If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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dattaswami
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Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:42 am

If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins

Post by dattaswami »

CONCEPT OF GOD IS TRUE

It is true that a few people exploited the concept of God for personal benefits. But, based on the few exceptions, you should not remove the basic system itself. A few railway accidents happen and due to such accidents, you should not cancel all the trains. You should concentrate to avoid the accidents. Similarly, some students might have copied in the examinations. Try to catch, such students. But, do not remove the system of examination itself. The system serves majority, doing a lot of good. You forget the vast positive side of the system based on the minor negative side. The concept of God controls the sin in the society.

If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins since already the ways to escape the punishment in courts are already available. The society will be crushed into pieces in the absence of the fear for sin. If God disappears, the hell disappears subsequently. The concept of sin will drown and destroy the society like a Tsunami. However, this does not mean that the concept of God is again a created view only to save the society. Such conclusions are not correct. The concept of God is basically true and we have explained the positive side of such concept. It is a real concept and hence, the positive side is also real. Of course, the minor negative side is also real and control should be implemented to keep such negative exploitations in check.

God Himself comes down in human form to give practical proof for the existence of the unimaginable God through the exhibition of unimaginable events called as miracles. Jesus told that He has come down to fulfill, what is said in the scripture. Krishna also said that He came down since there is a necessity and He said that He will come down whenever there is a necessity. The necessity is the requirement of practical proof for the theoretical explanation of God given in the scripture. Then only, the validity comes. Science is valid since every concept in the book is experimentally proven in the laboratory. A student of science always attends the practical class in the laboratory after the theory class.

The doubt about the existence of God is quite natural because there is every chance to doubt about the existence of anything, which is not understood even by intensive imagination. The human incarnation declares the existence of God after giving the practical proof. In fact, people experience the unimaginable events in their life, which indicate God. But, people do not care to analyze and remember God thereby. Even if we dispose all the miracles as magic show without careful analysis, the existence of unimaginable boundary of universe, which can be realized by anybody at anytime, is a clear proof for existence of unimaginable entity called as God.

God is said to be beyond this universe. It means that God can be seen after crossing the boundary of universe. You will reach the land after crossing the boundary of the ocean since the land is beyond ocean. You can never reach the boundary of the universe by any amount of even intensive imagination. This means that you can never imagine God and God is always unimaginable. Beyond the boundary of space, space should not exist just like beyond the boundary of ocean, water (ocean) should not exist. Since God is beyond space, space or spatial dimensions cannot exist in God. You can never imagine anything, which has no spatial dimensions.

Therefore, God’s existence is proved by the unimaginable miracles and God is unimaginable due to absence of spatial dimensions. The Veda clearly says that God is beyond words, mind, intelligence and logic. It also says that anything in the space or universe is not God since everything in the universe has some spatial dimensions (Neti...Neti...). It also says that God is the generator of space (Atmana Akashah…). The generator should not have the product in itself since the product should not exist before its generation. Therefore, God has no space or spatial dimensions and hence, is unimaginable. The Veda finally concludes that the only imagination about God is that He is unimaginable (Yasyaamatam…) and the only information about God is that He exists (Astityeva…).

Science says that the universe has no cause but exists. The same status can be extended to God. Therefore, God need not have a creator. The existence of unimaginable God is proved by the existence of unimaginable boundary of this universe. You call the unimaginable boundary of the universe itself as God. When we say that God is beyond the universe, we mean that God is just at the unimaginable boundary of the universe like the land beyond the boundary of ocean. Now the link between God and universe as cause and effect can be inferred by the inference of the existence of an intellectual administrator for the wonderfully arranged systematic universe for which mere inert randomness cannot be the cause.

Salvation Is Unrelated to God

[Mr. Anil asked Shri Swami to explain the concept of salvation. Shri Swami’s explanation is given below.]

