Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am There are no words to describe Oneness fully.
Yes there is, 'Oneness' being just one of those words, as you have just shown and proven here now.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is referred to as ''THIS'' or ''ISNESS'' and is as close as we can get to defining Oneness using language.
We can get much closer.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is just another word for Infinity. So how can the whole of infinity that is constantly changing from moment to moment be put into words - defining the constant flux of Infinity Oneness is to freeze frame the flow.
By just putting into words, like for example, 'Oneness, which is infinity in the constantly-changing HERE-NOW, is how the WHOLE can be put into words - very simply and very easily.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am So again I'd rather stick with my personal bone of contention which informs Oneness cannot be touched by words in no way shape or form.
So, once again, the personal little one known as "dontaskme" believes it knows more than 'I' God does, and that little one believes that in the ever-changing infiniteness of the One and WHOLE Universe forever more this One will never be able to find and use the 'right' words.

Although ALL the evidence in the Universe is pointing to the fact that words are an ever evolving thing, better explaining and describing what the Universe IS, and how It works, all the time, the one known as "dontaskme" thinks and believes that one knows more.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is realising a unity that goes beyond the physical Universe.
Are you at all able to explain how there is a unity that goes beyond the physical Universe?

There is a way to explain and describe this very simply so that this realization is easily fully understood by the way, in case you could not answer that question.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Therefore Oneness is beyond the ability of the limited finite human brain and mind to understand it using words.
There is NO human "mind".

Also, ALL-OF-THIS has already been worked out and understood.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Believe what you want Age with your limited brains capacity to understand infinity.
In case you have forgotten or just are completely incapable of learning and understanding this but I neither believe or disbelieve anything.

And, in case you have also forgotten I already understand infinity, and also understand how to explain It in words, very simply and very easily by the way. Did you forget that it is 'you' that cannot understand infinity in words?
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am But don't expect other people also with the capacity to think about this subject to be obliged to go along with your personal limited non-belief from the perspective of your brain which will one day be dead.
So, are 'you' now saying there really is separateness?
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Again, Oneness cannot be a finite experience, it can only be realised not spoken. No other person is obliged to go along with 'MY' idea either.

So I guess it's check mate for this face off.

.
This is only 'your' conclusion, which is based on your obviously very limited perception of this, and on your very limited ability to want to learn and discover more and anew.

'Oneness' is a word, which can not only be realized but also obviously spoken of.

There is also so much more to uncover, and reveal.
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Dontaskme
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Dontaskme »

Age wrote: Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:34 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am There are no words to describe Oneness fully.
Yes there is, 'Oneness' being just one of those words, as you have just shown and proven here now.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is referred to as ''THIS'' or ''ISNESS'' and is as close as we can get to defining Oneness using language.
We can get much closer.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is just another word for Infinity. So how can the whole of infinity that is constantly changing from moment to moment be put into words - defining the constant flux of Infinity Oneness is to freeze frame the flow.
By just putting into words, like for example, 'Oneness, which is infinity in the constantly-changing HERE-NOW, is how the WHOLE can be put into words - very simply and very easily.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am So again I'd rather stick with my personal bone of contention which informs Oneness cannot be touched by words in no way shape or form.
So, once again, the personal little one known as "dontaskme" believes it knows more than 'I' God does, and that little one believes that in the ever-changing infiniteness of the One and WHOLE Universe forever more this One will never be able to find and use the 'right' words.

Although ALL the evidence in the Universe is pointing to the fact that words are an ever evolving thing, better explaining and describing what the Universe IS, and how It works, all the time, the one known as "dontaskme" thinks and believes that one knows more.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is realising a unity that goes beyond the physical Universe.
Are you at all able to explain how there is a unity that goes beyond the physical Universe?

There is a way to explain and describe this very simply so that this realization is easily fully understood by the way, in case you could not answer that question.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Therefore Oneness is beyond the ability of the limited finite human brain and mind to understand it using words.
There is NO human "mind".

Also, ALL-OF-THIS has already been worked out and understood.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Believe what you want Age with your limited brains capacity to understand infinity.
In case you have forgotten or just are completely incapable of learning and understanding this but I neither believe or disbelieve anything.

