Do thoughts affect reality?

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

Moderators: AMod, iMod

Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:47 pm
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:10 am
Not a belief, you just haven't.
So, you CLAIM that I have NOT provided ANY proof. BUT, you do NOT believe this is true, correct?
Why wouldn't I,
BECAUSE YOU said and stated, "Not a belief".

Also, WHY do you appear to be COMPLETELY and UTTERLY INCAPABLE of just ANSWERING CLARIFYING QUESTIONS posed to you?

Would you like me to write; "Clarifying question:" BEFORE I write a CLARIFYING QUESTION, to you? Would that help you to just answer the ACTUAL CLARIFYING QUESTIONS I pose to you?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm you really haven't provided proof.
If you REALLY BELIEVE this is REALLY true, then so be it. This is PERFECTLY FINE with me.

But you have NOT YET proved YOUR CLAIM is true.
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm You seem to lack to capacity to even comprehend what "proof" even means.
LOL

What does 'proof' mean, to you? (That was a CLARIFYING QUESTION, just in case you NEED to be TOLD.)
Atla
Posts: 3517
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Atla »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:12 pm
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:47 pm

So, you CLAIM that I have NOT provided ANY proof. BUT, you do NOT believe this is true, correct?
Why wouldn't I,
BECAUSE YOU said and stated, "Not a belief".

Also, WHY do you appear to be COMPLETELY and UTTERLY INCAPABLE of just ANSWERING CLARIFYING QUESTIONS posed to you?

Would you like me to write; "Clarifying question:" BEFORE I write a CLARIFYING QUESTION, to you? Would that help you to just answer the ACTUAL CLARIFYING QUESTIONS I pose to you?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm you really haven't provided proof.
If you REALLY BELIEVE this is REALLY true, then so be it. This is PERFECTLY FINE with me.

But you have NOT YET proved YOUR CLAIM is true.
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm You seem to lack to capacity to even comprehend what "proof" even means.
LOL

What does 'proof' mean, to you? (That was a CLARIFYING QUESTION, just in case you NEED to be TOLD.)
Even your "questions" show that you have no idea about humans, proofs, beliefs etc.
Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:14 pm
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:12 pm
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm
Why wouldn't I,
BECAUSE YOU said and stated, "Not a belief".

Also, WHY do you appear to be COMPLETELY and UTTERLY INCAPABLE of just ANSWERING CLARIFYING QUESTIONS posed to you?

Would you like me to write; "Clarifying question:" BEFORE I write a CLARIFYING QUESTION, to you? Would that help you to just answer the ACTUAL CLARIFYING QUESTIONS I pose to you?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm you really haven't provided proof.
If you REALLY BELIEVE this is REALLY true, then so be it. This is PERFECTLY FINE with me.

But you have NOT YET proved YOUR CLAIM is true.
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:56 pm You seem to lack to capacity to even comprehend what "proof" even means.
LOL

What does 'proof' mean, to you? (That was a CLARIFYING QUESTION, just in case you NEED to be TOLD.)
Even your "questions" show that you have no idea about humans, proofs, beliefs etc.
Okay. If you can READ INTO and SEE this in just PURELY OPEN CLARIFYING QUESTIONS, posed for Truly Honest ANSWERS, then 'you', human beings, REALLY have some Truly AMAZING ABILITIES.

Clarifying question: What is the "etc" in relation to EXACTLY?
AlexW
Posts: 846
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:06 pm If I agree, or not, all depends on how you define these words. See, if 'I' understand 'you' correctly, to 'you', you define the word 'absolutely' in the phrase 'absolutely true facts' to mean essentially that there is ONLY One and One ONLY true fact, correct?
No, you got it wrong again. I do not mean that there is only one absolutely true fact - I am saying there are no such facts at all and that your belief of there being such facts is a misguided belief.
Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 11:49 pm
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:06 pm If I agree, or not, all depends on how you define these words. See, if 'I' understand 'you' correctly, to 'you', you define the word 'absolutely' in the phrase 'absolutely true facts' to mean essentially that there is ONLY One and One ONLY true fact, correct?
No, you got it wrong again.
But you did actually previously write:

For something to be "absolutely true" it has to stand on its own - meaning: it exists independently and not in relation to other things, statements or facts; it is, as such, not relative or comparative.

Now, the way you seem to see it, there are many other absolutely true facts besides the one absolutely true fact that you mentioned: "I am observing words".

As I see it - and this is also what the word "absolute" actually is meant to describe - there is only one absolute truth


Which appears to COMPLETELY CONTRADICT what you wrote now, which is;
AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 11:49 pm I do not mean that there is only one absolutely true fact -
So, are you able to EXPLAIN this apparent CONTRADICTION here?
AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 11:49 pm I am saying there are no such facts at all and that your belief of there being such facts is a misguided belief.
We ALREADY KNOW you say and BELIEVE that there are NO 'true facts'.

