Mind is immortal

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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bahman
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Mind is immortal

Post by bahman »

Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
Impenitent
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by Impenitent »

mind is reducible- it is dependent on various parts of the human brain, as demonstrated physically and chemically...

-Imp
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Sculptor
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:54 pm Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
Are you aware that this is a philosophy forum?
Dubious
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by Dubious »

bahman wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:54 pm Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
No such thing as free decision. The parasites in one's brain know what you're going to do or feel before you do because they're the ones who made you do it. You only feel the effect and that it's your mind that makes decisions when actually they decided before you. Also, some parasites are more intelligent than other parasites! :mrgreen:
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bahman
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by bahman »

Impenitent wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 10:05 pm mind is reducible- it is dependent on various parts of the human brain, as demonstrated physically and chemically...

-Imp
What is known is that there is a correlation between experience and brain activity. Consciousness is due to Matter activity. There is causation too. In the middle, we have a decision. Brain activity cannot resolve the conflict of interest in a situation when options are equally liked. That is true since the matter is a deterministic substance, one input and one output. There is no algorithm for free decision. It is not due to a deterministic object.
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bahman
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by bahman »

Sculptor wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 10:07 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:54 pm Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
Are you aware that this is a philosophy forum?
Oh yeah, My argument is simple, two premises and one conclusion: 1) Mind is irreducible, 2) Anything which is irreducible is immortal, 3) Therefore, mind is immortal. I can prove the two premises.
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bahman
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by bahman »

Dubious wrote: Tue Apr 21, 2020 6:02 am
bahman wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:54 pm Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
No such thing as free decision. The parasites in one's brain know what you're going to do or feel before you do because they're the ones who made you do it. You only feel the effect and that it's your mind that makes decisions when actually they decided before you. Also, some parasites are more intelligent than other parasites! :mrgreen:
Threre are decisions that is done with your conscious being. You cannot say that you do not matter. Unless you are at the bottom of decision hierarchy, you can contribute in the conscious decision. :mrgreen:
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Sculptor
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:39 pm
Sculptor wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 10:07 pm
bahman wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:54 pm Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
Are you aware that this is a philosophy forum?
Oh yeah, My argument is simple, two premises and one conclusion: 1) Mind is irreducible, 2) Anything which is irreducible is immortal, 3) Therefore, mind is immortal. I can prove the two premises.
It's just a tautology based on a false premise.

The mind is wholly reliant on its generation by living healthy neural tissue.
This is a no brainer, and fully consistent with the empirical facts
Dubious
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by Dubious »

bahman wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:45 pm
Dubious wrote: Tue Apr 21, 2020 6:02 am
bahman wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:54 pm Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
No such thing as free decision. The parasites in one's brain know what you're going to do or feel before you do because they're the ones who made you do it. You only feel the effect and that it's your mind that makes decisions when actually they decided before you. Also, some parasites are more intelligent than other parasites! :mrgreen:
Threre are decisions that is done with your conscious being. You cannot say that you do not matter. Unless you are at the bottom of decision hierarchy, you can contribute in the conscious decision. :mrgreen:
I'm not saying I don't matter. I'm saying there are parasites in the brain which influence decision making more than we would like to think. It's also a convenient way of passing the buck in a Trumpian manner. If it's a good decision then we're the ones who made it; if a bad one we'll blame it on the parasites, which according to Trump are ALL Democrats. :mrgreen:
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bahman
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by bahman »

Sculptor wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 10:20 pm
bahman wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:39 pm
Sculptor wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 10:07 pm

Are you aware that this is a philosophy forum?
Oh yeah, My argument is simple, two premises and one conclusion: 1) Mind is irreducible, 2) Anything which is irreducible is immortal, 3) Therefore, mind is immortal. I can prove the two premises.
It's just a tautology based on a false premise.

