Do thoughts affect reality?

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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Atla
Posts: 6699
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Atla »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:47 am
Atla wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:38 pm
Age wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:33 pm

I HAVE just PROVEN MY CLAIM AGAIN, ONCE MORE,

That is;
You made a CLAIM.

I then asked you to PROVIDE some thing, and then CLAIMED that you are COMPLETELY and UTTERLY INCAPABLE of being able to PROVIDE PROOF for you CLAIMS. I also CLAIMED that it will be 'you' who will PROVE this AGAIN, for Me, ONCE MORE.

Which you have just SUCCESSFULLY DONE, ONCE AGAIN.

So, 'T' THANK 'you', ONCE AGAIN, "atla".
Still no proof, just lies and lies about lies.
But 'you', "atla" just PROVED it. 'you', unfortunately for you, are just NOT YET able to SEE and RECOGNIZE this FACT. And, this is just SOLELY because of your preexisting and current ASSUMPTIONS and BELIEFS.

When, and if, 'you' EVER learn how to lose and rid "yourself" of them, then you will be able to SEE, and UNDERSTAND, much more clearly, and wisely.

Until then PLEASE carry on as you are now. You are helping and supporting me TREMENDOUSLY.
I'm not supporting you, only the voices in your head agree that you are proving here something. But ask any real human being about it.

More lies, still no proof for the universe's non-expansion.
AlexW
Posts: 852
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:52 am I responded to all of what you have written here, but it got lost while this website is slow to load, and I could not be bothered repeating.

But, essentially, you have NOT been reading the ACTUAL WORDS that I have been writing, and this explains the reason WHY you are NOT YET understanding what I am ACTUALLY MEANING.
I have "been reading the ACTUAL WORDS that you have been writing" - and I also do understanding what you are saying, but this doesn't mean that I share your opinion about the existence of "absolutely true facts" etc etc...
Anyway, I can't really be bothered either repeating the obvious - I am, as such, happy to agree to disagree.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:16 am
Age wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:52 am I responded to all of what you have written here, but it got lost while this website is slow to load, and I could not be bothered repeating.

But, essentially, you have NOT been reading the ACTUAL WORDS that I have been writing, and this explains the reason WHY you are NOT YET understanding what I am ACTUALLY MEANING.
I have "been reading the ACTUAL WORDS that you have been writing" - and I also do understanding what you are saying, but this doesn't mean that I share your opinion about the existence of "absolutely true facts" etc etc...
But YOUR CLAIM about what I have been SAYING is NOT what I have been ACTUALLY SAYING.
AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:16 am Anyway, I can't really be bothered either repeating the obvious - I am, as such, happy to agree to disagree.
What EXACTLY do you now think or BELIEVE we are "disagreeing" about?

One of the reasons WHY 'you', human beings, were STILL living the way you were, in those days when this was written, that is; living a bickering, disagreeing, ridiculing, humiliating, arguing, fighting, punishing and warring way of life is because of the 'resentment' of "others" that exists, which is left over AFTER 'agreement' is NOT made NOR reached.

If 'you' do NOT YET even KNOW WHY 'you' could NOT REACH AGREEMENT, then 'you' are left somewhat confused and bewildered, which leads to, even more, LESS UNDERSTANDING.

When, and if, you KNOW the very reason WHY you can NOT REACH AGREEMENT with "others", then you will also learn and UNDERSTAND how 'you' REALLY can REACH AGREEMENT with EVERY one "else"/ALL "others".
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:47 am
Atla wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:38 pm
Still no proof, just lies and lies about lies.
But 'you', "atla" just PROVED it. 'you', unfortunately for you, are just NOT YET able to SEE and RECOGNIZE this FACT. And, this is just SOLELY because of your preexisting and current ASSUMPTIONS and BELIEFS.

When, and if, 'you' EVER learn how to lose and rid "yourself" of them, then you will be able to SEE, and UNDERSTAND, much more clearly, and wisely.