Generally people think that salvation is related to God. Salvation is not at all related to God since it means only liberation from misery and stress and hence, is related to the soul and not God. Salvation can be achieved atleast temporarily with the help of a Psychiatrist or drugs etc. Salvation can also be achieved by self-realization as propagated by Shankara and it can be achieved with self effort. He was in the time of atheists and hence, introduction of God was not indicated since the atheists do not relish it.

But, introduction of self is a higher level than the basic level of materialized gross body. Jumping from materialized body to energetic self will help the next jump, which is from subtle energetic self to unimaginable God. Therefore, Shankara laid up the foundation for the spiritual knowledge in the minds of atheists. If you identify yourself to the materialized human body, all the bonds with body trouble you throwing yourself into misery and tension.

If you think that you are the subtle energy in the body, all these bonds with the materialized body get disconnected. In such case, you will have the salvation through self-realization. Thus, salvation is a topic of Pravrutti and hence, there is no reference of Nivrutti in this. Salvation is a natural instinct of every living being. Any living being tries to come out of the problems and hence, there is no relationship with God. It is the very basis of Pravrutti. Salvation is a natural instinct present in every living being. Even an insect tries to get rid of the tension. Hence, there is no element of divinity in salvation.

You may think that getting relief from problems and tensions and attaining peace and happiness is the highest level and call such state itself as God. In fact, Shankara called such state as God to satisfy the ego of atheists. But, by achieving such level through self-realization, the real status of the real God is not attained. Hence, the status of miraculous powers is not attained. In such case, it is only assumed imaginary status of God and not the real practical status of God. Shankara satisfied the atheists by another trick saying that such real status of God is unreal since the world is unreal. The controlling powers of the unreal world must be unreal. All this means that the real status of God is not relevant to you. He made the world as zero. Zero means unreal, which again means that it is not relevant to you in the present context.

Salvation is purely related to selfishness. You try to go near to God thinking that you will get the bliss from the blissful God. It is just like approaching the nearness of the fire to achieve heat in the winter. You can become close to God only when God is pleased with you. God is not like the inert fire to be approached at your wish. You must satisfy God in His tests through your sacrifice of anything including life for His sake. When God is satisfied by your true devotion, you will become very close to Him and this is called as ‘Sayujyam’, which is quite opposite to ‘Moksha’ or salvation. You have to prove yourself as a true devotee through practical sacrifice to attain Sayujyam.

Sayujyam is the subject related to God (Nivrutti) and Moksha or salvation is subject related to you (Pravrutti). Hanuman tried to sacrifice His life in searching for Sita and Gopikas sacrificed their lives by jumping into fire after Krishna. Therefore, Nivrutti is full of sacrifice, problems and tensions, which is called as the path of thorns. Salvation or Pravrutti is the path of effort to achieve happiness for the self.

The ignorant people due to lack of knowledge and analysis use the word salvation in the spiritual path. When Krishna was suffering with head-ache and the dust of the feet was declared as medicine, no devotee including the wives of Krishna and even Narada came forward fearing for the hell. Everybody wants relief from the torture of the hell even though God is tortured by the head-ache. But, Gopikas came forward to give dust from their feet and were ready to go to hell because their sole aim is only happiness of God and not the self happiness.

Therefore, all the devotees are in the path of salvation and Gopikas and Hanuman alone are in the path of Sayujyam. All the practices of yoga are only medical exercises and are related to salvation only without any reference to God. But, ignorant people are mislead to think that yoga is a divine practice related to God. Jesus gave life through crucifixion for the sake of God since it was the program designed by God. He imagined the torture and prayed Lord to avoid it if possible. This prayer indicates the climax of torture.