Also, you appear to have FORGOTTEN that I do NOT have a BELIEF regarding ANY thing here.

Is this now CLEAR and UNDERSTOOD, by you?
AlexW
Posts: 846
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:03 am So, are you able to EXPLAIN this apparent CONTRADICTION here?
Sure.
A fact is "a statement that can be proven true" (see dictionary).
Absolute truth is not a statement.
It is direct experience / reality itself and there is, as such, only one absolute truth - the one reality itself.

And, as a fact is always a statement about something (meaning: it is always only a conceptual interpretation), a fact can never be the absolute truth.

Do you understand it now?
AlexW
Posts: 846
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:03 am Also, you appear to have FORGOTTEN that I do NOT have a BELIEF regarding ANY thing here.
I haven't forgotten this "fact" :-)
But you seem to believe that facts can be absolutely true - while I see them as something like a strongly held belief.
There really is no difference if you hold on to beliefs or facts - they are ultimately one and the same.
Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:34 am
Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:03 am So, are you able to EXPLAIN this apparent CONTRADICTION here?
Sure.
A fact is "a statement that can be proven true" (see dictionary).
Absolute truth is not a statement.
It is direct experience / reality itself and there is, as such, only one absolute truth - the one reality itself.

And, as a fact is always a statement about something (meaning: it is always only a conceptual interpretation), a fact can never be the absolute truth.

Do you understand it now?
What I understand is that this is just 'your' view of things, and as such is NOT necessarily true at all. Is this correct?

'your', by the way, being the one known as "alexw", here.

Also, asking "another", "Do you understand 'it' now?" Could refer to just about ANY thing.
Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:39 am
Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:03 am Also, you appear to have FORGOTTEN that I do NOT have a BELIEF regarding ANY thing here.
I haven't forgotten this "fact" :-)
But if you SUPPOSEDLY had not forgotten this 'fact', then WHY did you say:

your belief of there being such facts is a misguided belief.

If you had REALLY not forgotten this 'fact', then saying this to me appears to be very nonsensical thing to do. That is; If you KNOW I have NO belief here, then WHY would you say I have?
AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:39 am But you seem to believe that facts can be absolutely true - while I see them as something like a strongly held belief.
ONCE AGAIN, WHY would you use the 'believe' word here in relation to 'me', especially when I KEEP INFORMING 'you' that I have NO beliefs? And, considering that you even just admitted that you have NOT forgotten this 'fact', then saying this again now seems to be even MORE nonsensical, and now become completely and utterly ridiculous and absurd.
AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:39 am There really is no difference if you hold on to beliefs or facts - they are ultimately one and the same.
If you say and believe so, then okay.

Also, are you AWARE that different people view, and seeing, things DIFFERENTLY?

Which means that what you SEE and PERCEIVE the word 'absolutely' to mean may NOT be the EXACT SAME meaning, to "others".
AlexW
Posts: 846
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:47 am
AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:34 am
Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:03 am So, are you able to EXPLAIN this apparent CONTRADICTION here?
Sure.
A fact is "a statement that can be proven true" (see dictionary).
Absolute truth is not a statement.
It is direct experience / reality itself and there is, as such, only one absolute truth - the one reality itself.

And, as a fact is always a statement about something (meaning: it is always only a conceptual interpretation), a fact can never be the absolute truth.

Do you understand it now?
What I understand is that this is just 'your' view of things, and as such is NOT necessarily true at all. Is this correct?

'your', by the way, being the one known as "alexw", here.

Also, asking "another", "Do you understand 'it' now?" Could refer to just about ANY thing.
Seems when you don't know what else to say, you simply blurt out nonsense like that... are you really incapable of thinking about "it" (to pretend you don't know what "it" was referring to is just plain simple - not to call it stupid...) and provide an "intelligent" answer?
Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:54 am But if you SUPPOSEDLY had not forgotten this 'fact', then WHY did you say:

your belief of there being such facts is a misguided belief.
I said it because I don't believe that you don't have any beliefs :-)
Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:17 am
Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:47 am
AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:34 am
Sure.
A fact is "a statement that can be proven true" (see dictionary).
Absolute truth is not a statement.
It is direct experience / reality itself and there is, as such, only one absolute truth - the one reality itself.

And, as a fact is always a statement about something (meaning: it is always only a conceptual interpretation), a fact can never be the absolute truth.

Do you understand it now?
What I understand is that this is just 'your' view of things, and as such is NOT necessarily true at all. Is this correct?

'your', by the way, being the one known as "alexw", here.