Until then PLEASE carry on as you are now. You are helping and supporting me TREMENDOUSLY.
I'm not supporting you,
You may well NOT WANT TO, but UNKNOWINGLY YOUR ARE. So, THANK 'you', "atla".
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am only the voices in your head agree that you are proving here something.
If this is what 'you' BELIEVE IS TRUE, then this MUST BE what is happening, correct?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am But ask any real human being about it.
How do 'I' decipher and discern between a 'real human' from one that is NOT 'real'?

How do 'you', "atla", define the word 'human'?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am More lies, still no proof for the universe's non-expansion.
The PROOF can ONLY be SEEN and UNDERSTOOD by those who are Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT. Just like the FACT that the earth was NOT the center of the Universe was ONLY SEEN and ONLY UNDERSTOOD by those who were Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT.

How MANY TIMES do you have to be INFORMED 'you' will NEVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth IS if 'you' BELIEVE otherwise.

What you seem to be expecting here is the "religious person" to PROVIDE proof that God exists, to those who BELIEVE otherwise, or vice-versa, expecting the "scientific person" to PROVIDE proof that God does not exist, to those who BELIEVE otherwise.

ABSOLUTELY NON of 'you', who BELIEVE things, will EVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth of things IS while what you are BELIEVING is true, is opposite or contrary to what is ACTUALLY True.

The stories about how long it took to just EXPLAIN what thee ACTUAL Truth IS in relation to the earth revolving around the sun to those who BELIEVED otherwise.

This EXACT SAME occurrence is HAPPENING, in the days when this is being written, with those who BELIEVE that the Universe is expanding.

Both of these groups of people, who were BELIEVING things here, could NOT back up and support THEIR CLAIMS and BELIEFS. But this NEVER STOPPED them from BELIEVING that they KNOW BEST. They just could NOT bring themselves to LOOKING AT and DISCUSSING what was 'trying to' be EXPLAINED to them.
Atla
Posts: 6699
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Atla »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:48 am
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:47 am

But 'you', "atla" just PROVED it. 'you', unfortunately for you, are just NOT YET able to SEE and RECOGNIZE this FACT. And, this is just SOLELY because of your preexisting and current ASSUMPTIONS and BELIEFS.

When, and if, 'you' EVER learn how to lose and rid "yourself" of them, then you will be able to SEE, and UNDERSTAND, much more clearly, and wisely.

Until then PLEASE carry on as you are now. You are helping and supporting me TREMENDOUSLY.
I'm not supporting you,
You may well NOT WANT TO, but UNKNOWINGLY YOUR ARE. So, THANK 'you', "atla".
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am only the voices in your head agree that you are proving here something.
If this is what 'you' BELIEVE IS TRUE, then this MUST BE what is happening, correct?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am But ask any real human being about it.
How do 'I' decipher and discern between a 'real human' from one that is NOT 'real'?

How do 'you', "atla", define the word 'human'?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am More lies, still no proof for the universe's non-expansion.
The PROOF can ONLY be SEEN and UNDERSTOOD by those who are Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT. Just like the FACT that the earth was NOT the center of the Universe was ONLY SEEN and ONLY UNDERSTOOD by those who were Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT.

How MANY TIMES do you have to be INFORMED 'you' will NEVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth IS if 'you' BELIEVE otherwise.

What you seem to be expecting here is the "religious person" to PROVIDE proof that God exists, to those who BELIEVE otherwise, or vice-versa, expecting the "scientific person" to PROVIDE proof that God does not exist, to those who BELIEVE otherwise.

ABSOLUTELY NON of 'you', who BELIEVE things, will EVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth of things IS while what you are BELIEVING is true, is opposite or contrary to what is ACTUALLY True.

The stories about how long it took to just EXPLAIN what thee ACTUAL Truth IS in relation to the earth revolving around the sun to those who BELIEVED otherwise.

This EXACT SAME occurrence is HAPPENING, in the days when this is being written, with those who BELIEVE that the Universe is expanding.

