Perception and Consciousness

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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Dontaskme
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:26 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:22 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:22 pm
How do you know that consciousness is a by-product of the brain?
I don't have any knowledge.
Then stop pretending that you do and realise you don't have to pretend you know...you are the unknown knowing, you are source, you are consciousness, you are not in your brain...no more that an artist is in the picture he paints.

.

Logik
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Logik » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:30 pm

Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:26 pm
Then stop pretending that you do and realise you don't have to pretend you know...you are the unknown knowing, you are source, you are consciousness, you are not in your brain...no more that an artist is in the picture he paints.
When did I ever claim or pretend to have any knowledge?

I just said I am trying to build a digital consciousness.

And if I am an AI (as you earlier claimed) that's bad news for you. Because you can't even tell that I am not a consciousness.

You are debating a robot right now.

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Dontaskme
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:34 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:30 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:26 pm
Then stop pretending that you do and realise you don't have to pretend you know...you are the unknown knowing, you are source, you are consciousness, you are not in your brain...no more that an artist is in the picture he paints.
When did I ever claim or pretend to have any knowledge?

I just said I am trying to build a digital consciousness.
You made a claim previously that consciousness is a by-product of the brain..that it is an emrgence of the brain...maybe you don't have any knowledge of that...that's ok, but you did state that ...so if you haven't got any knowledge of that yourself, then who told you that consciousness is a by-product of the brain? which you obviously believe is true otherwise you wouldn't have said it ...

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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:40 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:30 pm

And if I am an AI (as you earlier claimed) that's bad news for you. Because you can't even tell that I am not a consciousness.

You are debating a robot right now.
No Logik, you are trying to pull a fast one here...I know from first person direct experience what I am and what I am not.
I can tell the difference, the difference being there isn't one.

There is only undifferentiated consciousness...dreaming difference where there is none.

Who you think you are is the AI ..consciousness is totally real.

Over to you...

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Logik
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Logik » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:43 pm

Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:34 pm
You made a claim previously that consciousness is a by-product of the brain..that it is an emrgence of the brain...maybe you don't have any knowledge of that...that's ok, but you did state that ...so if you haven't got any knowledge of that yourself, then who told you that consciousness is a by-product of the brain? which you obviously believe is true otherwise you wouldn't have said it ...
It's just a theory.

If you demonstrate to me that consciousness is elsewhere then I will change my mind.

If you don't know what consciousness IS then how do you know WHERE consciousness is or isn't?

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Dontaskme
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:48 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:43 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:34 pm
You made a claim previously that consciousness is a by-product of the brain..that it is an emrgence of the brain...maybe you don't have any knowledge of that...that's ok, but you did state that ...so if you haven't got any knowledge of that yourself, then who told you that consciousness is a by-product of the brain? which you obviously believe is true otherwise you wouldn't have said it ...
It's just a theory.

If you demonstrate to me that consciousness is elsewhere then I will change my mind.

If you don't know what consciousness IS then how do you know WHERE consciousness is or isn't?

It's not a theory, theory is back in the dream character, the realm of knowledge.

You are, you do not have to theorise or think yourself into being, you are without a shadow of a doubt.

Consciousness is not somewhere else other than where you already are right here and now..nowhere.

It can't be pinned down no more than a rainbow can be put in a jar..where is the exact location of a rainbow?

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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:59 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:43 pm


If you demonstrate to me that consciousness is elsewhere then I will change my mind.
Nothing can see itself. Consciousness another word for no thing is the seeing that cannot see itself.

That's why it is not helpful to assume that you know where consciousness originates, you see consciousness is already an original, it has no copyright, it's all encompassing auspicious seeing right now embodied within itself.



Consciousness is another word for LIGHT ...light is not a by-product of the brain..the brain is LIGHT it's an illusory form of the formless.

.
Last edited by Dontaskme on Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Logik
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Logik » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:01 pm

Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:59 pm
Nothing can see itself. Consciousness another word for no thing is the seeing that cannot see itself.