Also, asking "another", "Do you understand 'it' now?" Could refer to just about ANY thing.
Seems when you don't know what else to say, you simply blurt out nonsense like that...
You asked me; "Do you understand 'it' now?"

I INFORMED you of 'what' I understand. So, I KNEW EXACTLY what to say.

Do you understand 'it' now?
AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:17 am are you really incapable of thinking about "it" (to pretend you don't know what "it" was referring to is just plain simple - not to call it stupid...) and provide an "intelligent" answer?
I PROVIDED what I understood.

Did you NOT understand this?

Look, you may be UNAWARE but I do NOT like to ASSUME ANY thing. So, this means that I VERY RARELY EVER DO, okay? And this is partly WHY I ask FAR MORE clarifying questions than ANY one "else" here in this forum.

ALSO, it was you who wrote:

Sure.
A fact is "a statement that can be proven true" (see dictionary).
Absolute truth is not a statement.
It is direct experience / reality itself and there is, as such, only one absolute truth - the one reality itself.

And, as a fact is always a statement about something (meaning: it is always only a conceptual interpretation), a fact can never be the absolute truth.


So, what part of 'it' were you referring to, EXACTLY?

See, I ALWAYS UNDERSTOOD 'it' here.

So, do you understand 'it' now?
AlexW wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:17 am
Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:54 am But if you SUPPOSEDLY had not forgotten this 'fact', then WHY did you say:

your belief of there being such facts is a misguided belief.
I said it because I don't believe that you don't have any beliefs :-)
There, NOW that is what I was LOOKING FOR, from you. So, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

If you DISBELIEVE some thing is true, then 'you', human beings, can NOT see 'it'. Even if right BEFORE YOUR EYES.

So, now do you get it?
AlexW
Posts: 846
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:05 am There, NOW that is what I was LOOKING FOR, from you. So, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

If you DISBELIEVE some thing is true, then 'you', human beings, can NOT see 'it'. Even if right BEFORE YOUR EYES.
I can see very well that you simply exchange one word for another and think the new word is in some way more trustworthy or accurate than the other.
You think you don't have any beliefs and to achieve that you simply call them facts.
But all you achieve by doing this, is to stop preaching to one god and instead preach to another - all you have done is change god's name, that's all.

Yet you do not see that this is the case and believe that now you have the ability and right to speak as "thee ONE" - a god speaker who has no beliefs and is telling the absolute truth - its pretty funny if it wouldn't be equally sad.
Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:28 am
Age wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:05 am There, NOW that is what I was LOOKING FOR, from you. So, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

If you DISBELIEVE some thing is true, then 'you', human beings, can NOT see 'it'. Even if right BEFORE YOUR EYES.
I can see very well that you simply exchange one word for another and think the new word is in some way more trustworthy or accurate than the other.
Can you?

So, if you can see VERY WELL that I have simply exchanged one word for another, and that I think the new word is in some way more trustworthy or accurate than the other word is, then WHAT word are you TALKING ABOUT and SEEING VERY WELL here?
AlexW wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:28 am You think you don't have any beliefs and to achieve that you simply call them facts.
As some say WTF?

When have I EVER exchanged the word 'beliefs' with the word 'facts'?

I KNOW I do NOT have ANY beliefs (besides the ONE that I SOMETIMES acknowledge), so I do NOT think this.

Also, your use of the 'that' word and the 'them' words leave me to WONDER what you are TALKING ABOUT and SEEING here, which leads 'me' to ask 'you' what does the 'that' word and the 'them' refer to EXACTLY, in your statement here?

What am I SUPPOSEDLY calling 'facts'?

I CALL 'facts' facts and 'beliefs' beliefs.

'you' and 'I' just have DIFFERENT definitions that we use for these words. What is SO HARD and COMPLEX to UNDERSTAND about this FACT?
AlexW wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:28 am But all you achieve by doing this, is to stop preaching to one god and instead preach to another - all you have done is change god's name, that's all.
As some say, WTF, AGAIN?
AlexW wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:28 am Yet you do not see that this is the case and believe that now you have the ability and right to speak as "thee ONE" - a god speaker who has no beliefs and is telling the absolute truth - its pretty funny if it wouldn't be equally sad.
LOL

EVERY one has the ABILITY and the, so called, RIGHT' to speak as 'thee One', and, in fact, EVERY one, at times, speaks as, or from, 'thee One'.

Children do this FAR MORE OFTEN than adults do, by the way. But, the ABILITY and the RIGHT remains in EVERY one, ALWAYS. In fact, ALL new born babies are speaking ONLY as, and from, 'thee One'. And, if EVERY one just LISTENED to those ones, and HEARD EXACTLY what those ones ARE SAYING, and then FOLLOWED those ones GUIDANCE, then Everyone would be living in Peace and in Harmony NOW-ALREADY. Instead of the other way around, which is what is occurring, in the days when this was written, where the adults TELL the children what they SHOULD, and MUST, DO, and HOW they SHOULD and MUST do 'it'.

