awareness

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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jackles
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awareness

Post by jackles » Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:21 pm

is consciouse awareness relativity with or without objects in it.in other words is awareness unmoving relativity with moving things inside it that have a time space surface.

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Bill Wiltrack
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Re: awareness

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:12 pm

.




Holy shit...a real philosopher emerges...





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Ginkgo
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Re: awareness

Post by Ginkgo » Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:24 pm

jackles wrote:is consciouse awareness relativity with or without objects in it.in other words is awareness unmoving relativity with moving things inside it that have a time space surface.

In a way yes, In neurophilosophy awareness is given to be attention. The short answer( if such a think is possible) is attention and synchroneity. Attention creates synchroneity, so the conditions required for consciousness becomes the focus for the empirical evidence.

jackles
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Re: awareness

Post by jackles » Thu Feb 13, 2014 2:22 pm

i think there is a deep conection between relativity and consciouness.some forget the part that there own consciousness play in perceiving relativity between things moving or unmoving.

Blaggard
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Re: awareness

Post by Blaggard » Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:09 pm

Well relativity states that time is not the same for two, meh I was going to explain it in my own words but I don't have time ironically.
In physics, special relativity (SR, also known as the special theory of relativity or STR) is the accepted physical theory regarding the relationship between space and time. It is based on two postulates: (1) that the laws of physics are invariant (i.e., identical) in all inertial systems (non-accelerating frames of reference); and (2) that the speed of light in a vacuum is the same for all observers, regardless of the motion of the light source. It was originally proposed in 1905 by Albert Einstein in the paper "On the Electrodynamics of Moving Bodies".[1] The inconsistency of classical mechanics with Maxwell’s equations of electromagnetism led to the development of special relativity, which corrects classical mechanics to handle situations involving motions nearing the speed of light. As of today, special relativity is the most accurate model of motion at any speed. Even so, classical mechanics is still useful (due to its simplicity and high accuracy) as an approximation at small velocities relative to the speed of light.

Special relativity implies a wide range of consequences, which have been experimentally verified,[2] including length contraction, time dilation, relativistic mass, mass–energy equivalence, a universal speed limit, and relativity of simultaneity. It has replaced the conventional notion of an absolute universal time with the notion of a time that is dependent on reference frame and spatial position. Rather than an invariant time interval between two events, there is an invariant spacetime interval. Combined with other laws of physics, the two postulates of special relativity predict the equivalence of mass and energy, as expressed in the mass–energy equivalence formula E = mc2, where c is the speed of light in vacuum.[3][4]

A defining feature of special relativity is the replacement of the Galilean transformations of classical mechanics with the Lorentz transformations. Time and space cannot be defined separately from one another. Rather space and time are interwoven into a single continuum known as spacetime. Events that occur at the same time for one observer could occur at different times for another.

The theory is called "special" because it applied the principle of relativity only to the special case of inertial reference frames. Einstein later published a paper on general relativity in 1915 to apply the principle in the general case, that is, to any frame so as to handle general coordinate transformations, and gravitational effects.

As Galilean relativity is now considered an approximation of special relativity valid for low speeds, special relativity is considered an approximation of the theory of general relativity valid for weak gravitational fields. The presence of gravity becomes undetectable at sufficiently small-scale, free-falling conditions. General relativity incorporates noneuclidean geometry, so that the gravitational effects are represented by the geometric curvature of spacetime. Contrarily, special relativity is restricted to flat spacetime. The geometry of spacetime in special relativity is called Minkowski space. A locally Lorentz invariant frame that abides by Special relativity can be defined at sufficiently small scales, even in curved spacetime.

Galileo Galilei had already postulated that there is no absolute and well-defined state of rest (no privileged reference frames), a principle now called Galileo's principle of relativity. Einstein extended this principle so that it accounted for the constant speed of light,[5] a phenomenon that had been recently observed in the Michelson–Morley experiment. He also postulated that it holds for all the laws of physics, including both the laws of mechanics and of electrodynamics.[6]
and
Einstein discerned two fundamental propositions that seemed to be the most assured, regardless of the exact validity of the (then) known laws of either mechanics or electrodynamics. These propositions were the constancy of the speed of light and the independence of physical laws (especially the constancy of the speed of light) from the choice of inertial system. In his initial presentation of special relativity in 1905 he expressed these postulates as:[1]

The Principle of Relativity – The laws by which the states of physical systems undergo change are not affected, whether these changes of state be referred to the one or the other of two systems in uniform translatory motion relative to each other.[1]
The Principle of Invariant Light Speed – "... light is always propagated in empty space with a definite velocity [speed] c which is independent of the state of motion of the emitting body." (from the preface).[1] That is, light in vacuum propagates with the speed c (a fixed constant, independent of direction) in at least one system of inertial coordinates (the "stationary system"), regardless of the state of motion of the light source.

The derivation of special relativity depends not only on these two explicit postulates, but also on several tacit assumptions (made in almost all theories of physics), including the isotropy and homogeneity of space and the independence of measuring rods and clocks from their past history.[8]

Following Einstein's original presentation of special relativity in 1905, many different sets of postulates have been proposed in various alternative derivations.[9] However, the most common set of postulates remains those employed by Einstein in his original paper. A more mathematical statement of the Principle of Relativity made later by Einstein, which introduces the concept of simplicity not mentioned above is:

Special principle of relativity: If a system of coordinates K is chosen so that, in relation to it, physical laws hold good in their simplest form, the same laws hold good in relation to any other system of coordinates K' moving in uniform translation relatively to K.[10]

Henri Poincaré provided the mathematical framework for relativity theory by proving that Lorentz transformations are a subset of his Poincaré group of symmetry transformations. Einstein later derived these transformations from his axioms.