That's why it is not helpful to assume that you know where consciousness originates, you see consciousness is already an original, it has no copyright, it's all encompassing auspicious seeing right now embodied within itself.
Let me ask you this question. Is there one consciousness or many?

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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:05 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:01 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:59 pm
Nothing can see itself. Consciousness another word for no thing is the seeing that cannot see itself.

That's why it is not helpful to assume that you know where consciousness originates, you see consciousness is already an original, it has no copyright, it's all encompassing auspicious seeing right now embodied within itself.
Let me ask you this question. Is there one consciousness or many?

One.

How can there be many...consciousness is the many of the one.

It's always one.

Everything is consciousnesss...if there were many, then where is the dividing line that separates my consciousness from yours? where does consciousness begin and end? ..it can't be measured as such..

.

Logik
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Logik » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:06 pm

Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:05 pm
One.

How can there be many...consciousness is the many of the one.

It's always one.

Everything is consciousnesss...if there were many, then where is the dividing line that separates my consciousness from yours? where does consciousness begin and end? ..it can't be measured as such..

.
Is consciousness bigger or smaller than the universe?

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Dontaskme
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:15 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:06 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:05 pm
One.

How can there be many...consciousness is the many of the one.

It's always one.

Everything is consciousnesss...if there were many, then where is the dividing line that separates my consciousness from yours? where does consciousness begin and end? ..it can't be measured as such..

.
Is consciousness bigger or smaller than the universe?

There is no universe, the universe is a conceptual dream no one aka consciousness aka awareness is dreaming.

There is nothing behind the image of matter except the formless light projecting the form onto it's screen.

Just like a movie on the white screen, the movie appears real to the senses but there is nothing behind the movie but a blank screen...the contrast between pure invisible white light and visible colour is needed in order for the movie to WORK...look real, it is real and unreal at the same time.

In reality, there is no colour, for colour is actually the invisible light..the source of all colour is no colour, so colour is an illusion.

It's the same with everything else, the source of all things is no thing.

That's why the world of the seen is called the dream, and the dream is all there is.

.

Logik
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Logik » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:16 pm

Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:15 pm
There is no universe, the universe is a conceptual dream no one aka consciousness aka awareness is dreaming.
OK. I am out at this point :)

There's no use for me staying in your Solipsist dream.

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Dontaskme
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Dontaskme » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:31 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:16 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:15 pm
There is no universe, the universe is a conceptual dream no one aka consciousness aka awareness is dreaming.
OK. I am out at this point :)

There's no use for me staying in your Solipsist dream.
As long as you keep believing the dream belongs to a ''someone'', then you are stuck in an illusory temporal character you believe exists, just like you believe you are inside your body, especially inside the confines of your brain...... if that's what you believe, then you wont see the actual infinite vastness of who you really are... you are actually the infinite awareness aka consciousness in which the whole dream is arising....coming and going..you won't see that what you are does not come and go..you won't see that that which does not come and go is the only SELF there is here.

You are the dreamer, the dreaming and the dream all at once, and you are even beyond that...in the realm of the unknowable.

But who would believe this?

.

Ramu
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Ramu » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:49 pm

Logik wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:22 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:22 pm
How do you know that consciousness is a by-product of the brain?
I don't have any knowledge.
It's just funny that everyone reverts back to a metaphysical brain that according to some concept is somehow responsible for creating consciousness..and everything else. Where IS this brain occurring? If everything I'm perceiving is being perceived in a brain then where is this brain?

Logik
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Re: Perception and Consciousness

Post by Logik » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:51 pm

Ramu wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:49 pm
It's just funny that everyone reverts back to a metaphysical brain that according to some concept is somehow responsible for creating consciousness..and everything else. Where IS this brain occurring? If everything I'm perceiving is being perceived in a brain then where is this brain?
Another solipsist?

It is very fucking tricky to see your own brain. For medical AND practical reasons.

But it is VERY easy to see other people's brains!

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