Search found 375 matches

by Peter Holmes
Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:06 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

Thanks, Belinda. I still you're making unjustified claims. I am wary of claims about human nature. I don't believe in God as provider of revealed moral law but I do believe in St Augustine's dictum that good is the default, so that lack of altruism such as ritualistic killing, or Nazism, or colour p...
by Peter Holmes
Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:49 pm
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

What I wrote about levels of maturity was backed by scientific evidence at the time when I learned it about thirty forty years ago, and may now be superseded. I think that this theory was from Piaget and that there was ample linguistic evidence from children of different ages. Piaget's judgement is...
by Peter Holmes
Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:25 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

Belinda By the definitions of 'subjective' and 'objective', moral judgements must be subjective and can't be objective. So a theistic argument from objective morality must be unsound, because the premise morality is objective is false. That so far no one has shown the existence of a god - or anythin...
by Peter Holmes
Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:02 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

God as the maker and revealer of the moral law legitimises the view that morality is objective; but this legitimation pertains only to persons who have not matured further than the insight that law and morality are the same. There is the same level of legitimation, that the law is absolutely right,...
by Peter Holmes
Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:59 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

Thanks, Judaka. I think what you say is thoughtful and thought-provoking. Your explanation of why we want to believe our moral judgements are factually true makes a lot of sense, at least to me. Following our discussion, here's my summary. 1 Factual assertions express falsifiable claims about featur...
by Peter Holmes
Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:58 pm
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

The question is this: whose "judgment" of these (moral) matters is definitive? If the "judgments" in question are being made by mere humans, there's no reason to privilege one human -- or even one group of humans -- over another, by selecting their "judgments" as ultimately right. But what if it we...
by Peter Holmes
Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:35 pm
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

From the fact that a rapist thinks rape is right, it doesn't follow that rape is right, Why not? The fact that you think it wrong doesn't make it wrong. It's subjective, remember? The subject in this situation (the rapist) enjoys violence against women.[/quote] Sorry - haven't got the hang of this ...
by Peter Holmes
Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:21 pm
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

The question is this: whose "judgment" of these (moral) matters is definitive? If the "judgments" in question are being made by mere humans, there's no reason to privilege one human -- or even one group of humans -- over another, by selecting their "judgments" as ultimately right. But what if it we...
by Peter Holmes
Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:20 pm
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

Hi, Immanuel Can. I've taken the following from one of your contributions. '[If you think morality is subjective] you'd have to also believe that rape, pre-meditated murder, slavery and pedophilia aren't really wrong. You'd be rationally bound to believe they're only "wrong" if the people who perpet...
by Peter Holmes
Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:41 pm
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

I've only just caught up with this conversation, and I'm not sure I've followed all of it - so apologies if I've missed something critical. That moral assertions express value judgements, and are therefore subjective, is true by definition of the word 'subjective', which means 'dependent on judgemen...
by Peter Holmes
Sun Jul 08, 2018 7:14 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

Morality is a cultural development not conditioned by an OR exclusion. It is, in effect, both objective and subjective; an acknowledgement of reality as perceived and ritualized accordingly. Agreed, morality is a cultural development. That we have developed moral codes is a fact - a true factual as...
by Peter Holmes
Sun Jul 08, 2018 7:03 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

How can one not say that Human Rights (UDHR) are not objective and an objection to crimes against people, such as slavery and other? Further, there are psychological consequences for doing (severe) immorality that I think the OP ignores. So why Kantian Ethics as objective? Can it be that it compels...
by Peter Holmes
Sun Jul 08, 2018 6:49 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

Thanks, Greta. I agree that the scope of our moral concerns is itself a matter of moral judgement: who are the others we should try not to harm? The scope has been widening - from the family group, to the tribe, the 'nation', and sometimes to humanity - through our history. And I think it should - a...
by Peter Holmes
Sun Jul 08, 2018 5:03 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

If, and it's a huge if ,it were known what the human being is, the total of what constitutes the human being, would a moral assertion then have truth value? No, because knowledge (expressed by means of facts - true factual assertions) is completely different from moral judgement. So omniscience has...
by Peter Holmes
Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:08 am
Forum: Ethical Theory
Topic: Is morality objective or subjective?
Replies: 193
Views: 4166

Re: Is morality objective or subjective?

Agreed, Judaka. Nothing in reality can verify or falsify a moral assertion, because it has no truth-value.