Both of these groups of people, who were BELIEVING things here, could NOT back up and support THEIR CLAIMS and BELIEFS. But this NEVER STOPPED them from BELIEVING that they KNOW BEST. They just could NOT bring themselves to LOOKING AT and DISCUSSING what was 'trying to' be EXPLAINED to them.
Still no proof presented, just more lies
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:52 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:48 am
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am
I'm not supporting you,
You may well NOT WANT TO, but UNKNOWINGLY YOUR ARE. So, THANK 'you', "atla".
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am only the voices in your head agree that you are proving here something.
If this is what 'you' BELIEVE IS TRUE, then this MUST BE what is happening, correct?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am But ask any real human being about it.
How do 'I' decipher and discern between a 'real human' from one that is NOT 'real'?

How do 'you', "atla", define the word 'human'?
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:19 am More lies, still no proof for the universe's non-expansion.
The PROOF can ONLY be SEEN and UNDERSTOOD by those who are Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT. Just like the FACT that the earth was NOT the center of the Universe was ONLY SEEN and ONLY UNDERSTOOD by those who were Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT.

How MANY TIMES do you have to be INFORMED 'you' will NEVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth IS if 'you' BELIEVE otherwise.

What you seem to be expecting here is the "religious person" to PROVIDE proof that God exists, to those who BELIEVE otherwise, or vice-versa, expecting the "scientific person" to PROVIDE proof that God does not exist, to those who BELIEVE otherwise.

ABSOLUTELY NON of 'you', who BELIEVE things, will EVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth of things IS while what you are BELIEVING is true, is opposite or contrary to what is ACTUALLY True.

The stories about how long it took to just EXPLAIN what thee ACTUAL Truth IS in relation to the earth revolving around the sun to those who BELIEVED otherwise.

This EXACT SAME occurrence is HAPPENING, in the days when this is being written, with those who BELIEVE that the Universe is expanding.

Both of these groups of people, who were BELIEVING things here, could NOT back up and support THEIR CLAIMS and BELIEFS. But this NEVER STOPPED them from BELIEVING that they KNOW BEST. They just could NOT bring themselves to LOOKING AT and DISCUSSING what was 'trying to' be EXPLAINED to them.
Still no proof presented, just more lies
I PROVIDED the PROOF, 'you', in your current state, are just NOT CAPABLE of SEEING and UNDERSTANDING this PROOF, YET.

If ANY one would like ANY MORE PROOF, then just let me know and I will SHARE It with you.
AlexW
Posts: 852
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:22 am One of the reasons WHY 'you', human beings, were STILL living the way you were, in those days when this was written, that is; living a bickering, disagreeing, ridiculing, humiliating, arguing, fighting, punishing and warring way of life is because of the 'resentment' of "others" that exists, which is left over AFTER 'agreement' is NOT made NOR reached.

If 'you' do NOT YET even KNOW WHY 'you' could NOT REACH AGREEMENT, then 'you' are left somewhat confused and bewildered, which leads to, even more, LESS UNDERSTANDING.
I know very well why there are some disagreements between "us human beings" (meaning: you and I) - there is no agreement because you believe certain things to be true, which I do not believe to be true (for example your claim: "I do not have any beliefs" - while, at the same time, you insist that there are "absolutely true facts", which is again nothing but a tightly held belief resulting in you not being OPEN to honestly evaluate a different opinion)

But, to me, this disagreement is really no problem at all, it does not have to end in "ridiculing, humiliating, arguing, fighting and punishing" - at least I have no interest in any of that...
Atla
Posts: 6699
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Atla »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:22 am
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:52 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:48 am

You may well NOT WANT TO, but UNKNOWINGLY YOUR ARE. So, THANK 'you', "atla".



If this is what 'you' BELIEVE IS TRUE, then this MUST BE what is happening, correct?



How do 'I' decipher and discern between a 'real human' from one that is NOT 'real'?

How do 'you', "atla", define the word 'human'?



