Search found 76 matches

by Dave Mangnall
Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:29 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: Re:Probability in a Deterministic World.

Knowing the outcome of a coin toss is much different than the outcome being determined. Just because that outcome is determined in advance, the person tossing or the person watching might not know the outcome, and their prediction is properly a probability. Thanks, Doc. On this, at least, you're on...
by Dave Mangnall
Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:18 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: Free Will in Discussing Free Will

To go back to your statement, the only implication of free will here would be that there was a genuine possibility that I might have refrained from whatever attempts I made to convince someone that their will was not free. It is precisely that possibility that I deny. I might, for all I know, desis...
by Dave Mangnall
Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:08 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: The Terror of Determinism

As I’ve mentioned elsewhere, I think, I’ve never understood the terror of determinism. Why do you imagine it would be so overwhelming and stultifying? I guess I have a bit of an idea. Terror? No, none of that. :D I'm "terrified" of only real things, and don't happen to regard Determinism as real. I...
by Dave Mangnall
Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:28 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: The God Who Guides But Does Not Cause.

Atheist though I be, I’m going to stand up for the idea of the omniscient God who gives guidance here. God, being omniscient, will know where His guidance will be effective and where it will be ignored, or ineffective for some other reason. He will therefore give His guidance where He knows it will...
by Dave Mangnall
Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:16 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re:"Free Will: You Are One..............."

Dave, I got next to no patience at all any more...my last nerve done been stomped on repeatedly...it's nuthin' but mush. “Free Will and Other Illusions” I'll write one...call it, 'Free Will: You Are One (so get over it and move on...)'. Bet mine is published before yours. Let me know when yours is ...
by Dave Mangnall
Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:13 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Free Will in Discussing Free Will

You prove your belief in free will every time you try to convince someone that their will is not free. Not so, Doc. I write as it is determined that I write. It is determined that I enjoy debate. Either my arguments convince my interlocutor or they do not. One of the two is true, and whichever is t...
by Dave Mangnall
Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:11 pm
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Dominoes and movies.

Determinism means the universe is nuthin' but an elaborate domino show with countless lil black rectangles topplin' into other lil black rectangles. Under this scheme, you and me and him and her, we're all just dominos too, gettin' toppled. No matter how you dress it up, soften it, cast it, frame i...
by Dave Mangnall
Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:45 pm
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

The Terror of Determinism

And I would note the general tendency among Determinists to lapse into acting as if free will is true, for the simple reason that the consequences of Determinism, if lived out rationally, would be so overwhelming as to stultify every attempt of a Determinist to describe what he's really doing, and ...
by Dave Mangnall
Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:30 pm
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: Deception and irrational anger

In a deterministic world, at the time you believed your wife to be faithful it would have been predetermined that you believed her to be faithful. You could not have done otherwise. Yet you would have been deceived. Yes. But that is because you do not live in a Determined world. You can be "deceive...
by Dave Mangnall
Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:12 pm
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: The God Who Guides But Does Not Cause.

... However, God can still be omniscient and omnipotent with the presence of free will. One must look at God as a guiding force rather than a great decider. It is possible for God to know all, be everywhere, and have influence over things without using those abilities to determine exactly how we wi...
by Dave Mangnall
Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:59 pm
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: Re:Probability in a Deterministic World.

Now with a coin toss, the outcome is just as determined in your free will model as it is in my determinism model. As you know full well, chance has nothing to do with it. It’s entirely to do with how the coin is tossed. So are you saying that it makes sense for you, who believe in free will, to say...
by Dave Mangnall
Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:56 pm
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: Re:Probability in a Deterministic World.

I hope it's a bit clearer now. Is it? :) Hi, Immanuel. Well, yes! What's clear is that you have a really peculiar idea of what determinism is and what it implies! Let's move on from probability, as we're never going to get anywhere. You've said other interesting things in your recent posts which I'...
by Dave Mangnall
Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:44 pm
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re:Probability in a Deterministic World.

I need probability to live. This confession, if true, should be enough to convince you, Dave, that Determinism is untrue. If you "need probability," then you can't have it in a Determined world...all you can have is the delusion of it. :shock: Probability, in life or in games, is nothing to do with...
by Dave Mangnall
Thu Apr 13, 2017 11:43 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: Free Will vs Determinism

Hi, Vendetta. I'm not sure I even understand how you are justifying using words such as probability or possibility, Dave, when there exists only one truth in the realm of determinism, and that is what has happened and what causes and continues to cause it. I need probability to live. Also, I need it...
by Dave Mangnall
Thu Apr 13, 2017 11:07 am
Forum: General Philosophical Discussion
Topic: Free Will vs Determinism
Replies: 1471
Views: 127420

Re: Free Will vs Determinism

Hi, again, Immanuel. No. "Subjective" is not a real thing under Determinism. It's an "epiphenomenon," an illusionary byproduct of an essentially Determined universe. So you're resting your explanation on a "free will" word -- "subjective." Why do you say “illusionary”? I know it suits your argument ...