Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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Skepdick
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Skepdick »

SteveKlinko wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:22 pm "Yes, Oneness cannot be put into words in the same way that Redness cannot be put into words".
And in response to that I said: You just succeeded putting into words that which (apparently) can't be put into words.

What was it that you put in to words, if it wasn't Oneness and Redness?
SteveKlinko wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:22 pm So why would you ask such a question except that you are trying to Disrupt, Divert, and Obfuscate the conversation? Do you have anything to say about Oneness, Redness, or Consciousness?
Steve, you are really REALLY confused. So confused that you are actually lying. I didn't ask any questions. I made a statement.

Observe the punctuation used at the end of my sentence. It's not a question mark.
Skepdick wrote: Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:00 pm You just succeeded putting into words that which (apparently) can't be put into words.
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Dontaskme
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Dontaskme »

SteveKlinko wrote: Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:43 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:31 pm One cannot fully explain Oneness in words, just as one cannot fully explain feelings in words, however, the connection one feels when they realize Oneness is what allows one to recognize it.

As soon as we use language to define The Source, we have tainted our understanding of The Source. When it comes to Oneness, it is a similar story. Oneness cannot be defined with words because Oneness is a state of being that can only be realized.

WHAT IS THE PHILOSOPHY OF ONENESS?
What is the philosophy of Oneness of God and what does Oneness really mean?



Source: https://www.selfhelphealing.co.uk/philo ... ss-of-god/
Yes, Oneness cannot be put into words in the same way that Redness cannot be put into words. These things can only be experienced. I have experienced Redness but I am still working on experiencing Oneness.
I agree with you Steve, that Oneness or for want of a better word (Nonduality) which is the same idea...definitely cannot be put into words in the context of how these words are to be understood by the one who ''apparently'' seeks to self inquire into the nature of reality.

Of course, it's obvious that the word ONENESS that is now appearing here in front of the eyes in symbolic form translated from arranged letters on this computer screen certainly does look as if that is how the word Oneness is put into words...but that's just too obvious, and not what this subject is pointing to at all. And I think that you Steve do know this in your own wisdom. You know this is more about wisdom than it is about general knowledge.

The point of this thread topic is that the word Oneness/ which is just another word for Non-duality or even Consciousness....is to inform the MIND that the capacity to explain or describe this word Oneness/Non-duality is impossible.

First of all, the manifestation of any ''WORD'' is always sourced from ''thought'' which requires a (mind brain body mechanism) to process the ''thought'' and so the awareness of any ''thought'' is always known to be dualistic by it's very nature. But that is NOT what is actually being pointed to which is the Non-dual reality.

The world created by ''thought'', is the world of words, language, and concepts, and is the world of mentally constructed opposites.

But what this thread is really pointing to when we use the word (Non-duality) is something that goes beyond all of these mind-made opposites. But how can we talk about something that goes beyond opposites, when even our attempt to talk about non-duality via the idea of it is dualistic?

In fact the non-duality we speak of is not the opposite of anything. This is impossible to understand logically or rationally. To see what is being spoken of, we must go beyond our ordinary way of thinking and seeing. Some people are able to do this, and they are labeled Non-dualists. So Steve, you say you are still working on going beyond your ordinary way of thinking and seeing this Non-dual reality.

What we are really trying to do when we say ONENESS is to point to life as it is right now, before the appearance of concepts and labels are superimposed upon it, before 'thought' creates a world of conceptual words known as things...including ideas such as: me, you, past, future etc. This subject topic is about what is life before 'thought'

Can we even talk about that? Is it possible to capture Non-duality into words?

The answer is blaringly and self evidently No, obviously.

Even to be labeled a nondualist is the result of ridiculous dogmatic thinking coupled with the deluded mental attitude of righteous religiosity.. like this for example: > ''You are dualistic and I am non-dualistic'' or I am more non-dual than you. But this is just turning further and further away from the point of this subject even more.... In truth, Non-duality is NOT a religion nor is it a theory, or an ism.

Non-dualists are more interested in the truth of Non-duality. Not the dogmatic thinking about it.

.
Age
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm
SteveKlinko wrote: Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:43 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:31 pm One cannot fully explain Oneness in words, just as one cannot fully explain feelings in words, however, the connection one feels when they realize Oneness is what allows one to recognize it.

As soon as we use language to define The Source, we have tainted our understanding of The Source. When it comes to Oneness, it is a similar story. Oneness cannot be defined with words because Oneness is a state of being that can only be realized.