And, in case you have also forgotten I already understand infinity, and also understand how to explain It in words, very simply and very easily by the way. Did you forget that it is 'you' that cannot understand infinity in words?
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am But don't expect other people also with the capacity to think about this subject to be obliged to go along with your personal limited non-belief from the perspective of your brain which will one day be dead.
So, are 'you' now saying there really is separateness?
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Again, Oneness cannot be a finite experience, it can only be realised not spoken. No other person is obliged to go along with 'MY' idea either.

So I guess it's check mate for this face off.

.
This is only 'your' conclusion, which is based on your obviously very limited perception of this, and on your very limited ability to want to learn and discover more and anew.

'Oneness' is a word, which can not only be realized but also obviously spoken of.

There is also so much more to uncover, and reveal.
I disagree with all your responses.

.
Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Sun Feb 16, 2020 9:15 am
Age wrote: Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:34 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am There are no words to describe Oneness fully.
Yes there is, 'Oneness' being just one of those words, as you have just shown and proven here now.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is referred to as ''THIS'' or ''ISNESS'' and is as close as we can get to defining Oneness using language.
We can get much closer.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is just another word for Infinity. So how can the whole of infinity that is constantly changing from moment to moment be put into words - defining the constant flux of Infinity Oneness is to freeze frame the flow.
By just putting into words, like for example, 'Oneness, which is infinity in the constantly-changing HERE-NOW, is how the WHOLE can be put into words - very simply and very easily.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am So again I'd rather stick with my personal bone of contention which informs Oneness cannot be touched by words in no way shape or form.
So, once again, the personal little one known as "dontaskme" believes it knows more than 'I' God does, and that little one believes that in the ever-changing infiniteness of the One and WHOLE Universe forever more this One will never be able to find and use the 'right' words.

Although ALL the evidence in the Universe is pointing to the fact that words are an ever evolving thing, better explaining and describing what the Universe IS, and how It works, all the time, the one known as "dontaskme" thinks and believes that one knows more.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Oneness is realising a unity that goes beyond the physical Universe.
Are you at all able to explain how there is a unity that goes beyond the physical Universe?

There is a way to explain and describe this very simply so that this realization is easily fully understood by the way, in case you could not answer that question.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Therefore Oneness is beyond the ability of the limited finite human brain and mind to understand it using words.
There is NO human "mind".

Also, ALL-OF-THIS has already been worked out and understood.
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Believe what you want Age with your limited brains capacity to understand infinity.
In case you have forgotten or just are completely incapable of learning and understanding this but I neither believe or disbelieve anything.

And, in case you have also forgotten I already understand infinity, and also understand how to explain It in words, very simply and very easily by the way. Did you forget that it is 'you' that cannot understand infinity in words?
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am But don't expect other people also with the capacity to think about this subject to be obliged to go along with your personal limited non-belief from the perspective of your brain which will one day be dead.
So, are 'you' now saying there really is separateness?
Dontaskme wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:59 am Again, Oneness cannot be a finite experience, it can only be realised not spoken. No other person is obliged to go along with 'MY' idea either.

So I guess it's check mate for this face off.

.
This is only 'your' conclusion, which is based on your obviously very limited perception of this, and on your very limited ability to want to learn and discover more and anew.

'Oneness' is a word, which can not only be realized but also obviously spoken of.

There is also so much more to uncover, and reveal.
I disagree with all your responses.

.
That is great and perfect.
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Dontaskme »

Dontaskme wrote: Sun Feb 16, 2020 9:15 am I disagree with all your responses.
Age wrote: Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:34 pmThat is great and perfect.
What is great and perfect is to .... "Research your own experience; absorb what is useful, reject what is useless and add what is essentially your own."


.
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Dontaskme »

Age wrote: Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:34 pm'Oneness' is a word, which can not only be realized but also obviously spoken of.
You are missing the point as usual. We are discussing the 'who or what' is the 'conscious being' that is believed to live and die.
ONE doesn't need to believe ONE is, for this is self evident. But then to claim this ONE lives and dies is a belief, a belief born of knowledge which is just an appearance within what already IS consciousness.

A ''word'' is an apearance of consciousness- it's a known concept of consciousness. But here in this topic we are trying to get to the actual consciousness that is aware of each concept and not focus on the known appearance of that consciousness.