Many of Einstein's papers present derivations of the Lorentz transformation based upon these two principles.[11]

Einstein consistently based the derivation of Lorentz invariance (the essential core of special relativity) on just the two basic principles of relativity and light-speed invariance. He wrote:

The insight fundamental for the special theory of relativity is this: The assumptions relativity and light speed invariance are compatible if relations of a new type ("Lorentz transformation") are postulated for the conversion of coordinates and times of events... The universal principle of the special theory of relativity is contained in the postulate: The laws of physics are invariant with respect to Lorentz transformations (for the transition from one inertial system to any other arbitrarily chosen inertial system). This is a restricting principle for natural laws...[7]

Thus many modern treatments of special relativity base it on the single postulate of universal Lorentz covariance, or, equivalently, on the single postulate of Minkowski spacetime.[12][13]

From the principle of relativity alone without assuming the constancy of the speed of light (i.e. using the isotropy of space and the symmetry implied by the principle of special relativity) one can show that the spacetime transformations between inertial frames are either Euclidean, Galilean, or Lorentzian. In the Lorentzian case, one can then obtain relativistic interval conservation and a certain finite limiting speed. Experiments suggest that this speed is the speed of light in vacuum.[14][15]

The constancy of the speed of light was motivated by Maxwell's theory of electromagnetism and the lack of evidence for the luminiferous ether. There is conflicting evidence on the extent to which Einstein was influenced by the null result of the Michelson–Morley experiment.[16][17] In any case, the null result of the Michelson–Morley experiment helped the notion of the constancy of the speed of light gain widespread and rapid acceptance.
Lazy I know but, time flies and there is no rest for the wicked. ;)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_relativity

I made a physics joke, yeah I know it wasn't funny. ;)

jackles
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Re: awareness

Post by jackles » Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:09 pm

yeah blogs thats relativity from a view assuming the observer is relative in the same way other things or objects are .my whole piont is that i think this is not the case as in the consciousness of the observer.all im saying is the relativity between objects or for that matter anything else cant not be described as anything .but its there non the less as is consciousness.are they consciousness and relativity indistguishable at a certain level.in other words is relative consciousness the vertial omni presenter.

Blaggard
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Re: awareness

Post by Blaggard » Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:30 pm

Yeah but what you just said makes absolutely no sense Jackles and that is the problem.

jackles
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Re: awareness

Post by jackles » Fri Feb 14, 2014 12:04 am

blags you are a spooky action at a distance .dennier .so they do exist spooky denniers.

Blaggard
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Re: awareness

Post by Blaggard » Fri Feb 14, 2014 12:06 am

I don't deny anything Jackles everything you have said is complete nonsense it's hard to deny utter nonsense.

Ginkgo
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Re: awareness

Post by Ginkgo » Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:13 am

jackles wrote:i think there is a deep conection between relativity and consciouness.some forget the part that there own consciousness play in perceiving relativity between things moving or unmoving.
Hi jackles,

Perhaps we could look at relativity in this way:

Imagine, you are in the rear of a train traveling in a straight line at a constant speed to 80 kph. Also image that the ride is perfectly smooth ( unrealistic I know).

You suddenly see a person vacate the toilet at the front of the carriage. In order to beat any other passenger intent on 'relieving themselves', you jump to your feet and run down the aisle at a speed of 10 kph. As far as the other passenger are concerned they see you running at 10kph and this is an accurate representation of your speed from the point of view of the passengers and yourself.

Also imagine a persons standing on the side of the tracks witnessing this event. From their point of view, you are not running at 10kph you are actually running at 90 kph.

jackles
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Re: awareness

Post by jackles » Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:38 am

thats exactly my point ginkgo.relativity is presenting the action to the observer whos consciousnesss is not moving cos it consciousness is the relativity.consciousness is the relativity of the of the moving objects in the brain.so consciousness is nothing with something inside it.

Ginkgo
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Re: awareness

Post by Ginkgo » Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:00 am

jackles wrote:thats exactly my point ginkgo.relativity is presenting the action to the observer whos consciousnesss is not moving cos it consciousness is the relativity.consciousness is the relativity of the of the moving objects in the brain.so consciousness is nothing with something inside it.
You've lost me a bit here.

What about the passengers who are actually moving in the train?

jackles
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Re: awareness

Post by jackles » Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:15 am

the consciouses of all observers concerned in the event is the relativity in the event as exprience from there frames referance.consciousness is the un moving common denominator of the event.the individuals are only individuals from the perspective of there brains identity of its self.the consciouse over self or common self is presenting the event and is the whole event and the relativity in the event.relativity is indistinguishable.the objects are just energy changing state or changing presentation to the observers omni unmoving common super position.
Last edited by jackles on Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

Ginkgo
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Re: awareness

Post by Ginkgo » Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:23 am

jackles wrote:the consciouses of all observers concerned in the event are the relativity in the event as exprience from there frame of referance.consciousness is the common denominator of the event.the individuals are only individuals from the perspective of there brains identity of its self.the consciouse over self or common self is presenting the event and is the whole event and the relativity in the event.
I think I see.

So how do you explain the ability to accurately measure the speed of a person running inside a carriage, i.e. running at 10 kph; while using similar measuring devices, the person who is the stationary observer measures the speed at 90 kph? That is to say verification independent of the conscious observer(s)

jackles
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Re: awareness

Post by jackles » Fri Feb 14, 2014 12:14 pm

all observers are part of all events seen or unseen.you your self are the super position of being all observers at once but with the restriction of your own brain perspective of an event.s all relativity between objects is then the never happen happened.the exact same never happened nonlocality that presents spooky action.

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