WHAT IS THE PHILOSOPHY OF ONENESS?
What is the philosophy of Oneness of God and what does Oneness really mean?



Source: https://www.selfhelphealing.co.uk/philo ... ss-of-god/
Yes, Oneness cannot be put into words in the same way that Redness cannot be put into words. These things can only be experienced. I have experienced Redness but I am still working on experiencing Oneness.
I agree with you Steve, that Oneness or for want of a better word (Nonduality) which is the same idea...definitely cannot be put into words in the context of how these words are to be understood by the one who ''apparently'' seeks to self inquire into the nature of reality.
So, 'Oneness' can now supposedly be even better explained, using just another word; 'Nonduality'.

Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm Of course, it's obvious that the word ONENESS that is now appearing here in front of the eyes in symbolic form translated from arranged letters on this computer screen certainly does look as if that is how the word Oneness is put into words...but that's just too obvious, and not what this subject is pointing to at all. And I think that you Steve do know this in your own wisdom. You know this is more about wisdom than it is about general knowledge.

The point of this thread topic is that the word Oneness/ which is just another word for Non-duality or even Consciousness....is to inform the MIND that the capacity to explain or describe this word Oneness/Non-duality is impossible.
So, the word 'Oneness' is now being ever better and further explained in and with more words like; 'Consciousness'.

LOL human beings trying to inform the One and only Mind that what It already KNOWS and completely understands in words can not be explained in words is truly absolutely hilarious.
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm First of all, the manifestation of any ''WORD'' is always sourced from ''thought'' which requires a (mind brain body mechanism) to process the ''thought'' and so the awareness of any ''thought'' is always known to be dualistic by it's very nature. But that is NOT what is actually being pointed to which is the Non-dual reality.

The world created by ''thought'', is the world of words, language, and concepts, and is the world of mentally constructed opposites.

But what this thread is really pointing to when we use the word (Non-duality) is something that goes beyond all of these mind-made opposites. But how can we talk about something that goes beyond opposites, when even our attempt to talk about non-duality via the idea of it is dualistic?

In fact the non-duality we speak of is not the opposite of anything. This is impossible to understand logically or rationally.
ALL-OF-THIS is ALREADY UNDERSTOOD logically AND rationally. In fact, ALL-OF-THIS is so UNDERSTOOD that it is so simple to explain in and with words.
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm To see what is being spoken of, we must go beyond our ordinary way of thinking and seeing.
Yes this is very true. Just going beyond he way 'you', human beings, think and see is exactly how ALL-OF-THIS can be UNDERSTOOD very easily.

Going beyond the way most human beings think and see, then one arrives at God or Nondual KNOWING and SEEING/UNDERSTANDING.
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm Some people are able to do this, and they are labeled Non-dualists. So Steve, you say you are still working on going beyond your ordinary way of thinking and seeing this Non-dual reality.

What we are really trying to do when we say ONENESS is to point to life as it is right now, before the appearance of concepts and labels are superimposed upon it, before 'thought' creates a world of conceptual words known as things...including ideas such as: me, you, past, future etc. This subject topic is about what is life before 'thought'
'Life' before 'thought' is what IS. What IS is extremely easy to KNOW, SEE, and UNDERSTAND. That is; once you learn or discover HOW to LOOK AT and SEE Life, Itself, HOW It really IS.
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm Can we even talk about that? Is it possible to capture Non-duality into words?
Yes VERY EASILY. But one has to be OPEN to talking about this and to the possibility that it is possible to explain in words. Obviously, if one is NOT open to this possibility, then there is no way they could learn and understand just how truly simple and easy it really IS.
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm The answer is blaringly and self evidently No, obviously.
LOL okay. If 'you' the concept and label believes so, then it MUST BE so, to 'you', and 'you' alone.
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm Even to be labeled a nondualist is the result of ridiculous dogmatic thinking coupled with the deluded mental attitude of righteous religiosity..
And unsurprisingly it was the labeled one "dontaskme" who was the one who came up with and made the label "nondualist" here. This is because of the OBVIOUS religious BELIEF that is being held onto so strongly by that one known and self-labeled "dontaskme".
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm like this for example: > ''You are dualistic and I am non-dualistic'' or I am more non-dual than you. But this is just turning further and further away from the point of this subject even more.... In truth, Non-duality is NOT a religion nor is it a theory, or an ism.
Yet it was 'you', "dontaskme", who wrote: Some people are able to do this, and they are labeled Non-dualists.