...So here it is seen that the WORD '' Consciousness'' is not what consciousness is, nor is it the experience of consciousness explained, rather the 'word' is an appearance in it....for example: if the known concept 'water' was the actual 'water' ....then explain using the word 'water' what the experience of being 'WATER' is like for you?
What is the experience of being WATER?...can you explain that experience?

Alternatively, explain in words what the experience of being a ''beer bottle'' is like for you?

This is the point being made here. In other words explain in words the experience of being conscious.. of oneness/consciousness itself?

I say the experience of being conscious cannot be spoken about because words will never be THE EXPERIENCER....words are only the appearances of THE EXPERIENCER....NOT the actual experiencer. The experiencer has no concept of itself AT ALL without then turning itself into a word, which it is NOT...in the same context the 'word water' is not the water.

I've talked about this many times, but it seems to falling on deaf ears...so be it.



.
surreptitious57
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by surreptitious57 »

Age wrote:
There is NO human mind

ALL OF THIS has already been worked out and understood
There is no human mind from your perspective but this view is not a universal one neither is it demonstrable
And it may already have been worked out and understood but only from your perspective not everyone elses

To me the human mind is the functioning of the human brain although often the two are taken to be the same
So the brain is the actual physical organ and the mind is what the brain does when it is active within the body
When the body dies the brain still exists but as it is no longer active then the mind ceases when the body dies
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by surreptitious57 »

Age wrote:
There is also so much more to uncover and reveal
There is indeed because knowledge can never be absolute even though it does increase over time
But new knowledge still leads to greater understanding because it is how we advance as a species
Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:02 am
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Feb 16, 2020 9:15 am I disagree with all your responses.
Age wrote: Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:34 pmThat is great and perfect.
What is great and perfect is to .... "Research your own experience; absorb what is useful, reject what is useless and add what is essentially your own."


.
Already done that.
Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 am
Age wrote: Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:34 pm'Oneness' is a word, which can not only be realized but also obviously spoken of.
You are missing the point as usual. We are discussing the 'who or what' is the 'conscious being' that is believed to live and die.
Is that what 'you' are talking about?

Sometimes you appear to be talking about thee One who and what does not die.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amONE doesn't need to believe ONE is, for this is self evident.
Remember it is thee 'I' who neither believes nor disbelieves any thing, and it is thee 'you' who believes and disbelieves things.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amBut then to claim this ONE lives and dies is a belief, a belief born of knowledge which is just an appearance within what already IS consciousness.
I have never ever thought that, let alone believed that. You are the only one I know who is talking about this.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amA ''word'' is an apearance of consciousness- it's a known concept of consciousness. But here in this topic we are trying to get to the actual consciousness that is aware of each concept and not focus on the known appearance of that consciousness.
I KNOW, and that is WHY I have said what I have here.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 am...So here it is seen that the WORD '' Consciousness'' is not what consciousness is, nor is it the experience of consciousness explained, rather the 'word' is an appearance in it....for example: if the known concept 'water' was the actual 'water' ....then explain using the word 'water' what the experience of being 'WATER' is like for you?
That is very easy and very simple to do. That is; when 'you' explain who and what the 'you' is here in your question.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amWhat is the experience of being WATER?...can you explain that experience?
Only One can explain the experience of thy Self, to thy Self. But, then thy would not have to. If they already knew a language and/or words, then they would already know.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amAlternatively, explain in words what the experience of being a ''beer bottle'' is like for you?
But only a beer bottle would know that.

Just like 'I' thee one and only One already KNOW the experience of BEING this Oneness.

By the way, this is extremely very simple and easy to explain, and understand. As I have been telling 'you'.

'you' just need to become Truly Honest to also understand this FULLY.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amThis is the point being made here. In other words explain in words the experience of being conscious.. of oneness/consciousness itself?
Already done. Now fully understood and KNOWN.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amI say the experience of being conscious cannot be spoken about because words will never be THE EXPERIENCER....words are only the appearances of THE EXPERIENCER....NOT the actual experiencer.
I KNOW this is what 'you' believe is the absolute truth.