The mind is wholly reliant on its generation by living healthy neural tissue.
This is a no brainer, and fully consistent with the empirical facts
What is known is that there is a correlation between experience and brain activity. Consciousness is due to Matter activity. There is causation too. In the middle, we have a decision. Brain activity cannot resolve the conflict of interest in a situation when options are equally liked. That is true since the matter is a deterministic substance, one input and one output. There is no algorithm for free decision. It is not due to a deterministic object.
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bahman
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by bahman »

Dubious wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 11:18 pm
bahman wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:45 pm
Dubious wrote: Tue Apr 21, 2020 6:02 am

No such thing as free decision. The parasites in one's brain know what you're going to do or feel before you do because they're the ones who made you do it. You only feel the effect and that it's your mind that makes decisions when actually they decided before you. Also, some parasites are more intelligent than other parasites! :mrgreen:
Threre are decisions that is done with your conscious being. You cannot say that you do not matter. Unless you are at the bottom of decision hierarchy, you can contribute in the conscious decision. :mrgreen:
I'm not saying I don't matter. I'm saying there are parasites in the brain which influence decision making more than we would like to think. It's also a convenient way of passing the buck in a Trumpian manner. If it's a good decision then we're the ones who made it; if a bad one we'll blame it on the parasites, which according to Trump are ALL Democrats. :mrgreen:
Oh yeah, very true.
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Sculptor
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Thu Apr 23, 2020 7:46 pm
Sculptor wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 10:20 pm
bahman wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:39 pm
Oh yeah, My argument is simple, two premises and one conclusion: 1) Mind is irreducible, 2) Anything which is irreducible is immortal, 3) Therefore, mind is immortal. I can prove the two premises.
It's just a tautology based on a false premise.

The mind is wholly reliant on its generation by living healthy neural tissue.
This is a no brainer, and fully consistent with the empirical facts
What is known is that there is a correlation between experience and brain activity. Consciousness is due to Matter activity. There is causation too. In the middle, we have a decision. Brain activity cannot resolve the conflict of interest in a situation when options are equally liked. That is true since the matter is a deterministic substance, one input and one output. There is no algorithm for free decision. It is not due to a deterministic object.
Not relevant.
Your burden is to demonstrate that mind is immortal.
You cannot do that.
Your premise remains a speculation based on a wish.
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bahman
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by bahman »

Sculptor wrote: Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:27 pm
bahman wrote: Thu Apr 23, 2020 7:46 pm
Sculptor wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 10:20 pm

It's just a tautology based on a false premise.

The mind is wholly reliant on its generation by living healthy neural tissue.
This is a no brainer, and fully consistent with the empirical facts
What is known is that there is a correlation between experience and brain activity. Consciousness is due to Matter activity. There is causation too. In the middle, we have a decision. Brain activity cannot resolve the conflict of interest in a situation when options are equally liked. That is true since the matter is a deterministic substance, one input and one output. There is no algorithm for free decision. It is not due to a deterministic object.
Not relevant.
It is relevant. The mind is real if the free decision is real. It then follows that the mind is irreducible as the free decision is irreducible.
Sculptor wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 10:20 pm Your burden is to demonstrate that mind is immortal.
You cannot do that.
Your premise remains a speculation based on a wish.
I can prove the second premise (the first premise is illustrated in the previous comment, it is obvious). The second premise can be proven by other arguments, 1) The mind cannot be created and 2) Something which cannot be created cannot be annihilated. I have a separate thread for each of these.
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Sculptor
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by Sculptor »

bahman wrote: Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:39 pm
Sculptor wrote: Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:27 pm
bahman wrote: Thu Apr 23, 2020 7:46 pm
What is known is that there is a correlation between experience and brain activity. Consciousness is due to Matter activity. There is causation too. In the middle, we have a decision. Brain activity cannot resolve the conflict of interest in a situation when options are equally liked. That is true since the matter is a deterministic substance, one input and one output. There is no algorithm for free decision. It is not due to a deterministic object.
Not relevant.
It is relevant. The mind is real if the free decision is real. It then follows that the mind is irreducible as the free decision is irreducible.
Sculptor wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 10:20 pm Your burden is to demonstrate that mind is immortal.
You cannot do that.
Your premise remains a speculation based on a wish.
I can prove the second premise (the first premise is illustrated in the previous comment, it is obvious). The second premise can be proven by other arguments, 1) The mind cannot be created and 2) Something which cannot be created cannot be annihilated. I have a separate thread for each of these.
Minds are created everyday.
I have a son. Once he did not used to exist. He was created by sex, and his mind was generated by his neural tissue which did not exist 24 years ago.
QED minds are created.
QED you are talking nonsense
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Re: Mind is immortal

Post by attofishpi »

bahman wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:54 pm Mind is irreducible since it makes free decision. Anything which is irreducible is immortal. Mind, therefore, is immortal.
What is a mind?
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