearances of the unknowable, aka illusions.

The observed appears to be the knower, but that’s the illusion, there simply is no knower there, only the idea, which is just emptiness appearing full.
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Sculptor
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Sculptor »

Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:06 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:58 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:53 pm


There’s many ways to paint the same picture.
Yes, that quote written above in bold is also saying the observer is the observed.
BUT.
THE OBSERVER CANNOT BE THE OBSERVED
It's the bloody thread title.
And you clinically insane?
That’s right, the observed cannot observe. There’s only Observing ..as the observer and the observed are inseparable one unitary action.

The observer is the observed means the observed is a known concept known only within this immediate knowing non conceptual observing.

A concept known does not know...it’s already being known by that which is unknowable.

All knowns are appearances of the unknowable, aka illusions.

The observed appears to be the knower, but that’s the illusion, there simply is no knower there, only the idea, which is just emptiness appearing full.
PLONK!
Dimebag
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Dimebag »

I’m not a huge fan of the nonduality word salad, it’s an attempt at turning something experiential into something conceptual, that’s one reason why it comes across as gibberish, the other reason being, it’s meant to intentionally stop thought, which if you attempt to decode it, it will do.

Honestly, there is no real way to explain this logically, if you are curious, start some basic meditation practice, mindfulness is best to start with as an entry level. You won’t get far unless you begin to open a little and trust. Skepticism is also critical, you need to doubt all your preconceived notions, as well as everything those in authority are telling you. Find out for yourself what is true.
AlexW
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by AlexW »

Dimebag wrote: Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:24 am Find out for yourself what is true.
Well said - fully agree.
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Dontaskme
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Dontaskme »

Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:32 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:06 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:58 pm
BUT.
THE OBSERVER CANNOT BE THE OBSERVED
It's the bloody thread title.
And you clinically insane?
That’s right, the observed cannot observe. There’s only Observing ..as the observer and the observed are inseparable one unitary action.

The observer is the observed means the observed is a known concept known only within this immediate knowing non conceptual observing.

A concept known does not know...it’s already being known by that which is unknowable.

All knowns are appearances of the unknowable, aka illusions.

The observed appears to be the knower, but that’s the illusion, there simply is no knower there, only the idea, which is just emptiness appearing full.
PLONK!

In saying The “observer is the observed” does not imply the “observer” can be observed. It just means there’s only OBSERVING and that this “observing” cannot then observe this observing....OK?
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Sculptor
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Sculptor »

Dontaskme wrote: Sat Sep 19, 2020 11:24 am
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:32 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 7:06 pm
That’s right, the observed cannot observe. There’s only Observing ..as the observer and the observed are inseparable one unitary action.

The observer is the observed means the observed is a known concept known only within this immediate knowing non conceptual observing.

A concept known does not know...it’s already being known by that which is unknowable.

All knowns are appearances of the unknowable, aka illusions.

The observed appears to be the knower, but that’s the illusion, there simply is no knower there, only the idea, which is just emptiness appearing full.
PLONK!

In saying The “observer is the observed” does not imply the “observer” can be observed. It just means there’s only OBSERVING and that this “observing” cannot then observe this observing....OK?
No not okay at all.
You are squirming. In future you need to say exactly what you mean.
So really - WTF are you actually talking about?
Dimebag
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Dimebag »

Tell me, what do you feel your identity is?

Your thoughts? Your emotions? Do you feel like a little you riding around inside your head, the one which sights and sounds are presented to? Or, do you feel like your body? Do you identify as your body?

Or do you feel like you are awareness, or consciousness?

Does consciousness happen TO you, or are you consciousness?

That whole thing where we say, “we’ll figure out who this consciousness thing happens to later”, well that’s what this is about.

Who are you, or more to the point, what are you?

Sculptor and Henry quirk, answer these questions?
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Sculptor
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Sculptor »

Dimebag wrote: Sat Sep 19, 2020 12:11 pm Tell me, what do you feel your identity is?
I identify as a homo sapiens. I regard all subcategories of this as divisive and potentially dangerous the health of humanity, and suspect all who promote other forms of group identity, which is most often damaging, as failing to see the solution to identity problem.

Your thoughts? Your emotions? Do you feel like a little you riding around inside your head, the one which sights and sounds are presented to? Or, do you feel like your body? Do you identify as your body?
Homo Sapience is about all these things.


Or do you feel like you are awareness, or consciousness?
What's the difference?


Does consciousness happen TO you, or are you consciousness?
The first seems like a disabling dualism. Attributing properties is what others do to you. I am complete with my consciousness, not separate from it.


That whole thing where we say, “we’ll figure out who this consciousness thing happens to later”, well that’s what this is about.
Never said it. Don't think i ever would.


Who are you, or more to the point, what are you?
Homo Sapiens


Sculptor and Henry quirk, answer these questions?
DOne
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henry quirk
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"Henry quirk, answer these questions?"

Post by henry quirk »

I did, upthread
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Dontaskme
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Re: The observer cannot be observed

Post by Dontaskme »

Sculptor wrote: Sat Sep 19, 2020 11:54 am
Dontaskme wrote: Sat Sep 19, 2020 11:24 am
Sculptor wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:32 pm

PLONK!

In saying The “observer is the observed” does not imply the “observer” can be observed. It just means there’s only OBSERVING and that this “observing” cannot then observe this observing....OK?
No not okay at all.
You are squirming. In future you need to say exactly what you mean.
So really - WTF are you actually talking about?
It’s you who is squirming mate. I’m good, I know what I mean.

But you don’t, and that not knowing makes you squirm.



Mind is the sixth sense. Mind is perceived, but it cannot perceive itself, just as teeth cannot bite themselves, or a finger can not touch itself.

Observing is One, this one cannot look at itself, if it could it would have to split itself in two into Knower and Known. There simply is no subject object divide. And yet Mind informs the divide, which is an illusion of course.
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