You have expressed your beliefs many times here already.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amThe experiencer has no concept of itself AT ALL without then turning itself into a word, which it is NOT...in the same context the 'word water' is not the water.
But the Experiencer ALREADY knows who and what 'It' IS. Once 'you' also discover or learn and know and understand the proper and correct answer to the question, 'Who am 'I'? then understanding how the Experiencer knows Itself will also be understood better.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:57 amI've talked about this many times, but it seems to falling on deaf ears...so be it.
.
You can tell Me that I do not have a concept of, or do know who and what I am, as many times as 'you' like, but remember 'you' are not 'I'.
Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:13 am
Age wrote:
There is NO human mind

ALL OF THIS has already been worked out and understood
There is no human mind from your perspective but this view is not a universal one neither is it demonstrable
How many views that you know of that are actually universal?

And is a human mind demonstrable?
If yes, then how?

Also, yes the above is from my perspective.
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:13 amAnd it may already have been worked out and understood but only from your perspective not everyone elses.
This is very, very, very True.
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:13 amTo me the human mind is the functioning of the human brain although often the two are taken to be the same
Is this a universal view? And is it demonstrable?
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:13 amSo the brain is the actual physical organ and the mind is what the brain does when it is active within the body
When the body dies the brain still exists but as it is no longer active then the mind ceases when the body dies
So, what exactly is the actual activity that the brain does, which you say is the "mind"?

And do ALL human brains do this exact same thing, or is what the brain does different to all different brains?
Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:20 am
Age wrote:
There is also so much more to uncover and reveal
There is indeed because knowledge can never be absolute even though it does increase over time
But new knowledge still leads to greater understanding because it is how we advance as a species
The more to uncover and reveal, which I was specifically referring to, is what leads to the greater understanding and the KNOWING so that one can see the big, whole, and perfect True picture of Life, Itself, already.
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by surreptitious57 »

Age wrote:
How many views that you know of that are actually universal ?

And is a human mind demonstrable ?

So what exactly is the actual activity that the brain does which you say is the mind ?

And do ALL human brains do this exact same thing or is what the brain does different to all different brains ?
There are truths that are universal because they are so obviously and demonstrably true
And so for example the truth that without any water the human body will eventually die

The functioning of the human brain is very demonstrable indeed
As electrical activity within it can be observed with a brain scan

Everything that the brain does while the body is alive is the functioning of the mind
This is true even when the body is asleep as the brain never stops till the body dies

I think there may be some differences between some brains but beyond that I cannot say
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Dontaskme »

DAM: Alternatively, explain in words what the experience of being a ''beer bottle'' is like for you?
Age wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 3:11 pmBut only a beer bottle would know that.

Just like 'I' thee one and only One already KNOW the experience of BEING this Oneness.
But Oneness is all inclusive of everything, including the beer bottle. So again explain the experience of being a 'beer bottle'

If it's easy and simply explained in words, then describe in words the experience of what being a 'beer bottle' is like?

I'll await your ridiculous answer.

.
Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:19 pm
DAM: Alternatively, explain in words what the experience of being a ''beer bottle'' is like for you?
Age wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 3:11 pmBut only a beer bottle would know that.

Just like 'I' thee one and only One already KNOW the experience of BEING this Oneness.
But Oneness is all inclusive of everything, including the beer bottle. So again explain the experience of being a 'beer bottle'

If it's easy and simply explained in words, then describe in words the experience of what being a 'beer bottle' is like?

I'll await your ridiculous answer.

.
But 'who' do 'you' want 'me' to explain the experience of what being a 'beer bottle' is like?

By the way, the 'beer bottle' does not have the ability to experience like the 'you' and thee 'I' do.
Age
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Re: Reincarnation. Who or what would reincarnate? (explained)

Post by Age »

surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:17 pm
Age wrote:
How many views that you know of that are actually universal ?

And is a human mind demonstrable ?

So what exactly is the actual activity that the brain does which you say is the mind ?

And do ALL human brains do this exact same thing or is what the brain does different to all different brains ?
There are truths that are universal because they are so obviously and demonstrably true
And so for example the truth that without any water the human body will eventually die

The functioning of the human brain is very demonstrable indeed
As electrical activity within it can be observed with a brain scan

Everything that the brain does while the body is alive is the functioning of the mind
How does this 'everything that the brain does' relate to this 'the functioning of the mind'?

What exactly is both of these things?
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:17 pmThis is true even when the body is asleep as the brain never stops till the body dies

I think there may be some differences between some brains but beyond that I cannot say
So, do you think there are as many minds as there are human brains "doing"?
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