But, finally, He said that the will of God must prevail. Through sacrifice and torture only Jesus became very close to God and sat on the right lap of the Lord. Since there is no liberation of the self from the tension here, this is not salvation but is a case of Sayujyam. Even Shankara denied salvation as the first item in the list of items of rejection (Na mokshasyaakaankshaa…). If the salvation is divine, He should not have rejected it. This is the best supporting evidence of the concept.
Skepdick
Posts: 14347
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:16 am

Re: If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins

Post by Skepdick »

If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins
So just remove the concept of "sin". Problem solved!
dattaswami
Posts: 653
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:42 am

Re: If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins

Post by dattaswami »

Skepdick wrote: Wed Nov 30, 2022 11:24 am
If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins
So just remove the concept of "sin". Problem solved!
Punishment given for a sin is only to change the mind of the soul and purify it. There is no trace of revenge in this. The hell is an indication of the intensive love of God to the souls through which God wants to reform the souls. The hell indicates the hectic effort of God put on the soul to reform it and not to leave the soul for its fate.

A father may leave his son since he is not changing inspite of all his efforts. But in the hell God puts serious effort and succeeds to change the soul. Therefore, even thousands of fathers cannot be equal to God. God is not leaving the soul without changing it and this point is indicated by the punishment and hell.

Therefore, there is no point of excusing the Prarabhdas if this true basis is understood. God will try to change the soul through preaching as far as possible. Punishment in the hell is the last resort. Once the soul is reformed all the sins are smashed since there is neither the necessity of preaching nor the necessity of punishment.


If you are not doing any sin, you are excused for all past sins

The results of all your good actions will be separate and will not interfere with the cancellation of sins. God will give you good results for all your prayers and any prayer will not cancel even a trace of your sin. Similarly, your charity.

If these good actions can reform you, then, your sins will be cancelled. Therefore, reformation of the soul is the only way by which God is pleased to cancel your sins. Even if you do not believe in God, it does not matter. If you are not doing any sin, you are excused for all past sins and you will live with immense happiness in the world and after death also.

If you are doing a sin, you are going against the will of God

You cannot please God by prayers and service simultaneously doing sins. If you are doing a sin, you are going against the will of God and you are insulting God. You cannot please and insult God simultaneously. Therefore, every devotee and servant of God should be careful about the concept of the sin and about the only path to cancel the sin.
Skepdick
Posts: 14347
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:16 am

Re: If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins

Post by Skepdick »

dattaswami wrote: Wed Nov 30, 2022 1:20 pm
Skepdick wrote: Wed Nov 30, 2022 11:24 am
If the concept of God is removed, lot of people will do lot of sins
So just remove the concept of "sin". Problem solved!
Punishment given for a sin is only to change the mind of the soul and purify it. There is no trace of revenge in this. The hell is an indication of the intensive love of God to the souls through which God wants to reform the souls. The hell indicates the hectic effort of God put on the soul to reform it and not to leave the soul for its fate.

A father may leave his son since he is not changing inspite of all his efforts. But in the hell God puts serious effort and succeeds to change the soul. Therefore, even thousands of fathers cannot be equal to God. God is not leaving the soul without changing it and this point is indicated by the punishment and hell.

Therefore, there is no point of excusing the Prarabhdas if this true basis is understood. God will try to change the soul through preaching as far as possible. Punishment in the hell is the last resort. Once the soul is reformed all the sins are smashed since there is neither the necessity of preaching nor the necessity of punishment.


If you are not doing any sin, you are excused for all past sins

The results of all your good actions will be separate and will not interfere with the cancellation of sins. God will give you good results for all your prayers and any prayer will not cancel even a trace of your sin. Similarly, your charity.

If these good actions can reform you, then, your sins will be cancelled. Therefore, reformation of the soul is the only way by which God is pleased to cancel your sins. Even if you do not believe in God, it does not matter. If you are not doing any sin, you are excused for all past sins and you will live with immense happiness in the world and after death also.

If you are doing a sin, you are going against the will of God

You cannot please God by prayers and service simultaneously doing sins. If you are doing a sin, you are going against the will of God and you are insulting God. You cannot please and insult God simultaneously. Therefore, every devotee and servant of God should be careful about the concept of the sin and about the only path to cancel the sin.
What if we get rid of both concepts? Dispose of God and sin...

I just saved your mind AND your soul - you can thank me later.
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