The PROOF can ONLY be SEEN and UNDERSTOOD by those who are Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT. Just like the FACT that the earth was NOT the center of the Universe was ONLY SEEN and ONLY UNDERSTOOD by those who were Truly OPEN and Truly CURIOS to IT.

How MANY TIMES do you have to be INFORMED 'you' will NEVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth IS if 'you' BELIEVE otherwise.

What you seem to be expecting here is the "religious person" to PROVIDE proof that God exists, to those who BELIEVE otherwise, or vice-versa, expecting the "scientific person" to PROVIDE proof that God does not exist, to those who BELIEVE otherwise.

ABSOLUTELY NON of 'you', who BELIEVE things, will EVER SEE what thee ACTUAL Truth of things IS while what you are BELIEVING is true, is opposite or contrary to what is ACTUALLY True.

The stories about how long it took to just EXPLAIN what thee ACTUAL Truth IS in relation to the earth revolving around the sun to those who BELIEVED otherwise.

This EXACT SAME occurrence is HAPPENING, in the days when this is being written, with those who BELIEVE that the Universe is expanding.

Both of these groups of people, who were BELIEVING things here, could NOT back up and support THEIR CLAIMS and BELIEFS. But this NEVER STOPPED them from BELIEVING that they KNOW BEST. They just could NOT bring themselves to LOOKING AT and DISCUSSING what was 'trying to' be EXPLAINED to them.
Still no proof presented, just more lies
I PROVIDED the PROOF, 'you', in your current state, are just NOT CAPABLE of SEEING and UNDERSTANDING this PROOF, YET.

If ANY one would like ANY MORE PROOF, then just let me know and I will SHARE It with you.
No, you haven't provided any proof.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:32 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:22 am One of the reasons WHY 'you', human beings, were STILL living the way you were, in those days when this was written, that is; living a bickering, disagreeing, ridiculing, humiliating, arguing, fighting, punishing and warring way of life is because of the 'resentment' of "others" that exists, which is left over AFTER 'agreement' is NOT made NOR reached.

If 'you' do NOT YET even KNOW WHY 'you' could NOT REACH AGREEMENT, then 'you' are left somewhat confused and bewildered, which leads to, even more, LESS UNDERSTANDING.
I know very well why there are some disagreements between "us human beings" (meaning: you and I) - there is no agreement because you believe certain things to be true,
LOL
LOL
LOL

What certain things do I SUPPOSEDLY believe to be true?

Or, did you mean 'you' and 'I' here, from the perspective that I use those words?
AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:32 am which I do not believe to be true (for example your claim: "I do not have any beliefs" - while, at the same time, you insist that there are "absolutely true facts", which is again nothing but a tightly held belief resulting in you not being OPEN to honestly evaluate a different opinion)
Have I EVER written the words 'absolutely true facts'?

If yes, then WHERE?

Now, if you can NOT find ANYWHERE where I have I have written 'absolutely true facts', then I suggest TAKING A LOOK at the ACTUAL WORDS that I hav ACTUALLY WRITTEN.
AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:32 am But, to me, this disagreement is really no problem at all, it does not have to end in "ridiculing, humiliating, arguing, fighting and punishing" - at least I have no interest in any of that...
If you can find WHERE I have said, 'absolutely true facts', THEN we can take a LOOK AT that, and then DISCUSS that.

Until then, I do NOT SAY NOR MEAN things in the way you think or BELIEVE I do.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:45 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:22 am
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:52 am
Still no proof presented, just more lies
I PROVIDED the PROOF, 'you', in your current state, are just NOT CAPABLE of SEEING and UNDERSTANDING this PROOF, YET.

If ANY one would like ANY MORE PROOF, then just let me know and I will SHARE It with you.
No, you haven't provided any proof.
If this is what you BELIEVE is true, then like I have been SAYING and POINTING OUT, then you are NOT OPEN to ANY thing opposing or contrary to this BELIEF. And thanks to 'you', "atla", you are PROVING this ABSOLUTELY, and IRREFUTABLY, True.
Atla
Posts: 6699
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Atla »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:58 am
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:45 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:22 am

I PROVIDED the PROOF, 'you', in your current state, are just NOT CAPABLE of SEEING and UNDERSTANDING this PROOF, YET.