So, what you, your "self", says leads further and further away from the point of this subject even more is the very thing you do here.
Dontaskme wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:08 pm Non-dualists are more interested in the truth of Non-duality. Not the dogmatic thinking about it.

.
Once again, 'you' use the words "non-dualists" inferring that there are some separate selfs who are "non-dualists" and some who are "dualists".

I do not think I have met a more contradictory writer than the one known as "dontaskme".
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by SteveKlinko »

Skepdick wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 2:04 pm
SteveKlinko wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:22 pm "Yes, Oneness cannot be put into words in the same way that Redness cannot be put into words".
And in response to that I said: You just succeeded putting into words that which (apparently) can't be put into words.

What was it that you put in to words, if it wasn't Oneness and Redness?
SteveKlinko wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:22 pm So why would you ask such a question except that you are trying to Disrupt, Divert, and Obfuscate the conversation? Do you have anything to say about Oneness, Redness, or Consciousness?
Steve, you are really REALLY confused. So confused that you are actually lying. I didn't ask any questions. I made a statement.

Observe the punctuation used at the end of my sentence. It's not a question mark.
Skepdick wrote: Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:00 pm You just succeeded putting into words that which (apparently) can't be put into words.
You of course did ask a question. You must not be Conscious of your posts. This is from your own post:
Can "Oneness" and "Redness" be put into words or not? This is not a word-play - this is a yes/no question.
This sure seems like a question to me.
You are Obfuscating and Diverting attention from the whole topic of Oneness. To say that, writing out the word Oneness, is putting Oneness to words is simply a grammar school prank. You obviously have nothing constructive to add to this or any other Conversation because this is all you ever do.
Skepdick
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Skepdick »

SteveKlinko wrote: Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:29 pm You of course did ask a question. You must not be Conscious of your posts. This is from your own post:
Can "Oneness" and "Redness" be put into words or not? This is not a word-play - this is a yes/no question.
This sure seems like a question to me.
Steve, do you know what a rhetorical question is?

It's a question that doesn't need an answer because it answers itself.
SteveKlinko wrote: Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:29 pm You are Obfuscating and Diverting attention from the whole topic of Oneness. To say that, writing out the word Oneness, is putting Oneness to words is simply a grammar school prank.
If expressing the word "Oneness" is not putting "Oneness" into a word, then what the hell is?!?!?
SteveKlinko wrote: Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:29 pm You obviously have nothing constructive to add to this or any other Conversation because this is all you ever do.
Steve, I am speaking truth. The word "Oneness" is a word. The statement "Oneness cannot be put into a word" is self-contradictory.

If you are going to throw false allegations at me, I might just assume you are being intentionally malicious.
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Dontaskme »

Skepdick wrote: Fri Feb 28, 2020 7:38 pmIf expressing the word "Oneness" is not putting "Oneness" into a word, then what the hell is?!?!?
There is nothing explaining the word oneness.

No 'entity' known as a 'person' ever explained anything using words, this is the whole point of what this thread is pointing to. ''No one or thing'' not even the WORD explained anything.

A word is an appearance from right out of the void, and that which is of the void is nothing but the void. Every word is empty to the core.

And yes, for some phantoms who believe in their own phantom existence that do not actually exist as that non-existent belief could be likened to hell.
Skepdick
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Skepdick »

Dontaskme wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 9:40 am There is nothing explaining the word oneness.
Do you understand the difference between expressing and explaining oneness?

"putting things into words" is expression.

You have expressed "Oneness" in words.
Steve has expressed "Oneness" in words.
Skepdick
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Skepdick »

Dontaskme wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 9:40 am No 'entity' known as a 'person' ever explained anything using words, this is the whole point of what this thread is pointing to. ''No one or thing'' not even the WORD explained anything.
So, what is it that you are doing right now, then?

It seems to me that you are explaining why things can't be explained. You are doing it using words.
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Dontaskme »

Skepdick wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 12:03 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 9:40 am No 'entity' known as a 'person' ever explained anything using words, this is the whole point of what this thread is pointing to. ''No one or thing'' not even the WORD explained anything.
So, what is it that you are doing right now, then?

It seems to me that you are explaining why things can't be explained. You are doing it using words.
Why don't you explain this ''You'' Word that is claimed to be doing what it's not doing, without using words ?

.
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by bahman »

Dontaskme wrote: Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:31 pm One cannot fully explain Oneness in words, just as one cannot fully explain feelings in words, however, the connection one feels when they realize Oneness is what allows one to recognize it.

