Philosophy Now Forum

8) No. I'm asking a perfectly fair question, which I've asked you several times, and which you've never once been able to answer. So who's "avoiding" now? :? I saw it. But it contained a variety of untruths and misrepresentations of what you'd achieved, so I ignored it in kindness, so I w...

And you can't suggest one moral value that objectivism can necessitate for one rational person, either. Sure I can. Objectivism says it's immoral to steal, for example. Your only problem with that is presumptive: that is, that not believing in God, you do not believe in any Lawgiver or Ultimate Aut...

When you say "subjective" morality, do you mean to say that morality is "subjective" in the sense that it is something that applies to conscious subjects and not to "objects" like rocks or conscious matter? I take it you're not saying that morality is non-existent or n...

Sure we do. I want to get stuff for nothing. Stealing is great for that. So what are you condemning that you like? :? Then you don't use subjective morality. But my reasons would just be a matter of my subjective opinion, so how is that objective? Then you're not using subjective morality because y...

With good reason: as I've shown, it can't even make sense for the Subjectivist , and even when we grant him all his suppositions from the get-go. Great. Then give me one moral value that the Subjectivist can affirm on the basis of his Subjectivism. And you're not avoiding? :) 8) No. I'm asking a pe...

"Prevent"? Nobody can prevent a Rotherham gang member from committing rape. Ah, we're back to Rotherham again. It's as if you think I'm somehow responsible for that unfortunate Rotherham incident. :( Not at all, of course. But your justified antipathy to what they did is what's telling......

I'm not avoiding. I know perfectly well, and have always said, that a person who disbelieves in God has no hope of establishing reasons to believe in objective morality. And since you reject God, that's you...and I'm honouring your supposition and treating it as serious. And I know perfectly well t...

They are, but not only that. If that's all they are, then you have no right at all not to be robbed, raped, enslaved, killed, cheated, oppressed, denied access, excluded, abused or slighted. And nobody who wants to rob, rape, enslave, kill, cheat, oppress, deny you access, exclude, abuse or slight ...

They are, but not only that. If that's all they are, then you have no right at all not to be robbed, raped, enslaved, killed, cheated, oppressed, denied access, excluded, abused or slighted. And nobody who wants to rob, rape, enslave, kill, cheat, oppress, deny you access, exclude, abuse or slight ...

What we're doing, at the moment is allowing for the sake of argument that what you say is true . So objective morality is out of the conversation: we'll assume there's no such thing. My only purpose here is to argue that there are no such things as objective moral truths; hence objective morality i...

Because they don't want to be treated unjustly. They would prefer not to be robbed, raped, enslaved, or killed. Likewise, and more subtly, you also don't want to be cheated, oppressed, denied access, excluded, abused or slighted. And since you don't want such things, you need a common set of practi...

...you are completely unable to show how objective morality exists, or even how it could possibly exist. There is no such thing as objective moral truth. What we're doing, at the moment is allowing for the sake of argument that what you say is true . So objective morality is out of the conversation...

You miss my point, which is that we don't tend to condemn things we do like. Sure we do. I want to get stuff for nothing. Stealing is great for that. So what are you condemning that you like? :? So would I, so I don't see how you could disapprove of my subjective morality on that score. Then you do...

Not liking something seems a perfectly good explanation for condemning it to me. I don't lots of things. It doesn't mean that I condemn them and prevent other people from doing them or 'enjoying' them :shock: You miss my point, which is that we don't tend to condemn things we do like. I would have ...

I already gave an example ... if stealing is accepted as moral, then people would have to waste time, effort and money on securing their property. If nobody minded spending time, effort and money on securing their property, and they didn't mind having their possessions stolen, then what reason woul...