If ANY one would like ANY MORE PROOF, then just let me know and I will SHARE It with you.
No, you haven't provided any proof.
If this is what you BELIEVE is true, then like I have been SAYING and POINTING OUT, then you are NOT OPEN to ANY thing opposing or contrary to this BELIEF. And thanks to 'you', "atla", you are PROVING this ABSOLUTELY, and IRREFUTABLY, True.
Not a belief, you just haven't.
AlexW
Posts: 852
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:53 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by AlexW »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:55 am Have I EVER written the words 'absolutely true facts'?

If yes, then WHERE?

Now, if you can NOT find ANYWHERE where I have I have written 'absolutely true facts', then I suggest TAKING A LOOK at the ACTUAL WORDS that I hav ACTUALLY WRITTEN.
You have written:
This is because, to me, 'facts' are absolutely, and irrefutably true.

If 'facts' are absolutely, and irrefutably true then these are of course 'absolutely true facts' - wouldn't you agree?

Or do you see a difference between 'facts' being absolutely, and irrefutably true and 'absolutely true facts'?
I for sure don't.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:10 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:58 am
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:45 am
No, you haven't provided any proof.
If this is what you BELIEVE is true, then like I have been SAYING and POINTING OUT, then you are NOT OPEN to ANY thing opposing or contrary to this BELIEF. And thanks to 'you', "atla", you are PROVING this ABSOLUTELY, and IRREFUTABLY, True.
Not a belief, you just haven't.
So, you CLAIM that I have NOT provided ANY proof. BUT, you do NOT believe this is true, correct?
Atla
Posts: 6699
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:27 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Atla »

Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 12:47 pm
Atla wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:10 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:58 am

If this is what you BELIEVE is true, then like I have been SAYING and POINTING OUT, then you are NOT OPEN to ANY thing opposing or contrary to this BELIEF. And thanks to 'you', "atla", you are PROVING this ABSOLUTELY, and IRREFUTABLY, True.
Not a belief, you just haven't.
So, you CLAIM that I have NOT provided ANY proof. BUT, you do NOT believe this is true, correct?
Why wouldn't I, you really haven't provided proof. You seem to lack to capacity to even comprehend what "proof" even means.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Do thoughts affect reality?

Post by Age »

AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:48 am
Age wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:55 am Have I EVER written the words 'absolutely true facts'?

If yes, then WHERE?

Now, if you can NOT find ANYWHERE where I have I have written 'absolutely true facts', then I suggest TAKING A LOOK at the ACTUAL WORDS that I hav ACTUALLY WRITTEN.
You have written:
This is because, to me, 'facts' are absolutely, and irrefutably true.
Yes, I agree.
AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:48 am If 'facts' are absolutely, and irrefutably true then these are of course 'absolutely true facts' - wouldn't you agree?
If I agree, or not, all depends on how you define these words. See, if 'I' understand 'you' correctly, to 'you', you define the word 'absolutely' in the phrase 'absolutely true facts' to mean essentially that there is ONLY One and One ONLY true fact, correct?

If this is correct, then saying, 'facts' are absolutely, and irrefutably, true is NOT saying these are of course 'absolutely true facts'.

To me, 'facts', by definition, are just absolutely, and thus irrefutably, true, anyway. So, it would be completely unnecessary to say "absolutely true facts". Which would NOT fit in with how you see this term anyway, correct?
AlexW wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:48 am Or do you see a difference between 'facts' being absolutely, and irrefutably true and 'absolutely true facts'?
I for sure don't.
I do. As just explained.

However, to me, there can be 'absolutely true facts', but for people like "yourself", if 'I' have 'you' correct, will just MISINTERPRET what is MEANT if I was to say and use that phrase.
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