As soon as we use language to define The Source, we have tainted our understanding of The Source. When it comes to Oneness, it is a similar story. Oneness cannot be defined with words because Oneness is a state of being that can only be realized.

WHAT IS THE PHILOSOPHY OF ONENESS?
What is the philosophy of Oneness of God and what does Oneness really mean?



Source: https://www.selfhelphealing.co.uk/philo ... ss-of-god/
I once experienced oneness. I once apprehended mind. I cannot make those experiences again or explain them by words. Oneness is a sort of experience of a very specific mental state. It is very rare though, not like love and hate.
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Dontaskme »

bahman wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 9:51 pm I once experienced oneness. I once apprehended mind. I cannot make those experiences again or explain them by words. Oneness is a sort of experience of a very specific mental state. It is very rare though, not like love and hate.
The I does not experience oneness.

The notion of an 'I' experiencing itself ..is a 'thought'.

The 'thought' is an appearance of oneness that you already are prior to the 'thought' which is not what oneness is.

Follow the "I" inwards into itself. Do not associate it with any thought, feeling or perception to discover that you are obviously the 'thoughtless' witness of the 'thought' not the 'thought'.

The 'thoughtless' state cannot be put into words without making it a word which it is not. But this confuses the mind, but does not confuse the mind that has transcended itself to arrive at oneness, which is a rare state for the mind like you say. . because there are not many people willing to admit they have never existed except as an empty 'thought'

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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Skepdick »

Dontaskme wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:10 pm Why don't you explain this ''You'' Word that is claimed to be doing what it's not doing, without using words ?
Why don't you explain what you mean by 'without using words' ?
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Dontaskme »

Skepdick wrote: Sun Mar 01, 2020 10:58 am
Dontaskme wrote: Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:10 pm Why don't you explain this ''You'' Word that is claimed to be doing what it's not doing, without using words ?
Why don't you explain what you mean by 'without using words' ?
Words divide albeit illusory what is ultimately indivisible.

I AM ''THAT'' and you are too.

''When the bubble of ignorance bursts the self realizes its oneness with the indivisible Self. Words that proceed from the Source of Truth have real meaning. But when men speak these words as their own, the words become meaningless.''

''Even faith in God is only a stage on the way. Ultimately you abandon all, for you come to something so simple that there are no words to express it.''


Skeptic, if you insist that Oneness can be put into words, I have no problem with that. You can convince yourself of anything you want, if that's what you so desire.
But, all I'm saying is that I don't agree with what you have already convinced yourself of, so I have no actual argument with that. That said, I prefer to stick to my own unique meaning and understanding of oneness.

If you are seaching for meaning in what I write, then you will be disappointed with my responses because what is being pointed to using words has no requirement for words to BE what it is.

So anything I say to you will be of no use for you especially if you persist in looking for what you are looking for in some other source other than your own 'direct experience' which is the only REAL TRUE source available.

.
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by Dontaskme »

Image


This kind of knowing is without knowing, without the narrative of the mental noise of concepts.

A knowing so deep it is ONE without words.

.
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Re: Oneness cannot be completely explained using words.

Post by SteveKlinko »

Skepdick wrote: Fri Feb 28, 2020 7:38 pm
SteveKlinko wrote: Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:29 pm You of course did ask a question. You must not be Conscious of your posts. This is from your own post:
Can "Oneness" and "Redness" be put into words or not? This is not a word-play - this is a yes/no question.
This sure seems like a question to me.
Steve, do you know what a rhetorical question is?

It's a question that doesn't need an answer because it answers itself.
SteveKlinko wrote: Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:29 pm You are Obfuscating and Diverting attention from the whole topic of Oneness. To say that, writing out the word Oneness, is putting Oneness to words is simply a grammar school prank.
If expressing the word "Oneness" is not putting "Oneness" into a word, then what the hell is?!?!?
SteveKlinko wrote: Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:29 pm You obviously have nothing constructive to add to this or any other Conversation because this is all you ever do.
Steve, I am speaking truth. The word "Oneness" is a word. The statement "Oneness cannot be put into a word" is self-contradictory.

If you are going to throw false allegations at me, I might just assume you are being intentionally malicious.
Here is your question again:
Can "Oneness" and "Redness" be put into words or not? This is not a word-play - this is a yes/no question.

That was no rhetorical question.
You even emphasize a yes/no answer.

I know you must know what a rhetorical question actually is so this is a pure grammar school prank again.
You just continue to play juvenile word games.

Back to the question of this topic, which you are trying to obstruct, and in your manner of speaking:
What the hell is Oneness?!?!?
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