If adults just LISTENED TO the new ones, RECOGNIZED and ACCEPTED them for they Truly ARE, BELIEVED in them, and LET them (or LEFT them) become WHO they Truly ARE, then they COULD and WOULD create the life that 'we' ALL WANT and DESIRE NOW, for "ourselves".

Also, you have STILL completely MISINTERPRETED what I have been saying about the 'absolute Truth. Absolute Truth is NOT necessarily what ANY one speaks, NOR even almost EVERY one speaks, but rather what EVERY one AGREES WITH and ACCEPTS.

But you have NOT been ABLE to SEE that this is what this one has been SAYING and SPEAKING because 'you' are BELIEVING otherwise.
AlexW
Posts: 846
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 am I do NOT have ANY beliefs
Is this statement a fact?
If yes, then this statement is one example where you exchange the word 'belief' with the word 'fact' so that it fits into your "I don't have any beliefs" belief.
Age wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 am Children do this FAR MORE OFTEN than adults do, by the way. But, the ABILITY and the RIGHT remains in EVERY one, ALWAYS. In fact, ALL new born babies are speaking ONLY as, and from, 'thee One'. And, if EVERY one just LISTENED to those ones, and HEARD EXACTLY what those ones ARE SAYING, and then FOLLOWED those ones GUIDANCE, then Everyone would be living in Peace and in Harmony NOW-ALREADY.
Well, then let me speak to you like a baby:

"Gobbledy gobbledy Gooooo!"

Now, please follow this guidance :-)
Age
Posts: 7805
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:27 am
Age wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 am I do NOT have ANY beliefs
Is this statement a fact?
Yes, IF and WHEN I have NO beliefs.

IF, however, I choose to BELIEVE some thing, then that statement is NOT a fact.
AlexW wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:27 am If yes, then this statement is one example where you exchange the word 'belief' with the word 'fact' so that it fits into your "I don't have any beliefs" belief.
Will you answer this CLARIFYING question?

Do you have a BELIEF that EVERY one HAS TO BELIEVE things?

Also, your CLAIM above is NONSENSICAL, from my perspective, but you might be able to CLEAR things up.

To you, if the statement, 'I do NOT have ANY beliefs' is a statement of fact, then WHERE and HOW, EXACTLY, did I exchange the word 'belief' with the word 'fact'?

I was the one saying, 'I do NOT have ANY beliefs'. So, there is NO exchange here. Also, I would NOT say, 'I do NOT have ANY facts'. I would NOT say this because this NOT true. Whereas, when I say, 'I do NOT have ANY beliefs', then this is a true statement IF and WHEN I have NO beliefs.

And, WHY do you insist the statement, 'I do NOT have ANY beliefs', is a BELIEF?

Would the statement, 'I do NOT have ANY armchairs', be a BELIEF, ALSO? Could this statement be a fact, without being a BELIEF?

Are you able to CLEAR ANY of this up?

If so, then WILL you?
AlexW wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:27 am
Age wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:56 am Children do this FAR MORE OFTEN than adults do, by the way. But, the ABILITY and the RIGHT remains in EVERY one, ALWAYS. In fact, ALL new born babies are speaking ONLY as, and from, 'thee One'. And, if EVERY one just LISTENED to those ones, and HEARD EXACTLY what those ones ARE SAYING, and then FOLLOWED those ones GUIDANCE, then Everyone would be living in Peace and in Harmony NOW-ALREADY.
Well, then let me speak to you like a baby:

"Gobbledy gobbledy Gooooo!"

Now, please follow this guidance :-)
You OBVIOUSLY have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA AT ALL about what I SAYING, TALKING ABOUT, and MEANING.

Let us LOOK AT this ANOTHER WAY, How do human beings whose ears do NOT work LISTEN, HEAR, and UNDERSTAND things about their babies?

Or, how do adult human beings HEAR what their babies are SAYING? These adults OBVIOUSLY can NOT understand the "words" that come out.

Now, the EXACT SAME principle applies to ALL parents of new born babies, they do NOT understand ONE "word" that comes out of a new born babies mouth. But these parents can VERY QUICKLY work out what the baby's WANTS and NEEDS.

Now, IF you WANT to LOOK INTO this more deeply, and DISCUSS this further, then just let me KNOW.

Otherwise carry on BELIEVING and SEEING what you have been. But just be AWARE that what you are SEEING and BELIEVING in what I am SAYING and MEANING, just maybe COMPLETELY and UTTERLY Wrong and Incorrect. As has been PROVED True, a few times ALREADY.
Post Reply